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Post by deepjohn on Jul 31, 2016 0:12:29 GMT -5
Please provide support for the following assertions: - "effortless delivery"
- "he can throw strike after strike after strike like a strike-throwing machine."
- "He's just out there experimenting and learning, nibbling at the edge and trying to fool batters."
- "The Sox could get Sale for Kopech"
By the way, a troll is someone who makes intentionally inflammatory comments in order to provoke arguments or otherwise induce angry responses. You have a long history of doing so here by posting wild, unsupported assertions like the above. Either provide more support for your arguments, or tone down the nonsense.
In the video in the link I posted above, the BA scout says, at :30 "his classic delivery that takes stress off his shoulder and his arm." And at about :50 the scout says: "a 97-99 MPH fastball from that delivery is incredibly impressive." "Strike after strike after strike" is a reference, as fans of Kopech know, to the "immaculate inning." Nine pitches. nine strikes. three outs. He's also had games where, overall, he's thrown about two thirds strikes, which is very good. Getting swings at the edge of the plate (high OSwing%, low Zcontact%) may be how soft contact is induced (some studies show), and when you look at Kopech's milb PBP you see that pretty much any contact that's made is soft. Bowden said that the ChiSox would ask for Kopech/Moncada+ for Sale. Please don't accuse me of making wild, unsupported assertions, which in turn becomes its own wild, unsupported assertion. But it's all good.
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Post by burythehammer on Jul 31, 2016 3:14:40 GMT -5
If "every scout and GM in the game", or even a good amount of them, knew that he was the next Syndergaard then he would be a top 5 prospect in baseball, as these lists are heavily influenced by the industry. But he's not even close.
Which means you're flat out lying and making things up. Which is what a troll does. It wouldn't bother me, but I suspect there are some people here who might actually take you seriously (or course they'd either have to be children or morons) and you're doing them a disservice.
So just stop. It's embarrassing and not funny.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jul 31, 2016 7:44:37 GMT -5
Just because someone has a wildly optimistic view of things doesn't make him a lair. This board allows you to block people's posts and your own brain allows you to skip them so unless someone is attacking you its my opinion that you should just not read whoever you don't respect for whatever reason. I could make an argument that a couple of the regular "smart" posters here do more trolling than deepjohn. Some people spend more posts just making snarky smart *** responses to others just to point out what they perceive as stupidity and then hardly ever actually add anything themselves. It's like they read the board and act like an ******* teacher.
But point is. Just don't read deepjohn if you don't like his posts.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jul 31, 2016 7:49:25 GMT -5
Regarding Eric... I like his "cherry picked" stats and anecdotes, because they show thought about real world cause and affect. The truth is there are things that cannot be measured that are REAL and truly affect performance (like sleep loss or depression or other things). A statistician that actually thinks about this and tries to use it is refreshing. He will be wrong a bunch and whatnot but so will those who are just safe and boring and try to be traditional with the way they predict things because the world doesn't work that way. It's it like he doesn't explain what's he's doing or that years of reading him doesn't tell us where he's coming from.
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Post by jmei on Jul 31, 2016 8:05:52 GMT -5
Please provide support for the following assertions: - "effortless delivery"
- "he can throw strike after strike after strike like a strike-throwing machine."
- "He's just out there experimenting and learning, nibbling at the edge and trying to fool batters."
- "The Sox could get Sale for Kopech"
By the way, a troll is someone who makes intentionally inflammatory comments in order to provoke arguments or otherwise induce angry responses. You have a long history of doing so here by posting wild, unsupported assertions like the above. Either provide more support for your arguments, or tone down the nonsense.
