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2021 MLB Draft
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Post by James Dunne on Apr 24, 2021 16:54:35 GMT -5
.... Seriously? That was the quote from his travel ball coach, not the scouts or analysts.
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Post by sarasoxer on Apr 24, 2021 17:16:21 GMT -5
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Post by sarasoxer on Apr 24, 2021 17:36:07 GMT -5
The guy was then viewed as a top of the rotation pitcher but due to various outlined factors, fell. There was no boom or bust then ascribed as there may now be. This spring I saw him hit 97 with max, not easy as described, effort as if he were trying to impress but he was very wild in process. Reading SP, his velocity has lessened following surgery. I hope not, but I fear that he will tumble further down our prospect list following the upcoming draft. No sure shot regardless, but my overall view is to draft a position player given the vagaries. As someone above said, sign the established pitcher in free agency.
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steveofbradenton
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Watching Spring Training, the FCL, and the Florida State League
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Post by steveofbradenton on Apr 24, 2021 18:06:03 GMT -5
I'm somewhat worried, as Sarasoxer, about taking a pitcher this high. I know there is NO guarantee with any of these players, but I do believe one of the young shortstops has a better chance of being a real contributor for the SOX over a 10-year period.
I love Lawlor and Meyar. There is a good possibility both will be gone before we pick. I like Leiter but he WILL go in the top 3 in my estimate.
I'm actually pleased with Rocker's last start. He was electric! I won't be depressed if he stays at that level and we take him, but as stated I would prefer a positional player. I know Brady House still has his detractors but he is my 3rd pick at number 4. His footwork in the infield his pretty good. He may have a decent chance to even stay at short and hit 30 bombs! He may have to move to 3rd. Big deal! He potentially could be very good over there.
I hope Rocker keeps up his performance. There is a better chance a Detroit may take him at 3, but he will still excite our base if we end up with him.
I WISH THE DAM DRAFT WAS IN A COUPLE WEEKS!
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Post by James Dunne on Apr 24, 2021 18:18:29 GMT -5
.... Seriously? That was the quote from his travel ball coach, not the scouts or analysts. How high up on the SP list was he when drafted? 5th or 6th. The discussion was whether he or Kopech should rank higher. Keeping in mind that Kopech had just missed half the season due to getting into a fight with a teammate, following a year in which he missed the final seven weeks due to a positive PED test. He had come into that season ranked 89th by BA and unranked by MLB.
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Post by sarasoxer on Apr 24, 2021 18:39:04 GMT -5
How high up on the SP list was he when drafted? 5th or 6th. The discussion was whether he or Kopech should rank higher. Keeping in mind that Kopech had just missed half the season due to getting into a fight with a teammate, following a year in which he missed the final seven weeks due to a positive PED test. He had come into that season ranked 89th by BA and unranked by MLB.
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Post by sarasoxer on Apr 24, 2021 18:44:03 GMT -5
How high up on the SP list was he when drafted? 5th or 6th. The discussion was whether he or Kopech should rank higher. Keeping in mind that Kopech had just missed half the season due to getting into a fight with a teammate, following a year in which he missed the final seven weeks due to a positive PED test. He had come into that season ranked 89th by BA and unranked by MLB. Please show the original SP post draft report on Groome.
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Post by orion09 on Apr 24, 2021 19:15:14 GMT -5
The guy was then viewed as a top of the rotation pitcher but due to various outlined factors, fell. There was no boom or bust then ascribed as there may now be.He fell in large part because of personal concerns, which would seem to imply a higher level of risk, so I would argue he was boom or bust from the beginning. As it turns out, it's been mostly injury stuff, not character stuff, that's help him back, but I don't think it's accurate to say that there was no concern about his risk level
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Post by James Dunne on Apr 24, 2021 19:29:15 GMT -5
5th or 6th. The discussion was whether he or Kopech should rank higher. Keeping in mind that Kopech had just missed half the season due to getting into a fight with a teammate, following a year in which he missed the final seven weeks due to a positive PED test. He had come into that season ranked 89th by BA and unranked by MLB. Please show the original SP post draft report on Groome. Here is the first scouting report Ian filed on him: news.soxprospects.com/2016/09/scouting-scratch-jason-groome.htmlSummary: Here are the podcasts with the initial takes: June 10, immediately post draftJune 16 w/ Jim Callis
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Post by sarasoxer on Apr 24, 2021 19:57:30 GMT -5
The guy was then viewed as a top of the rotation pitcher but due to various outlined factors, fell. There was no boom or bust then ascribed as there may now be.He fell in large part because of personal concerns, which would seem to imply a higher level of risk, so I would argue he was boom or bust from the beginning. As it turns out, it's been mostly injury stuff, not character stuff, that's help him back, but I don't think it's accurate to say that there was no concern about his risk level Boom or bust was not mentioned in scouting reports vs. that of outstanding ability. His dad had legal problems but there was no ascribed "guilt by association" as far as I know. Where was an overriding health/ability risk mentioned above any other HS pick?
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Post by soxinsf on Apr 24, 2021 19:59:19 GMT -5
“No boom or bust on Groome as drafted”?
When a pitcher with his stuff falls from 1 to 12 based on character concerns, their is always a giant element of risk in that selection. Not only does he have to overcome the usual uncertainty associated with any HS pitcher, but he had to overcome the character concerns.
The Sox and we all hoped that he would overcome the latter, and it seems that he has. But, the usual young pitcher concerns have been there in spades. Groome was clearly a risky pick, more than normal, or he would not have dropped.
