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Post by pappyman99 on Aug 3, 2024 7:17:35 GMT -5
If he can hit better than Hamilton I rather have him for his more fluid defense at 2B and a switch hitter
Hamilton is a great bench piece with speed
Craig will be extremely busy with trades this offseason as we are finding the nice problems of logjams at positions
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 3, 2024 7:59:47 GMT -5
I like Sogard but the guy was a .279 hitter at age 25 in Worcester. Thats not that overly impressive.
I'd rather have Hamilton on my bench than Sogard although at the moment there's room for both as they platoon.
Sogard can play the 2018 Ian Kinsler role for now. That's fine but eventually Grissom or even Campbell will seize the 2b job as a regular and should run with it.
I think Hamilton will be the main utility guy, unless he's dealt which would open up a spot for Sogard depending upon what happens with Meidroth who does give off some Brock Holt vibes.
I think the walks will certainly fall off for Meidroth as he will get challenged a lot more. Will he hit enough? That I don't know. I'm sure he'll continue to get more than his fair share of walks. With Meidroth he could sneak into the 2b job if both Grissom and Campbell dont cut it, or like Hamilton could be a valuable bench piece, or even traded to become a regular for another team with a need.
Of course Story clouds the issue as I'm assuming hes the SS to begin next season but could eventually cede SS to Mayer and go to 2b if need be. Truth of the matter is I have trouble seeing him staying healthy for an extended period, but if Sale can do it....
The Sox just have so many options I think there would have to be a lot of trades to elevate Sogard into a long term bench piece.
I'm happy for him that he got his chance yesterday and played well. I just think going forward, particularly beyond this year it'll take a lot to keep him on the roster and I dont think hes much more than a .250 hitter or so. He can help out sone teams. Just dont think it will be for the Sox much beyond now and When Casas comes back I think Sogard winds up back in AAA
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Aug 3, 2024 8:29:39 GMT -5
I like Sogard but the guy was a .279 hitter at age 25 in Worcester. Thats not that overly impressive. I'd rather have Hamilton on my bench than Sogard although at the moment there's room for both as they platoon. Sogard can play the 2018 Ian Kinsler role for now. That's fine but eventually Grissom or even Campbell will seize the 2b job as a regular and should run with it. I think Hamilton will be the main utility guy, unless he's dealt which would open up a spot for Sogard depending upon what happens with Meidroth who does give off some Brock Holt vibes. I think the walks will certainly fall off for Meidroth as he will get challenged a lot more. Will he hit enough? That I don't know. I'm sure he'll continue to get more than his fair share of walks. With Meidroth he could sneak into the 2b job if both Grissom and Campbell dont cut it, or like Hamilton could be a valuable bench piece, or even traded to become a regular for another team with a need. Of course Story clouds the issue as I'm assuming hes the SS to begin next season but could eventually cede SS to Mayer and go to 2b if need be. Truth of the matter is I have trouble seeing him staying healthy for an extended period, but if Sale can do it.... The Sox just have so many options I think there would have to be a lot of trades to elevate Sogard into a long term bench piece. I'm happy for him that he got his chance yesterday and played well. I just think going forward, particularly beyond this year it'll take a lot to keep him on the roster and I dont think hes much more than a .250 hitter or so. He can help out sone teams. Just dont think it will be for the Sox much beyond now and When Casas comes back I think Sogard winds up back in AAA I mean it’s a .382 OBP and a little juice in his bat, that’s pretty damn good for a middle infielder lol Agree that he’s unlikely a long term solution here but we don’t need to act like his year in Worcester has been mediocre
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 3, 2024 8:32:54 GMT -5
