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5/1 ML Gameday Thread: Portland in the morning
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Post by thelavarnwayguy on May 1, 2013 18:32:10 GMT -5
I can't remember the farm ever having this many solid starting pitching prospects, or even as many solid prospects in general. It would be interesting to see what orgs like BP and BA think at the end of the year. I would think top 5 at minimum if trends continue. We have often lacked that top tier Profars type guy but we have some players approaching that level it would seem.Players? Like plural? I guess I don't see the Red Sox having more than 1 guy (Xander) who's close to the level Profar is at. Who are the other guys in your opinion that are approaching his (top 5 prospect in baseball) level? Approaching as in top 25 potential. No doubt we just don't seem to get that top 1 or 2 guy but the key word was "approaching". I remain convinced that this is the strongest farm we have had in my opinion in many years. As in over 25 years. Bogaerts, Webster, Bradley all could be considered in the top 25 range. Cechinni, Ranaudo, Workman, Iglesias, Barnes, Owens all could be top 100 potentially before year end. I still think Swihart is a probable stud and I'm holding out for Coyle to reemerge this year.
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Post by thelavarnwayguy on May 1, 2013 18:33:38 GMT -5
I don't consider De La Rosa as a prospect but he is in that conversation also.
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Post by iakovos11 on May 1, 2013 18:52:25 GMT -5
Coyle with 2B and Cecchini singles him home for Salem's only 2 hits through 4.
EDIT: Spoke too soon. Cecchini adds an RBI double.
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Post by bjb406 on May 1, 2013 19:14:42 GMT -5
yet another multi hit game for cecchini
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Post by threeifbaerga on May 1, 2013 19:16:40 GMT -5
Cecchini brought his BA over .400 with that double.
And I'd say Coyle has re-emerged, what with the 1.100+ OPS.
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Post by stevedillard on May 1, 2013 19:29:17 GMT -5
Anyone else coo coo for Kukukuk?
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Post by thelavarnwayguy on May 1, 2013 19:37:39 GMT -5
The strength of the minor league pitching we now have really sets this farm apart. And lots of these guys are at the higher levels. I do hear some of the comments about guys like Workman and Ranaudo being projected as #5 starters at this point but there is still some time for growth and guys like Webster, Barnes and Owens all could well project higher and this is not even considering guys like De La Rosa, Britton, Johnson, Butrey....etc. There are some relief arms there also. Guys like Bogaerts and Bradley cancel out the Ellsbury's and Andersons. This farm is just better. At this point in time.
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Post by brianthetaoist on May 1, 2013 19:49:32 GMT -5
I can't remember the farm ever having this many solid starting pitching prospects, or even as many solid prospects in general. It would be interesting to see what orgs like BP and BA think at the end of the year. I would think top 5 at minimum if trends continue. We have often lacked that top tier Profars type guy but we have some players approaching that level it would seem. It's been five years or so. Back in 2008 we had Buchholz, Masterson and Bowden (who was highly-regarded at the time), as well as Nick Hagadone lower in the system. For position players, Ellsbury and Lowrie were in the system, and we were all convinced that Lars Anderson would become a great power bat for the Red Sox at some point. Interesting to note that out of those elite prospects, only four ever contributed in Boston and only two are still here five years later. It's true that that was a good time for the system, with some depth to it. But I think the farm system has more high-end talend now. Buchholz was seen as a stud, for sure. I think he got up in the top 10, maybe even top 5 in BA. But Masterson wasn't nearly as highly regarded, Bowden was always generally seen as intriguing at the lower levels but never quite broke through. If either of those two cracked the top 50, I'd be surprised. Lars Anderson is a good cautionary tale; he was top 20 or so, but that was after Ellsbury graduated. Lowrie never quite caught on with national publications; he was never seen as a shortstop. He maybe cracked the top 100 once, but I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't. But the point is, there's maybe 3 from that group that ever were in the top 50 and not all at the same time. Assuming no graduations from this group, I think the Sox could have at least four guys in the top 50 this year out of Bradley, Bogaerts, Webster, Barnes, Cecchini, Workman, Ranaudo, and Owens, and it could easily be more. And there's still some potential top 100 guys in Iglesias, Brentz, maybe even Coyle if he somehow keeps some facsimile of this up. And poor Deven Marrero pulls a hammy, and we all forget about him immediately.
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jimoh
Veteran
Posts: 4,002
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Post by jimoh on May 1, 2013 20:03:59 GMT -5
In 2008 these were in the BBA top 100: 4. Clay Buchholz rhp, Red Sox 13. Jacoby Ellsbury of, Red Sox 40. Lars Anderson 1b, Red Sox 64. Justin Masterson rhp, Red Sox 73. Jed Lowrie ss, Red Sox 94. Michael Bowden rhp, Red Sox 96. Ryan Kalish of, Red Sox
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Post by lennsakata on May 1, 2013 20:12:28 GMT -5
Mookie Betts continues with his ridulous walk rate.
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Post by njsox on May 1, 2013 20:36:41 GMT -5
In 2008 these were in the BBA top 100: 4. Clay Buchholz rhp, Red Sox 13. Jacoby Ellsbury of, Red Sox 40. Lars Anderson 1b, Red Sox 64. Justin Masterson rhp, Red Sox 73. Jed Lowrie ss, Red Sox 94. Michael Bowden rhp, Red Sox 96. Ryan Kalish of, Red Sox Wow, that really was a nice group. I bet it would look even better had Kalish stayed healthy. Also Reddick was looking pretty special at that time, was probably just outside the top 100.
