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4/16-4/17 Red Sox @ Yankees Series Thread
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 17, 2019 20:40:36 GMT -5
You could just see this loss coming a mile away when Workman came in, followed by the inconcevable move to let Barnes stay on the bench when the game was on the line, you know, your only good reliever out there. Workman walked something named Mike Tauchman and Austin Romine. I mean, that's as bad as it gets. Brasier is also turning into the pitcher he was before last year too.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Apr 17, 2019 20:41:17 GMT -5
Is it time to blow up the team yet? Toss the dead wood, admit that last year was a career year for the team and so many of its players. Moreland (already started his late season swoon), Pearce, Pedroia, Nunez, Leon, Workman, Hembree, maybe more - bring up the kids (well, the best of a mediocre lot). Sorry - just feeling pretty deflated about this team and don't see how things can get better any time soon.
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Post by incandenza on Apr 17, 2019 20:44:38 GMT -5
All right, I see the calls to trade Mookie have begun - I'm taking that as the sign to buy low on this team. We win tomorrow and get the split at Yankee Stadium! And we'll be 4-3 in our last 7 games, a 93-win pace! And Mookie is, I very much promise everyone, going to hit better than he has been! And this team will finish the year with better than an 83 wRC+! The turnaround starts tomorrow! okay but see now the problem is what could you even get for a guy struggling to stay over the mendoza line?
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bosox
Veteran
Posts: 2,117
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Post by bosox on Apr 17, 2019 20:51:25 GMT -5
Is it time to blow up the team yet? Toss the dead wood, admit that last year was a career year for the team and so many of its players. Moreland (already started his late season swoon), Pearce, Pedroia, Nunez, Leon, Workman, Hembree, maybe more - bring up the kids (well, the best of a mediocre lot). Sorry - just feeling pretty deflated about this team and don't see how things can get better any time soon. I think they have a ways to go before they decide to move some guys. However, to your point, there is only one trade deadline this year and if this team continues playing poorly and cannot make a significant turnaround by mid June, it will be interesting to see when or if they decide to wave the white flag and move some guys.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 17, 2019 20:52:51 GMT -5
The people on WEEI (not fans) are already calling for Chavis to be promoted.
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Post by station13 on Apr 17, 2019 20:55:44 GMT -5
Workman seems to still be living on the few outs he got in the 2013 world series. He is what he is...very good curve ball but only a show me fastball. He tried to nibble to Yankee power. Predictable results. It was only a matter of time for the pen...and we all knew that down deep even if we tried to dismiss the Boogeyman. Assembling this bullpen of Workman, Hembree, Thornbugh, Valasquez, Johnson is malpractice worthy.
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Post by kevfc89 on Apr 17, 2019 21:05:31 GMT -5
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Post by dirtdog on Apr 17, 2019 21:14:01 GMT -5
17-2 to 6-13. What a difference a year makes.
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Post by ancientsoxfogey on Apr 17, 2019 21:14:23 GMT -5
Is it time to blow up the team yet? Toss the dead wood, admit that last year was a career year for the team and so many of its players. Moreland (already started his late season swoon), Pearce, Pedroia, Nunez, Leon, Workman, Hembree, maybe more - bring up the kids (well, the best of a mediocre lot). Sorry - just feeling pretty deflated about this team and don't see how things can get better any time soon. I think they have a ways to go before they decide to move some guys. However, to your point, there is only one trade deadline this year and if this team continues playing poorly and cannot make a significant turnaround by mid June, it will be interesting to see when or if they decide to wave the white flag and move some guys. Relax everyone. Nobody's going to be moved for awhile. If this team can't turn it around, it is going to be given every opportunity to hang itself good and proper. What a stupendous turnaround. It's as if the team just coasted through the winter, coasted through ST, coasted into the season, and figured that 2018 pedigree would get the job done. Nobody has shown any diligence, never mind urgency, about getting into the regular season with some kind of intensity. Not the players. Not the manager. Not the general manager. Nobody. If this soufflé continues to sag anything like it has so far, it is going to be the #1 story in baseball this year. Now understand, I'm not being critical here. I am just astounded at the scale of the collapse thus far. As a Sox fan for 62 years, I can get a sort of perverse enjoyment out of the enormity of this train wreck, were it to continue. Truly, after crossing an historically good season by my favorite team off my bucket list last year, I feel no angst whatsoever about this.
