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2013 Offseason non-Sox MLB Discussion
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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Nov 5, 2013 16:19:20 GMT -5
Rangers sign Soto for a little over $3 million plus incentives .
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 6, 2013 6:44:56 GMT -5
Bard made his first appearance in the Puerto Rico winter league yesterday. Four batters. 1 BB, 3 HBP. Added a WP for good measure. Just sad at this point.
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Post by nexus on Nov 6, 2013 10:33:21 GMT -5
A former Penthouse model who loves guns. Who could have ever predicted this outcome?
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 6, 2013 12:53:15 GMT -5
Nexus unless that is a second occurrence, this story is so old we might as well bring up Wil Cordero...
Well maybe not nearly that old, but it's been around for a bit..
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Post by Oregon Norm on Nov 6, 2013 13:00:39 GMT -5
Nexus unless that is a second occurrence, this story is so old we might as well bring up Wil Cordero... Well maybe not nearly that old, but it's been around for a bit.. This is actually one of the last things Elmore Leonard wrote, about a month before he died. He shopped it around and ABC news bought it if I remember right.
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Post by nexus on Nov 6, 2013 13:16:07 GMT -5
Nexus unless that is a second occurrence, this story is so old we might as well bring up Wil Cordero... Well maybe not nearly that old, but it's been around for a bit.. Wow. Guess yesterday's sentencing was what brought the story back up to the surface. Sorry, folks. I'll go back under the rock and keep to myself.
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 6, 2013 13:17:42 GMT -5
Nexus unless that is a second occurrence, this story is so old we might as well bring up Wil Cordero... Well maybe not nearly that old, but it's been around for a bit.. Wow. Guess yesterday's sentencing was what brought the story back up to the surface. Sorry, folks. I'll go back under the rock and keep to myself. Honestly, it's a funny story that I never dislike hearing so feel free to bring it up every few months if you'd like.
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Post by grandsalami on Nov 6, 2013 15:46:46 GMT -5
What are the odds the cubs planted this NON STORY
Peter Gammons ?@pgammo 33m Held back from what?
Peter Gammons ?@pgammo 32m No one asked to speak to him
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Post by wcsoxfan on Nov 6, 2013 15:57:20 GMT -5
A former Penthouse model who loves guns. Who could have ever predicted this outcome? A lesson to the young kids out there: Have a fun time - but ' You don't Marry the stripper'
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Post by pedroelgrande on Nov 6, 2013 18:54:09 GMT -5
Rick Renteria will be the new Cubs' manager per the twitterverse Also this from Gammons regarding Lovullo: Edit: Also this is the last year before the mass exodus of Red Sox personnel leaving to go "win" with the Cubs.
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Post by Don Caballero on Nov 6, 2013 19:55:41 GMT -5
Also this is the last year before the mass exodus of Red Sox personnel leaving to go "win" with the Cubs. I know you are kidding, but the Cubs are a strongly middle of the road team. Their system is good, but is not stacked by any means, and there are just too many holes about everywhere. It's been a good while since Theo last been a good GM.
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Post by charliezink16 on Nov 6, 2013 20:46:18 GMT -5
Also this is the last year before the mass exodus of Red Sox personnel leaving to go "win" with the Cubs. I know you are kidding, but the Cubs are a strongly middle of the road team. Their system is good, but is not stacked by any means, and there are just too many holes about everywhere. It's been a good while since Theo last been a good GM. I disagree with you here Don. Chicago may have the best group of hitting prospects in all of baseball. Alcantara at 2B, Dan Vogelbach at 1B, Mike Olt & Kris Bryant at 3B, Albert Almora in center, Jorge Soler in RF, and of course the (2nd) best power hitting SS prospect in baseball in Javier Baez. I think they easily have the best hitting farm system in baseball, and it's hard to think of a recent group of prospects with such power potential. The future of the team will in part hinge on these guys staying healthy/panning out, but still they have good pitching prospects too, and big market money. For Theo, ideally the core of these guys come up ~2015, and he makes a couple free agent splashes between (2014 & 2016). And I still view Theo as a good GM, I just think us Sox fans have a biased view due to how he went out, and how Ben C has spoiled this fan base since he took over. I can easily say that Ben Cherington is the best general manager in baseball.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Nov 6, 2013 20:51:57 GMT -5
Also this is the last year before the mass exodus of Red Sox personnel leaving to go "win" with the Cubs. I know you are kidding, but the Cubs are a strongly middle of the road team. Their system is good, but is not stacked by any means, and there are just too many holes about everywhere. It's been a good while since Theo last been a good GM.Yeah, because he hasn't been a GM since he went to the Cubs.
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Post by Don Caballero on Nov 6, 2013 20:57:23 GMT -5
I know you are kidding, but the Cubs are a strongly middle of the road team. Their system is good, but is not stacked by any means, and there are just too many holes about everywhere. It's been a good while since Theo last been a good GM.Yeah, because he hasn't been a GM since he went to the Cubs. You know what I meant. Perhaps my view of Theo is too rough since, as charliezink16 points out, they are in better shape than they were before. Maybe I'm still not over how he completely mailed in his last years as a Red Sox GM.
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 6, 2013 21:02:06 GMT -5
Did he mail them in? That's a bit unfair and speculative.