In the video in the link I posted above, the BA scout says, at :30 "his classic delivery that takes stress off his shoulder and his arm." And at about :50 the scout says: "a 97-99 MPH fastball from that delivery is incredibly impressive." "Strike after strike after strike" is a reference, as fans of Kopech know, to the "immaculate inning." Nine pitches. nine strikes. three outs. He's also had games where, overall, he's thrown about two thirds strikes, which is very good. Getting swings at the edge of the plate (high OSwing%, low Zcontact%) may be how soft contact is induced (some studies show), and when you look at Kopech's milb PBP you see that pretty much any contact that's made is soft. Bowden said that the ChiSox would ask for Kopech/Moncada+ for Sale. Please don't accuse me of making wild, unsupported assertions, which in turn becomes its own wild, unsupported assertion. But it's all good. Here's the full BA video. In it, literally the first thing they say about him is "one of the first things you notice about Kopech mechanically is that he strides across his body and cuts himself off." When they mention his "classic delivery," they're talking about his arm action, but you won't find a single scout who thinks his overall delivery is effortless. While it has improved since he was drafted, just about every scouting report on Kopech notes his high-effort delivery, with a lot of moving parts and timing issues that prevent him from commanding his pitches ( SoxProspects, Speier, Fangraphs). When you say a pitcher can "throw strikes", it's generally a reference to consistently throwing pitches in the strike zone. Literally no (other) human on earth thinks Kopech, at this point in his career, is a "strike-throwing machine." League-average in MLB is that about two-thirds of pitches thrown are strikes, so if he tops out around there, it's not actually all that impressive. You're making the assertion that Kopech could throw pitches in the strike zone if he wanted to, but is instead just choosing to throw pitches off the zone to get guys to chase. That's a pretty strong assertion, and the burden of proof is on you to support it-- so far, you haven't. When you say "the Red Sox could get Sale for Kopech," it implies that the trade package includes only that prospect, or at the very least is headlined by that prospect. That Bowden link says the White Sox would ask for Moncada, Benintendi, Kopech and Swihart for Sale and might be willing to settle for Moncada, Rodriguez, Kopech and Swihart. In other words, that Kopech could be the third or fourth best player in a package for Sale. No reasonable person reads that and thinks "the Red Sox could get Sale for Kopech." So, yes, those are wild, unsupported assertions, and whether intentionally or not, they've provoked strong responses from other folks on this board which have totally derailed this thread. You know or should know what you're doing, so I'll ask again: cut out the overbearing, unsupported rhetoric, or you'll need to find another forum to peddle your nonsense.
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Post by jmei on Jul 31, 2016 8:09:34 GMT -5
Just because someone has a wildly optimistic view of things doesn't make him a lair. This board allows you to block people's posts and your own brain allows you to skip them so unless someone is attacking you its my opinion that you should just not read whoever you don't respect for whatever reason. I could make an argument that a couple of the regular "smart" posters here do more trolling than deepjohn. Some people spend more posts just making snarky smart *** responses to others just to point out what they perceive as stupidity and then hardly ever actually add anything themselves. It's like they read the board and act like an ******* teacher. But point is. Just don't read deepjohn if you don't like his posts. We have a ground rule against trolling (baiting other members into arguments), because those folks derail and ruin the threads that they post in. If you think anyone else is trolling, my inbox is open, but we've certainly gotten many, many complaints about deepjohn, and I'm inclined to agree with those complaints.
