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Post by pedey on Aug 15, 2017 10:48:31 GMT -5
There hasn't been a new thread on Stanton in a long time. I doubt a Stanton trade would be possible nor practical for the Sox. But its fun to imagine Stanton in the heart of the order playing half his games at Fenway park
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Post by brendan98 on Aug 15, 2017 10:49:49 GMT -5
So Giancarlo Stanton cleared waivers, lots of sources saying the Marlins need to trade him, what would a Red Sox trade for Stanton look like?
I know everyone feels like there is no way the Sox are trading for Stanton, and unfortunately I agree, but had an outside the box thought that I wanted to throw out.
A Stanton trade is extremely unlikely without talking names like Devers and Benintendi, but what if the Sox went way outside the box and offered the Marlins Bogaerts and Bradley plus a top prospect? Bogaerts and Bradley are 2 and 3 years away from free agency respectively, both are represented by Boras so difficult to re-sign, and honestly who’s to say the Sox will even want to put big money into resigning either guy, as both their careers have been defined by and continue to be defined by ups and downs.
The only downs Stanton has is downtime due to injury, when healthy he is a monster. A 2-5 in our lineup of Benintendi, Betts (who is the guy you want to pay between him, JBJ, and Xander), Stanton, Devers, for the next 6 years could be awesome!! If Chavis and or Travis pan out even moreso. Lin and Marrero can handle SS defensively, and Nunez could be resigned as a SS heavy super utility guy.
I know this is the longest of long shots but thought it was a fun idea, thoughts?
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Post by brendan98 on Aug 15, 2017 10:56:10 GMT -5
Also, I should add on that a major consideration for the Sox is staying under the salary cap this year, Stanton’s contract pro-rated for the remainder of the season is approximately $4M, but I don’t see any reason why the Marlins wouldn’t pay the rest of this year, in order to jettison at least $295M through 2027. The 2027 season will be Stanton’s age 37 season, which is likely a year or two longer than you’d want to pay him, but really not bad at all in comparison to most mega deals handed out (Joey Votto).
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Post by jmei on Aug 15, 2017 13:28:21 GMT -5
Merged two Stanton threads.
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Post by soup888 on Aug 15, 2017 13:31:28 GMT -5
I agree on Bogaerts and Bradley but we'd be selling low at this point.
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Post by jdb on Aug 15, 2017 14:23:47 GMT -5
I couldn't give up top prospects or MLB talent when we could just go out and sign JD Martinez. I know they aren't he same but we wouldn't be opening any holes either.
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Post by pedey on Aug 15, 2017 14:57:06 GMT -5
I couldn't give up top prospects or MLB talent when we could just go out and sign JD Martinez. I know they aren't he same but we wouldn't be opening any holes either. I agree. I realize that if JBJ is traded, Stanton could take left field and Benny could take center. No holes in the outfield. But trading XB leaves a huge hole at SS. Yes, Xander is having an off year, but the replacements on hand at SS are Marrero and Lin. I doubt either could hit over .220 over an extended period of time. In addition, if Stanton is injury-prone now, imagine how bad he will be in 4 years and still owed roughly 150 million at that point. It would be great to have him in the lineup, but it simply doesn't seem feasible right now. Unless someone else has any other ideas on how to aquire Stanton...
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 15, 2017 14:57:28 GMT -5
First the new ownership group would need to sign off on this. If you're Jeter the guy that will be running the Baseball side. I don't see how you want this done before you take over. Even if they want it done, wouldn't you want to control the process ?
Second Stanton has 10 years and basically 295 million left on deal. That is massive contract for a guy that had a very so so year in 2016. He's a great slugger and a good hitter. Not the type of player I want for 10 years and almost 300 million. I want a great hitter.
I think Votto has one of the 10 worst contracts in Baseball. I think Stanton's deal is worse. It's almost double the money and years. Stanton is younger,so you get a bunch of prime years. Thing is Stanton is not the type of guy I want to bet on to age well. You never know, but I will always take the better hitter. Votto deal carries a ton of risk, but if you were going to pick a hitter to give it to, he is that guy. I would bet on Votto playing well into his late 30's over Stanton.
