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Post by Guidas on Jul 30, 2016 22:38:26 GMT -5
Annnnd now that they're down by three the sleep walk to the end of the game has begun. BUt don't worry fellas, tomorrow will be a Joh Farrell getaway day special.
I need to go find how many games the Sox have won this year when Ortiz does not start.
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Post by James Dunne on Jul 30, 2016 22:39:00 GMT -5
Joe Kelly had a hell of a time throwing strikes anywhere but in the middle of the plate as a starter. What makes the front office think he'll suddenly acquire more skill as a reliever? IMHO Lackey and Lester trades are still among the very worst of Ben Cherrington's work, equaled only, perhaps, by the Reddick trade. Send Kelly back to Pawtucket until he can command his FB and a breaking pitch around different parts of the zone. Until then he's just velo and walks, and most of the guys in MLB can deal with velo. Rick Porcello is nearly as good as Lester for a lot less money. Hard to rate that deal as worse than the Andrew Bailey debacle, or the way he bought high and sold low on Melancon.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Jul 30, 2016 22:39:13 GMT -5
It's a question whether Porcello figured it out with the help of the coaches. That may be, but at some point the question needs to be asked if there is an organizational issue with why pitchers tend to stink when the don the great Sox uni. There probably is no way to really know, but how the hell does everyone seem to stink when they pitch for us. Price....Kimbrel....Pomeranz...Joe kelly....every friggin pitcher we sign gets turrible when they start pitching for us. WTF is going on? Hanrahan...Gagne..Bailey...Melancon... It seems like there are a number of possible factors - NL vs AL, and AL East...Boston...Fenway. Success on a poor team, small market, etc - doesn't seem to translate well to Boston. I've not looked up data or stats - just a feeling.
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Post by grandsalami on Jul 30, 2016 22:41:34 GMT -5
Our offense fell into a black hole
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bosox
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Posts: 2,117
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Post by bosox on Jul 30, 2016 22:42:53 GMT -5
I was hoping Pomeranz could've stayed on to save the pen. Guess there won't be any silver lining to this game. After scoring a ton of runs in Pomeranz' first game, the offense has scored only 2 runs in each of his two other starts.
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Post by grandsalami on Jul 30, 2016 22:43:36 GMT -5
But...but...Pomeranz is a steal. An absolute steal!! At some point down the road, the Red Sox are really, really going to regret this trade. He has had THREE starts. THREE. get back one at the end of August. It's too early to call it a. Bust.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jul 30, 2016 22:43:38 GMT -5
It's a question whether Porcello figured it out with the help of the coaches. That may be, but at some point the question needs to be asked if there is an organizational issue with why pitchers tend to stink when the don the great Sox uni. There probably is no way to really know, but how the hell does everyone seem to stink when they pitch for us. Price....Kimbrel....Pomeranz...Joe kelly....every friggin pitcher we sign gets turrible when they start pitching for us. WTF is going on? Hanrahan...Gagne..Bailey...Melancon... It seems like there are a number of possible factors - NL vs AL, and AL East...Boston...Fenway. Success on a poor team, small market, etc - doesn't seem to translate well to Boston. I've not looked up data or stats - just a feeling. Those probably have been vetted..although I am not saying your wrong. Particularly the AL v NL stuff. But the mound is 60' 6" in every park. It seems like the major reason is the pitchers turn into a meatball factory worker when they pitch for us.
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Post by dcsoxfan on Jul 30, 2016 22:47:26 GMT -5
Joe Kelly had a hell of a time throwing strikes anywhere but in the middle of the plate as a starter. What makes the front office think he'll suddenly acquire more skill as a reliever? IMHO Lackey and Lester trades are still among the very worst of Ben Cherrington's work, equaled only, perhaps, by the Reddick trade. Send Kelly back to Pawtucket until he can command his FB and a breaking pitch around different parts of the zone. Until then he's just velo and walks, and most of the guys in MLB can deal with velo. Is there anything about either the way the Red Sox handled the situation with Lester or the Lackey deal that feels even remotely consistent with any other aspect of Cherington's tenure in Boston? Am I the only one who feels like Cherington was given instruction from above that he needed to get back to the playoffs without signing a pitcher to a long term contract? Isn't this basically what Peter Gammons implied?
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jul 30, 2016 22:48:24 GMT -5
But...but...Pomeranz is a steal. An absolute steal!! At some point down the road, the Red Sox are really, really going to regret this trade. He has had THREE starts. THREE. get back one at the end of August. It's too early to call it a. Bust. I would normally agree with this...but we only have what.....12-15 starts with the guys this year. We are in the middle of a pennant race...no more inconsequential starts with the worst team in the division....he has to pitch like the games are going to end up 1-0...haste makes waste at this point. He's got to be better...they all do. It is bullspit.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jul 30, 2016 22:50:11 GMT -5
Joe Kelly had a hell of a time throwing strikes anywhere but in the middle of the plate as a starter. What makes the front office think he'll suddenly acquire more skill as a reliever? IMHO Lackey and Lester trades are still among the very worst of Ben Cherrington's work, equaled only, perhaps, by the Reddick trade. Send Kelly back to Pawtucket until he can command his FB and a breaking pitch around different parts of the zone. Until then he's just velo and walks, and most of the guys in MLB can deal with velo. Is there anything about either the way the Red Sox handled the situation with Lester or the Lackey deal that feels even remotely consistent with any other aspect of Cherington's tenure in Boston? Am I the only one who feels like Cherington was given instruction from above that he needed to get back to the playoffs without signing a pitcher to a long term contract? Isn't this basically what Peter Gammons implied? I'm inclined to agree with you. I think Lucchino had something to do with Lester's lowball intial offer that set the tone. He was soon gone thereafter. I think upon Dombrowski's hire, he made it clear to Henry who he wanted to sign as a free agent. I think if Henry said no, Dombrowski might not have taken the job. I'm sure Dombrowski had other offers.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jul 30, 2016 22:52:14 GMT -5
But...but...Pomeranz is a steal. An absolute steal!! At some point down the road, the Red Sox are really, really going to regret this trade. He has had THREE starts. THREE. get back one at the end of August. It's too early to call it a. Bust. I'm not saying he's a bust. I'm just refuting that this deal was an absolute steal for the Red Sox. It's too early to say he's a bust, but it's not too early to say that he's been disappointing thus far and there's reason to be concerned he won't be anywhere near as good with the Sox as he was with the Padres. If you would have told before the year started the Sox would trade Espinoza for Pomeranz, you would have thought they were nuts.