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Post by deepjohn on Jul 31, 2016 9:01:38 GMT -5
In the video in the link I posted above, the BA scout says, at :30 "his classic delivery that takes stress off his shoulder and his arm." And at about :50 the scout says: "a 97-99 MPH fastball from that delivery is incredibly impressive." "Strike after strike after strike" is a reference, as fans of Kopech know, to the "immaculate inning." Nine pitches. nine strikes. three outs. He's also had games where, overall, he's thrown about two thirds strikes, which is very good. Getting swings at the edge of the plate (high OSwing%, low Zcontact%) may be how soft contact is induced (some studies show), and when you look at Kopech's milb PBP you see that pretty much any contact that's made is soft. Bowden said that the ChiSox would ask for Kopech/Moncada+ for Sale. Please don't accuse me of making wild, unsupported assertions, which in turn becomes its own wild, unsupported assertion. But it's all good. Here's the full BA video. In it, literally the first thing they say about him is "one of the first things you notice about Kopech mechanically is that he strides across his body and cuts himself off." When they mention his "classic delivery," they're talking about his arm action, but you won't find a single scout who thinks his overall delivery is effortless. While it has improved since he was drafted, just about every scouting report on Kopech notes his high-effort delivery, with a lot of moving parts and timing issues that prevent him from commanding his pitches ( SoxProspects, Speier, Fangraphs). When you say a pitcher can "throw strikes", it's generally a reference to consistently throwing pitches in the strike zone. Literally no (other) human on earth thinks Kopech, at this point in his career, is a "strike-throwing machine." League-average in MLB is that about two-thirds of pitches thrown are strikes, so if he tops out around there, it's not actually all that impressive. You're making the assertion that Kopech could throw pitches in the strike zone if he wanted to, but is instead just choosing to throw pitches off the zone to get guys to chase. That's a pretty strong assertion, and the burden of proof is on you to support it-- so far, you haven't. When you say "the Red Sox could get Sale for Kopech," it implies that the trade package includes only that prospect, or at the very least is headlined by that prospect. That Bowden link says the White Sox would ask for Moncada, Benintendi, Kopech and Swihart for Sale and might be willing to settle for Moncada, Rodriguez, Kopech and Swihart. In other words, that Kopech could be the third or fourth best player in a package for Sale. No reasonable person reads that and thinks "the Red Sox could get Sale for Kopech." So, yes, those are wild, unsupported assertions, and whether intentionally or not, they've provoked strong responses from other folks on this board which have totally derailed this thread. You know or should know what you're doing, so I'll ask again: cut out the overbearing, unsupported rhetoric, or you'll need to find another forum to peddle your nonsense. The view is not "unsupported". It has limited support as I've said in my post. There's a big difference. The alternative or contrarian view will always have relatively less support, until the contrarian view prevails. Then the view is acknowledged and now there's lots of support. If you don't want contrarian views, you should just say so. But don't pretend the view is wild and unsupported, just because it's an alternative view. Just to be clear, the view I'm expressing is that the public evaluators of Kopech have got it wrong (including, respectfully, the really good evaluators on this forum) and he's much, much better than they think, in the eyes of GMs and scouts all over the league. The point about the ChiSox wanting Kopech for Sale is that he's a necessary part of the deal. Other players (Benny, Swihart, Erod) are interchangeable. But it's Kopech or no deal. And the Sox say, NO DEAL!! Kopech is just too good to trade for anyone, even Sale. **The reason Moncada is always mentioned in every deal is that he's still relatively high risk, since AA lefties are making him look silly so far, with 12 Ks in 19 ABs. (So teams are hoping they can pry him loose and assume the risk.)
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Post by deepjohn on Jul 31, 2016 9:25:12 GMT -5
Just because someone has a wildly optimistic view of things doesn't make him a lair. This board allows you to block people's posts and your own brain allows you to skip them so unless someone is attacking you its my opinion that you should just not read whoever you don't respect for whatever reason. I could make an argument that a couple of the regular "smart" posters here do more trolling than deepjohn. Some people spend more posts just making snarky smart *** responses to others just to point out what they perceive as stupidity and then hardly ever actually add anything themselves. It's like they read the board and act like an ******* teacher. But point is. Just don't read deepjohn if you don't like his posts. We have a ground rule against trolling (baiting other members into arguments), because those folks derail and ruin the threads that they post in. If you think anyone else is trolling, my inbox is open, but we've certainly gotten many, many complaints about deepjohn, and I'm inclined to agree with those complaints. The guideline I hold myself to is I don't make a post here unless it's "good news" to Red Sox fans, and it's news to the forum. But if you don't want my posts, just say so. No hard feelings.
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Post by jmei on Jul 31, 2016 9:55:24 GMT -5
It is fine to present contrarian opinions (e.g., I think Kopech will be Syndergaard 2.0). It is not fine to make statements of fact that are demonstrably false or cannot be supported (e.g., that he has an effortless delivery or that he's a strike-throwing machine).
