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Post by jimed14 on Nov 21, 2014 15:52:51 GMT -5
Will agree with others above in disagreeing with this. If the lineup were Castillo and eight David Ortizes, then sure, but it's not like there aren't any other guys who have a vaguely leadoff-ish skillset that they could put up there. Put me in the camp that assumes it's Betts. Pretty open-shut case based on current roster construction, imo. And also, agree with those who've pointed out that leadoff wasn't the problem last year. Red Sox leadoff hitters hit .269/.330/.378. League average was .268/.326/.392. Compare that to 7-9: Sox, .221/.288/.323; AL, .243/.302/.362. Really important to correct this. A lineup with 8 David Ortizes and a Catillo would have Ortiz 1-8 and Castillo 9. Probably one of them would get some rest and Gomes would take his place against RHP.
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Post by Don Caballero on Nov 22, 2014 1:54:07 GMT -5
Will agree with others above in disagreeing with this. If the lineup were Castillo and eight David Ortizes, then sure, but it's not like there aren't any other guys who have a vaguely leadoff-ish skillset that they could put up there. Put me in the camp that assumes it's Betts. Pretty open-shut case based on current roster construction, imo. I don't know, you guys are thinking about this too logically. We have a manager that sat a better player in the post-season because of how his gut felt (and won the damn thing). If Castillo is what he's hyped to be, I'd be willing to bet that his skill set would be too irresistible to say no regarding leading off.
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Post by JackieWilsonsaid on Nov 22, 2014 4:42:49 GMT -5
Assuming you are correct, I still would expect betts near the top as well.
Castillo Mookie Petey (if fully recovered and rebounding instead of following his trend downward) Papi Panda Napoli Cespedes Vasquez Xander ( who I think is going to kill it next year)
If Castillo and Betts perform at the top, this is potentially as good a lineup as we have seen in quite a while.
Should swihart mash early, he could be a second half call up and part time boost at the bottom of the order.
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Post by iakovos11 on Nov 22, 2014 7:45:33 GMT -5
Will agree with others above in disagreeing with this. If the lineup were Castillo and eight David Ortizes, then sure, but it's not like there aren't any other guys who have a vaguely leadoff-ish skillset that they could put up there. Put me in the camp that assumes it's Betts. Pretty open-shut case based on current roster construction, imo. I don't know, you guys are thinking about this too logically. We have a manager that sat a better player in the post-season because of how his gut felt (and won the damn thing). If Castillo is what he's hyped to be, I'd be willing to bet that his skill set would be too irresistible to say no regarding leading off. What if Mookie is what he's hyped to be? We actually saw more from Mookie last year. Plus, Farrell did bat Mookie leadoff when both he and Castillo were in the lineup. Just because Farrell played Johnny Gomes in the 2013 playoffs (we won it all, by the way) doesn't mean every decision he makes will be illogical or opposite of what we'd think he would/should do.
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Post by jmei on Nov 22, 2014 9:02:11 GMT -5
Will agree with others above in disagreeing with this. If the lineup were Castillo and eight David Ortizes, then sure, but it's not like there aren't any other guys who have a vaguely leadoff-ish skillset that they could put up there. Put me in the camp that assumes it's Betts. Pretty open-shut case based on current roster construction, imo. I don't know, you guys are thinking about this too logically. We have a manager that sat a better player in the post-season because of how his gut felt (and won the damn thing). If Castillo is what he's hyped to be, I'd be willing to bet that his skill set would be too irresistible to say no regarding leading off. There is good reason to believe that Gomes started those games because of his splits versus GB pitchers (his uppercut swing means he's great versus balls in the lower half of the zone but struggles against high heat).
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Post by jimed14 on Nov 22, 2014 10:16:58 GMT -5
But there is absolutely no logic when Farrell played Gomes daily for a short period of time this year and said he deserved the every day job while he was OPSing about .500 vs. RHP while Nava was on the bench.
This is quite an aggravating subject where I'm getting worked up for no reason about some wrong decision that Farrell probably won't make. We know a lot more about Mookie than about Castillo. I know the season is long and all of that, but I don't really want to waste a month seeing if Castillo can have an OBP higher than .300 with him leading off as a worst case scenario.
