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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 25, 2017 10:35:29 GMT -5
Again, I'm no expert but I don't believe that's true.
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Post by Guidas on Aug 25, 2017 10:55:32 GMT -5
There are no more penalties, it's a hard cap. Unless there is a loophole in the latest CBA that hasn't been reported, I think it is extremely unlikely that Otani will come to the MLB before he is 25. If he did come earlier under the hard cap he would be passing up hundreds of millions of dollars available to him as a free agent. In this case the new CBA, negotiated by owners trying to keep down salary costs and established players looking out for themselves, has lowered MLB revenue. This has been my point all along - that, and why would his team post their best player and human ATM when it comes to merchandising/ticket sales. It would be more likely after next year when they only have 1 more year of control. They they could literally cash out, but doesn't mean Otani has to take any offer and he could opt to go back for the last year of his deal. At that point (or now, when he's only 2 years from 100s of Millions of $), why not ride it out? Many MLB elite, controllable young players are doing the same thing lately, refusing to sign extensions in the 2nd or 3rd year of league service and opting to wait into Free Agency.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 25, 2017 11:23:46 GMT -5
Again, I'm no expert but I don't believe that's true. You are incorrect. All IFAs under 25 need to sign the uniform minor league player contract. Jump to page 287 at www.mlbplayers.com/pdf9/5450407.pdf
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Post by tallthrill on Aug 25, 2017 17:21:02 GMT -5
Again, I'm no expert but I don't believe that's true. You are incorrect. All IFAs under 25 need to sign the uniform minor league player contract. Jump to page 287 at www.mlbplayers.com/pdf9/5450407.pdfYou are also incorrect in believing that Otani is currently making less in the NPB than the (theoretical) one million dollars the Red Sox have left to offer in this signing period: Otani's 2017 salary is 270 million JPY, or approximately $2.5 million. nbakki.hatenablog.com/entry/Top_100_Salaries_of_NPB_Players_in_2017Either way, the problem with him coming over now isn't a couple million here or there. Otani would be lined up for a $200+ million dollar contract as a MLB free agent if he waits until he is 25. Compare that to the approximately $10 million dollar bonus a "Competitive Balance Round B" team could offer if they traded for the maximum pool amount, signed no other IFA in the period, and allocated that entire budget to him. I think fans of the sport should be angry at the greedy owners and players for negotiating a system of disincentives that might be keeping the best baseball player in the world away from the best baseball league in the world in his prime. I think it is shameful.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 31, 2017 6:59:02 GMT -5
Ken RosenthalVerified account @ken_Rosenthal 17m17 minutes ago More Scout’s first-hand report on Shohei Otani, who pitched for second time this season earlier today in Japan for Hokkaido Nippon-Ham Fighters:
Ken RosenthalVerified account @ken_Rosenthal 18m18 minutes ago More “94-100. FB command spotty. Healthy. Gave up 3-run HR last pitch. Left trailing 4-1. Went 3.1 IP.” Otani had dealt with thigh, ankle issues.
Ken RosenthalVerified account @ken_Rosenthal 18m18 minutes ago More Teams, according to scout in attendance, that requested seats to see Otani: AZ, BAL, BOS, CHC, CIN, CLE, LAD, NYY, PIT, SEA, TEX, TOR, WAS.
Ken RosenthalVerified account @ken_Rosenthal 7m7 minutes ago More Two other teams that are in Japan for Otani, per scout: SD, TB.
. . .
Apparently there are those that believe he is serious....
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 31, 2017 8:14:03 GMT -5
So every team in the league is in on Otani. Wow shocker. Lol.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 31, 2017 9:42:47 GMT -5
I'm sure people like Cashman are in Japan right now because there's zero chance he's coming.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 31, 2017 10:16:12 GMT -5
Jon MorosiVerified account @jonmorosi 53m53 minutes ago More After Shohei Ohtani’s encouraging performance today, increasing confidence within industry he’ll come to @mlb for 2018 season. @mlbnetwork
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Sept 2, 2017 20:08:55 GMT -5
The answer is probably no way, but if I'm understanding properly, if Otani comes to the states for next season, the Red Sox have a very small amount of money left to offer Otani, probably about 100K, while other teams probably still have a portion of their bonuses available - like the Yankees have $4 million available perhaps.
If that's the case it would seem the Red Sox have virtually no chance of getting Otani. Could the Red Sox skirt the rule by offering incentive bonuses like $90 million for winning Rookie of the Year or $72 million for being runner-up? The idea of the $90 million bonus would be so that it would divide by the 6 years they have him at relative peanuts to give him an additional $15 million/year, and yes I know arbitration would be involved jacking up his annual value, but is any of this even legal?
I can't imagine that most teams have a ton of international money left as I'd think that most of the talent was signed on July 2, 2017?
I was reading that having more money doesn't necessarily mean you get the player - that his desire of where to play and the level of effective recruitment will get the player, but I can't imagine the Red Sox even have a shot if they have practically no international money left? Correct?
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Sept 2, 2017 23:58:51 GMT -5
I was under the impression that we have about $1m left from an article earlier. How credible that is, I don't know.
