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Post by taftreign on Nov 4, 2014 16:23:31 GMT -5
Doesn't help that he is a right handed bat either. The team really does need a lefty which would lead to the reason Sandoval has been suggested as the main target. I agree we need more LHH in the lineup, and I would concede my scenario is not likely but a healthy Hanley would probably hit RHP about as good as any LHH we could pick up for 3B in 2015. He does have a career .860 ops vs. RHP....FWIW. Just doing a basic comparison of Sandoval vs Hanley Ramirez starting in 2012 per FanGraphs: 2012: Sandoval 118 wrc+, 2.6 war Ramirez 106 wrc+, 2.9 war 2013: Sandoval 116 wrc+, 2.3 war Ramirez 191 wrc+, 5.0 war 2014: Sandoval 111 wrc+, 3.0 war Ramirez 135 wrc+, 3.4 war
2015 Steamer: Sandoval 120 wrc+, 3.8 war Ramirez 126 wrc+, 3.4 war
You could make the argument that Ramirez is the more valuable of the two given past performance and the position versatility of Hanley considering 3B and SS possibilities. Hanley is 2 years older and Pablo is the more consistent from year to year but with what may be a lower ceiling. Hanley has missed games the past few seasons and this could be a red flag. Still part of me thinks if Hanley were to move to 3rd full time it would be better for his overall game. Don't you think that if Pablo can get 5 years and 100 mil it is well within the projections for Hanley who is still only 30. I like the idea of Hanley but I think Ben would have to get creative and more active to add additional left handed hitting to the roster via trade.
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Post by moonstone2 on Nov 4, 2014 16:26:08 GMT -5
It's interesting that he doesn't have Headley on his top 10 list. He must think Headley will get less than the 4 years/$52 million he predicts for Russell Martin, his No.10 guy. I think he gets 4/48
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Post by soxfanatic on Nov 4, 2014 16:30:14 GMT -5
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Post by soxfanatic on Nov 4, 2014 17:20:35 GMT -5
Chris Cotillo ?@chriscotillo 9 min.9 minuten geleden I'm told the rumor that Sandoval is nearing agreement with the #RedSox is not even close to true.
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Post by sibbysisti on Nov 4, 2014 17:57:13 GMT -5
Ramirez off the table for the Red Sox. He going back to the.............Brewers; Aramis, that is.
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Post by greatscottcooper on Nov 4, 2014 19:15:45 GMT -5
I agree we need more LHH in the lineup, and I would concede my scenario is not likely but a healthy Hanley would probably hit RHP about as good as any LHH we could pick up for 3B in 2015. He does have a career .860 ops vs. RHP....FWIW. Just doing a basic comparison of Sandoval vs Hanley Ramirez starting in 2012 per FanGraphs: 2012: Sandoval 118 wrc+, 2.6 war Ramirez 106 wrc+, 2.9 war 2013: Sandoval 116 wrc+, 2.3 war Ramirez 191 wrc+, 5.0 war 2014: Sandoval 111 wrc+, 3.0 war Ramirez 135 wrc+, 3.4 war
2015 Steamer: Sandoval 120 wrc+, 3.8 war Ramirez 126 wrc+, 3.4 war
You could make the argument that Ramirez is the more valuable of the two given past performance and the position versatility of Hanley considering 3B and SS possibilities. Hanley is 2 years older and Pablo is the more consistent from year to year but with what may be a lower ceiling. Hanley has missed games the past few seasons and this could be a red flag. Still part of me thinks if Hanley were to move to 3rd full time it would be better for his overall game. Don't you think that if Pablo can get 5 years and 100 mil it is well within the projections for Hanley who is still only 30. I like the idea of Hanley but I think Ben would have to get creative and more active to add additional left handed hitting to the roster via trade.
I was just looking at his OPS as a quick reference, I'm sure Sandoval has better numbers than HanRam in recent years. But how much of that has been due to Sandoval being more healthy and staying on the field more??? This is why I said a healthy Ramirez could be more productive, but that doesn't mean he could stay healthy and play a full season. Still, even if he isn't fully healthy and has a season that resembles what he's done the last several years he'd still probably be better than what we have gotten out of the position recently and I still think the downside is inherently much less risky than a long term commitment in the 4-6 year range between Headley and Pablo. When it comes down to it, I'm not sold or stuck on the ideal of Ramirez coming into Boston. I'd prefer they bring in one of the big two, even if the last year or two looks bad. I was just trying to think outside the box a bit and throw around a crazy but perhaps plausible scenario.
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Post by jmei on Nov 5, 2014 17:04:16 GMT -5
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Post by jmei on Nov 5, 2014 18:00:45 GMT -5
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Post by johnsilver52 on Nov 5, 2014 18:42:08 GMT -5
I had no issue with his extension when it was given out and still don't. He's one of a handful of players in the league whom can be counted on to play at 100% of their God given ability, for as long as they can. Unlike many, who will either tank it, or back it off several notches after cashing in. He may hurt himself playing hard, but we do know it's not from lack of effort when he takes the field.
