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Post by fenwaythehardway on Jun 18, 2016 13:23:36 GMT -5
I doubt Ted Williams routinely faced 95+ mph fastballs and the quality/variability of competition Ortiz has. Don't underestimate who Ted Williams was. Williams would slaughter 95 mph fastballs.Williams didn't have the luxury of hitting in the lively ball era or facing the glut of mediocre middle relievers that dot teams' rosters. Who Ted Williams was as a hitter would have held up in any era. If you could get a time machine and bring 1941 Ted Williams back to play a full season in 2016, I'm not sure he would even hold an MLB job all season. He damn sure wouldn't hit anywhere close to .400.
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Post by ray88h66 on Jun 18, 2016 13:44:45 GMT -5
Don't underestimate who Ted Williams was. Williams would slaughter 95 mph fastballs.Williams didn't have the luxury of hitting in the lively ball era or facing the glut of mediocre middle relievers that dot teams' rosters. Who Ted Williams was as a hitter would have held up in any era. If you could get a time machine and bring 1941 Ted Williams back to play a full season in 2016, I'm not sure he would even hold an MLB job all season. He damn sure wouldn't hit anywhere close to .400. Come on man. Comparing eras is tough. But Ted would have a job.
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sarasoxer
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Post by sarasoxer on Jun 18, 2016 13:48:32 GMT -5
Don't underestimate who Ted Williams was. Williams would slaughter 95 mph fastballs.Williams didn't have the luxury of hitting in the lively ball era or facing the glut of mediocre middle relievers that dot teams' rosters. Who Ted Williams was as a hitter would have held up in any era. If you could get a time machine and bring 1941 Ted Williams back to play a full season in 2016, I'm not sure he would even hold an MLB job all season. He damn sure wouldn't hit anywhere close to .400. Williams was the best hitter in the game then (over a twenty one year period) and would be the best hitter today IMO. No one so gifted ever worked as hard at his craft. He was obsessed with hitting like no one else. With today's modern training, nutritional advantages, analyses etc. he would be just as devastating vs the league. He retired at his age 42 season (hitting .316 with 29 hrs. in only 310 at bats). Estimates are that had he not lost nearly 5 years to the armed services, he would have hit 169 more home runs...making a total of 690 hrs. He retired with the second highest hr ratio/at bat in history at 1/14.7 The only one higher was Ruth at 1/11.9. Williams had one bad season hitting .254 at age 41 when he had a season long chronic neck injury. Despite that and a broken elbow in an early 50's all-star game that impacted him to a degree over the remainder of his career, he still had a lifetime average of.344. He hit .388 at age 38. George Brett, Rod Carew and Tony Gwinn (retired 2001 at age 41) came close to hitting .400 and they were not in Williams'class. Ted had a lifetime OPS of 1.116 and a slugging % of .634. Ted's performance speaks for itself and in any era.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Jun 18, 2016 13:51:44 GMT -5
Just back in town after a long time away from decent connectivity. I did get hold of scores every now and then so I was able to see that the team has been on the negative side over the last two weeks.
I think that those arguing for more offense are missing the point. This team will score runs. Also, the Sox have decent starters in Price, Wright, and Porcello - a good to very good threesome. But I've been thinking about Rodriguez. It's got to be quite different for him with a leg brace given how much leverage pitchers get from their lower half. He's going to need time and my hope is that he only gets better as the season moves on. I believe that will happen, but getting that time in Boston isn't easy given the absurd expectations of the media and fans.
I like Elias' stuff quite a bit, but he doesn't have the command to make it effective at this point. He's going to have to be a lot better at hitting spots. The fastball has nice movement and the curve can be a killer, but he can't just throw that stuff up there which is what he was doing yesterday. Middle of the plat is a no-man's land in the majors and he's got to be good enough to play on the edges. He's not there.
I wonder if they won't give Wilkerson a shot as others have suggested. He's been outstanding at AA and AAA. Might be time to find out if the stuff plays at the top of the food chain.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jun 18, 2016 14:00:20 GMT -5
We were all excited in ST by the amazingly great bench of Ryan Hanigan, Brock Holt, Travis Shaw, and Chris Young. Put your hand up if you predicted that on 6/18 it would be ... Sandy Leon, Marco Hernandez, Deven Marrero, and Ryan LeMarre.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Jun 18, 2016 14:14:13 GMT -5
...but that is exactly what AAA depth is for, no? I like that collection of guys I might add.
Hope that Holt gets over the concussion symptoms at some point. He'd be very useful if he were available.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Jun 18, 2016 14:26:11 GMT -5
...Don't underestimate who Ted Williams was. Williams would slaughter 95 mph fastballs. Williams didn't have the luxury of hitting in the lively ball era or facing the glut of mediocre middle relievers that dot teams' rosters. Who Ted Williams was as a hitter would have held up in any era. You've got to be kidding. There was nothing like the endless stream of hard-throwing middle men most of whom have 1 and even 2 or three secondary pitches, nothing at all. Teams pitched guys till they fell by the wayside, that's the reality. Williams was one of a kind, and I'd agree that under the current nutritional and training regimes he'd thrive. The greatest statement about who he was is the simple fact that, for his career, he was on base after almost half of his plate appearances. That's how much fear he generated and how good he was. But there is no comparing the current level of specialization to the haphazard pitching rosters of yesteryear.
