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Post by notguilty on Aug 18, 2015 22:28:51 GMT -5
I'll say this: DD is a hell of a sharp dresser.
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Post by grandsalami on Aug 18, 2015 22:29:31 GMT -5
How long till GM IS hired? End of week?
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Post by notguilty on Aug 18, 2015 22:32:26 GMT -5
Somebody posted this on SOSH, probably relevant here-
Dombrowski, in a 2002 article:
"I don't think people want to hear about the minor league system," he said. "People want results."
Not saying he's wrong, but that's quite a sharp turn this team is taking there.
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Post by grandsalami on Aug 18, 2015 22:32:58 GMT -5
Somebody posted this on SOSH, probably relevant here- Dombrowski, in a 2002 article: "I don't think people want to hear about the minor league system," he said. "People want results." Not saying he's wrong, but that's quite a sharp turn this team is taking there. static.espn.go.com/mlb/news/2002/0408/1364856.html
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2015 22:33:06 GMT -5
I wonder if there was any behind the scenes attempt to pry Billy Beane away from the A's. If not, then perhaps this really does spell the demise of Sabermetrics in Boston.
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Post by dcsoxfan on Aug 18, 2015 22:33:32 GMT -5
In Detroit, Dave Dombrowski was hired to deliver a championship before the owner rode off into the sunset; neither really cared what happened after they left (anybody here see the Tigers' future as bright?
Does anybody really believe he was just hired in Boston for a different reason?
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Post by soxfanatic on Aug 18, 2015 22:34:14 GMT -5
Somebody posted this on SOSH, probably relevant here- Dombrowski, in a 2002 article: "I don't think people want to hear about the minor league system," he said. "People want results." Not saying he's wrong, but that's quite a sharp turn this team is taking there. It's 13 years ago. Who knows, his philosophy might have changed.
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Post by sammo420 on Aug 18, 2015 22:34:20 GMT -5
Why do you assume that any GM in the majors would have ever given up anything whatsoever for Lars Anderson? Because other teams are stupid when we're smart? 'Cause at one time Lars was considered a potential impact bat, certainly attractive enough to be a pot sweetener in a trade. If I'm not mistaken this site had him as one of the top 2 or 3 prospects in the system at one time. I definitely remember Callis or Law having him as the top prospect in the system and BA having him as one of the top 50 or so in BB. And I remember a BA chat where somebody asked something about Lars Anderson possibly being the top prospect in baseball at this time next year. Obviously that was more than a couple years ago.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 18, 2015 22:35:28 GMT -5
Somebody posted this on SOSH, probably relevant here- Dombrowski, in a 2002 article: "I don't think people want to hear about the minor league system," he said. "People want results." Not saying he's wrong, but that's quite a sharp turn this team is taking there. Easy to say that in the middle of the steroid era. It's could not possibly be more different right now. T hat's just ridiculously dumb.
I mean, trade Xander for Brady Anderson?
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 18, 2015 22:37:33 GMT -5
I wonder if there was any behind the scenes attempt to pry Billy Beane away from the A's. If not, then perhaps this really does spell the demise of Sabermetrics in Boston. If that's the case, it's the worst decision ever made. Consider that they're worse at advanced stats than everyone, not that advanced stats are worthless.
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Post by notguilty on Aug 18, 2015 22:40:08 GMT -5
Somebody posted this on SOSH, probably relevant here- Dombrowski, in a 2002 article: "I don't think people want to hear about the minor league system," he said. "People want results." Not saying he's wrong, but that's quite a sharp turn this team is taking there. It's 13 years ago. Who knows, his philosophy might have changed. Given that the Detroit farm system was ranked the worst in the majors by Keith Law just recently (before Spring Training), that seems pretty consistent with the philosophy espoused in the above quote. That doesn't mean he'll do that here, of course (though I expect that he will). I'll just take the popcorn and watch.
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Post by dcsoxfan on Aug 18, 2015 22:40:28 GMT -5
There is a story, possibly apocryphal, about an IQ test given to young children.
The researcher would place a piece of candy on a table and tell the children he was going to leave them for fifteen minutes, but if the candy was still there when he got back, they would receive a second piece of candy. The subjects were tracked for years after that. Allegedly, the ability to leave the candy on the table correlated far more closely with future success than any other measure.
One gets the feeling the Red Sox just ate that single piece of candy.
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Post by soxfan06 on Aug 18, 2015 22:41:44 GMT -5
If making the playoffs year in and year out is mediocrity, well then so be it. I'm on board with mediocrity. I assume you have a plan (and a time machine) for moving the Red Sox into the AL Central (circa pre-2014)? Or do you think those 86 wins in the AL Central equals a whole lot of playoff appearances in the AL East? Yes. Because at this point in time, the AL East is more like the AL Central, than the AL central. And they've also added a Wild Card spot. The idea that Dombroski was putting mediocre teams out in Detroit, is one of the dumbest things I've read in a while.