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Post by station13 on Apr 17, 2019 21:14:35 GMT -5
He would cost Mookie just to start the convo. PS we might throw Nunez as bonus.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Apr 17, 2019 21:25:14 GMT -5
Sure DFA Swihart - he was better at his position, and a couple others than Nuñez is at any, and a better hitter and ballplayer. I’m not 100% sure Swihart isn’t a better second baseman than Nuñez.
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Post by incandenza on Apr 17, 2019 21:34:12 GMT -5
Fun fact: in 23 career IP, he has accumulated 2.0 fWAR more than Eduardo Nunez has given the Red Sox since the start of 2018. (He has 1.2 fWAR.)
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Post by dirtdog on Apr 17, 2019 21:47:05 GMT -5
Just saw that homer by Gardner. Looked like it literally cleared the fence by 6 inches. Been that kind of year.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 17, 2019 21:49:14 GMT -5
Looks like Lin is getting called up and Pedrioa is going to the IL.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 17, 2019 21:50:58 GMT -5
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Post by libertine on Apr 17, 2019 22:02:35 GMT -5
Well the was depressingly predictable. Our pitcher throws on 0-2 pitch that gets hit out for a slam. Our hitter comes up with the bases loaded and pops up the first pitch.
We're going to be struggling all season trying to dig ourselves out of this hole. We'll have some good stretches and just when we think they're on the right track...
I think that this is just going to be one of those seasons. I don't think we'll be this bad all season but we probably will never resemble the 2018 Sox.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Apr 17, 2019 22:08:27 GMT -5
The rubik's cube of this collapse (or maybe we can say puke-worthy start to the season).
Does the early on poor starting pitching lead to pressing from the offense and bad habits forming? Does the early horrendous offense put too much pressure on the starters to be too perfect - and they end up missing badly? Does the horrible starting pitching lead to a burnout of the pen (already)? Does all of the above lead to poor defense and base running because of the shock of being so bad? Does the inability of the straws that stir the drink to hit consistently (Mookie and Benni) stifle the offense?
Combinations of all of the above, I suspect. But...the root cause of all of this has to be the way that the team spent spring training - "easing in" meant "not ready".
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Post by sarasoxer on Apr 17, 2019 22:15:58 GMT -5
Just saw that homer by Gardner. Looked like it literally cleared the fence by 6 inches. Been that kind of year. Last year this was a win. Brasier starts the 7th followed by Barnes and Kimbrel. Oh, and we would have scored a couple more runs. I still expect a .500 season... as the starters resurrect. Either this year or next, Porcello looks to be gone and likely Bradley, Pearce, Nunez, Pedey, Workman, Thornburg, Hembree, Johnson. Devers had us salivating with the Chapman home run but...will his train arrive? ..with the Sox? Will Martinez want to stay around? How much money will Mookie cost himself? How can Tampa be so good with so little payroll? Can we hire some of their analytic guys? How long will it take to rebuild the farm to provide help? Questions,questions...
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 17, 2019 22:19:41 GMT -5
At least they won it all last year. They can't take that away.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Apr 17, 2019 22:48:16 GMT -5
I tuned out with the score 3-1. Had the feeling that the offense was done for the night. When you're not going good, if you don't hit a HR you can't string the hits together or maximize offense in a way where the runners move over and score on a hit.
Eovaldi looked good, but you knew sooner or later the bullpen would bite them in the butt. I figured they'd lose and I really wasn't in the mood to see it.
And even though it hasn't happened too often, I think this kind of thing will happen more often in the future and kind of undermine any turnaround they have, because they will blow games in the pen, so that the team won't be able to sustain a scorching hot streak like they did last year.
As it is, if they played .600 ball the rest of the way (86-57), they'd wind up 92-70 and it would be questionable if they make the playoffs.
And at this point, I really don't believe they can play .600 ball the rest of the way. I do think eventually they play much better, but I think 81-62 might be more realistic, and if that's the case, you're looking at 87-75 and not likely in the playoffs.
Hell at this point 81-62 looks optimistic. The pitching is terrible, whether it's the starters struggling or the thin bullpen struggling to hold leads (BTW, why wasn't Barnes in this game? I thought he was the high leverage guy?!!)
The injury to Pedroia means a lot more 2b for Eduardo Nunez which is a scary thought. I would have been fine with him as a righty PH bat off the bench who could spell Devers at 3b. I wanted no part of him back at 2b, and that's right where they are again.