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Post by ryan24 on Sept 3, 2017 3:25:00 GMT -5
Why would a guy sign and come to the states for a couple of mil, when if he waits 2 years he gets all the big market teams to bid on him and he gets 50 to 100 mil more? I guess I missed something here.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Sept 3, 2017 4:40:35 GMT -5
None of us is Otani. He keeps saying he's going to do it with the implication that he wants to perform on the biggest stage and can wait for the big paycheck. His club has agreed to post him if requested. The major leagues believe it enough to send some pretty high level people (I don't know who for the Sox but I know Cashman was there for the Yankees) and it's not like as if he's going to be on food stamps while he waits for the big payday down the road.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Sept 3, 2017 8:09:58 GMT -5
Otanimania 1:12 If you were a GM who was told by Otani's agent that allowing him to hit was a mandatory part of signing him would you do it? I imagine given the IFA restrictions his decision will probably come down to something like that Keith Law 1:12 If we're doing handshake deals I'd rather do one that says, hey, we'll tear this up in a year and give you $20MM a year than hamstring myself like that given the probability that he's not even an adequate MLB hitter.
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Post by Guidas on Sept 3, 2017 10:46:19 GMT -5
Otanimania 1:12 If you were a GM who was told by Otani's agent that allowing him to hit was a mandatory part of signing him would you do it? I imagine given the IFA restrictions his decision will probably come down to something like that Keith Law 1:12 If we're doing handshake deals I'd rather do one that says, hey, we'll tear this up in a year and give you $20MM a year than hamstring myself like that given the probability that he's not even an adequate MLB hitter. For how many years? 8 or 10 OK - def. 5, not so much.
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Post by sarasoxer on Sept 3, 2017 11:09:18 GMT -5
Why would a guy sign and come to the states for a couple of mil, when if he waits 2 years he gets all the big market teams to bid on him and he gets 50 to 100 mil more? I guess I missed something here. True but perhaps we are thinking like Americans. If you wanted to test yourself on the highest stage and knew you could get it all back especially playing in N.Y. or L.A.for example, maybe you do it. Incidentally N.Y. papers are smug in their belief that he is destined to play there based on his taste for the big city lights.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Sept 3, 2017 11:53:41 GMT -5
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 5, 2017 10:20:58 GMT -5
He probably read the Heyman report.
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Post by ramireja on Sept 5, 2017 12:48:55 GMT -5
I was under the impression that we have about $1m left from an article earlier. How credible that is, I don't know. If we assume Heyman is right that we have $8m in spending money....then we currently have spent $7,153,000 according to the bonuses we have reported on our site (bonuses of $10,000 or less are exempt from the pool). That would leave $847,000 to spend but keep in mind there have been reports of additional signings (e.g., Nixon Munoz, Brandon Rinconces, etc.) with unannounced bonuses so we may very well be close to our $8m limit already. Bottom line -- we wouldn't appear to be competitive if Otani decided to sign to the best offer he receives in the current spending period.
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Post by jimed14 on Sept 5, 2017 13:16:55 GMT -5
I can't imagine if Otani is signing this winter that the amount of signing bonus is going to decide anything. He can make far more in endorsement deals.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Sept 5, 2017 20:53:33 GMT -5
For the Japanese culture, honor is important, maybe the single most important thing.
The sign stealing charges are going to have bigger implications than we think.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Sept 6, 2017 9:27:11 GMT -5
Literally every team steals signs. I don't think anyone's going to care.
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Post by Guidas on Sept 6, 2017 10:53:21 GMT -5
Literally every team steals signs. I don't think anyone's going to care. Agreed. NYY is trying to get Sox on "use of illegal electronic devices." I heard a (maybe silly, maybe not) rumor this a.m. that NYY has asked commissioner to deduct some of Bos's intl bonus money as a penalty.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Sept 7, 2017 5:45:45 GMT -5
Literally every team steals signs. I don't think anyone's going to care. Anyone being Red Sox fans? I seriously doubt that Otani is going to chance tarnishing his reputation by signing with a dirty team, earned or not.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Sept 7, 2017 6:19:52 GMT -5
Literally every team steals signs. I don't think anyone's going to care. Anyone being Red Sox fans? I seriously doubt that Otani is going to chance tarnishing his reputation by signing with a dirty team, earned or not. How do you know what Otani will want? Maybe the Sox win the world series this year and Otani all of a sudden realizes that it's better to join the best team in baseball rather than go to say, the Yankees and go against them. Edit- Since you've made up Otani's made for him, I'm glad because this also puts the dirty Yankees out of the running too because the Sox turned up evidence against them also.
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Post by jimed14 on Sept 7, 2017 6:49:05 GMT -5
Literally every team steals signs. I don't think anyone's going to care. Anyone being Red Sox fans? I seriously doubt that Otani is going to chance tarnishing his reputation by signing with a dirty team, earned or not. You act like you know him personally and know exactly what he thinks about every team. Talk about assumptions. Guess he won't play for the Yankees either.
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