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Cora, Dombrowski, and Pedroia Addressing the Media
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Post by carmenfanzone on May 27, 2019 14:04:01 GMT -5
I sure hope that jerk Machado is happy.
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TearsIn04
Veteran
Everybody knows Nelson de la Rosa, but who is Karim Garcia?
Posts: 2,835
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Post by TearsIn04 on May 27, 2019 14:33:18 GMT -5
It seems to me that the common-sense way to handle this is for Dustin to retire and for the RS to then immediately hire him as a coach - at the same salary he gets now - through the end of the 2021 season. That way, he doesn't lose any money and his earnings won't count toward luxury tax calculations.
Going over the the top threshold in 2018 cost the RS a first rounder in this year's draft and they're tight up against that limit again. If he retired now, it would free up enough money to make a meaningful BP acquisition.
Oh yeah, let's hang "15" up on the RF facade.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on May 27, 2019 14:40:11 GMT -5
He would also probably be better suited to contribute as a coach if he is done.
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Post by jimed14 on May 27, 2019 14:42:53 GMT -5
It seems to me that the common-sense way to handle this is for Dustin to retire and for the RS to then immediately hire him as a coach - at the same salary he gets now - through the end of the 2021 season. That way, he doesn't lose any money and his earnings won't count toward luxury tax calculations. Going over the the top threshold in 2018 cost the RS a first rounder in this year's draft and they're tight up against that limit again. If he retired now, it would free up enough money to make a meaningful BP acquisition. Oh yeah, let's hang "15" up on the RF facade. I imagine the league wouldn't allow that.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on May 27, 2019 14:51:00 GMT -5
It seems to me that the common-sense way to handle this is for Dustin to retire and for the RS to then immediately hire him as a coach - at the same salary he gets now - through the end of the 2021 season. That way, he doesn't lose any money and his earnings won't count toward luxury tax calculations. Going over the the top threshold in 2018 cost the RS a first rounder in this year's draft and they're tight up against that limit again. If he retired now, it would free up enough money to make a meaningful BP acquisition. Oh yeah, let's hang "15" up on the RF facade. The money is on the CBT. It's not coming off.
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Addam603
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Posts: 3,204
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Post by Addam603 on May 27, 2019 14:53:26 GMT -5
Slightly edited Carrabis quote, but this is the perfect way to describe Pedroia. Always has been and always will be my favorite Sox player.
“This is Dustin f****** Pedroia, who’s only in the situation that he’s currently in, health-wise, because he played the game so damn hard every single day for over a decade. He did that for his teammates, he did that for the fans, and he did that because he was proud of the name that he wore across the front of his jersey. They don’t make ‘em like Pedroia anymore.”
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 27, 2019 16:29:10 GMT -5
It seems to me that the common-sense way to handle this is for Dustin to retire and for the RS to then immediately hire him as a coach - at the same salary he gets now - through the end of the 2021 season. That way, he doesn't lose any money and his earnings won't count toward luxury tax calculations. Going over the the top threshold in 2018 cost the RS a first rounder in this year's draft and they're tight up against that limit again. If he retired now, it would free up enough money to make a meaningful BP acquisition. Oh yeah, let's hang "15" up on the RF facade. The money is on the CBT. It's not coming off. I'm confused about this. I thought if he retired the Sox wouldn't owe him and his money would be off the books. I thought that's what Ryan Dempster did - and I seem to recall that his salary wasn't on the books since he elected to retire and not get paid, so if I'm wrong, I'm obviously missing something. What am I missing?
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Post by jimed14 on May 27, 2019 16:31:01 GMT -5
The money is on the CBT. It's not coming off. I'm confused about this. I thought if he retired the Sox wouldn't owe him and his money would be off the books. I thought that's what Ryan Dempster did - and I seem to recall that his salary wasn't on the books since he elected to retire and not get paid, so if I'm wrong, I'm obviously missing something. What am I missing? You're missing the fact that the only reason he's not playing or will not play is because of injury, not because of choice.
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Post by splendidsplinter on May 27, 2019 16:31:22 GMT -5
Agree. He doesn’t owe anything to anyone. He earned every last penny and more.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 27, 2019 16:32:32 GMT -5
My only hope for Pedroia as a player is to get some garbage time ABs, watch him put on a laser show, and see his lifetime batting average inch back up to .300. He was at .300 but his 2-20 or whatever it was dropped him to .299.
Other than that, I don't think it's realistic to expect to ever really see him play again. What a great player. He's a Red Sox for life. It shouldn't take more than 2 seconds - when he's ready - to get him into the organization somehow - he'd make a fantastic coach. Like Pedro, Ortiz, Wakefield, and Tek, Pedroia is a Red Sox lifer.