The standard you need to hold yourself to is the ground rules of this forum, one of which is don't bait other members into arguments. You know full well which of your posts are hyperbolic and poorly supported and are there just to get a rise out of folks. Please stop making those posts.
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Post by deepjohn on Jul 31, 2016 10:07:53 GMT -5
It is fine to present contrarian opinions (e.g., I think Kopech will be Syndergaard 2.0). It is not fine to make statements of fact that are demonstrably false or cannot be supported (e.g., that he has an effortless delivery or that he's a strike-throwing machine). The standard you need to hold yourself to is the ground rules of this forum, one of which is don't bait other members into arguments. You know full well which of your posts are hyperbolic and poorly supported and are there just to get a rise out of folks. Please stop making those posts. No, he's Noah 2.0ah (tm).
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jul 31, 2016 10:23:12 GMT -5
Here's the full BA video. In it, literally the first thing they say about him is "one of the first things you notice about Kopech mechanically is that he strides across his body and cuts himself off." When they mention his "classic delivery," they're talking about his arm action, but you won't find a single scout who thinks his overall delivery is effortless. While it has improved since he was drafted, just about every scouting report on Kopech notes his high-effort delivery, with a lot of moving parts and timing issues that prevent him from commanding his pitches ( SoxProspects, Speier, Fangraphs). When you say a pitcher can "throw strikes", it's generally a reference to consistently throwing pitches in the strike zone. Literally no (other) human on earth thinks Kopech, at this point in his career, is a "strike-throwing machine." League-average in MLB is that about two-thirds of pitches thrown are strikes, so if he tops out around there, it's not actually all that impressive. You're making the assertion that Kopech could throw pitches in the strike zone if he wanted to, but is instead just choosing to throw pitches off the zone to get guys to chase. That's a pretty strong assertion, and the burden of proof is on you to support it-- so far, you haven't. When you say "the Red Sox could get Sale for Kopech," it implies that the trade package includes only that prospect, or at the very least is headlined by that prospect. That Bowden link says the White Sox would ask for Moncada, Benintendi, Kopech and Swihart for Sale and might be willing to settle for Moncada, Rodriguez, Kopech and Swihart. In other words, that Kopech could be the third or fourth best player in a package for Sale. No reasonable person reads that and thinks "the Red Sox could get Sale for Kopech." So, yes, those are wild, unsupported assertions, and whether intentionally or not, they've provoked strong responses from other folks on this board which have totally derailed this thread. You know or should know what you're doing, so I'll ask again: cut out the overbearing, unsupported rhetoric, or you'll need to find another forum to peddle your nonsense. The view is not "unsupported". It has limited support as I've said in my post. There's a big difference. The alternative or contrarian view will always have relatively less support, until the contrarian view prevails. Then the view is acknowledged and now there's lots of support. If you don't want contrarian views, you should just say so. But don't pretend the view is wild and unsupported, just because it's an alternative view. Just to be clear, the view I'm expressing is that the public evaluators of Kopech have got it wrong (including, respectfully, the really good evaluators on this forum) and he's much, much better than they think, in the eyes of GMs and scouts all over the league. The point about the ChiSox wanting Kopech for Sale is that he's a necessary part of the deal. Other players (Benny, Swihart, Erod) are interchangeable. But it's Kopech or no deal. And the Sox say, NO DEAL!! Kopech is just too good to trade for anyone, even Sale. **The reason Moncada is always mentioned in every deal is that he's still relatively high risk, since AA lefties are making him look silly so far, with 12 Ks in 19 ABs. (So teams are hoping they can pry him loose and assume the risk.) The reason why Moncada is mentioned in every deal is because he's the Sox' best prospect. Yeah, he has struggled in a small sample size against lefties. I'm not ready to proclaim him a platoon guy, are you? Don't think anybody else in their right mind, including the Red Sox, would think so. Kopech has a great arm, but his control is questionable. You have to be blind not to see it. Doesn't mean he can't harness his control and become a great starting pitcher, but if he can't that means he's either a five or six inning type starter at 100 pitches at some point in the 5th inning or a closer type, one good enough to command great prospects in a trade as we've been seeing.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Jul 31, 2016 11:11:37 GMT -5
... he's much, much better than they think, in the eyes of GMs and scouts all over the league ... I find most of your optimistic posts mostly entertaining. But claims like the above -- literally unknowable, for anyone -- severely detract from any legitimacy you might otherwise create.