I like Sogard but the guy was a .279 hitter at age 25 in Worcester. Thats not that overly impressive. I'd rather have Hamilton on my bench than Sogard although at the moment there's room for both as they platoon. Sogard can play the 2018 Ian Kinsler role for now. That's fine but eventually Grissom or even Campbell will seize the 2b job as a regular and should run with it. I think Hamilton will be the main utility guy, unless he's dealt which would open up a spot for Sogard depending upon what happens with Meidroth who does give off some Brock Holt vibes. I think the walks will certainly fall off for Meidroth as he will get challenged a lot more. Will he hit enough? That I don't know. I'm sure he'll continue to get more than his fair share of walks. With Meidroth he could sneak into the 2b job if both Grissom and Campbell dont cut it, or like Hamilton could be a valuable bench piece, or even traded to become a regular for another team with a need. Of course Story clouds the issue as I'm assuming hes the SS to begin next season but could eventually cede SS to Mayer and go to 2b if need be. Truth of the matter is I have trouble seeing him staying healthy for an extended period, but if Sale can do it.... The Sox just have so many options I think there would have to be a lot of trades to elevate Sogard into a long term bench piece. I'm happy for him that he got his chance yesterday and played well. I just think going forward, particularly beyond this year it'll take a lot to keep him on the roster and I dont think hes much more than a .250 hitter or so. He can help out sone teams. Just dont think it will be for the Sox much beyond now and When Casas comes back I think Sogard winds up back in AAA I mean it’s a .382 OBP, that’s pretty damn good lol It is but pitchers normally have better control and command in the majors so a portion of those walks do go away and you do wind up relying more on the hit tool because the free pass isnt quite as prevalent in the majors. But like you point out hes not a hacker, so he would be less prone to getting himself out, which can be half the battle at times.
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Aug 3, 2024 9:11:41 GMT -5
I mean it’s a .382 OBP, that’s pretty damn good lol It is but pitchers normally have better control and command in the majors so a portion of those walks do go away and you do wind up relying more on the hit tool because the free pass isnt quite as prevalent in the majors. But like you point out hes not a hacker, so he would be less prone to getting himself out, which can be half the battle at times. Agreed- that plus his ability to hit velo probably allows him to stick as a big leaguer. If not here then somewhere else
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Aug 3, 2024 13:24:23 GMT -5
It is but pitchers normally have better control and command in the majors so a portion of those walks do go away and you do wind up relying more on the hit tool because the free pass isnt quite as prevalent in the majors. But like you point out hes not a hacker, so he would be less prone to getting himself out, which can be half the battle at times. Agreed- that plus his ability to hit velo probably allows him to stick as a big leaguer. If not here then somewhere else And that he can field pretty much every position adequately. I also hear folks out on Hamilton and his speed, but I’m opposed to carrying someone on the bench who essentially is just a pinch runner. His glove is subpar at best and he’s limited to two positions. Not to mention, it isn’t like there aren’t other guys on the club (e.g. Duran, Rafaela, Romy, Wong) who have speed. Giving a spot to Hamilton if he isn’t swinging a good bat just seems like a waste of a roster spot.
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shagworthy
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Post by shagworthy on Aug 3, 2024 13:33:14 GMT -5
Agreed- that plus his ability to hit velo probably allows him to stick as a big leaguer. If not here then somewhere else And that he can field pretty much every position adequately. I also hear folks out on Hamilton and his speed, but I’m opposed to carrying someone on the bench who essentially is just a pinch runner. His glove is subpar at best and he’s limited to two positions. Not to mention, it isn’t like there aren’t other guys on the club (e.g. Duran, Rafaela, Romy, Wong) who have speed. Giving a spot to Hamilton if he isn’t swinging a good bat just seems like a waste of a roster spot. Would agree with this, the last time I said that about Hamilton however he went on a ridiculous heater with the bat, if he hits you can overlook the warts of his glove, and his throwing arm. Even from 2nd he looks like he has to wind up to reach 1B. At this point I'll take stable production on both sides of the ball over the promise of havoc on one side of the ball when all the stars align. It's early though, we've seen 1 game of Sogard as a major leaguer. We could all be tar and feathering him in 3 weeks time if he's not at least meeting our average expectation.
