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Choose Your Own Adventure: You're Dave Dombrowski!
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Post by mgoetze on Nov 15, 2015 17:51:56 GMT -5
Of those posters who have even mentioned our 3rd-best starting pitcher, Steven Wright, the majority have him starting in Pawtucket. Please elaborate on how you plan to arrange that given that he has no options left.
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Post by bigpapismangosalsa on Nov 15, 2015 19:18:10 GMT -5
Mentioned in another thread that Wright might be out of options, so he would be part of the 'pen assuming that is the case. He takes the "Hembree" spot at the end of the 'pen in my scenario, if of course he doesn't win the 5th spot, which I think he will be in competition for, I just think Owens will beat him out.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Nov 15, 2015 19:26:13 GMT -5
Mentioned in another thread that Wright might be out of options, so he would be part of the 'pen assuming that is the case. He takes the "Hembree" spot at the end of the 'pen in my scenario, if of course he doesn't win the 5th spot, which I think he will be in competition for, I just think Owens will beat him out. The likelihood that Owens is on the major league roster in any scenario to start year is at about 3%
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Post by pedroisback on Nov 15, 2015 19:53:11 GMT -5
Margot, Guerra, Asuaje and Allen for Kimbrel Betts, Johnson, Owens, and Holt for Syndergaard Devers, Espinoza, Kopech, Ball, and Miley for Sale
Rotation: Sale Syndergaard Buchholz Porcello Rodriguez
Tawaza Kelly Uehara Barnes Kimbrel
RF Moncada SS Bogaerts 2B Pedroia DH Ortiz 1B Ramirez 3B Sandoval C Swihart CF Bradley, Jr. LF Castillo
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Post by mgoetze on Nov 15, 2015 20:15:06 GMT -5
Betts, Johnson, Owens, and Holt for Syndergaard Devers, Espinoza, Kopech, Ball, and Miley for Sale Move Betts down one line and you might actually get Sale. Won't leave quite enough for Syndergaard though.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Nov 15, 2015 20:19:18 GMT -5
Margot, Guerra, Asuaje and Allen for Kimbrel Betts, Johnson, Owens, and Holt for Syndergaard Devers, Espinoza, Kopech, Ball, and Miley for Sale Rotation: Sale Syndergaard Buchholz Porcello Rodriguez Tawaza Kelly Uehara Barnes Kimbrel RF Moncada SS Bogaerts 2B Pedroia DH Ortiz 1B Ramirez 3B Sandoval C Swihart CF Bradley, Jr. LF Castillo Moncada won't be the RF in 2016. Nor would I practically empty the farm system, even for Chris Sale. The Red Sox don't need to be some fantasy league team to win the World Series.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Nov 15, 2015 22:21:28 GMT -5
Margot, Guerra, Asuaje and Allen for Kimbrel Betts, Johnson, Owens, and Holt for Syndergaard Devers, Espinoza, Kopech, Ball, and Miley for Sale Rotation: Sale Syndergaard Buchholz Porcello Rodriguez Tawaza Kelly Uehara Barnes Kimbrel RF Moncada SS Bogaerts 2B Pedroia DH Ortiz 1B Ramirez 3B Sandoval C Swihart CF Bradley, Jr. LF Castillo Lol congratulations. You've decimated the farm system and left the team without a single worthwhile pitching prospect anywhere in the minors. You would be tarred and feathered and run out of boston.
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Post by soxcentral on Nov 15, 2015 22:36:47 GMT -5
I have no respect for anyone who bashes other people's ideas incessantly but fails to propose any of their own.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Nov 15, 2015 22:55:23 GMT -5
With Freddie Freeman being reported as available, I'm pretty sure that DD will be kicking the tires here. It's a shame Tehran had such a bad year (looks like an injury suspect), that could have been an interesting trade expansion. None of the Braves starters this year were worth considering, their future is in the farm although it's interesting how a decent staff fell apart so fast.
Our proposal would have to include Hanley and a boatload of cash plus other considerations.
Given Atlanta's Simmons trade, Marrero seems like a natural fit here (Aybar's walk year).