But I'd hate to see you banned. In fact, I'd surely protest your removal.
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Post by burythehammer on Jul 31, 2016 11:22:21 GMT -5
Deepjohn, are you claiming that you work in baseball or have in the past? Or are you saying you're just some dude in his underwear who happens to have contacts with GMs? You like to dance around this because if you actually came right out and said it even your supporters would laugh at you. So how about it? What are your credentials?
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Post by deepjohn on Jul 31, 2016 11:51:24 GMT -5
... he's much, much better than they think, in the eyes of GMs and scouts all over the league ... I find most of your optimistic posts mostly entertaining. But claims like the above -- literally unknowable, for anyone -- severely detract from any legitimacy you might otherwise create.
But I'd hate to see you banned. In fact, I'd surely protest your removal.
That's the view I'm expressing, but you're right, I'm not claiming I know it to be true, or that anyone could know it. It's supported in various ways, by Speier, who says Kopech is drawing interest from all over the league. By gammo, who says the Sox have told teams they won't discuss Kopech. By Coppo at the Braves, who structured a deal to give the Sox incentives to include Kopech. By the ChiSox, who made Kopech a necessary part of the deal for Sale. By DDo, who said they could trade AE, because of the emergence of Kopech. Even by klaw, who when asked about his 40ish ranking of Kopech, says "I have no idea what to do with him", and adds that there's really no comparable starter. He's throwing as hard as Kimbrel or Chapman for so far, 97 pitches. And then there was the "immaculate inning' when he was like a strike-throwing machine. The secret is obviously in his delivery, I think. In the video I posted above, the BA scout described the delivery as extremely athletic, deceptive and "incredibly impressive." When you add all this up, you see that Kopech has been severely underrated so far by public evaluators. He should be the top 1 or 2 prospect in all of baseball ( opinion), maybe even ahead of Moncada who is still risky because AA lefties are so far making him look silly, with 12 Ks in 19 ABs. jmei, would never ban me. He's quite fair about things. But he does need to be fair to all, and a lot of the members here are complaining to him about me, so he's being a good mod and asking me to please avoid hyperbole. Which I'll try to do.
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Post by telson13 on Jul 31, 2016 12:05:39 GMT -5
Here's the full BA video. In it, literally the first thing they say about him is "one of the first things you notice about Kopech mechanically is that he strides across his body and cuts himself off." When they mention his "classic delivery," they're talking about his arm action, but you won't find a single scout who thinks his overall delivery is effortless. While it has improved since he was drafted, just about every scouting report on Kopech notes his high-effort delivery, with a lot of moving parts and timing issues that prevent him from commanding his pitches ( SoxProspects, Speier, Fangraphs). When you say a pitcher can "throw strikes", it's generally a reference to consistently throwing pitches in the strike zone. Literally no (other) human on earth thinks Kopech, at this point in his career, is a "strike-throwing machine." League-average in MLB is that about two-thirds of pitches thrown are strikes, so if he tops out around there, it's not actually all that impressive. You're making the assertion that Kopech could throw pitches in the strike zone if he wanted to, but is instead just choosing to throw pitches off the zone to get guys to chase. That's a pretty strong assertion, and the burden of proof is on you to support it-- so far, you haven't. When you say "the Red Sox could get Sale for Kopech," it implies that the trade package includes only that prospect, or at the very least is headlined by that prospect. That Bowden link says the White Sox would ask for Moncada, Benintendi, Kopech and Swihart for Sale and might be willing to settle for Moncada, Rodriguez, Kopech and Swihart. In other words, that Kopech could be the third or fourth best player in a package for Sale. No reasonable person reads that and thinks "the Red Sox could get Sale for Kopech." So, yes, those are wild, unsupported assertions, and whether intentionally or not, they've provoked strong responses from other folks on this board