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asm18
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Post by asm18 on Aug 3, 2024 13:33:36 GMT -5
Agreed- that plus his ability to hit velo probably allows him to stick as a big leaguer. If not here then somewhere else And that he can field pretty much every position adequately. I also hear folks out on Hamilton and his speed, but I’m opposed to carrying someone on the bench who essentially is just a pinch runner. His glove is subpar at best and he’s limited to two positions. Not to mention, it isn’t like there aren’t other guys on the club (e.g. Duran, Rafaela, Romy, Wong) who have speed. Giving a spot to Hamilton if he isn’t swinging a good bat just seems like a waste of a roster spot. Grissom has up until August 9th before he has to be optioned or not (when his rehab will end) so they still have another week before they have to make a decision. Might as well let Hamilton try to get out of his funk, and if it doesn’t look like that will happen… you figure it out from there
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Post by greenmonster on Aug 3, 2024 13:42:37 GMT -5
In the words of Neil Diamond....
Good Times Never Seemed So Good ... SoGard! SoGard!
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Post by Soxfansince1971 on Aug 3, 2024 13:50:42 GMT -5
Must-read story by (who else?) Alex Speier in today's (8/2) Globe. Can you name all of Nick's predecessors in the 2B vs. LHP role?
Sogard was rocking a .303 / .407 / .484 when he had a brutal stretch from June 22 to the ASB -- .155 / .279 / .224. But since then he's been his standard self, .310 / .375 / .476.
If they end up with a Jansen / Refsnyder / Smith bench when Casas returns, the Sogard vs. Romy G. competition for the last spot will be interesting.
Answer: Pablo Reses, Zack Short, Vaughn Grissom, Jamie Westbrook, Romy Gonzalez. Sixth time's the charm?
Unless Sogard absolutely catches fire the next couple of weeks, I have a very hard time seeing him staying when Casas is back seeing Romy has been generally really great off the bench. At this point, I’d prefer to see Hamilton go down. I know his speed his elite, but his bat has regressed in a big way lately. My ideal bench when Casas is back: Jansen Romy Sogard/Dom (tough call here if Dom keeps swinging a hot bat) Refsynder If and when Grissom comes back, then cut Dom or Sogard. If Hamilton does not start hitting he is the player who goes down. Your starter vs RH starters would be Sogard. I have loved how great the fit is for Dom Smith and the Red Sox, but Sogard is so much more versatile than Smith, and both can stay up in Boston as Sogard would start most games with a bench of Jansen, Romy, Refsnyder, and Smith…..all this presumes that Sogard hits remotely close to what he has done the last 4 years in AAA.
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Post by Soxfansince1971 on Aug 3, 2024 13:56:13 GMT -5
Romy: 113 wRC+ in MLB. Sogard: 115 wRC+ in AAA Romy: fast. Sogard: not that fast Defense is probably a wash?
I don't see this competition as particularly close.
Not to mention Romy hits the ball WAY harder. Sogard’s exit velos are pretty bad. I do not see the competition between Romy and Sogard. I see it between Sogard and Hamilton….
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Aug 3, 2024 14:07:02 GMT -5
And that he can field pretty much every position adequately. I also hear folks out on Hamilton and his speed, but I’m opposed to carrying someone on the bench who essentially is just a pinch runner. His glove is subpar at best and he’s limited to two positions. Not to mention, it isn’t like there aren’t other guys on the club (e.g. Duran, Rafaela, Romy, Wong) who have speed. Giving a spot to Hamilton if he isn’t swinging a good bat just seems like a waste of a roster spot. Grissom has up until August 9th before he has to be optioned or not (when his rehab will end) so they still have another week before they have to make a decision. Might as well let Hamilton try to get out of his funk, and if it doesn’t look like that will happen… you figure it out from there Seems like from multiple reports is that Grissom will be optioned when his rehab is done. This makes sense as it allows you to carry Dom for August then bring up Grissom in September when rosters expand.
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Post by soxin8 on Aug 3, 2024 15:49:05 GMT -5
Last night in the post game interview, Nick said he had wondered if this day would ever happen. I remember watching him in Hartford batting 9th for Portland, hitting .250 without any power threat, thinking the same thing. I didn't see the offensive explosion he had this year coming. Did anybody? Really happy for him and his family and wish him continued success.