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Nov 15, 2015 23:07:18 GMT -5
I have no respect for anyone who bashes other people's ideas incessantly but fails to propose any of their own. Right now? The best way to complete this club is to sign David Price by absolutely blowing the Cubs out of the water. If the Dodgers get involved in Price, try to scoop up Greinke with the Allen Baird/Bannister connections. Sign a Chris Young/Rajai Davis type for 2/12-2/15 depending on the guy. If that doesn't happen, look into Mike Leake or Kazmir for some savings. If those seem unsatisfactory, lube up for a Jose Quintana/Carrasco trade. Quintana is the better match, but it'll probably take Swihart + Owens + others. See how trade market develops once FA starters start coming off the board. Leave the pen alone for now: Kimbrel, Koji, Taz, Varvaro (Kimbrel's successful setup man 2013 and 2014) Ross, Layne, Wright. Wright being out of options is tough, not sure what happens if he's not on major league roster. Throw Kelly in pen if Varvaro isn't ready or Wright/Ross look atrocious in spring. Potentially look into trading Miley or Kelly in spring depending on how things shake out. See how guys like Barnes/Hembree/Aro/Light look in spring training, make room for any standouts. Basically I don't want a ton of moves. I saw a team pitch and hit well for the final two months of the season. You have question marks in Vazquez and Pablo and Hanley, but it's not unreasonable to think that Hanley and Pablo won't be the same black holes they were last season. You would expect some correction back towards career numbers. At the end of the season last year we played good ball, and were missing Koji, Taz, Hanley, Pablo, and Christian Vazquez. These are significant upgrades. My offseason plan? Patience. We don't know what team this is yet, so blowing up the farm or ML roster makes little sense.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Nov 15, 2015 23:17:36 GMT -5
If you *must* target another reliever, don't look to Chapman. Don't sign O'Day who mostly likely doesn't want to go to a team where he's pitching the 6th or 7th inning anyway.
Look to the Brewers, a team that has stated time and time again they are willing to make some trades. Will Smith and Jeremy Jeffress are too nice controllable guys who can grab some strikeouts, but won't command a premium like some flashier names. Depends on what they want. It's a organization that's not quite rebuilding but not quite competing either, so their needs are more elastic.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Nov 15, 2015 23:25:54 GMT -5
With Freddie Freeman being reported as available, I'm pretty sure that DD will be kicking the tires here. It's a shame Tehran had such a bad year (looks like an injury suspect), that could have been an interesting trade expansion. None of the Braves starters this year were worth considering, their future is in the farm although it's interesting how a decent staff fell apart so fast. Our proposal would have to include Hanley and a boatload of cash plus other considerations. Given Atlanta's Simmons trade, Marrero seems like a natural fit here. Fans would burn down the stadium if they replaced Freeman with Hanley Ramirez haha. Not to mention you'd have to probably pay 13-15 mill of Hanley's contract yearly. So between Freeman and Hanley, you'd have about 25 million devoted to your theoretical 1B this year. And then 42.5-43 for the next 3 years when Freeman's contract spikes. I just don't see it. Right now we don't know what Hanley does at 1B. It's not likely, but maybe he'll be okay. Shaw performed admiarbly there for league minimum and Sam Travis is raking in the minors. Unless you have some GM with an ACE that has a HUGE BONER for Sam Travis or Travis Shaw, I don't see how you don't add an insane amount of payroll (with also adding an ACE thru FA, the idea being that Freeman makes Shaw and Travis expendable due to them being relegated to depth options). Otherwise, you sell off a sizable chunk of the farm to offset the cost of Freeman/Hanley dump. That cost controlled starter will cost you a few of the Swihart, Benintendi, Owens, Espinoza, etc.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Nov 15, 2015 23:36:21 GMT -5