Anyone want to make a bet that Mookie's OBP is higher this year? Didn't think so. This is a no-brainer. I really doubt Farrell will make the wrong choice given that he put Nava leading off last year so he knows that OBP is important in that spot. I think Castillo should probably start 6th or 7th.
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Post by Smittyw on Nov 22, 2014 10:24:20 GMT -5
Betts Pedroia Ortiz Cespedes Napoli Sandoval (probably) Bogaerts Castillo Vazquez
Starting Castillo off lower in the order should be a no-brainer given how little we know about him so far. If he plays himself into a top of the order spot, then that's great...but at this point the leadoff role should be Mookie's to lose, end of story.
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Post by youngbillrussell on Nov 22, 2014 11:19:59 GMT -5
Nuffcedmcgreevey- that is my ideal lineup as well, hope to see it on opening day with Nava,Holt,Craig,Ross as the bench.
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alnipper
Veteran
Living the dream
Posts: 619
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Post by alnipper on Nov 22, 2014 11:41:39 GMT -5
Betts should bat leadoff unless he is traded. If Betts is traded then it'll be Victorino or Castillo.
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Post by Don Caballero on Nov 22, 2014 21:57:22 GMT -5
There is good reason to believe that Gomes started those games because of his splits versus GB pitchers (his uppercut swing means he's great versus balls in the lower half of the zone but struggles against high heat). Wow, I hadn't thought about that, that's awesome! That doesn't help my narrative of Castillo as a leadoff hitter, and I certainly don't remember people considering that possibility during that time, but this is a little thing that makes 2013 even more special.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Nov 23, 2014 10:39:33 GMT -5
There is good reason to believe that Gomes started those games because of his splits versus GB pitchers (his uppercut swing means he's great versus balls in the lower half of the zone but struggles against high heat). Wow, I hadn't thought about that, that's awesome! That doesn't help my narrative of Castillo as a leadoff hitter, and I certainly don't remember people considering that possibility during that time, but this is a little thing that makes 2013 even more special. That fact was definitely written about at the time. Forget who did it, but it was out there.
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Post by sarasoxer on Nov 23, 2014 10:55:20 GMT -5
Betts should bat leadoff unless he is traded. If Betts is traded then it'll be Victorino or Castillo. Betts will not be traded and Betts will bat leadoff at some point probably after various veterans have had their chance and Betts' OBP dwarfs theirs.
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Post by brianthetaoist on Nov 23, 2014 10:55:13 GMT -5
Lineup looks like this to me:
Betts Pedroia Ortiz Napoli Sandoval Bogaerts Castillo Nava Vazquez
I'm assuming Cespedes gets traded, presumably as part of a bigger trade for a pitcher ... that lineup has some real downside risk to it with the young guys Bogaerts, Castillo, Vazquez, and Betts (as well as normal injury risk). But it has the potential to be a really good one, dynamic and pretty balanced.
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Post by jmei on Nov 23, 2014 11:32:50 GMT -5
While we're on the topic of lineups: if Pedroia's decline is really more attributable to age/wear-and-tear and he's a true-talent 100-105 wRC+ guy going forward, we have to give real consideration to moving him down the lineup. At that level of performance, it's not at all clear that he's a better hitter than Nava/RHH, Bogaerts, 3B (assuming Sandoval or Headley), or even Castillo. If Pedroia bounces back to the 115-ish wRC+ level he was at in 2012-2013, he's still a fine #2 hitter, but if he doesn't, it may make more sense to move him down the order.
(Of course, you start the season with him as the #2 hitter, because with his track record, he's earned at least a continued long look there, and it's likely that a good portion of his 2014 decline is attributable to discrete injuries that he's since fully recovered from. But I'm just suggesting that his lock on that spot is not as strong as it has been in years past.)
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Post by sarasoxer on Nov 23, 2014 18:11:23 GMT -5
Barring injury or re-injury, Pedroia will be batting second and I fully expect a resurgence commensurate with his prior performances modified by increased league pitching results. On that basis I would envision 12-15 hrs. and a .290 BA. That plays for me.
