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Post by mattpicard on Oct 6, 2016 22:43:08 GMT -5
He went. Mookie/JBJ and especially X s**t the bed tonight.
I guess the good news is Miller/Allen went 40+ pitches each.
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Oct 6, 2016 22:43:14 GMT -5
The check swings were unbearable tonight.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Oct 6, 2016 22:43:16 GMT -5
Sucks they lost but what a great game. (Except the home plate ump)
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TearsIn04
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Everybody knows Nelson de la Rosa, but who is Karim Garcia?
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Post by TearsIn04 on Oct 6, 2016 22:43:37 GMT -5
Nobody to blame but themselves for that 9th inning. The JBJ and Leon ABs were atrocious. I don't think Leon saw a strike the whole AB.
I don't know what the word is for a guy who's the opposite of a grinder outer of ABs, but this team has too many of 'em.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Oct 6, 2016 22:44:03 GMT -5
Wow. Watch the balls...swing at strikes. What a concept. Maybe Sox hitters should try it.
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Post by Legion of Bloom on Oct 6, 2016 22:44:08 GMT -5
Need to move Benintendi to the 2 hole or behind Hanley. Xander and JBJ were awful.
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cutz
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Post by cutz on Oct 6, 2016 22:44:52 GMT -5
I'm not giving Cleveland bull pen credit, like they are saying on NESN right now. Frickin' Sox hitter swung at so many balls it was embarassing.
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Post by tizzle on Oct 6, 2016 22:44:54 GMT -5
Our Cy Young candidate pitched like crap and our MVP candidate missed multiple pitches to crush.
Other things to point to, obviously. But if big guns suck like that, you kind of expect to lose.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Oct 6, 2016 22:45:29 GMT -5
The guys had real trouble with the breaking balls tonight. I think they'll make the adjustment. The opposing manager managed like he was on death row.....the opposing team hit 3 solo shots (that's not happening again).....the opposition's best relief pitchers threw a combined 80 pitches....we had substandard performances from Betts, Bogey, Bradley.
I don't know alot...but if we can get this to 5 games (probable best chance)...we will win the series.
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Post by humanbeingbean on Oct 6, 2016 22:45:32 GMT -5
At least we burned out Miller and Allen and Benny showed some playoff strength. Hopefully Price spins a gem tomorrow.
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Post by klostrophobic on Oct 6, 2016 22:45:40 GMT -5
How many times did they swing at 56-foot curveballs? Like at least fifteen times. Oh well, they taxed their bullpen so hopefully that comes back to help them later in the series.
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Post by Don Caballero on Oct 6, 2016 22:45:46 GMT -5
Watch Miller and Allen pitch 200 balls tomorrow and another 200 on Sunday and we get swept and then they're put into the DL before the next series. Thanks Tito.
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Post by Coreno on Oct 6, 2016 22:46:02 GMT -5
God I hope Price pitches the game of his life tomorrow. On the bright side, Miller and Allen both threw a ton of pitches, hopefully Tito blew his load in game 1.
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Post by soxfan06 on Oct 6, 2016 22:46:07 GMT -5
Short postseason for us if the lineup doesn't improve 10 fold.
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Post by tizzle on Oct 6, 2016 22:46:10 GMT -5
Need to move Benintendi to the 2 hole or behind Hanley. Xander and JBJ were awful. I'd move him to 6th and Bradley/Xander to 8 and 9.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2016 22:46:49 GMT -5
Would love to know how many swing and misses Red Sox hitters had outside the strike zone tonight. It seemed to happen all night long. And Xander...good Lord...learn to recognize a slider, dude.
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ghostofyaz
Rookie
Who the hell is between Youk and Trot??
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Post by ghostofyaz on Oct 6, 2016 22:49:09 GMT -5
Hopefully the Boston Check Sox got it out of their system tonight.
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Post by humanbeingbean on Oct 6, 2016 22:49:27 GMT -5
I think Ortiz needs to gather a players-only meeting and "kindly" explain that he really wants another ring.
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cutz
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Post by cutz on Oct 6, 2016 22:51:53 GMT -5
Would love to know how many swing and misses Red Sox hitters had outside the strike zone tonight. It seemed to happen all night long. And Xander...good Lord...learn to recognize a slider, dude. They may have set a playoff record for swing and misses outside the strike zone.
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Post by huskies15 on Oct 6, 2016 22:55:41 GMT -5
If Xander never swung at another breaking ball in his career he would improve as a hitter. Kluber is going to throw his breaking ball all game long tomorrow unless the Sox adjust. That was awful tonight.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 6, 2016 23:00:08 GMT -5
Hey, who needs the home field advantage? The Cleveland crowd was electric and the Indians hit much better at Cleveland than on the road. It almost reminds me of how the Patriots didn't really consider the HFA crucial in the playoffs last season, punted it away, and lost at Denver by 2 points - a game that I believe would have turned out totally different had the game been at Foxborough.
And it was another game that was a one run affair where they couldn't come up with the big hit when they absolutely needed to, the same damn pattern they had a lot of the season with the exception of that two week joy ride.
I have no faith in Bogaerts or Bradley right now. The whole teams seems to have trouble with the curve. So many damn checked swings. At this point I don't know if Bogaerts can do anything else but. It's like he has absolutely no clue what's coming and he lets the pitcher dictates his ABs. And unless JBJ runs into one, he's a strike out waiting to happen. Leon is pretty much the same thing, although he did blast one tonight.