With Freddie Freeman being reported as available, I'm pretty sure that DD will be kicking the tires here. It's a shame Tehran had such a bad year (looks like an injury suspect), that could have been an interesting trade expansion. None of the Braves starters this year were worth considering, their future is in the farm although it's interesting how a decent staff fell apart so fast. Our proposal would have to include Hanley and a boatload of cash plus other considerations. Given Atlanta's Simmons trade, Marrero seems like a natural fit here. Fans would burn down the stadium if they replaced Freeman with Hanley Ramirez haha. Not to mention you'd have to probably pay 13-15 mill of Hanley's contract yearly. So between Freeman and Hanley, you'd have about 25 million devoted to your theoretical 1B this year. And then 42.5-43 for the next 3 years when Freeman's contract spikes. I just don't see it. Right now we don't know what Hanley does at 1B. It's not likely, but maybe he'll be okay. Shaw performed admiarbly there for league minimum and Sam Travis is raking in the minors. Unless you have some GM with an ACE that has a HUGE BONER for Sam Travis or Travis Shaw, I don't see how you don't add an insane amount of payroll (with also adding an ACE thru FA, the idea being that Freeman makes Shaw and Travis expendable due to them being relegated to depth options). Otherwise, you sell off a sizable chunk of the farm to offset the cost of Freeman/Hanley dump. That cost controlled starter will cost you a few of the Swihart, Benintendi, Owens, Espinoza, etc. I've seen statements to the effect that we might increase payroll this coming season. The Braves replaced Simmons with one year of Aybar, 2 good pitching prospects and cash. There would need to be a ton of cash but a top prospect doesn't seem likely in this situation since Boston's back isn't against the wall. The Braves aren't going to win anything for a few years, dumping salary isn't unusual. You also have to consider other clubs. Most of the big spenders seem set at first base. We might have the best hand and it's certainly worth kicking the tires without offering the farm. (I'm not one that thinks DD will blow up the farm unless we have an outrageous offer).
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Nov 15, 2015 23:48:50 GMT -5
I also don't think Sam Travis is the key here. The Braves don't have the DH so trading for Hanley and Travis seems counterproductive. Also, Sam has been raking but I don't think anybody projects him to be as good as Freeman has been. Career OPS+ 126 at very young ages.
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Post by bmitchsox on Nov 15, 2015 23:56:55 GMT -5
I think this could happen, not sure exactly what it would take to land Gray though. Imo, we definitely need a #1 AND #2, plus a solid set up man.
Trade Swihart, Johnson, Craig, Kelly and Travis to OAK for Sonny Gray Trade Panda for a prospect Trade Miley for a prospect
Sign Greinke for 5 / 150 Sign Madson for 3 / 30
Greinke Gray Buccholz Rodriguez Porcello
Betts LF Pedroia 2B Bogaerts SS Ortiz DH Shaw 3B Ramirez 1B Bradley CF Castillo RF Vazquez C
Hannigan / Marrero / Holt / Rutledge
Kimbrell Madson Koji Tazawa Barnes Ross Layne / Varvaro
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Nov 16, 2015 1:02:25 GMT -5
Fans would burn down the stadium if they replaced Freeman with Hanley Ramirez haha. Not to mention you'd have to probably pay 13-15 mill of Hanley's contract yearly. So between Freeman and Hanley, you'd have about 25 million devoted to your theoretical 1B this year. And then 42.5-43 for the next 3 years when Freeman's contract spikes. I just don't see it. Right now we don't know what Hanley does at 1B. It's not likely, but maybe he'll be okay. Shaw performed admiarbly there for league minimum and Sam Travis is raking in the minors. Unless you have some GM with an ACE that has a HUGE BONER for Sam Travis or Travis Shaw, I don't see how you don't add an insane amount of payroll (with also adding an ACE thru FA, the idea being that Freeman makes Shaw and Travis expendable due to them being relegated to depth options). Otherwise, you sell off a sizable chunk of the farm to offset the cost of Freeman/Hanley dump. That cost controlled starter will cost you a few of the Swihart, Benintendi, Owens, Espinoza, etc. I've seen statements to the effect that we might increase payroll this coming season. The Braves replaced Simmons with one year of Aybar, 2 good pitching prospects and cash. There would need to be a ton of cash but a top prospect doesn't seem likely in this situation since Boston's back isn't against the wall. The Braves aren't going to win anything for a few years, dumping salary isn't unusual. You also have to consider other clubs. Most of the big spenders seem set at first base. We might have the best hand and it's certainly worth kicking the tires without offering the farm. (I'm not one that thinks DD will blow up the farm unless we have an outrageous offer). We're already at nearly 177 million in payroll, 12 until cap. So, adding a FA starter and a 4th OF sits anywhere from 25-37 million on top of that. And that's without any extra bullpen work. I'm already considering this team being about 20 mill over the cap.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Nov 16, 2015 1:08:37 GMT -5
We have no idea what limits DD is under. Henry has stated in the past that the penalties for going over the cap (the loss of revenue sharing part) were nowhere near as extensive as initially thought be the industry.
