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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 18, 2016 12:49:00 GMT -5
This is why I want them to put dates on when the scouting reports are written. Most are pretty outdated.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 18, 2016 12:41:18 GMT -5
OMG. A fifth starter question? And then Sonny Gray's name comes up. What complete BS. They're not going to consider Gray because thye hve trouble with the 5th starter. Personally, I think Wright will be excellent in that role. If they need to get Gray, it's because Buchholz, Porcello, and/or Kelley have been awful or hurt and they're still potentially in it. Another stupid article from the Boston media that takes a mild concern (5th starter) and tries make the leap for a Sonny Gray trade. A little weird disjointed writing here, but actually reading the entire article helps clear it up. It sounds like the general consensus among scouts and industry people is summed up by this: “They can’t be comfortable with any arm behind [David] Price,” said the second scout. “They don’t have the luxury of waiting on ‘what if’ with [Joe] Kelly, [Rick] Porcello, and [Clay Buchholz]. Not after last year.” And that that is probably what is leading some to think about a Gray/big time SP trade. I don't think Boston Media is jumping to Gray because Elias or Wright gets a start or two, it's because Buch, Porcello look meh and E-Rod is still only using his leg gingerly.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 18, 2016 12:30:22 GMT -5
Radio is going nuts with Sale trade chatter now that he's going to war with Kenny Williams.
Realistically, if Williams traded Sale I think there'd be a damn walk out in that clubhouse.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 16, 2016 17:00:51 GMT -5
And the Miller trade is a great comp, because it shows you what the market was this winter for trading pitching. Them having to "overpay" was the actual price. That was the market. If you want to go out and buy a Shelby Mustang, yeah the sticker is 65k but you're most likely going to be paying a dealer markup of 15 grand on top of that.
I agree Donaldson trade isn't a good comp for anything, because A.) it's Beane, he's routinely goes against the grain in who and what he values, and B.) Donaldson was coming off a .798ops season, and didn't have quite the same "elite" track record that Sale has.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 16, 2016 16:56:35 GMT -5
To respond to a couple other arguments from the last page of the thread: -The Shelby Miller deal is not really a useful comparison. By all accounts, the Diamondbacks significantly overpaid, and one aberrant deal does not set the market. I could just as well point to the Josh Donaldson trade and say, look, we should be able to get Sale for Devers, Holt and spare pieces, but that's not really a fair comparison, either. -The longer the White Sox wait to trade Sale, the less of a package they're going to get. David Price is a player of comparable quality, and neither of his recent trades really returned a monster package, largely because teams no longer trade multiple blue-chip prospects for a year or two of team control. -I agree that neither team would be motivated to do such a deal and so it's a moot discussion. But if that changed, I do think Betts would be close to fair value for Sale. You people are living in fantasy world. I agree Betts is a wildly valuable player. But there's a reason it takes a ton of talent to get established elite big leaguers. Betts for Sale, at this point in time, is not realistic. No GM is looking at a fangraphs article and saying "oh okay, this adds up." We see it time and time again, that when you have an elite guy, under control long term for great dollars, it takes a wild overpay, nearly every time. And overpay is the wrong word, because it's something we set, instead of looking at the market and using ACTUAL deals to rationalize prices. White Sox have zero reason at this point in time to sell. They have zero incentive to make a deal that we consider "FAIR VALUE". Hence, Betts for Sale, is a pipedream.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 16, 2016 16:50:00 GMT -5
Actually, it's not as bad as it sounds. Apparently he brought the kid in every day and Williams just asked that he not bring him nearly as often. Frankly, it seems reasonable. Yeah, this is totally on Laroche. No one else brings in their kid 100% of the time. I wouldn't be shocked if it irritated some players, and lots of the clubhouse staff who have to babysit the kid at times. Plus LaRoche was coming off an awful year, they probably wanted him to be more focused. Regardless, it's not a freakin' daycare. LaRoche is 100% in the wrong.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 15, 2016 18:19:02 GMT -5
Speier says he had it pinned today, 6 weeks till throwing
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 15, 2016 18:00:15 GMT -5
Nice job by Hanley bailing out Pablo.
Not a repetition play either, this was a in-play adjustment he had to make off instincts. Good to see.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 15, 2016 17:26:22 GMT -5
Is this Xander hitting cleanup now a set in stone thing?
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 15, 2016 12:34:15 GMT -5
You can't even really put a Price on Sale. There's so much control left that the asking price is just almost indeterminable. They can wait 2-3 years and if he's the same guy they can still get a similar package. Sure - but, the control on Mookie is longer......(2-5 years vs 2-4 years) If the White Sox became sellers, Mookie is probably the best they can get for Sale. But I agree, they're unlikely to trade Sale unless they think he's an injury risk. Here is Dave Cameron's trade value list - with Mookie at 6 and Sale at 11. As Mookie had a stronger 2nd half than Sale, I'm betting they're about dead even. www.fangraphs.com/blogs/2015-trade-value-the-full-list/Sorry man, you're reading the list wrong.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 13, 2016 17:11:57 GMT -5
Mookie is playing way too deep in RF, at least sometimes ~ 1 meter in front of warning track. The defense overall is just atrocious Good thing Farrell hired crack baseball mind Ruben Amaro to coach the OFers
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 13, 2016 17:09:35 GMT -5
You have to overpay for guys like Sale, which is why they don't get traded. So you're both right. You can't even really put a Price on Sale. There's so much control left that the asking price is just almost indeterminable. They can wait 2-3 years and if he's the same guy they can still get a similar package.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 13, 2016 17:07:53 GMT -5
If DD was offered Sale straight up for Betts at the beginning of the offseason I believe he would have pulled the trigger near instantaneously. Once he got Price, no, then the deal doesn't make quite the same sense. The narrative for the offseason was that DD went around figuring out the asking prices for Ace starting pitching early on, so of course that's the timing I was assuming. Essentially Betts would have went for Sale, DD would have acquired O'Day and Smith, and then probably signed a higher profile OFer than Young.