If Stanton was a free agent would he get more than 10 years and 295 million? I don't think so. So if you want a slugger signed to a market rate contract. Why not just sign a free agent? You could most likely get a JD Martinez for 100 to 150 million next year. You keep Bogaerts, Bradley and our prospects. Wait till 2019 there are a few good players that year if you want to spend 300 million.
If we do trade Bogaerts at some point, I sure hope it's for bundle of near major league ready prospects.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,851
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Post by nomar on Aug 15, 2017 15:47:57 GMT -5
It would start with Bogaerts for me too. They could sign Cozart in the offseason or someone relatively cheap. Not sure the Sox would really be interested in Stanton's contract though.
Votto's contract really isn't bad, and definitely won't look bad in 7 years. It's a big contract, but he's well worth it every year, and looks to be the type to age well.
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Post by jiant2520 on Aug 15, 2017 16:07:33 GMT -5
I am on record as loving Stanton in the lineup, but do not want the contract.
Also, I am not sure Miami wants JBJ and X... I think they know they cannot resign them, and as they become FAs, it is probably their realistic time frame to compete. They are not competing over the next 2yrs with them and wo Stanton, IMO.
If I am the Marlins, I'm asking for guys I can control longer.
We may need to trade one of them though, as I am not sure we can resign them either.
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Post by brian on Aug 15, 2017 16:16:50 GMT -5
The marlins tried to offload him at the deadline and nobody bit. He was subjected to waivers and nobody claimed him. People are terrified of that contract.
If Sox made a run at him. His deal this year prorated with the marlins throwing in a small chunk of cash could help keep them under the CBT.
If I'm the Red Sox I look to deal Bradley, a young pitching prospect like Shawaryn/ Roudes and maybe a pitching reclamation project like Darwinzon Hernandez or Jake Cosart. That should be enough.
Win win for them, first they will be able to unload a gigantic long term liability, next, Jeter gets a slight overall downgrade from a Stanton to a JBJ but still a 150+ games 5 War player who can do a lot of things well, possible starter who isn't too far away and a bullpen piece who if they can figure out the mechanics could possibly an 8th inning guy.
From the Red Sox perspective, they are getting a righty power bat who can protect devers and hit to all fields, stay under the luxury tax threshold and not deal any super elite prospects.
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Post by jiant2520 on Aug 15, 2017 16:26:54 GMT -5
My biggest concern acquiring Stanton is our ability to resign Betts, Benny, JBJ, Xander, Sale, Pomeronez, E. Rodriguez, Kimbrel.... not to mention Devers too. Obviously one will need be included in a trade, but thats a lot of resigning going on....
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 15, 2017 16:44:34 GMT -5
No team claiming Stanton could mean a few things. No one thinks Marlins will actually trade him, so why bother claiming him. It might also mean that teams were scared Marlins might try and dump the contract.
Now if you take it that other teams fear that contract. You then can't say a team will trade a bunch of assets for him.
I take it as they are just seeing whats out there. Which teams might be interested. Big difference in trading a guy for value and trading him to just dump his contract. I have to think one or more teams would just take him and his contract for free.
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Post by jmei on Aug 15, 2017 20:31:45 GMT -5
Stanton almost certainly won't be traded this season. A new ownership group just purchased the Marlins and that sale isn't scheduled to close until October. It seems very unlikely that lame duck ownership is going to trade the most notable player in the organization in the limbo period between signing and closing the sale of the team.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 15, 2017 20:50:49 GMT -5
I think a Stanton trade should be explored in the off-season, but I wouldn't want to give up too much and I'd want the Marlins to pick up the rest of the Hanley salary if the Sox were to trade for him.
The Sox could put Stanton in RF and maybe look to put Mookie back to second base and RF (of course they would need to find a manager comfortable with moving Mookie around, unlike John Farrell). The Sox could move Pedrioa in and out of second base and DH in the future which would be beneficial to his long term health for the team. They could DH Stanton to keep him healthy too because the only question about Stanton is his durability in the past, not his ability on the field.
I have no problem trading for a 50 homerun bat. Sure he is getting paid like a 50 homerun hitter but it's worth it. Think the Manny Ramirez contract, that was worth the price of admission too.