We've only seen DD statements that the payroll is unlikely to decrease.
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Post by blizzards39 on Nov 16, 2015 1:17:05 GMT -5
I think this could happen, not sure exactly what it would take to land Gray though. Imo, we definitely need a #1 AND #2, plus a solid set up man. Trade Swihart, Johnson, Craig, Kelly and Travis to OAK for Sonny Gray Trade Panda for a prospect Trade Miley for a prospect Sign Greinke for 5 / 150 Sign Madson for 3 / 30 Greinke Gray Buccholz Rodriguez Porcello Betts LF Pedroia 2B Bogaerts SS Ortiz DH Shaw 3B Ramirez 1B Bradley CF Castillo RF Vazquez C Hannigan / Marrero / Holt / Rutledge Kimbrell Madson Koji Tazawa Barnes Ross Layne / Varvaro I like the roster but To get gray, Oakland is going to want much more than that, plus I don't think he is avalible. Panda is untradablewithout eating most of his money and wouldn't get anything back of note. No way we spend any more significant money in the bullpen. And I don't think 5/150 will be enough. Plus I don't think the Sox will go to the 250 plus million that this would take. I still think this team has many options to go but the next thing that they are going to try and do is sign one of the big 4 pitchers. Price-obviously the number one choice but JH would have to really be persuaded in order to write this cheque. It's possible it goes 8/250 Greinke- probably as good as price but the extra age will keep the years down. Something the Sox like to do. Still will be stupid money. 5/160 or 6/180 and the 12 th pick Zimmerman- youngest and possibly the cheapest of the big names but 12tg pick Cueto- I think this is the Sox go after. Can probably keep the term to 5 years with some sort of a option maybe if they go high enough on the money. No draft pick. 5/135. ? Ridiculous but ? If the Sox are able to secure one of these big name/contract pitchers, the next step will be shedding some payroll. Easy to say panda/Hanley but this may be impossible without dangling a carrot(prospect) with them. Something that should be considered. More likely we are probably stuck with at least one of these players and if we can shed one of them we will still be stuck with a big chunk of there salary so it may not really help. So more likely look for one or two of Porcello(sell low and still have to eat some) Miley, Kelly, Castillo, Tazawa, Hanigan(doubtful unless Vazquez looks close then why not) or Bucholtz. It's impossible to predict which one of these players would be moved but mark my word if/when the Sox sign an Ace then subsequent move will be creating some payroll.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Nov 16, 2015 1:23:56 GMT -5
If Price and Greinke want NL, you gotta think Cueto definitely wants NL. The guy is the one pitcher we've seen VISIBLY shaken by home crowds Toronto and Pitt in the last two years. He's probably terrified of Boston. Gammons points out he has a 5.56 ERA in 6 AL hitter's parks, most of which are in the AL East.
I honestly don't think Cueto even wants to come to Boston, and I think with SF missing on Price and Greinke, he is going to be at the top of the Giants wishlist in that huge ballpark.