It's amazing how terrible Shaw, Bogaerts, and Bradley have been in the second half of the season. Bradley couldn't miss anything during that 29 game winning streak, Bogaerts was batting .359, spraying the ball everywhere, and looking like a guy who was a lock to get 210 hits. Shaw was played very well thru the end of May, too. They tailed off so bad. Mookie and Hanley stepped in and upped their games, as did Pedroia, but those three hitters are so lost right now and they absolutely need Xander and JBJ.
Tito went for the kill in Game 1 using Miller and Allen for 3.2 crucial outs in which they allowed no runs and the hitters for the most part looked completely clueless. The Red Sox got 4 runs in 5.2 innings off the lesser pitchers.
Tito will be alright tomorrow though. While Kluber needs to go long, he can still squeeze an inning out of Miller and Allen with the days coming off, and Dan Otero, who has been highly effective, becomes a big weapon for them tomorrow.
The Sox need to really jump on the Indians, and they need to capitalize in a way they didn't really do with Mookie and Papi up in the 1st, Price needs to be the pitcher they paid all that money for. You don't want to go home down 2-0 needing to win at Fenway with Buchholz and E-Rod starting and then go to Cleveland for the decider. If they lose they're not necessarily done, but given the way Francona is managing, the Sox - if they're down a run or two are going to find it very difficult to come all the way back. This is kind of what I feared when the Sox got matched up against the Indians. You take their starting pitching injuries and hope to really knock out their starters, but if you have automatic outs in the order it's kind of hard to do.
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Post by station13 on Oct 6, 2016 23:13:23 GMT -5
Red Sox had their chances. That would be a crushing lost for Cleveland who exhausted all it options. Pedroia, Sandy and JBJ should all take their bases in the 9th. The pitches weren't close.
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ericmvan
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Supposed to be working on something more important
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Post by ericmvan on Oct 7, 2016 1:41:20 GMT -5
The Sox had 3 HR, 5 2B, 2 1B, and a BB, and had no GDP or CS ... and scored 4 runs. You won't see that too often.
When you hit .278 / .297 / .667 in a game, there's always a chance that too high a percentage of the XBH will happen with the bases empty. In this case it was 7 out of 8 -- and in the exception, a runner was correctly sent home with two outs and got thrown out by a near-perfect relay.
The Indians, meanwhile, hit an effective .313 / .303 / .656 (excluding the IBB and deducting a baserunner for the GDP) and had 4 of 5 XBH with the bases empty, the exception being an automatic 2B with two outs that failed to score the runner.
Since a point of OBP is worth twice as much as a point of SA, those two hitting lines are essentially identical. The bases empty / runners on splits for XBH are weirdly similar. The Indians got a 2 1 0 1 4, 2B line from their LHR and we got a 2.1 3 0 0 1 5, 2B, IBB line from ours.
The game came down to that play at the plate, which was so close the ump got it wrong originally, and a catcher taking second on a fly ball to LF, and our LHR having his initial struggles with a man on and theirs with the bases empty.
Meanwhile, re all of the chasing out of the zone ... out of 144 SP with 80+ IP, plus 135 "qualified" relievers at FG (not sure what their criterion is), Andrew Miller ranked 4th in percentage of all pitches that were out-of-zone swings and misses, while Cody Allen ranked 25th. That's 98th percentile and 91st. You have to give them some credit.
Kluber ranked 23rd. We'll see if we do a better job tomorrow.
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Post by burythehammer on Oct 7, 2016 6:42:53 GMT -5
The Sox had 3 HR, 5 2B, 2 1B, and a BB, and had no GDP or CS ... and scored 4 runs. You won't see that too often. When you hit .278 / .297 / .667 in a game, there's always a chance that too high a percentage of the XBH will happen with the bases empty. In this case it was 7 out of 8 -- and in the exception, a runner was correctly sent home with two outs and got thrown out by a near-perfect relay. Yep. That was Bauer's first start without a walk since July 8...2015. Looking quickly he's only done that 3 times in 92 career MLB starts. Total fluke and that was the difference in the game.
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Post by ancientsoxfogey on Oct 7, 2016 7:11:02 GMT -5
What made the swinging-at-bad-pitches syndrome so interesting was that several times, according to my pitch tracker, Sox hitters took ball one, then swung at the same pitch in pretty much to identically the same spot, as if they had a preconceived notion that "now he's got to come to me." And they continued to swing at similar pitches as the AB went on. Late in the game, when outs felt crucial, the respected Sox hitters kept getting 5, 6, 7 of the same pitch in a row, an indication that Cleveland has a firm book on how to attack the hitters that would be expected to give them trouble, and when the outs get crucial they will lean on the particular pitch/location, even exclusively, rather than "mixing it up". This fixation could be a fatal flaw though, IF the Sox hitters recognize what is going on and can find the discipline to force them out of the pattern.
Who got the pitches to hit? Holt and Benintendi, the guys who, through reputation or maybe unfamiliarity, don't have such books or don't get respect. In the 9th the Sox got themselves out. Allen threw next to nothing in the strike zone, and he didn't need to. The one time he broke discipline was with Benintendi early, and Benintendi hit him.
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