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Dave Cameron: Cespedes for Cueto?
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Post by mookiemagicfan on May 25, 2015 20:32:30 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure we have all been including Chapman in this discussion. Most people seem to be inclined that we can get him sans Margot. Think again people. Owens plus Marrero and extras will not be enough. Margot will be the headliner or part one of 2 headliners where Owens plus Johnson and another piece or 2 for a cherry. Lets be somewhat real about what Cin will ask for. And tbh,this still probably isn't enough.
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Post by mookiemagicfan on May 25, 2015 20:36:17 GMT -5
Not to mention...we have so many solid/good prospects with no where to play. Why not use our "envienable depth" and put it to good use...like, I don't know...say for our MLB team?
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 25, 2015 23:14:51 GMT -5
I would say that you're not going to get Cueto for second tier prospects as the headline attraction.
I would expect that the price would be something like Rodriguez, Margot, and Marrero for Cueto. If you want Chapman, too, I would expect it might cost Devers or Owens, too.
Cueto may be a rental, but there are a lot of teams with a chance to win. The competition to get him should be pretty fierce, and I'm sure somebody will come up with an A prospect to get Cueto if they think he'll put them over the top.
With the Red Sox still under .500, I think it would be foolish for the Sox to go all in to get Cueto via trade. It's hard for me to think of the Sox as serious contenders when they can't even get to the .500 mark.
The Sox need to keep their A/B+ prospects. I'd rather see them keep those guys as cheap solution to help support an expensive free agent starter. Somebody like a Cueto.
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Post by jimed14 on May 26, 2015 6:54:37 GMT -5
Not to mention...we have so many solid/good prospects with no where to play. Why not use our "envienable depth" and put it to good use...like, I don't know...say for our MLB team? They do that all the time.
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Post by jimed14 on May 26, 2015 6:56:58 GMT -5
I would say that you're not going to get Cueto for second tier prospects as the headline attraction. I would expect that the price would be something like Rodriguez, Margot, and Marrero for Cueto. If you want Chapman, too, I would expect it might cost Devers or Owens, too. Cueto may be a rental, but there are a lot of teams with a chance to win. The competition to get him should be pretty fierce, and I'm sure somebody will come up with an A prospect to get Cueto if they think he'll put them over the top. With the Red Sox still under .500, I think it would be foolish for the Sox to go all in to get Cueto via trade. It's hard for me to think of the Sox as serious contenders when they can't even get to the .500 mark. The Sox need to keep their A/B+ prospects. I'd rather see them keep those guys as cheap solution to help support an expensive free agent starter. Somebody like a Cueto. There's no way that Cueto moves now. It will be 2 months from now.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 26, 2015 12:50:56 GMT -5
I would say that you're not going to get Cueto for second tier prospects as the headline attraction. I would expect that the price would be something like Rodriguez, Margot, and Marrero for Cueto. If you want Chapman, too, I would expect it might cost Devers or Owens, too. Cueto may be a rental, but there are a lot of teams with a chance to win. The competition to get him should be pretty fierce, and I'm sure somebody will come up with an A prospect to get Cueto if they think he'll put them over the top. With the Red Sox still under .500, I think it would be foolish for the Sox to go all in to get Cueto via trade. It's hard for me to think of the Sox as serious contenders when they can't even get to the .500 mark. The Sox need to keep their A/B+ prospects. I'd rather see them keep those guys as cheap solution to help support an expensive free agent starter. Somebody like a Cueto. There's no way that Cueto moves now. It will be 2 months from now. I meant if the Sox were still under .500 come July 31st. From what I've read Cincy has no plans to move him until after the all-star game which is being played in Cincinnati this year. Cueto could be the guy starting for the NL this year. Who knows? I fully suspect the Reds will be lousy come July 31st and will unload him, and with many teams in the hunt, the price in talent could be very steep as teams try to outbid one another. If the Sox are playing sub .500 ball by the end of July, that tells me the Sox have more than just "lacking an ace" issue, and I wouldn't want to see the team go crazy and trade their best young talent for a rental. That would make no sense. If the Sox were playing better baseball and it was obvious that they are lacking that ace and everything else about the team looks at least average to good, then that would be a different story, but I've also never been a fan of trading 6 years of potential top notch talent for 3 months of rental (assuming play-offs). And I say this as a guy who thinks very highly of Cueto and would like to see the Sox go after him at the end of the season, although I wouldn't expect them to.