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Post by youngbillrussell on Nov 5, 2014 18:57:12 GMT -5
What will the Red Sox do with Shane Victorino?
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Post by pedroelgrande on Nov 5, 2014 19:29:25 GMT -5
According to Ken Rosenthal the Rockies are listening on CarGo and Tulo, and seem more willing to move them than in the past. fb.me/2Z4KJ6bq9
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Post by greatscottcooper on Nov 5, 2014 19:37:47 GMT -5
What will the Red Sox do with Shane Victorino? If he's healthy he is your starting right fielder. If he's not his season will mirror this past and the Sox will have to just deal with it. H
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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Nov 5, 2014 20:37:21 GMT -5
According to Ken Rosenthal the Rockies are listening on CarGo and Tulo, and seem more willing to move them than in the past. fb.me/2Z4KJ6bq9Given their ages, salaries and injury histories, I am not sure that any team would offer more than 50 cents on the dollar to trade for either one of them.
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Post by larrycook on Nov 5, 2014 21:40:55 GMT -5
According to Ken Rosenthal the Rockies are listening on CarGo and Tulo, and seem more willing to move them than in the past. fb.me/2Z4KJ6bq9Given their ages, salaries and injury histories, I am not sure that any team would offer more than 50 cents on the dollar to trade for either one of them. I would love to see tulo at short for the sox next season. I am passing on cargo.
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Post by soxcentral on Nov 6, 2014 9:34:37 GMT -5
Given his age and injury history, I wonder if Tulo could be a good value pick up for 3B.
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Post by jimed14 on Nov 6, 2014 9:55:40 GMT -5
Given his age and injury history, I wonder if Tulo could be a good value pick up for 3B. You mean like buy-low on a guy who had 5.1 fWAR in just 91 games? Pretty sure you're paying full value. And he's an above average SS so there's no point in moving him to 3rd.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 6, 2014 11:43:59 GMT -5
Yeah, he's easily the best shortstop in the game and it's not close. You're paying just as much for him as you would for Stanton probably.
Not sure what the issue would be with his age. He's going to be 30 next year and is signed through his age 34 season. This isn't the A-Rod contract.
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Post by jhenrywaugh, prop. on Nov 6, 2014 20:53:05 GMT -5
Yeah, he's easily the best shortstop in the game and it's not close. You're paying just as much for him as you would for Stanton probably. Not sure what the issue would be with his age. He's going to be 30 next year and is signed through his age 34 season. This isn't the A-Rod contract. Injuries aside, Tulo's contract is looking pretty damn good, especially given what current projections are for Sandoval. 15-19:$20M annually, 20:$14M, 21:$15M club option ($4M buyout) Chris raises in interesting question, I think. All things considered, who are you going to back up the truck of prospects for, Tulo or Stanton? On one hand, you have track record, elite defense at SS, clubhouse leader, and injury history. On the other you have youth, infinite power, and a less established track record.
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Post by grandsalami on Nov 6, 2014 20:53:33 GMT -5
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Post by brianthetaoist on Nov 6, 2014 21:05:04 GMT -5
But Vasquez reiterated that Sandoval is more mature and will not allow himself to get so overweight again that he cannot perform. HAHA ... man, that's a pretty low bar to clear there, Panda. "Look, I can't say this any more strongly: there's just no way Pablo will get so incredibly fat he literally can't swing the bat anymore. Bank on it."
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Post by xanderbogaerts2 on Nov 6, 2014 21:26:49 GMT -5
6 years? pass. I would rather go after Headley or Hanley instead if we go the FA route.
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 6, 2014 21:39:52 GMT -5
Does anyone else miss the steroid era?
I can't believe a guy like Sandoval is arguably worth 6 years at 20 per....
I'm all set with him or Headley, but what the hell do you do otherwise?
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Post by larrycook on Nov 6, 2014 22:14:11 GMT -5
Here are a few buy-low bullpen arms that have piqued my interest at a casual glance: Sergio Santos, Matt Belisle, Kyuji Fujikawa, Jose Veras, Jamey Wright, Ronald Belisario, Casey Janssen. Unfortunately, the crop of lefties is pretty meh after Miller. The likes of Joe Thatcher, Neal Cotts, Tom Gorzelanny, and Zach Duke are decent enough, but they're more LOOGY-types than lefty setup men. Maybe they can get Breslow on a minor league/league-minimum deal. Casey janssen is an intriguing possibility for us. Any chance cherrington is interested?
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Post by thelavarnwayguy on Nov 6, 2014 23:57:22 GMT -5
Does anyone else miss the steroid era? I can't believe a guy like Sandoval is arguably worth 6 years at 20 per.... I'm all set with him or Headley, but what the hell do you do otherwise? Sign 2 really good starters.
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Post by jimed14 on Nov 7, 2014 9:19:43 GMT -5
Sandoval is the perfect candidate for becoming the next Crawford. Stay far away...
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