It's extra special he and his family grew up Sox fans.
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Post by okin15 on Aug 5, 2024 14:22:03 GMT -5
Grissom has up until August 9th before he has to be optioned or not (when his rehab will end) so they still have another week before they have to make a decision. Might as well let Hamilton try to get out of his funk, and if it doesn’t look like that will happen… you figure it out from there Seems like from multiple reports is that Grissom will be optioned when his rehab is done. This makes sense as it allows you to carry Dom for August then bring up Grissom in September when rosters expand. Yeah, I wonder if they're trying to avoid burning options for any of Sogard, Hamilton, Romy G, or Grissom, while still keeping Dom Smith. They each would have up to 19 days to spend in the minors (after being added to the 40-man roster). Romy and Hamilton each played a handful of days in Worcester at the beginning of the season, but either could be optioned for the 10-day minimum if needed. Grissom will have to come up right before the end of August unless they play a little loose with the Yet to Report designation at each end of that option. Looks like Casas will also want to return to the roster before September 1, so they'll need a roster spot for him at some point. Unless he forces their hand (or it "works itself out"), I could see Sogard being a brief option when they need a roster spot, followed by a September call-up 19 days later. How many September call-ups do they get?
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Post by rickasadoorian on Aug 5, 2024 14:46:22 GMT -5
Seems like from multiple reports is that Grissom will be optioned when his rehab is done. This makes sense as it allows you to carry Dom for August then bring up Grissom in September when rosters expand. Yeah, I wonder if they're trying to avoid burning options for any of Sogard, Hamilton, Romy G, or Grissom, while still keeping Dom Smith. They each would have up to 19 days to spend in the minors (after being added to the 40-man roster). Romy and Hamilton each played a handful of days in Worcester at the beginning of the season, but either could be optioned for the 10-day minimum if needed. Grissom will have to come up right before the end of August unless they play a little loose with the Yet to Report designation at each end of that option. Looks like Casas will also want to return to the roster before September 1, so they'll need a roster spot for him at some point. Unless he forces their hand (or it "works itself out"), I could see Sogard being a brief option when they need a roster spot, followed by a September call-up 19 days later. How many September call-ups do they get?
Grissom I could see not wanting to burn an option on, but not so much Sogard, Hamilton and Romy G. All 3 will be under team control into their 30s anyway. They already have control of their peak years. I can't imagine a 33 yo Hamilton, a 33 year old Romy and a 34 year old Sogard to have much value. Nevermind the 34 and 35 year old versions. They are already pretty marginal. I can't see them being all that good at 33+. The extra year of control just isn't worth jerking them around to manipulate service time. Grissom would be 30. His age 31 season could have some value so it may be worth doing so with him.
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Post by soxin8 on Aug 5, 2024 15:10:39 GMT -5
Seems like from multiple reports is that Grissom will be optioned when his rehab is done. This makes sense as it allows you to carry Dom for August then bring up Grissom in September when rosters expand. Yeah, I wonder if they're trying to avoid burning options for any of Sogard, Hamilton, Romy G, or Grissom, while still keeping Dom Smith. They each would have up to 19 days to spend in the minors (after being added to the 40-man roster). Romy and Hamilton each played a handful of days in Worcester at the beginning of the season, but either could be optioned for the 10-day minimum if needed. Grissom will have to come up right before the end of August unless they play a little loose with the Yet to Report designation at each end of that option. Looks like Casas will also want to return to the roster before September 1, so they'll need a roster spot for him at some point. Unless he forces their hand (or it "works itself out"), I could see Sogard being a brief option when they need a roster spot, followed by a September call-up 19 days later. How many September call-ups do they get?
Rosters expand from 26 to 28.