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Post by blizzards39 on Nov 16, 2015 1:34:06 GMT -5
If Price and Greinke want NL, you gotta think Cueto definitely wants NL. The guy is the one pitcher we've seen VISIBLY shaken by home crowds Toronto and Pitt in the last two years. He's probably terrified of Boston. Gammons points out he has a 5.56 ERA in 6 AL hitter's parks, most of which are in the AL East. I honestly don't think Cueto even wants to come to Boston, and I think with SF missing on Price and Greinke, he is going to be at the top of the Giants wishlist in that huge ballpark. Can't argue that, it's just that with- 1-with what DD has recently said about signing a top end starter 2-already trading a couple top chips 3-potential lack of availability of a top pitcher through a trade 4-deepest FA class of pitchers ever 5- are obvious need of a front line starter I can't see the FO not making a serious run at at least one of these guys. Impossible to say who they like best but we do know they will cover that 12th pick and DD likes hard throwers. Price / Cueto. Do ya just take Price on JH yacht (did he sell the thing??) and let him fill out the blank cheque.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Nov 16, 2015 2:39:17 GMT -5
I also don't think Sam Travis is the key here. The Braves don't have the DH so trading for Hanley and Travis seems counterproductive. Also, Sam has been raking but I don't think anybody projects him to be as good as Freeman has been. Career OPS+ 126 at very young ages. Hanley and Freeman both have OPS+ of 129 on their careers. Freeman had a def rating last year of -3.9. And -11.4 in 2014. Hanley was -6ish in 2014 at 3rd.
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Post by pokeyreesespieces on Nov 16, 2015 2:42:16 GMT -5
If Price and Greinke want NL, you gotta think Cueto definitely wants NL. The guy is the one pitcher we've seen VISIBLY shaken by home crowds Toronto and Pitt in the last two years. He's probably terrified of Boston. Gammons points out he has a 5.56 ERA in 6 AL hitter's parks, most of which are in the AL East. I honestly don't think Cueto even wants to come to Boston, and I think with SF missing on Price and Greinke, he is going to be at the top of the Giants wishlist in that huge ballpark. Can't argue that, it's just that with- 1-with what DD has recently said about signing a top end starter 2-already trading a couple top chips 3-potential lack of availability of a top pitcher through a trade 4-deepest FA class of pitchers ever 5- are obvious need of a front line starter I can't see the FO not making a serious run at at least one of these guys. Impossible to say who they like best but we do know they will cover that 12th pick and DD likes hard throwers. Price / Cueto. Do ya just take Price on JH yacht (did he sell the thing??) and let him fill out the blank cheque. I think they're going to be heavily involved in both Price and Greinke. DD does not seem like a half-measure kind of guy.
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Post by jiant2520 on Nov 16, 2015 9:13:29 GMT -5
I'm probably so far wrong here, but I'll try.....
Three team deal... Boston gets Harvey. Mets get Carlos Gonzalez, Holt, Devers, Owens and Chavis. Colorado gets Kopech, Johnson and Ball.
Ramirez and money to Bal for Matusz.
Buchholz to LA, ARI, SL or SF for a prospect or two.
Sign Cuato, Gordon, Sipp and S. Pearce.
Cuato Harvey Porcello Rodriguez Miley
Kimbrel Uehara Sipp Tazawa Kelly Matusz Wright/Ross
Betts Pedroia Ortiz Gordon Bogaerts Swihart Sandoval Shaw Bradley
Castillo Hanigan Marrero Pearce
Wright beats out Ross at least at first as he has no options remaining.
Cuato as he does not have a pick attached.
Pearce as a RH bat to compliment Shaw.
Sipp as our LHP.
With the money we save from trading Ramirez and Buchholz allows us to sign Gordon and Sipp.
The Mets probably won't do it, I know.
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jimoh
Veteran
Posts: 3,990
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Post by jimoh on Nov 16, 2015 12:47:35 GMT -5
I also don't think Sam Travis is the key here. The Braves don't have the DH so trading for Hanley and Travis seems counterproductive. Also, Sam has been raking but I don't think anybody projects him to be as good as Freeman has been. Career OPS+ 126 at very young ages. Is Freeman good enough to pay 20-22M 2017-2021, at ages 27-31? Bad D, and .841 OPS at 1b this past year. Is he likely, after an OK 2015, to keep getting better, or at least hit the way he did two years ago? Am I crazy to worry that it would be like signing Crawford? (Who admittedly had not had as many very good years).
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Post by rjp313jr on Nov 16, 2015 18:20:35 GMT -5
Why is Price the obvious top target? Greinke should be. He's better, doesn't suck in the playoffs and is right handed. With Miley, Rodriguez and Owens we don't want another lefty IF a right handed pitcher is a legit option. Now is rather Price than Zimmerman but that's because I'm not downgrading just to have a righty.
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