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Post by mookiemagicfan on May 26, 2015 12:54:35 GMT -5
Well if his elbow mri doesn't come back clean...he's not moving...period.
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Post by jimed14 on May 26, 2015 13:35:30 GMT -5
There's no way that Cueto moves now. It will be 2 months from now. I meant if the Sox were still under .500 come July 31st. From what I've read Cincy has no plans to move him until after the all-star game which is being played in Cincinnati this year. Cueto could be the guy starting for the NL this year. Who knows? I fully suspect the Reds will be lousy come July 31st and will unload him, and with many teams in the hunt, the price in talent could be very steep as teams try to outbid one another. If the Sox are playing sub .500 ball by the end of July, that tells me the Sox have more than just "lacking an ace" issue, and I wouldn't want to see the team go crazy and trade their best young talent for a rental. That would make no sense. If the Sox were playing better baseball and it was obvious that they are lacking that ace and everything else about the team looks at least average to good, then that would be a different story, but I've also never been a fan of trading 6 years of potential top notch talent for 3 months of rental (assuming play-offs). And I say this as a guy who thinks very highly of Cueto and would like to see the Sox go after him at the end of the season, although I wouldn't expect them to. I think it's pretty obvious that they wouldn't go all out buying at the end of July if they're under .500.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on May 26, 2015 14:35:16 GMT -5
Well, if sub-.500 is still 2.5 games out, they still might.
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Post by jimed14 on May 26, 2015 14:39:54 GMT -5
Well, if sub-.500 is still 2.5 games out, they still might. I doubt they go for a blockbuster like Cueto/Chapman though unless it's too good to pass up. They might try something a little more half-hearted. Can the title of this thread be changed?
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 26, 2015 15:43:35 GMT -5
Well, if sub-.500 is still 2.5 games out, they still might. I doubt they go for a blockbuster like Cueto/Chapman though unless it's too good to pass up. They might try something a little more half-hearted. Can the title of this thread be changed? I agree with Chris. If they're still in the same situation they are now come July 31st hovering within a few games of 1st place, but with a .500ish record, then yeah, I can see them going all out for Cueto or some top rental pitcher. I think the Sox are in a situation this year where there is a lot more external pressure to win something, like a division title, or at least make the playoffs. I wouldn't be surprised if Farrell was let go if the team missed the playoffs. Last year was different in that there was still the hangover affect going on - World Champs of 2013. So there was more of a grace period. And there was also the matter of the trade chips the Sox were sitting on if things went bad last year. The Sox were dangling Lester, Lackey, and Miller as potential trades, in addition to Uehara as well. This year the Sox are in a different situation. They increased the payroll heavily and if the Sox go south, they don't have as much to trade, which would really make it a wasted year. Perhaps a Napoli, but not much that would bring a ton of value if the team tanked. Last year, at some point in June, some of us were already counting down to July 31st wondering what the Sox would do to build for the future. That isn't the case this year, and because of that I think there's more pressure on the team to make the playoffs and make a big acquisition if they're reasonably close, regardless if the team has many other problems or not. That doesn't mean that I want to see the Sox go that route, though. I know once the playoffs begin it's a new season, but with 11 or even 12 games to win, I think it's tougher for 1973 Mets type of team today to win. I know the Giants and Royals last year weren't imitating the 27 Yankees, but when the Sox have won their 3 recent Championships, they were as good if not better than everybody else in baseball. I like those odds better than an 85 win team's odds, and personally would rather see them add in a scenario where they're not trying to capture lightning in a bottle.
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Post by jimed14 on May 26, 2015 15:49:05 GMT -5
If that is the case, then they are abandoning the plan and I think it would be a mistake. There is a fine line between doing what they are doing now and going right back to 2012 where the future is bleak and your depth starters are Cook and Weiland.