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Post by grandsalami on Aug 18, 2015 22:45:45 GMT -5
In Detroit, Dave Dombrowski was hired to deliver a championship before the owner rode off into the sunset; neither really cared what happened after they left (anybody here see the Tigers' future as bright? Does anybody really believe he was just hired in Boston for a different reason? Well our owner is not about to croak. So yes.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2015 22:45:54 GMT -5
There is a story, possibly apocryphal, about an IQ test given to young children. The researcher would place a piece of candy on a table and tell the children he was going to leave them for fifteen minutes, but if the candy was still there when he got back, they would receive a second piece of candy. The subjects were tracked for years after that. Allegedly, the ability to leave the candy on the table correlated far more closely with future success than any other measure. One gets the feeling the Red Sox just ate that single piece of candy. In a related experiment, upon his return the researcher ate the candy the children left on the table and told them there wasn't any more. Tracked for years after this incident, all of the subjects carried varying degrees of guilt and butthurt over having not maximized their opportunity to eat candy.
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atzar
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Post by atzar on Aug 18, 2015 22:46:57 GMT -5
After reading for a bit, I'd characterize my outlook on Dombrowski as cautious, conditional optimism. I want Frank Wren to stay far away, and I really, really hope the minor league scouting/development system stays largely intact. But it's tough to look at DD's transaction history and come away anything but impressed.
Like I said... Warily intrigued at this point.
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Post by notguilty on Aug 18, 2015 22:52:15 GMT -5
In Detroit, Dave Dombrowski was hired to deliver a championship before the owner rode off into the sunset; neither really cared what happened after they left (anybody here see the Tigers' future as bright? Does anybody really believe he was just hired in Boston for a different reason? Well our owner is not about to croak. So yes. In a manner of speaking. Our owner just saw his team coming last three years out of four. Another owner is seeing NESN ratings go to the dumps, and we know he's very sensitive to those. So it's fair to surmise "win now" is probably part of the mandate here too. Discounting a little bit for the guy on his deathbed, I suppose.
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Post by seanleary001 on Aug 18, 2015 22:52:29 GMT -5
This team needs a lot of work to be done to fix the bullpen. Dombrowski has created a lot of bad bullpens in Detroit.
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Post by soxfan06 on Aug 18, 2015 22:55:03 GMT -5
Well our owner is not about to croak. So yes. In a manner of speaking. Our owner just saw his team coming last three years out of four. Another owner is seeing NESN ratings go to the dumps, and we know he's very sensitive to those. So it's fair to surmise "win now" is probably part of the mandate here too. Discounting a little bit for the guy on his deathbed, I suppose. Unless I'm losing it, our owners have been "win now" since they bought the team. They have been encouraging winning each year as evidence by the constant spending in the top 3 of the MLB. What you are surmising is what we will call "win at any cost" which is what the situation was reportedly in Detroit and we have NEVER seen that here in Boston under current ownership.
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Post by notguilty on Aug 18, 2015 22:55:37 GMT -5
My summary view: sad to see BC go, but after a year like 2015, probably inevitable. I'm not a DD fan, but whatever. He does make some pretty good trades. Not looking forward to seeing my binkies traded though.
Like many here, I'll probably fall one way or another depending on who the GM is.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 18, 2015 22:56:26 GMT -5
Well our owner is not about to croak. So yes. In a manner of speaking. Our owner just saw his team coming last three years out of four. Another owner is seeing NESN ratings go to the dumps, and we know he's very sensitive to those. So it's fair to surmise "win now" is probably part of the mandate here too. Discounting a little bit for the guy on his deathbed, I suppose. He has won 3 championships in 10 years. I doubt he is desperate. T hey are still to this day selling games out.
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Post by grandsalami on Aug 18, 2015 22:57:35 GMT -5
Well our owner is not about to croak. So yes. In a manner of speaking. Our owner just saw his team coming last three years out of four. Another owner is seeing NESN ratings go to the dumps, and we know he's very sensitive to those. So it's fair to surmise "win now" is probably part of the mandate here too. Discounting a little bit for the guy on his deathbed, I suppose. Win now /= win at ALL COST
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Post by notguilty on Aug 18, 2015 22:57:58 GMT -5
In a manner of speaking. Our owner just saw his team coming last three years out of four. Another owner is seeing NESN ratings go to the dumps, and we know he's very sensitive to those. So it's fair to surmise "win now" is probably part of the mandate here too. Discounting a little bit for the guy on his deathbed, I suppose. Unless I'm losing it, our owners have been "win now" since they bought the team. They have been encouraging winning each year as evidence by the constant spending in the top 3 of the MLB. What you are surmising is what we will call "win at any cost" which is what the situation was reportedly in Detroit and we have NEVER seen that here in Boston under current ownership. Yeah, that's a fair point, there's a difference there. Though I never like the "the owner made me do it" or "Lucchino made me do it" excuses, but whatever.
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Post by sammo420 on Aug 18, 2015 23:02:09 GMT -5
After reading for a bit, I'd characterize my outlook on Dombrowski as cautious, conditional optimism. I want Frank Wren to stay far away, and I really, really hope the minor league scouting/development system stays largely intact. But it's tough to look at DD's transaction history and come away anything but impressed. Like I said... Warily intrigued at this point. This in almost every way except I consider myself more optimistic on Dombrowski. I hope Jerry DiPoto gets the regular GM job.
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Post by grandsalami on Aug 18, 2015 23:02:23 GMT -5
“@jeffpassan: Sources: Blue Jays had serious conversations with Dave Dombrowski. Red Sox knew this, gave Dombrowski full power over baseball operations.”
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