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Post by soxfanatic on Jan 8, 2015 18:26:08 GMT -5
Ryan Hannable ?@ryanhannable 3 min. On @weei, Farrell says batting order will likely go 2-6: Pedroia, Ortiz, Ramirez, Sandoval, Napoli.
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Post by ramireja on Jan 8, 2015 19:47:32 GMT -5
Ryan Hannable ?@ryanhannable 3 min. On @weei, Farrell says batting order will likely go 2-6: Pedroia, Ortiz, Ramirez, Sandoval, Napoli. You didn't answer the question of the thread.
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TX
Veteran
Posts: 265
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Post by TX on Jan 8, 2015 20:09:01 GMT -5
Because Castillo screams "traditional leadoff hitter" and he got big money, which is not a combination that allows room for creativity. I'd be surprised if he isn't used there next season, unless he flops tremendously. I'll add that if that is true (BC and Farrell agree), Betts starts the season in AAA, which actually has its advantages. But if Castillo is deemed formidable leading off, and I'm real sure Vic shows up in this, his contract year, I see no point having Betts hanging around on the bench. Neither Vic or Castillo will be benched by Betts, that much I am sure of. Not this year.
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Post by jmei on Jan 8, 2015 20:14:11 GMT -5
Neither Vic or Castillo will be benched by Betts, that much I am sure of. Not this year. I strongly disagree. I'm pretty certain that Betts is guaranteed a starting OF spot, and that one of Victorino/Castillo is benched or traded (Victorino)/optioned to the minors (Castillo).
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TX
Veteran
Posts: 265
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Post by TX on Jan 8, 2015 20:17:23 GMT -5
Castillo being benched I don't see. A healthy Vic sitting with Farrell as coach is even more far-fetched. We'll see though.
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Post by brianthetaoist on Jan 8, 2015 21:05:23 GMT -5
Ryan Hannable ?@ryanhannable 3 min. On @weei, Farrell says batting order will likely go 2-6: Pedroia, Ortiz, Ramirez, Sandoval, Napoli. That's pretty good ... But, on topic, personally I expect Mookie to lead off, but we have to acknowledge that the error bars on the projections for Castillo and Betts are big enough that we're not really sure which will be the better hitter next year. I expect it'll go Mookie/Pedroia/Ortiz/Ramirez/Sandoval/Napoli/Castillo/Bogaerts/Vazquez, but Castillo and Betts could easily switch. Looking at that lineup, though ... whew. Don't want to get too overboard, but the upside potential of that crew is enormous.
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Post by wskeleton76 on Jan 8, 2015 21:29:50 GMT -5
No doubt my avatar will do.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jan 8, 2015 23:18:10 GMT -5
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Post by wcsoxfan on Jan 9, 2015 4:07:44 GMT -5
Ryan Hannable ?@ryanhannable 3 min. On @weei, Farrell says batting order will likely go 2-6: Pedroia, Ortiz, Ramirez, Sandoval, Napoli. Unless Nava is batting 7th - why should Sandoval hit ahead of Napoli? Isn't Napoli a better hitter? Isn't putting your only starting LHH one spot away from your only starting switch hitter a bad idea?
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jan 9, 2015 4:13:03 GMT -5
Ryan Hannable ?@ryanhannable 3 min. On @weei, Farrell says batting order will likely go 2-6: Pedroia, Ortiz, Ramirez, Sandoval, Napoli. Unless Nava is batting 7th - why should Sandoval hit ahead of Napoli? Isn't Napoli a better hitter? Isn't putting your only starting LHH one spot away from your only starting switch hitter a bad idea? If you read the article I linked, the advantage is pedroia right, Ortiz left, Ramirez right, Sandoval switch, Napoli right. As Farrel alluded to, sandwiching Sandoval between Ramirez and Napoli should mean more left handed ABs for Sandoval. Check out his splits, he's significantly better left than right. An opposing manager would be more inclined to leave in a right hander against Sandoval with Napoli and presumably Xander batting behind him.
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