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7/2 Gameday Thread: Hello Mata! Here I am, at Hadlock Field
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Post by soxfan511 on Jul 2, 2019 22:16:09 GMT -5
I’m just going to say it...mata is untouchable right now. MLB and BA will soon recognize him nationally He's looking good but the question will be how long it takes to ramp up to a season's load. His career high is 77 innings. Idk, but he has grown in height and weight (muscle) significantly over the past 3 years, his fastball has gone from 90 up to sitting 96 (touching 98), his newly developed cutter/slider is a plus, and his curveball to me has fantastic movement I think it’s a plus (I disagree with our scouts who say average). Plus he throws a 4th pitch, a change up. Seems like the real deal deal to me. Very high ceiling now at this point. |
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jul 2, 2019 22:21:07 GMT -5
He's looking good but the question will be how long it takes to ramp up to a season's load. His career high is 77 innings. Idk, but he has grown in height and weight (muscle) significantly over the past 3 years, his fastball has gone from 90 up to sitting 96 (touching 98), his newly developed cutter/slider is a plus, and his curveball to me has fantastic movement I think it’s a plus (I disagree with our scouts who say average). Plus he throws a 4th pitch, a change up. Seems like the real deal deal to me. Very high ceiling now at this point. I don't at all disagree with the talent. Teams just don't add significant innings year over year. Right now, he's only at 57 innings. |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 2, 2019 22:50:49 GMT -5
Idk, but he has grown in height and weight (muscle) significantly over the past 3 years, his fastball has gone from 90 up to sitting 96 (touching 98), his newly developed cutter/slider is a plus, and his curveball to me has fantastic movement I think it’s a plus (I disagree with our scouts who say average). Plus he throws a 4th pitch, a change up. Seems like the real deal deal to me. Very high ceiling now at this point. I don't at all disagree with the talent. Teams just don't add significant innings year over year. Right now, he's only at 57 innings. Yeah he's 2 years away from a full-time big league role in a rotation still. Even at a jump of 110 innings this year, he'll be at 150 next year at most. Maybe he can help in the back half of 2020, but they'll be careful with him. |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 2, 2019 22:55:47 GMT -5
Still, the progression of Mata in the last month is incredible. We went from talking about this guy being the next Porcello, to maybe turning into the next Kevin Brown.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jul 2, 2019 23:03:21 GMT -5
Well, at least the Red Sox now have a starting pitching prospect. That's something. For the past few year's it's been - well, he'd probably profile better in relief. Mata does have a future starting. It's just a matter of him building up his innings and keeping his stamina.
Like Pedro said, perhaps the Sox call him up toward the end of 2020.
But at least it's somebody you can tentatively pencil into the rotation at some point hopefully in 2021.
Now if Groome can get healthy and become what was hoped and if Noah Song doesn't miss 2 years (I think he still does? Not sure how the change of rules changes his status), perhaps Song can become a candidate to be a starter down the road.
Other than those 3 possibilities the Sox will most likely have to trade for starters down the road if they need/want them.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Jul 3, 2019 7:56:52 GMT -5
He's looking good but the question will be how long it takes to ramp up to a season's load. His career high is 77 innings. Idk, but he has grown in height and weight (muscle) significantly over the past 3 years, his fastball has gone from 90 up to sitting 96 (touching 98), his newly developed cutter/slider is a plus, and his curveball to me has fantastic movement I think it’s a plus (I disagree with our scouts who say average). Plus he throws a 4th pitch, a change up. Seems like the real deal deal to me. Very high ceiling now at this point. Not just us - you're disagreeing with literally every evaluator who has seen him based on (I believe) one video you saw of the pitch. It's probably an average pitch, maybe it tops out at above average but that's a best case scenario. Cutter/slider needs more consistency from outing to outing, based on what I've heard as well. But there's a lot of potential there. It is an exciting package, but he does have development left - which is why he's in the minors and not Boston, right? |
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Post by James Dunne on Jul 3, 2019 8:09:41 GMT -5
Mata was sitting 92-93 when Ian saw him at Instructs back in 2016. "Mata generates easy velocity and sat 92-93 mph in this outing. The fastball was heavy, with life, and given his delivery and projectability, he could add velocity as he matures." I have no idea where this idea that he was only throwing 90 came from. news.soxprospects.com/2016/10/scouting-scratch-fall-instructs-part.htmlI'd have no problem ranking him second (heck, even first) if he gets close to 100 healthy innings this year. He just has to do it. |
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Post by brendan98 on Jul 3, 2019 8:31:34 GMT -5
It’s kind of funny how quickly so many people jump on and off of the bandwagon of prospects, failing to realize that they are 17-23 year old kids that are still learning to play the game.