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Post by grandsalami on Jul 30, 2016 22:55:21 GMT -5
“@jmastrodonato: Boom or bust Red Sox offense of late: In last 10 games (including tonight), have scored either 3 or less OR 8 or more. Nothing in between.”
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jul 30, 2016 22:59:46 GMT -5
Drew gave up 67 hits in 102 innings for the Pads this year....and now 18 hits in 15.1 innings for us. He has the advantage of guys not seeing him with any regularity. This is on him. I am so sick of this stuff.
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Post by bigpupp on Jul 30, 2016 23:02:23 GMT -5
Drew gave up 67 hits in 102 innings for the Pads this year....and now 18 hits in 15.1 innings for us. He has the advantage of guys not seeing him with any regularity. This is on him. I am so sick of this stuff. Except in 1/3 of his starts so far.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jul 30, 2016 23:05:35 GMT -5
Drew gave up 67 hits in 102 innings for the Pads this year....and now 18 hits in 15.1 innings for us. He has the advantage of guys not seeing him with any regularity. This is on him. I am so sick of this stuff. Except in 1/3 of his starts so far. True...and they were the ones who said he had the best stuff they'd seen all year and they still knocked him around.
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bosox
Veteran
Posts: 2,117
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Post by bosox on Jul 30, 2016 23:15:58 GMT -5
Doesn't seem right but Santiago gets the win.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jul 30, 2016 23:18:25 GMT -5
“@jmastrodonato: Boom or bust Red Sox offense of late: In last 10 games (including tonight), have scored either 3 or less OR 8 or more. Nothing in between.” Whatever. I am not going to be the guy to point out a sample of this offense not being good. He is trying to stir up trouble. They have saved this pitching staff all year. We would be in last place without this offense and should be in first place if not for the pitching. I need to sign off....I am completely frustrated at this point.
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Post by telluricrook on Jul 30, 2016 23:23:12 GMT -5
“@jmastrodonato: Boom or bust Red Sox offense of late: In last 10 games (including tonight), have scored either 3 or less OR 8 or more. Nothing in between.” Tell that idiot that the Red Sox scored Six Runs last night.
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Post by station13 on Jul 30, 2016 23:32:34 GMT -5
It would be nice if Brent, Holt never start again. How far off are Swihart and Young?
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Post by station13 on Jul 30, 2016 23:34:56 GMT -5
Drew gave up 67 hits in 102 innings for the Pads this year....and now 18 hits in 15.1 innings for us. He has the advantage of guys not seeing him with any regularity. This is on him. I am so sick of this stuff. He has given up bad HR at the time he could not afford to, with runners on. Otherwise I thought he has done well. I wouldn't trust Buchholz, Owens or anyone else to start.
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Post by DesignatedKyle on Jul 30, 2016 23:45:49 GMT -5
why is Brentz even on the team? We're paying Castillo megabucks, why not have him do the same thing at the plate but actually show some semblance of a glove in LF
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Post by bigpupp on Jul 30, 2016 23:51:43 GMT -5
Because Castillo counting $0 against the cap is more valuable than anything he could do on the field.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 31, 2016 0:10:10 GMT -5
Drew gave up 67 hits in 102 innings for the Pads this year....and now 18 hits in 15.1 innings for us. He has the advantage of guys not seeing him with any regularity. This is on him. I am so sick of this stuff. He has given up bad HR at the time he could not afford to, with runners on. Otherwise I thought he has done well. I wouldn't trust Buchholz, Owens or anyone else to start. At this point you have to wonder what Owens could of done. I have no doubt that Owens could give up a bunch of walks, hits, homeruns in 3 starts and had one quality start in the three starts that Pomeranz had started. Ohh and you don't lose Espinoza by doing this.
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Post by mgoetze on Jul 31, 2016 3:14:02 GMT -5
Just one game. Just like the other 13 wins were just one game. Such a cherry-picker! In the games he didn't win, Porcello has a 5.02 ERA! (... which is still better than Pomeranz, Rodriguez, Buchholz and Kelly in ALL their games for the Sox.)
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Post by mgoetze on Jul 31, 2016 3:20:44 GMT -5
Let's not get ahead of ourselves. Pedro also called ruby de la rosa the next Pedro and we saw how that turned out. We did? I haven't been watching any Diamondbacks games, actually, but looking at the stats, Rubby is at least pitching better than the guy we traded him for...
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