I really think they need the new young core to take over for Papi/Pedey. And they're too young to do it now.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on May 26, 2015 15:56:38 GMT -5
If that is the case, then they are abandoning the plan and I think it would be a mistake. There is a fine line between doing what they are doing now and going right back to 2012 where the future is bleak and your depth starters are Cook and Weiland. I really think they need the new young core to take over for Papi/Pedey. And they're too young to do it now. I agree and I hope that's exactly what they do. If they believe in that young core, they have to nurture it and supplement it. I do wonder if Ben's rope is short, would that be allowed to happen? There is the business side of things and the "Win now" theme that can be part of Boston at times. I hope they don't give in to it. I hate watching them lose a lot more than they should or I'd want them to, but if there's a purpose, a grand plan that's worthy, I can live with it.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on May 26, 2015 16:56:07 GMT -5
Well what's "all out buying"? If you're saying they're going to make really stupid trades that destroy their future, then no, I don't think they'll do that no matter what their record is.
Cherington is principled to a fault regarding what he'll give up assets for. It's not like if they're winning the division he's suddenly going to trade Swihart, Devers, Rodriguez, Margot, Moncada, Johnson, and Keith Couch for Cueto and Chapman where he wouldn't have if they were 6 games out.
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Post by jimed14 on May 27, 2015 10:09:06 GMT -5
All out buying is probably a Cueto/Chapman trade. Half-hearted would be Scott Thornton/John MacDonald type of trades.
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Post by mookiemagicfan on May 27, 2015 10:34:47 GMT -5
Outside of Cueto, Hammels, and maybe Shark...is there any other Ace that could become,available? I would think Det would hold on to Price, and Washing would hold on to their starters to go for it...but outside of the few I don't see,much. Maybe we blow OAK away for Grey...yeah right. So it seems it's just mid-level starters for now. We will see come July if this even matters.
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Post by grandsalami on Jun 14, 2015 16:29:54 GMT -5
“@jonmorosi: #RedSox had a scout at Johnny Cueto’s most recent start, but now they have second-worst record in AL. Can they legitimately buy at deadline?”
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,799
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Post by nomar on Jun 14, 2015 16:32:08 GMT -5
“@jonmorosi: #RedSox had a scout at Johnny Cueto’s most recent start, but now they have second-worst record in AL. Can they legitimately buy at deadline?” Can't imagine they'd risk trading prospects for half of a season of Cueto when we're already screwed.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jun 14, 2015 22:32:07 GMT -5
“@jonmorosi: #RedSox had a scout at Johnny Cueto’s most recent start, but now they have second-worst record in AL. Can they legitimately buy at deadline?” Can't imagine they'd risk trading prospects for half of a season of Cueto when we're already screwed. The only way that makes any sense is if they're able to deal for him and immediately tie him up to a long-term deal. The Sox would certainly need to show him the money because there's a lot to be made in December and last I remember reading, his agent was looking for $200 million.
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Post by grandsalami on Jul 19, 2015 14:09:57 GMT -5
“@jonmorosi: Johnny Cueto has walked 5 batters in this game, fueling speculation about whether he's truly healthy. Shying away from fastball.”
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Post by amfox1 on Jul 25, 2015 22:21:59 GMT -5
Ken Rosenthal @ken_Rosenthal 14m14 minutes ago #Royals were close to acquiring Cueto from #Reds earlier tonight, sources tell me and @jonmorosi. Deal fell through.
Ken Rosenthal @ken_Rosenthal 14m14 minutes ago Sources indicate that the problem was that one of the players going from the #Royals to the #Reds for Cueto did not check out medically.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jul 25, 2015 23:01:25 GMT -5
Hope the Royals find a way to make this Cueto deal work. If so, you know there's no chance he'll be re-signed, so you figure the Sox have a real shot at him if they really do want him.
Also, I have a feeling NY will be playing KC in the ALCS, sort of like it was the late 70s, and I'd feel better knowing that the Yankees would have to deal with him.
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Post by DesignatedForAssignment on Jul 26, 2015 0:04:40 GMT -5
Cueto 8.0 4H 0R 1BB 5K 100-68
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Post by amfox1 on Jul 26, 2015 11:13:57 GMT -5
Cueto traded to Royals, per the Twitterverse.
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