A month ago Duran was the next big thing, now after struggling for a little over 100 at bats, while making the toughest jump in the minor leagues (A to AA), folks jumping off that ship already.
A year or two ago, I remember all the talk about Chavis, and how he could only pull the ball, and how it wouldn’t translate to MLB.
Dalbec strikes out too much and won’t make enough contact to be a MLB hitter, but we have an example (Gallo) of a guy developing into more than a two true outcome hitter right before our eyes.
Darwinzon has to go to the bullpen because he doesn’t have control, nevermind the fact that he began playing baseball at the age of 15 and has a lot of catching up to do.
A players development is never a straight line, and sometimes a player struggling can end up being the best thing that ever happened to them, because it forces them to make some adjustments that they needed to make that they may not have if they were having success. Sometimes these adjustments are made quickly, but more often than not it is a process that plays out over a season or seasons or careers.
Mata is performing very well right now, but he is 1 year removed from a season where he walked as many as he struck out. It’d be great if he continues to be lights out in AA, but don’t be shocked if he gets hit around at some point, the Red Sox promoted him to challenge him, to force him to continue to develop at a level where maybe he will need more than great stuff to get hitters out.
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radiohix
Veteran
'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
Posts: 6,584
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Post by radiohix on Jul 3, 2019 10:19:34 GMT -5
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Jul 3, 2019 10:20:05 GMT -5
Along those same lines, keep in mind Mata's best pitch two years ago was his changeup, which now is a distant fourth and not even an average pitch probably (my guess is it somehow was a victim of his growth spurt).
Development is definitely not linear.
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Post by soxfan511 on Jul 3, 2019 12:52:06 GMT -5
It’s kind of funny how quickly so many people jump on and off of the bandwagon of prospects, failing to realize that they are 17-23 year old kids that are still learning to play the game. A month ago Duran was the next big thing, now after struggling for a little over 100 at bats, while making the toughest jump in the minor leagues (A to AA), folks jumping off that ship already. A year or two ago, I remember all the talk about Chavis, and how he could only pull the ball, and how it wouldn’t translate to MLB. Dalbec strikes out too much and won’t make enough contact to be a MLB hitter, but we have an example (Gallo) of a guy developing into more than a two true outcome hitter right before our eyes. Darwinzon has to go to the bullpen because he doesn’t have control, nevermind the fact that he began playing baseball at the age of 15 and has a lot of catching up to do. A players development is never a straight line, and sometimes a player struggling can end up being the best thing that ever happened to them, because it forces them to make some adjustments that they needed to make that they may not have if they were having success. Sometimes these adjustments are made quickly, but more often than not it is a process that plays out over a season or seasons or careers. Mata is performing very well right now, but he is 1 year removed from a season where he walked as many as he struck out. It’d be great if he continues to be lights out in AA, but don’t be shocked if he gets hit around at some point, the Red Sox promoted him to challenge him, to force him to continue to develop at a level where maybe he will need more than great stuff to get hitters out. You make a lot of excellent points. I think the difference in Mata is he seems to have hit a huge growth spurt which is hard to predict in a player. And that growth spurt caused a huge spike in his velocity and strength. None of those other guys had such a transformation with their height and weight like Mata did since starting in our system. |
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