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Post by johnsilver52 on Nov 6, 2013 21:08:34 GMT -5
Hmmm... That 2011 draft, with Epstein and his people in charge of it doesn't look very "mailed in" to me.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 7, 2013 16:09:44 GMT -5
I know you are kidding, but the Cubs are a strongly middle of the road team. Their system is good, but is not stacked by any means, and there are just too many holes about everywhere. It's been a good while since Theo last been a good GM. I disagree with you here Don. Chicago may have the best group of hitting prospects in all of baseball. Alcantara at 2B, Dan Vogelbach at 1B, Mike Olt & Kris Bryant at 3B, Albert Almora in center, Jorge Soler in RF, and of course the (2nd) best power hitting SS prospect in baseball in Javier Baez. I think they easily have the best hitting farm system in baseball, and it's hard to think of a recent group of prospects with such power potential. The future of the team will in part hinge on these guys staying healthy/panning out, but still they have good pitching prospects too, and big market money. For Theo, ideally the core of these guys come up ~2015, and he makes a couple free agent splashes between (2014 & 2016). And I still view Theo as a good GM, I just think us Sox fans have a biased view due to how he went out, and how Ben C has spoiled this fan base since he took over. I can easily say that Ben Cherington is the best general manager in baseball. This. Cubs have, at worst, a top ten farm system. More likely that they're ranked top 5.
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Post by soxfanatic on Nov 7, 2013 16:14:35 GMT -5
The Rangers have extended Martin Perez for 4 years and 3 club options. The guaranteed money is $12.5 million.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Nov 7, 2013 17:45:02 GMT -5
Yeah, because he hasn't been a GM since he went to the Cubs. You know what I meant. Perhaps my view of Theo is too rough since, as charliezink16 points out, they are in better shape than they were before. Maybe I'm still not over how he completely mailed in his last years as a Red Sox GM.I think that's ridiculous and I think the Cubs have been extremely well run since he and his team took over.
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Post by Don Caballero on Nov 7, 2013 19:13:04 GMT -5
I think that's ridiculous and I think the Cubs have been extremely well run since he and his team took over. That depends on how you view their system, because the ML roster has nothing outside of Rizzo and Castro. There is some real potential there, but it's actually nowhere near that KC system from a few years back and I really don't remember people claiming Dayton Moore was doing a extremely good job. We'll know in a couple of years. He was NOT a good GM in his last years with the Red Sox for whatever reason, I can't see how claiming that is ridiculous.
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Post by James Dunne on Nov 7, 2013 19:28:22 GMT -5
He inherited a bad team, and the incentives for just blowing up the major league roster are higher than they were when he took over the Red Sox - not only do you get a higher draft pick, but the increase in bonus money is huge. (Aside: it's a real problem how much they've incentivized tanking, and should be addressed in the next CBA).
Theo's last draft in Boston was fantastic, and the 2010 one looks a lot better than it did a year ago, with the growth of Cecchini and Workman and the reemergence of Ranaudo. The Gonzalez trade was totally sensible, and the Lackey deal looks pretty reasonable now. To me, his only major mistake was Crawford.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Nov 7, 2013 19:37:03 GMT -5
He was NOT a good GM in his last years with the Red Sox for whatever reason, I can't see how claiming that is ridiculous. Why? He really didn't make any terrible decisions. He got a lot of terrible outcomes, but that kind of analysis is purely retrospective. Everything he did was at least defensible at the time, and more often than not his moves were praised to high heaven. The fact that a bunch of the players he brought in decided to go into mid-career tailspins at the same time... I mean, no one predicted that and I don't know how anyone could have predicted it.
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Post by Don Caballero on Nov 7, 2013 20:24:07 GMT -5
Why? He really didn't make any terrible decisions. He got a lot of terrible outcomes, but that kind of analysis is purely retrospective. Everything he did was at least defensible at the time, and more often than not his moves were praised to high heaven. The fact that a bunch of the players he brought in decided to go into mid-career tailspins at the same time... I mean, no one predicted that and I don't know how anyone could have predicted it. Nothing terrible, but there were a lot of sort of bad moves. The Lowell contract; replacing Manny with Bay (which was okay) and then with Cameron, shifting Ellsbury to LF (which was not, not for Cameron as a player, but for the OF it would create); taking really long to find any replacement for Jason Varitek's corpse; failing to have pitching depth, both starting and bullpen; the Crawford contract; the Beckett contract; the Bobby Jenks contract. The Beckett and Crawford contracts were the ones that did me in. But you can disagree you know, free country and all.
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Post by theolearyfactor on Nov 8, 2013 14:56:48 GMT -5
The Rangers have extended Martin Perez for 4 years and 3 club options. The guaranteed money is $12.5 million. I think Texas has done a really good job solidifying their rotation. Darvish gets the big bucks, Perez is now locked up until 2020, and Harrison and Holland are also locked up on reasonable, team-friendly contracts. If only they hadn't shelled out for Andrus, they'd be in a pretty interesting situation financially.
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Post by prangerx on Nov 10, 2013 9:09:27 GMT -5
The only thing that would worry me if I was a Cubs fan would be their lack of high up side pitching prospects. They seem loaded with hitting prospects. But dont seem to have many pitching prospects. Of course trades and future drafting could fix that.
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