The damn shame is if not for that injury, Pedroia might have wound up in the HOF. He probably would have finished with about 2500 hits. I'd say it's Doerr and Pedroia (not sure of the order there) and everybody else when it comes to all-time Red Sox 2b.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 27, 2019 16:33:54 GMT -5
I'm confused about this. I thought if he retired the Sox wouldn't owe him and his money would be off the books. I thought that's what Ryan Dempster did - and I seem to recall that his salary wasn't on the books since he elected to retire and not get paid, so if I'm wrong, I'm obviously missing something. What am I missing? You're missing the fact that the only reason he's not playing or will not play is because of injury, not because of choice. Ok, so if a player elects to retire for non-injury reasons, he forfeits his contract, but if it's injury-related that's a different story? Ok.
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Post by jimed14 on May 27, 2019 16:36:45 GMT -5
You're missing the fact that the only reason he's not playing or will not play is because of injury, not because of choice. Ok, so if a player elects to retire for non-injury reasons, he forfeits his contract, but if it's injury-related that's a different story? Ok. If he "retires", I believe he wouldn't officially retire until his contract is done. The Red Sox may just make an agreement to let him retire with pay just to have the roster spot back in the offseason. I mean it's a legit injury and he has to be paid his entire contract regardless of what he decides. The Red Sox won't make him continue to kill himself trying to rehab for 3 full seasons to prove that he's trying to come back.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 27, 2019 16:48:48 GMT -5
Ok, so if a player elects to retire for non-injury reasons, he forfeits his contract, but if it's injury-related that's a different story? Ok. If he "retires", I believe he wouldn't officially retire until his contract is done. The Red Sox may just make an agreement to let him retire with pay just to have the roster spot back in the offseason. I mean it's a legit injury and he has to be paid his entire contract regardless of what he decides. The Red Sox won't make him continue to kill himself trying to rehab for 3 full seasons to prove that he's trying to come back. Nah, at this point, he should just try to make it so it won't cause him a lot of pain in his life after his baseball career. I think the career is secondary at this point. He's too young to have trouble walking and usually when there's knee trouble it can definitely lead to that. I have minor knee issues and it can be a chore to walk downstairs at times. I can only imagine how he's feeling.
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Post by jimed14 on May 27, 2019 17:01:09 GMT -5
If he "retires", I believe he wouldn't officially retire until his contract is done. The Red Sox may just make an agreement to let him retire with pay just to have the roster spot back in the offseason. I mean it's a legit injury and he has to be paid his entire contract regardless of what he decides. The Red Sox won't make him continue to kill himself trying to rehab for 3 full seasons to prove that he's trying to come back. Nah, at this point, he should just try to make it so it won't cause him a lot of pain in his life after his baseball career. I think the career is secondary at this point. He's too young to have trouble walking and usually when there's knee trouble it can definitely lead to that. I have minor knee issues and it can be a chore to walk downstairs at times. I can only imagine how he's feeling. He'll probably have his knees replaced soon after he retires. Or at least the bad one.
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Post by patford on May 27, 2019 18:26:33 GMT -5
It seems to me that the common-sense way to handle this is for Dustin to retire and for the RS to then immediately hire him as a coach - at the same salary he gets now - through the end of the 2021 season. That way, he doesn't lose any money and his earnings won't count toward luxury tax calculations. Going over the the top threshold in 2018 cost the RS a first rounder in this year's draft and they're tight up against that limit again. If he retired now, it would free up enough money to make a meaningful BP acquisition. Oh yeah, let's hang "15" up on the RF facade. The money is on the CBT. It's not coming off. I somehow didn't realize that. In that case it does not matter what he does. I guess he could take the rest of the year off and try and figure out some kind of rehab which might get him back on the field next year. Stem cell ? Some sort of exercise program which would slowly build strength and support ? Radical diet ?
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TearsIn04
Veteran
Everybody knows Nelson de la Rosa, but who is Karim Garcia?
Posts: 2,835
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Post by TearsIn04 on May 27, 2019 18:40:09 GMT -5
The money is on the CBT. It's not coming off. I'm confused about this. I thought if he retired the Sox wouldn't owe him and his money would be off the books. I thought that's what Ryan Dempster did - and I seem to recall that his salary wasn't on the books since he elected to retire and not get paid, so if I'm wrong, I'm obviously missing something. What am I missing? My assumption in my original post was the same as redsoxchamps04071318. If he retires he frees the RS of their obligation to him and, thus, the money wouldn't count against them for tax purposes. But I'm not sure and would like to see something definitive.
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TearsIn04
Veteran
Everybody knows Nelson de la Rosa, but who is Karim Garcia?