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Post by okin15 on Aug 5, 2024 16:21:40 GMT -5
Yeah, I wonder if they're trying to avoid burning options for any of Sogard, Hamilton, Romy G, or Grissom, while still keeping Dom Smith. They each would have up to 19 days to spend in the minors (after being added to the 40-man roster). Romy and Hamilton each played a handful of days in Worcester at the beginning of the season, but either could be optioned for the 10-day minimum if needed. Grissom will have to come up right before the end of August unless they play a little loose with the Yet to Report designation at each end of that option. Looks like Casas will also want to return to the roster before September 1, so they'll need a roster spot for him at some point. Unless he forces their hand (or it "works itself out"), I could see Sogard being a brief option when they need a roster spot, followed by a September call-up 19 days later. How many September call-ups do they get?
Grissom I could see not wanting to burn an option on, but not so much Sogard, Hamilton and Romy G. All 3 will be under team control into their 30s anyway. They already have control of their peak years. I can't imagine a 33 yo Hamilton, a 33 year old Romy and a 34 year old Sogard to have much value. Nevermind the 34 and 35 year old versions. They are already pretty marginal. I can't see them being all that good at 33+. The extra year of control just isn't worth jerking them around to manipulate service time. Grissom would be 30. His age 31 season could have some value so it may be worth doing so with him. it's not about years of control, but option years, IE, years they can bounce back and forth on the Worcester shuttle. All three of those guys could very much be that type of player (and it's hard to know Grissom won't be as well). Honestly, it's better for the player to have that option as well... makes them more employable if they're not quite a MLB regular. BUT I forgot it was only a 28-man roster in September (ty SoxIn8). They'll probably want one of their two adds to be a P, so something's gotta give, whether it's one of those 4 burning an option, or losing Smith, or an injury (to almost any infielder). Fingers crossed it's not the last, but as mentioned, Sogard's agent might prefer a DL stint to burning an option given the pay differential and career ramifications.
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Post by nonothing on Aug 6, 2024 21:38:39 GMT -5
Grissom I could see not wanting to burn an option on, but not so much Sogard, Hamilton and Romy G. All 3 will be under team control into their 30s anyway. They already have control of their peak years. I can't imagine a 33 yo Hamilton, a 33 year old Romy and a 34 year old Sogard to have much value. Nevermind the 34 and 35 year old versions. They are already pretty marginal. I can't see them being all that good at 33+. The extra year of control just isn't worth jerking them around to manipulate service time. Grissom would be 30. His age 31 season could have some value so it may be worth doing so with him. it's not about years of control, but option years, IE, years they can bounce back and forth on the Worcester shuttle. All three of those guys could very much be that type of player (and it's hard to know Grissom won't be as well). Honestly, it's better for the player to have that option as well... makes them more employable if they're not quite a MLB regular. BUT I forgot it was only a 28-man roster in September (ty SoxIn8). They'll probably want one of their two adds to be a P, so something's gotta give, whether it's one of those 4 burning an option, or losing Smith, or an injury (to almost any infielder). Fingers crossed it's not the last, but as mentioned, Sogard's agent might prefer a DL stint to burning an option given the pay differential and career ramifications. Not sure if by Sept 1, but Story and Hendriks might turn out to be their roster adds in Sept. A little non-traditional, but there may not be any spots for.young guys to move up. If that's the case, they would be in good shape though.
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Aug 6, 2024 22:04:17 GMT -5
it's not about years of control, but option years, IE, years they can bounce back and forth on the Worcester shuttle. All three of those guys could very much be that type of player (and it's hard to know Grissom won't be as well). Honestly, it's better for the player to have that option as well... makes them more employable if they're not quite a MLB regular. BUT I forgot it was only a 28-man roster in September (ty SoxIn8). They'll probably want one of their two adds to be a P, so something's gotta give, whether it's one of those 4 burning an option, or losing Smith, or an injury (to almost any infielder). Fingers crossed it's not the last, but as mentioned, Sogard's agent might prefer a DL stint to burning an option given the pay differential and career ramifications. Not sure if by Sept 1, but Story and Hendriks might turn out to be their roster adds in Sept. A little non-traditional, but there may not be any spots for.young guys to move up. If that's the case, they would be in good shape though. Has there been news on Story I’ve missed?