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Post by sarasoxer on Apr 24, 2021 20:15:49 GMT -5
“No boom or bust on Groome as drafted”? When a pitcher with his stuff falls from 1 to 12 based on character concerns, their is always a giant element of risk in that selection. Not only does he have to overcome the usual uncertainty associated with any HS pitcher, but he had to overcome the character concerns. The Sox and we all hoped that he would overcome the latter, and it seems that he has. But, the usual young pitcher concerns have been there in spades. Groome was clearly a risky pick, more than normal, or he would not have dropped. Let me say again, on then assessed/projected talent there were no reported boom or bust concerns raised beyond that attendant any high or high school pick. Yeah, he wanted huge dollars. Yeah his dad had legal problems. Yeah he screwed up out of IMG. But listen to Ian Cundall (sp) on the podcast posted. Per, we had a coup.
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Post by wOBA Fett on Apr 24, 2021 20:39:19 GMT -5
Leiter's line tonight
Player IP H R ER BB K TP ST Leiter 5.0 6 4 4 3 8 96 57
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Post by unitspin on Apr 24, 2021 20:39:25 GMT -5
I was all for the groome pick at 12 but to say that ppl didnt think there was concerns for him to drop from top 5 to 12 is an interesting take. There is always a bigger risk with HS arms compared to college arms then you add questionable character issues he was a high risk high reward pick for sure.
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Post by tyler3 on Apr 24, 2021 20:40:15 GMT -5
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Post by sarasoxer on Apr 24, 2021 20:52:39 GMT -5
I was all for the groome pick at 12 but to say that ppl didnt think there was concerns for him to drop from top 5 to 12 is an interesting take. There is always a bigger risk with HS arms compared to college arms then you add questionable character issues he was a high risk high reward pick for sure. Read my lips and those of Ian Cundall...On a talent basis, Groome was a top pick who slid to us. Of course high school vs college is a factor and should be. But Groome, on talent alone, was deemed a possible 1-1 who dropped for unrelated reasons. Let's leave it at that.
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Apr 25, 2021 0:46:13 GMT -5
Leiter back to 1.04 LETSSSS GOOOOOO
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Post by tyler3 on Apr 25, 2021 7:45:21 GMT -5
Now as for today....that’s now 2 good starts in a row for Rocker with his velocity back. Leiter had his worse game last week. It will be interesting to see how Leiter does tonight. Any signs of struggle from Leiter may reignite that whole Rocker vs Leiter debate. In any case as others have mentioned, Rocker shoving is good for us either way. Is the debate back on?
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Post by tyler3 on Apr 25, 2021 7:58:24 GMT -5
I mean, if I was picking 1 or 2 I may be running for the safety of a bat. Leiter has looked sub par for 2 games in a row and as a little guy....long way to go but I think the chances a deal gets cut above us grow if the slam dunk number 1 pick continues to get muddled.
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Post by unitspin on Apr 25, 2021 8:25:27 GMT -5
“No boom or bust on Groome as drafted”? When a pitcher with his stuff falls from 1 to 12 based on character concerns, their is always a giant element of risk in that selection. Not only does he have to overcome the usual uncertainty associated with any HS pitcher, but he had to overcome the character concerns. The Sox and we all hoped that he would overcome the latter, and it seems that he has. But, the usual young pitcher concerns have been there in spades. Groome was clearly a risky pick, more than normal, or he would not have dropped. Well we agree on it, you do not drop from the top five to 12 without serious concerns about the player.
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Post by azblue on Apr 25, 2021 10:01:57 GMT -5
The members of this board could not unanimously agree that being a rich, great lookikng genius would be a good thing, let alone agree upon any board member's assessment of any player.
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Post by dyoungteach on Apr 25, 2021 10:26:24 GMT -5
I'm somewhat worried, as Sarasoxer, about taking a pitcher this high. I know there is NO guarantee with any of these players, but I do believe one of the young shortstops has a better chance of being a real contributor for the SOX over a 10-year period. I love Lawlor and Meyar. There is a good possibility both will be gone before we pick. I like Leiter but he WILL go in the top 3 in my estimate. I'm actually pleased with Rocker's last start. He was electric! I won't be depressed if he stays at that level and we take him, but as stated I would prefer a positional player. I know Brady House still has his detractors but he is my 3rd pick at number 4. His footwork in the infield his pretty good. He may have a decent chance to even stay at short and hit 30 bombs! He may have to move to 3rd. Big deal! He potentially could be very good over there. I hope Rocker keeps up his performance. There is a better chance a Detroit may take him at 3, but he will still excite our base if we end up with him. I WISH THE DAM DRAFT WAS IN A COUPLE WEEKS! Is there a way to upvote a quote 25x over? Nope? Dang it. Great quote. Bring it back every other week because this is how I feel now and 2 days before the draft. Player mighty change but theory will be the same!
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radiohix
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'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
Posts: 6,583
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Post by radiohix on Apr 25, 2021 10:43:49 GMT -5
My order of preference right now would be: 1- Mayer: Love the smoothness in the field and in the batter box. 2- Davis: A catcher with a canon arm who also sports a plus hit tool to go with great plate discipline? Ramireja did a ++ lobbying job 😂 3- Frelick: I'm a fan of small athletic guys with plus hit tool and sneaky power...l just love them. 4- Lawlar: He stopped striking out but that kid just give me a Royce Lewis vibes when I watch him and I'm not a big fan of Lewis. No pitchers for me, pitching prospects will break your heart.
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Post by tyler3 on Apr 25, 2021 11:29:11 GMT -5
The members of this board could not unanimously agree that being a rich, great lookikng genius would be a good thing, let alone agree upon any board member's assessment of any player. I disagree
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Post by unitspin on Apr 25, 2021 11:49:45 GMT -5
The members of this board could not unanimously agree that being a rich, great lookikng genius would be a good thing, let alone agree upon any board member's assessment of any player. Lol, perfect. Might be my favorite post of the year.
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