Posts: 2,835
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Post by TearsIn04 on May 27, 2019 18:45:27 GMT -5
It seems to me that the common-sense way to handle this is for Dustin to retire and for the RS to then immediately hire him as a coach - at the same salary he gets now - through the end of the 2021 season. That way, he doesn't lose any money and his earnings won't count toward luxury tax calculations. Going over the the top threshold in 2018 cost the RS a first rounder in this year's draft and they're tight up against that limit again. If he retired now, it would free up enough money to make a meaningful BP acquisition. Oh yeah, let's hang "15" up on the RF facade. I imagine the league wouldn't allow that. Whether or not MLB would allow it is a legit question and something I've wondered about. But where would MLB throw up its roadblock? They can't stop him from retiring and I wouldn't think they could stop him and the RS from agreeing on his taking a high salary as a coach. As long as Rob Manfred doesn't consult Goodell on how to handle it, we might be Ok.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on May 27, 2019 19:12:02 GMT -5
The Sox essentially did that with Ryan Dempster. He retired and the Sox instead made a donation to his foundation equal to his salary. There was a difference though, Dempster retired in spring training. I believe the CBT amounts are fixed as of opening day so, I don't believe anything can be done about 2019 for any player on the payroll when the season started.
I might be wrong though, wouldn't be the first time.
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Post by patford on May 27, 2019 19:17:02 GMT -5
The Sox essentially did that with Ryan Dempster. He retired and the Sox instead made a donation to his foundation equal to his salary. There was a difference though, Dempster retired in spring training. I believe the CBT amounts are fixed as of opening day so, I don't believe anything can be done about 2019 for any player on the payroll when the season started. I might be wrong though, wouldn't be the first time. If I understand Chris correctly the salary continues to count if the retirement in injury related.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on May 27, 2019 19:33:32 GMT -5
The Sox essentially did that with Ryan Dempster. He retired and the Sox instead made a donation to his foundation equal to his salary. There was a difference though, Dempster retired in spring training. I believe the CBT amounts are fixed as of opening day so, I don't believe anything can be done about 2019 for any player on the payroll when the season started. I might be wrong though, wouldn't be the first time. If I understand Chris correctly the salary continues to count if the retirement in injury related. I didn't read that into Chris' statement and I don't know of any such rule. If Dustin retires this coming off season, he would forfeit his salary because he has the option of remaining on the injured list and keeping his salary. There's no reason for him to do that nor should he. Pretty much all contracts are considered as insurance (a guarantee of salary) for the player against a major injury, otherwise they would all just go year to year. A death would terminate the contact and then it would be up to the club what they would do.
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Addam603
Veteran
Posts: 3,204
Member is Online
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Post by Addam603 on May 27, 2019 19:42:28 GMT -5
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Post by philsbosoxfan on May 27, 2019 19:45:35 GMT -5
I think the ultimate tribute was Mo naming him as the player he most admired in his book, over any of his own team mates.
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Post by jimed14 on May 27, 2019 21:24:48 GMT -5
The Sox essentially did that with Ryan Dempster. He retired and the Sox instead made a donation to his foundation equal to his salary. There was a difference though, Dempster retired in spring training. I believe the CBT amounts are fixed as of opening day so, I don't believe anything can be done about 2019 for any player on the payroll when the season started. I might be wrong though, wouldn't be the first time. The difference is that Dempster wasn't forced to retire because of injury. He decided to because he was tired of the grind.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on May 27, 2019 21:32:44 GMT -5
The Sox essentially did that with Ryan Dempster. He retired and the Sox instead made a donation to his foundation equal to his salary. There was a difference though, Dempster retired in spring training. I believe the CBT amounts are fixed as of opening day so, I don't believe anything can be done about 2019 for any player on the payroll when the season started. I might be wrong though, wouldn't be the first time. The difference is that Dempster wasn't forced to retire because of injury. He decided to because he was tired of the grind. The difference is when it transpired. Iirc, Dempster was fighting an arm injury and would have opened the season on the DL. If he just decided to retire there would have been no need for the donation to his trust. He would be walking away from a contract which would make it void.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on May 27, 2019 21:39:28 GMT -5
Faced with a battle to make the Red Sox' rotation this spring and a neck problem that, in his words, has "made it harder and harder to throw a baseball and throw it like I'm accustomed to throwing it," Ryan Dempster informed the team on Sunday that he will not pitch this season. Speaking to the media at Boston's spring camp on Sunday, Dempster, who will be 37 in May, explicitly said that he is not retiring, but almost everything else he said made it sound as if that is effectively what he is doing. For now, he's being placed on the restricted list by the Red Sox and will thus forfeit his $13.25 million salary for 2014, the second and final year of his contract.
"After a long offseason and thinking about things and seeing where I was at both physically and personally, I just made the decision that I'm not going to pitch in the 2014 season and go from there www.si.com/mlb/strike-zone/2014/02/17/ryan-dempster-red-sox-walks-away-retired. . . The Sox them made a donation coincidentally equal to his salary to the Dempster Family Foundation which was subsequently closed in 2015. I'm not sure how it happened but he officially retired as a Cub.
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