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Post by rjp313jr on May 1, 2013 20:36:48 GMT -5
I was expecting to see Garin finally have less than 2 hits nod was ready for some wise as comment, yet he ad 2 more tonight... Yawn - A ball is too easy right now.
Maybe Barnes is just a morning person... Good to see the improvement, especially with that curve. Hopefully, Pedro can go help him with a change-up... Success can breed success.
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Post by wskeleton76 on May 1, 2013 20:38:14 GMT -5
Don't forget about Manuel Margot. He is really loved by scouts. If he produces in Lowell he would be top 100.
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jimoh
Veteran
Posts: 4,002
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Post by jimoh on May 1, 2013 21:12:55 GMT -5
Does this make Barnes intriguing again?Kidding aside, nice outing. Nice to see him make adjustments. Interesting that both of his two good starts came his second time facing a team. ... Someone on Sickels' minorleagueball gameday suggests that Barnes' troubles are just freaky high BABIP, perhaps luck, perhaps poor defense. Not a lot of defensive stars in Portland's infield or outfield.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2013 21:24:28 GMT -5
Whooaaaaaaaa there Nelly. It's a good group yes but let's tap the breaks a little bit. All of these guys have flaws and a couple of them it seems you are expecting way too much out of.
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Post by Jim Crowell on May 1, 2013 21:28:41 GMT -5
Does this make Barnes intriguing again?Kidding aside, nice outing. Nice to see him make adjustments. Interesting that both of his two good starts came his second time facing a team. ... Someone on Sickels' minorleagueball gameday suggests that Barnes' troubles are just freaky high BABIP, perhaps luck, perhaps poor defense. Not a lot of defensive stars in Portland's infield or outfield. I saw Barnes in one of his bad starts and it had nothing to do with BABIP. He threw maybe one good curveball and two good changeups all game. He also struggled repeating his delivery which caused him to lose control of his fastball. I've also seen Barnes when he has all three pitches working and he is almost unhittable. I can't guarantee that's why he's struggled in all 3 of his bad starts, but that's what I saw in New Britain.
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Post by pedroelgrande on May 1, 2013 22:16:47 GMT -5
Anyone else coo coo for Kukukuk? I don't know about coo coo but I like him ever since they drafted him. Profile too similar to Jon Lester for me not to be intrigued.
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Post by Don Caballero on May 2, 2013 0:10:58 GMT -5
In 2008 these were in the BBA top 100: 4. Clay Buchholz rhp, Red Sox 13. Jacoby Ellsbury of, Red Sox 40. Lars Anderson 1b, Red Sox 64. Justin Masterson rhp, Red Sox 73. Jed Lowrie ss, Red Sox 94. Michael Bowden rhp, Red Sox 96. Ryan Kalish of, Red Sox Which reminds me of how overrated Kalish always was as a prospect. Dude had one of the ugliest swings I EVER saw at the time, there's no way he would ever have cut it in the majors with that kind of stuff. But at the time I also thought Lars had just the perfect swing for Fenway, so f*#@ the heck do I know.
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Post by bjb406 on May 2, 2013 1:12:49 GMT -5
In 2008 these were in the BBA top 100: 4. Clay Buchholz rhp, Red Sox 13. Jacoby Ellsbury of, Red Sox 40. Lars Anderson 1b, Red Sox 64. Justin Masterson rhp, Red Sox 73. Jed Lowrie ss, Red Sox 94. Michael Bowden rhp, Red Sox 96. Ryan Kalish of, Red Sox Wow, that really was a nice group. I bet it would look even better had Kalish stayed healthy. Also Reddick was looking pretty special at that time, was probably just outside the top 100. our top 20 from september 2005 (after the draft, before hanley and anibal got traded) Papelbon, Lester, Anibal Sanchez, Hanley Ramirez, Craig Hansen, Manny Delcarmen, Dustin Pedroia, Kelly Shappach, Brandon Moss, David Pauley, David Murphy, Luis Soto, Jacoby Ellsbury, Jed Lowrie, Abe Alvarez, Ryan Phillips, Clay Buchholz, Mike Rozier, Edgar MArtinez, Alejandro Machado I doubt the current group touches that level of production
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Post by Steve Henley on May 2, 2013 10:42:42 GMT -5
our top 20 from september 2005 (after the draft, before hanley and anibal got traded) Papelbon, Lester, Anibal Sanchez, Hanley Ramirez, Craig Hansen, Manny Delcarmen, Dustin Pedroia, Kelly Shappach, Brandon Moss, David Pauley, David Murphy, Luis Soto, Jacoby Ellsbury, Jed Lowrie, Abe Alvarez, Ryan Phillips, Clay Buchholz, Mike Rozier, Edgar MArtinez, Alejandro Machado I doubt the current group touches that level of production Yeah, that 2005 Portland team alone had fifteen guys who would later play in the majors (not counting guys who had already debuted and were just hanging on). 8 of them (Moss, Murphy, Ramirez, Pedroia, Lester, Papelbon, Sanchez, Delcarmen) would post career WAR better than 3.
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Post by elguapo on May 2, 2013 21:17:47 GMT -5
Which reminds me of how overrated Kalish always was as a prospect. That's still an open question, and may always be. Maybe he'll get healthy and have major league success. Maybe he would have had success already absent injury. Maybe neither.
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