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Post by blizzards39 on Jun 18, 2016 14:28:20 GMT -5
If you could get a time machine and bring 1941 Ted Williams back to play a full season in 2016, I'm not sure he would even hold an MLB job all season. He damn sure wouldn't hit anywhere close to .400. Come on man. Comparing eras is tough. But Ted would have a job. Would his bats come with him in the time machine or could he use new bats???
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Post by cheers on Jun 18, 2016 14:35:17 GMT -5
I fail to see how bringing up Mr. Marrero helps the club be better. Castillo brings more upside (although I can't define what that might be).
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Post by jmei on Jun 18, 2016 15:18:51 GMT -5
That was a really good job of getting out of a jam by Porcello.
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redsox04071318champs
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jun 18, 2016 15:27:33 GMT -5
...Don't underestimate who Ted Williams was. Williams would slaughter 95 mph fastballs. Williams didn't have the luxury of hitting in the lively ball era or facing the glut of mediocre middle relievers that dot teams' rosters. Who Ted Williams was as a hitter would have held up in any era. You've got to be kidding. There was nothing like the endless stream of hard-throwing middle men most of whom have 1 and even 2 or three secondary pitches, nothing at all. Teams pitched guys till they fell by the wayside, that's the reality. Williams was one of a kind, and I'd agree that under the current nutritional and training regimes he'd thrive. The greatest statement about who he was is the simple fact that, for his career, he was on base after almost half of his plate appearances. That's how much fear he generated and how good he was. But there is no comparing the current level of specialization to the haphazard pitching rosters of yesteryear. I was thinking more along the lines of the middle relievers that used to dot the rosters when the league ERAs were around 5 in the heights of the steroid eras. I acknowledge that middle relievers are generally a lot better than they have been in years, and I also acknowledge Williams got to face some crappy Senators/Browns/A's pitching staffs, but Williams was also a brilliant hitter, something that I think you can agree with. I doubt he'd have much trouble adjusting to the pitching he faced. I think he'd thrive.
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Post by grandsalami on Jun 18, 2016 15:33:20 GMT -5
Slump slump dump
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redsox04071318champs
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jun 18, 2016 15:33:23 GMT -5
Don't underestimate who Ted Williams was. Williams would slaughter 95 mph fastballs.Williams didn't have the luxury of hitting in the lively ball era or facing the glut of mediocre middle relievers that dot teams' rosters. Who Ted Williams was as a hitter would have held up in any era. If you could get a time machine and bring 1941 Ted Williams back to play a full season in 2016, I'm not sure he would even hold an MLB job all season. He damn sure wouldn't hit anywhere close to .400. Williams might not bat .406 but he'd probably be leading the league in hitting around .350 or something. If you got in your time machine and met Ted Williams, I think you'd walk away convinced that you met as smart a hitter as there has ever been. Ted Williams, living in today's world, given his driven focus, would be doing whatever he needed to do to be in fantastic shape to hit (and I'm not talking about PEDs). Your last line is utterly ridiculous. You make Williams sound like he's Daniel Nava or something like that. Williams would thrive in any era.
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Post by grandsalami on Jun 18, 2016 15:37:17 GMT -5
We should be sellers IMO
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Post by grandsalami on Jun 18, 2016 15:37:27 GMT -5
FOR SALE!!!
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wcp3
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Post by wcp3 on Jun 18, 2016 15:39:45 GMT -5
After Wright and Price, these pitchers are positively putrid.
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redsox04071318champs
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jun 18, 2016 15:49:28 GMT -5
That's a very extreme assessment. The Sox have their problems but they're not THIS bad. They're contenders, albeit ones with mediocre to bad pitching, but they're not sellers.
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bosox
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Post by bosox on Jun 18, 2016 15:51:23 GMT -5
The Sox lineup should be beating on pitchers like Tyler Wilson and Sampson.
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Post by grandsalami on Jun 18, 2016 15:54:25 GMT -5
GJGE. Bag skate for the sox
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Post by ianrs on Jun 18, 2016 15:57:52 GMT -5
Red Sox record for the last 30 days entering today is 13-15.
Last 30 games for Travis Shaw: 111 AB, .207/.254/.324, 29 K to 7 BB Last 30 games for Hanley Ramirez: 107 AB, .215/.309/.280, 18 K to 12 BB Last 30 games for Christian Vazquez: 94 AB, .202/.235/.266, 21 K to 4 BB
Hopefully these guys pick it up soon. Good signs for Hanley over the past week or so (and at least his K/BB is the most promising). Even so, this team is now incredibly thin at 1B, 3B, and C. Would be nice to get Swihart and Holt back and in good health soon. Wishing them speedy recoveries.
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Post by grandsalami on Jun 18, 2016 15:59:01 GMT -5
Here comes the shutout.
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bosox
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Post by bosox on Jun 18, 2016 16:00:59 GMT -5
It's nice when a ballgame breaks out in the middle of a half inning public service announcement.
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Post by grandsalami on Jun 18, 2016 16:01:53 GMT -5
Boooooooo
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wcp3
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Post by wcp3 on Jun 18, 2016 16:14:51 GMT -5
I wish horrible things on MLB umps. They're the worst humans alive.
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ianrs
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Post by ianrs on Jun 18, 2016 16:21:53 GMT -5
Props to Rick Porcello on keeping his team in this game on a day where he has given up a decent chunk of hits and does not have his best stuff. Becoming a theme for him, and the tightrope walking is a little scary, but still nice to see.
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