which have totally derailed this thread. You know or should know what you're doing, so I'll ask again: cut out the overbearing, unsupported rhetoric, or you'll need to find another forum to peddle your nonsense. The view is not "unsupported". It has limited support as I've said in my post. There's a big difference. The alternative or contrarian view will always have relatively less support, until the contrarian view prevails. Then the view is acknowledged and now there's lots of support. If you don't want contrarian views, you should just say so. But don't pretend the view is wild and unsupported, just because it's an alternative view. Just to be clear, the view I'm expressing is that the public evaluators of Kopech have got it wrong (including, respectfully, the really good evaluators on this forum) and he's much, much better than they think, in the eyes of GMs and scouts all over the league. The point about the ChiSox wanting Kopech for Sale is that he's a necessary part of the deal. Other players (Benny, Swihart, Erod) are interchangeable. But it's Kopech or no deal. And the Sox say, NO DEAL!! Kopech is just too good to trade for anyone, even Sale. **The reason Moncada is always mentioned in every deal is that he's still relatively high risk, since AA lefties are making him look silly so far, with 12 Ks in 19 ABs. (So teams are hoping they can pry him loose and assume the risk.) It's very clear to me that the issue has *nothing* to do with taking a contrarian view. A "contrarian view" is a different *opinion*, not an alternate factual universe. Nobody is objecting to your opinion on Kopech. What people are objecting to is the incredible extrapolation of nuggets of rumor or anecdotal isolated events that blossom into your "contrarian" reality, where you convert your opinion into facts that support it. I'm fine with anyone opining whatever they like. And people are always going to manipulate and obfuscate facts for their own purposes, to argue their opinions. But its a whole other to simply make up "facts" and present them as reality. I don't mind the enthusiasm, but I think Jmei's right that the wild statements detract from the thread. I mean, taking the leap from his one immaculate inning to the idea that he can throw strikes at will is just beyond the pale, and that's not even the most egregious instance here.
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Post by digit on Jul 31, 2016 12:15:39 GMT -5
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Post by burythehammer on Jul 31, 2016 12:35:00 GMT -5
By Coppo at the Braves, who structured a deal to give the Sox incentives to include Kopech. By the ChiSox, who made Kopech a necessary part of the deal for Sale. Where was this reported? Provide a link or an exact quote.
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Post by humanbeingbean on Jul 31, 2016 13:15:40 GMT -5
Anybody can be the number 1 or 2 prospect in baseball if you squint hard enough and cherry-pick some stats and achievements here and there.
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Post by barney27 on Jul 31, 2016 13:19:20 GMT -5
Guys stop acting like 5 year olds and quit trying to piss each other off. The discussion is what do you think about Kopech as a prospect and the chance that he makes it to the majors and has a positive impact for the sox to win. Forecasting what someone will be like in 2 or 3 years is VERY HARD. If you know how to do it perfectly then I suggest you not waste your time on this board and start calling the 30 different teams in the bigs, because you can make huge money helping them. Detroit many years back traded for doyle alexander and he helped them to the world series. And Atlanta got a low level A lottery ticket named john smoltz. How could you miss not seeing a future hall of fame potential pitcher. Well it happens . He developed 2 or 3 years down the road into something special. Will kopech do the same? Good question. sabermetric, gut feel and videos may give you indications, but you will not know until 2 or 3 years down the road. Sale may help you win the world series and kopech may be the next john smoltz.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Jul 31, 2016 13:47:23 GMT -5
Guys stop acting like 5 year olds and quit trying to piss each other off. The discussion is ... I would suppose lecturing the board is likely to "piss off" a member or two. Did you properly chastise yourself as well? (Aside: excluding the female members might also be a sub-optimum posting technique, if board harmony is your true objective).