Hell, 3 years of Shelby Miller took a 4 WAR OFer under control for 5 seasons, a #1 prospect (both system and draft) who they just gave 6.5mill to, and a highly rated pitching prospect.
Sale is far and away a better pitcher with an extra year of control.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 13, 2016 13:35:38 GMT -5
Lol, Betts for Sale would never get it done. I'm sorry to tell you that, but it's the absolute truth. 2015 rWAR for Betts 6.00 for Sale 3.3. Betts has 8.1 wars in 1 and a 1/3 seasons, that is very very elite. Betts is 3 years younger and makes a lot less money. So how do you think Sale has a higher trade value??
By saying Betts would never get it done, all your saying is that the White Sox won't trade Sale at all. There is a 99% chance that Betts straight up for Sale is by far and away the best deal they could ever get. Then add in the fact that with Sales build and the way he throws everyone worries that at some point he's going to have injuries(you just don't know when). You have no such worries with Betts.
Are you a White Sox fan?? The way you value Sale to Betts makes it seem that you are.
I'm sorry dude, but you're wrong. It's not a straight WAR comparison. Sale has the track record of a perennial top 5 cy young finalist year after year. It's the absolute hardest thing to find in baseball, and he's on a great contract. It makes no sense for them to trade Sale anyway the way they're set up. His value is almost indeterminable with how good of contract he's on. They can wait two years and if he's the same guy can trade him for essentially the same package. I personally wouldn't do it, but I bet if White Sox offered Sale for Betts, DD would have pulled the trigger.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 13, 2016 13:27:53 GMT -5
Damn, I really like Elias. He's a lot better than I thought he'd be. Definitely not just a throw in. DD did good His numbers in the majors have been totally serviceable as a mlb starter
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 13, 2016 13:27:22 GMT -5
Michael Silverman (@mikesilvermanbb) tweeted "Appeared as if Swihart failed a concussion protocol administered by trainer, w Farrell standing close by. Swihart stayed on feet, walked off"
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 13, 2016 13:22:31 GMT -5
Let's hope no concussion for Swihart
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 13, 2016 13:03:03 GMT -5
Lol, Betts for Sale would never get it done. I'm sorry to tell you that, but it's the absolute truth. That's pretty much why none of these trades will ever get done. I wouldn't trade Betts either. I agree with all that.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 13, 2016 12:59:08 GMT -5
Haven't been watching to closely, but has JBJ lost a step out there in center? Severely doubt it. Maybe in a couple of years. Is there a reason you ask or are you just curious? Single into left center looked catchable. Remember thinking something similar a few times over his last few starts.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 13, 2016 12:38:10 GMT -5
Haven't been watching to closely, but has JBJ lost a step out there in center?
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 13, 2016 12:25:41 GMT -5
They're not going to accept a plethora of 4/5 starters and Swihart for Sale. If you want Sale you better be ready to part with Betts, Rodriguez, and probably two high level prospects.
The White Sox are not positioned to sell. They've got good players under reasonable contracts. Sale for 4 years under good money, Rodon poised to take a step forward, Quintana under a great deal, Abreu on a great deal, Brett Lawrie with a few more years, Eaton under a reasonable contract, Garcia under control and looking AMAZING with his new stance and approach this spring. Heck, they just added a 35 homer bat in Todd Frazier.
They have a great core under reasonable money, there is no reason to sell them off. If they want, they can trade guys like Lawrie, LaRoche, Frazier, and Melky at the deadline if they blow and recoup some prospects, and figure out other things to do in the offseason. Come on, I wouldn't trade Betts straight up for Sale. Betts has to be top5 in the trade value for the whole league. Look at last years salary and WAR and get back to me. Lol, Betts for Sale would never get it done. I'm sorry to tell you that, but it's the absolute truth.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 12, 2016 18:34:37 GMT -5
Another SS injured, Corey Seager to get knee MRI
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 12, 2016 17:00:36 GMT -5
I keep worrying Shaw is going to be a mirage, but I can't argue with the freaking numbers or how balanced he looks at the plate at the moment.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 12, 2016 14:36:56 GMT -5
Any implications for Amendola with the Hogan signing?
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Mar 12, 2016 14:10:49 GMT -5
David Freese, a 2.2 WAR 3B in 2015 literally just signed for peanuts after getting little to no interest Freese is 33, played in 121 games last season, horrible k/bb ratio, mediocre hit tool, no power or on base ability. Not familiar with his defense. Yeah, and Freese is that unimpressive and he's still 4 WAR above Panda. My point is no one was gagging for a third baseman. And certainly not for Panda.
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