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Post by gregblossersbelly on Aug 17, 2017 12:28:36 GMT -5
Wait a year and sign Machado or Donaldson without giving up anything. Let Machado know he can play short if he wants. Can deal Xander for pitching. I'd be willing to move Price and Porcello's contracts too so Sale can be extended.
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Post by Coreno on Aug 20, 2017 16:54:04 GMT -5
Wait a year and sign Machado or Donaldson without giving up anything. Let Machado know he can play short if he wants. Can deal Xander for pitching. I'd be willing to move Price and Porcello's contracts too so Sale can be extended. This sounds like a great way to go with force trades on while playing MLB The Show
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Post by thelavarnwayguy on Aug 20, 2017 17:02:04 GMT -5
Agreed on looking at in in the off season but Stanton is cost effective for the Marlins. It's not like their payroll is that bad overall and he probably brings people to the stadium. And generates TV revenue. It's not crazy for them to keep him.
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Post by Guidas on Aug 21, 2017 10:37:59 GMT -5
Stanton almost certainly won't be traded this season. A new ownership group just purchased the Marlins and that sale isn't scheduled to close until October. It seems very unlikely that lame duck ownership is going to trade the most notable player in the organization in the limbo period between signing and closing the sale of the team. Agreed. It will be interesting to watch, depending on how fast this new ownership team comes together in the fall. Anyone think Hanley for Stanton straight up with the Sox taking all the money would fly? Yeah, me either.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 21, 2017 14:02:36 GMT -5
I wonder if Stanton is open to playing first base full time. That would be one way of getting him without having to trade anyone but prospects.
Imagine Devers and Stanton back to back. Manny and Ortiz redux all over again for 6 years possibly!!
As for the Harper and Machado comments, there are a good possibility that Machado and Harper both make more than Stanton by the time they're free agents. The Stanton contract could look like a small bargain if that's the case.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 21, 2017 14:14:53 GMT -5
But the Red Sox can't trade for Stanton using only prospects (if you're not including Devers in that group). The Marlins would not take a package of the entire Red Sox top 10 (again, sans Devers) for Stanton.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 21, 2017 14:38:33 GMT -5
But the Red Sox can't trade for Stanton using only prospects (if you're not including Devers in that group). The Marlins would not take a package of the entire Red Sox top 10 (again, sans Devers) for Stanton. No chance the Sox can't do a Adrian Gonzalez deal in 2012? Chavis, Beeks, and a lottery ticket while taking on the whole contract? You'd have to think there's only 3 or 4 teams in the league willing to even take the whole contract.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 21, 2017 14:43:07 GMT -5
But the Red Sox can't trade for Stanton using only prospects (if you're not including Devers in that group). The Marlins would not take a package of the entire Red Sox top 10 (again, sans Devers) for Stanton. No chance the Sox can't do a Adrian Gonzalez deal in 2012? Chavis, Beeks, and a lottery ticket while taking on the whole contract? You'd have to think there's only 3 or 4 teams in the league willing to even take the whole contract. The Marlins don't have to trade him though. They wouldn't even counter that offer. Maybe they'd think about it if they had a Carl Crawford on the books for another $100 million. I mean if Stanton's contract is so bad that the Marlins have to give him away, why do we want him? The Red Sox traded AGon to get rid of Crawford, not because AGon's contract was terrible.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 21, 2017 14:43:57 GMT -5
I also think that Jeter's investors have a ton to do with this. After spending 1.2 billion, the team might need to clear a payroll figure as big as Stantons.
Jeter right now is currently seeking more investors to even buy the team the last I read about the sale of the Marlins.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Aug 21, 2017 14:48:02 GMT -5
No chance the Sox can't do a Adrian Gonzalez deal in 2012? Chavis, Beeks, and a lottery ticket while taking on the whole contract? You'd have to think there's only 3 or 4 teams in the league willing to even take the whole contract. The Marlins don't have to trade him though. They wouldn't even counter that offer. Maybe they'd think about it if they had a Carl Crawford on the books for another $100 million. I mean if Stanton's contract is so bad that the Marlins have to give him away, why do we want him? Because he is a 50 homerun hitter and the Sox can afford him and can create a budget around him. The Jeter group might not have the budget and/or funds for a Stanton contract on the budget and may want to reset like the 2012 Sox did.
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