As to MK, it seems to me his career trajectory is almost limitless. Waking up from a Rip Van Winkle sleep twenty years from now, virtually any career narrative might feel entirely believable.
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Post by barney27 on Jul 31, 2016 14:36:05 GMT -5
Guys stop acting like 5 year olds and quit trying to piss each other off. The discussion is ... I would suppose lecturing the board is likely to "piss off" a member or two. Did you properly chastise yourself as well? (Aside: excluding the female members might also be a sub-optimum posting technique, if board harmony is your true objective).
As to MK, it seems to me his career trajectory is almost limitless. Waking up from a Rip Van Winkle sleep twenty years from now, virtually any career narrative might feel entirely believable.
Sorry. Sometimes the school teacher comes out. Duly noted. I am just interested in talking baseball. Each person reserves the right to disagree.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Jul 31, 2016 15:15:36 GMT -5
As to MK, it seems to me his career trajectory is almost limitless. Waking up from a Rip Van Winkle sleep twenty years from now, virtually any career narrative might feel entirely believable. [/p][/quote] It's not particularly believable that he's going to develop two more plus pitches and plus command.
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Post by jimed14 on Jul 31, 2016 15:20:49 GMT -5
As to MK, it seems to me his career trajectory is almost limitless. Waking up from a Rip Van Winkle sleep twenty years from now, virtually any career narrative might feel entirely believable. It's not particularly believable that he's going to develop two more plus pitches and plus command. Or that the Red Sox' unwillingness to trade him is the only thing preventing a Chris Sale trade.
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Post by thelavarnwayguy on Jul 31, 2016 20:52:19 GMT -5
Deepjohn, as someone who also tries to be polite but sometimes disagrees with collective wisdom here, I just want to say go for it. Someone has a different view and you state it respectfully and 4-5 guys go off the deep end in nit picking response. Man does that sound familiar and when you turn out to be right it's nothing but crickets and denials and even vitriol because you had the audacity to really believe in a player. Is it really appropriate for everyone on the forum to act like a professional analyst? I mean really? So that everyone is supposed to treat every prospect with cold, dispassionate "wisdom" as defined by a 4-5 person cabal? Sometimes, that cabal totally gets it wrong. Not criticizing it but no one is perfect, although I readily admit that jmei is far beyond me in knowledge and ability. That doesn't mean we have to agree with everything.
Big deal if someone is a little hyperbolic. Get over it. The guy is throwing 103-105 and putting up decent numbers and he's young, big and strong with good mechanics. There is a whole lot to like and a case could absolutely be made that he is already one of the most valuable prospects in baseball. Look at the cost of top starting pitching and he fits the profile. This guy is worth getting hyperbolic over. I don't think he nets Chris Sale tomorrow but he is one hell of a great prospect already. The walk numbers could be influenced a little by the broken hand one would think maybe...and the shortened season so far. His walk numbers were not horrible in Greenville. His control looks better than Daniel Bard's numbers were coming up and his stuff is maybe a little better than that even.
He could rocket through the system or he could bust but both he and Groome are tremendous pitching prospects. Not many teams have even 2 starting pitching prospects in their stratosphere.
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Post by telluricrook on Jul 31, 2016 21:05:48 GMT -5
It is fine to present contrarian opinions (e.g., I think Kopech will be Syndergaard 2.0). It is not fine to make statements of fact that are demonstrably false or cannot be supported (e.g., that he has an effortless delivery or that he's a strike-throwing machine). The standard you need to hold yourself to is the ground rules of this forum, one of which is don't bait other members into arguments. You know full well which of your posts are hyperbolic and poorly supported and are there just to get a rise out of folks. Please stop making those posts. No, he's Noah 2.0ah (tm). Thats too bad. I dont want a (Noah 2.0). Theres a hand full of other pitchers id rather him end up being similar to. Anyway the only one that said Michael Kopech will be the second coming of Noah is Michael Kopech lol.
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