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 6, 2024 22:40:08 GMT -5
it's not about years of control, but option years, IE, years they can bounce back and forth on the Worcester shuttle. All three of those guys could very much be that type of player (and it's hard to know Grissom won't be as well). Honestly, it's better for the player to have that option as well... makes them more employable if they're not quite a MLB regular. BUT I forgot it was only a 28-man roster in September (ty SoxIn8). They'll probably want one of their two adds to be a P, so something's gotta give, whether it's one of those 4 burning an option, or losing Smith, or an injury (to almost any infielder). Fingers crossed it's not the last, but as mentioned, Sogard's agent might prefer a DL stint to burning an option given the pay differential and career ramifications. Not sure if by Sept 1, but Story and Hendriks might turn out to be their roster adds in Sept. A little non-traditional, but there may not be any spots for.young guys to move up. If that's the case, they would be in good shape though. FWIW, September roster expansion hasn't been about the "kids" since they cut it back to 28. It's always a veteran RP and a third catcher or some similarly boring complimentary bench piece. Like if it's not Hendriks it's going to be Weissert or Booser or they activate Slaten without optioning someone.
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Aug 7, 2024 1:22:21 GMT -5
Not sure if by Sept 1, but Story and Hendriks might turn out to be their roster adds in Sept. A little non-traditional, but there may not be any spots for.young guys to move up. If that's the case, they would be in good shape though. Has there been news on Story I’ve missed? Story has apparently progressed really quickly. Already been doing soft toss. Cora said there was a chance he could make it back this season. That said, question: does a player have to be on the active 28 man roster on Sept 1st to qualify to play in the playoffs, or can they be on the 40 man?
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Post by rkarp on Aug 7, 2024 4:45:33 GMT -5
www.mlb.com/news/red-sox-injuries-and-roster-movesSS Trevor Story (dislocated left shoulder) Expected return: Late 2024 or start of '25 Red Sox manager Alex Cora was recently encouraged when he watched Story hit soft toss, and hasn't ruled out the possibility of the shortstop returning late in the season. Story progressed to hitting overhand as of Aug. 5, and was with Boston on its trip to Kansas City. Story dislocated his shoulder diving for a ball on April 5 in Anaheim. He was transferred from the 10-day IL to the 60-day IL on April 19. "He's hit underhand tosses this past weekend, and now it's overhand. And in his words, 'That's close to BP,'" Cora said on Aug. 5. "He's excited about it. "I never thought we were going to get to this point, so I'm excited. Obviously not 100% that it is going to happen, but the fact that he is doing everything possible to make it happen is great. He's moving well, his swing looks great. Obviously, there's a lot of stuff that we need to do before this becomes a reality." (Last updated: Aug. 5)
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Post by orion09 on Aug 7, 2024 6:04:37 GMT -5
Has there been news on Story I’ve missed? Story has apparently progressed really quickly. Already been doing soft toss. Cora said there was a chance he could make it back this season. That said, question: does a player have to be on the active 28 man roster on Sept 1st to qualify to play in the playoffs, or can they be on the 40 man? www.mlb.com/glossary/transactions/postseason-roster-rules-eligibility
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Post by Underwater Johnson on Aug 7, 2024 8:52:49 GMT -5
Has there been news on Story I’ve missed? Story has apparently progressed really quickly. Already been doing soft toss. Cora said there was a chance he could make it back this season. That said, question: does a player have to be on the active 28 man roster on Sept 1st to qualify to play in the playoffs, or can they be on the 40 man? They just have to be in the org as of that date (I believe 9/1 is correct) but if they weren’t on the 40-man at that point they’d have to be replacing an injured player. So Montgomery, Elmer and Password could all get calls out of the blue on Oct 1st and be on the playoff roster if they were replacing injured players. Of course, they would have to add them to the 40-man at that point.
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art
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Post by art on Aug 7, 2024 11:39:24 GMT -5
In regard to the Hamilton vs Sogard discussion, one issue I have with Hamilton is that twice in about the last week he has watched strike 3 go by with a runner on 3B and nobody out. In that situation you gotta swing at the pitch if it's close to the plate.
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