They have no hope for any offense from catcher, and I know Vazquez hit his 3rd homer, but when it's all said and done his offense will be terrible.
At the moment Devers and JBJ have been struggling and Mookie is picking up where he left off in the post-season. He has returned to being passive at the plate, and he's been no spark plug.
One of the biggest differences is that last year Mookie would lead off, get on base, get the Sox the lead, and continue to hit. This season, they're not getting the same spark, and even when the Sox do get the lead, either the starters or the bullpen gives it right back.
This series was predictable. The Yankees are all sorts of messed up right now and the comparatively healthy Sox stunk up the joint and got themselves swept. Now they head to Tampa 8.5 games out and they'll be lucky to win 1 game. If they get swept they can forget winning the division and there would still be about 10 days left in April.
While I do believe the Sox will improve, I think once the Yankees get healthier, they'll play better than the Sox, and between the Rays, A's, Astros, and the ALC winner, I'm starting to believe the Red Sox won't make the post-season or even make it to 90 wins.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Apr 18, 2019 0:42:48 GMT -5
The people on WEEI (not fans) are already calling for Chavis to be promoted. His bat sure seems ready and we could use it.
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Post by flabosox on Apr 18, 2019 2:29:20 GMT -5
Releasing Swihart looks even worse now that the over-rated, over the hill, broken down Pedroia is hurt again. Swihart could handle 2nd base until Holt got back. Why did DD have so much confidence in Pedroia? His at bats were horrific this year. $40 million left to pay him after paying him $16 million last year to rehab. Ranks right up there with Cherington's other contract blunders:
Worst: Sandoval (Obvious) 2nd Worse: Ramirez ($100+ mil for a guy you "hoped' could play left field) 3rd worse: Pedroia- Half of $110 mil contract was worthless.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 18, 2019 2:46:34 GMT -5
Ahh come on man, you can call Pedrioa over the hill (due to injuries) all you want, but the guy isn't over-rated.
He was one of the 5 best 2nd baseman in the league in 2016. He was even really good in 2017. The guy has never been over-rated. He's just cooked it looks like.
You want to blame Cherrington for the contract? Fine. Pedrioa is the freaking man and don't you forget that.
If you wanted to keep Swihart (like I did), it's because you think he has the potential to be one of the 3 best catchers out of the Sox catching group, not because he might be able to play 2nd base. I would hate to see Swihart play second base. Let Lin try out there.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 18, 2019 3:00:42 GMT -5
Guys, don't blame Pedrioa for being done. He gave you 12 of the best years I have ever seen a Red Sox second baseman ever play.
Blame Dombrowski for not dumping Nunez. The guy was your 3rd option at second base off the bench (second after Holt got hurt) for some odd reason after he looked unplayable there last year.
In the off-season thread, I proposed to go get Derek Dietrich who signed for a minor league deal (really a NOTHING deal). He has already been worth a half a win with the Reds so far this year.
Nunez on the other hand has cost this team a half a win.
The only good argument that anyone had against signing a guy like Dietrich is that Chris Hatfield said that he would rather see Lin get a shot. At this point, you could have used one and probably now both to begin 2019. Pedrioa was such a huge question and you needed the depth.
Nunez is costing this team wins, he's so freaking horrible. He shouldn't be on this roster anymore.
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Post by wildsox on Apr 18, 2019 3:36:41 GMT -5
Guys, don't blame Pedrioa for being done. He gave you 12 of the best years I have ever seen a Red Sox second baseman ever play. Blame Dombrowski for not dumping Nunez. The guy was your 3rd option at second base off the bench (second after Holt got hurt) for some odd reason after he looked unplayable there last year. In the off-season thread, I proposed to go get Derek Dietrich who signed for a minor league deal (really a NOTHING deal) He has already been worth a half a win with the Reds so far this year. Nunez on the other hand has cost this team a half a win. The only good argument that anyone had against signing a guy like Dietrich is that Chris Hatfield said that he would rather see Lin get a shot. At this point, you could have used one and probably now both to begin 2019. Pedrioa was such a huge question and you needed the depth. Nunez is costing this team wins, he's so freaking horrible. He shouldn't be on this roster anymore. Agreed. Last year everything we did went our way and it masked how bad Nunez is at 2B and can’t be a regular. This year when the margin for error is smaller it’s very clear to see he should never play another inning at second. Make Lin the everyday second baseman or go outside the organization for a replacement
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