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Red Sox reportedly shopping Benintendi
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Jan 12, 2021 20:20:29 GMT -5
Gabrielle Starr has a Red Sox podcast. I can't speak for her being connected at all. But she's also not random enough that I'd immediately dismiss it, if that makes sense?
Mastrodonato is... indeed a person who writes about the Red Sox.
Keep it in mind, lock it away. We'll see if anything comes of it.
The one thing that kind of seems clear at this point is that there is some set of moves about to go down to fill out this roster and it's not necessarily going to be as simple as sign a CF, sign a 2B, sign 2 SP, sign a RP.
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Post by ortiz34 on Jan 12, 2021 20:22:32 GMT -5
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Post by taftreign on Jan 12, 2021 20:42:46 GMT -5
Former number one overall pick. Dombrowski trading the farm again lol. Just make sure we get that extra piece thrown in to recoup the ones Dombroski sent out!
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Post by tyler3 on Jan 12, 2021 20:48:26 GMT -5
I’m mean I cheap center fielder whose underperformed but young and potentially a change of scenery candidate AND decent triple A arm ( all depends on arm) and more money for Red Sox to maneuver with. Don’t think it can be dismissed out of hand
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Post by alexcorahomevideo on Jan 12, 2021 21:09:06 GMT -5
I’m mean I cheap center fielder whose underperformed but young and potentially a change of scenery candidate AND decent triple A arm ( all depends on arm) and more money for Red Sox to maneuver with. Don’t think it can be dismissed out of hand That return seems like it's extremely light.
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Jan 12, 2021 21:13:44 GMT -5
Id much rather just hold on to beni than trading him for a bust in moniak and a triple a pitcher from an organization that doesn't have much in the farm.
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Post by tyler3 on Jan 12, 2021 21:23:01 GMT -5
All right you guys, fair enough.
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Post by electricityverdugo99 on Jan 12, 2021 21:34:01 GMT -5
Trying to connect some dots and maybe this is out of left field, but once the Cardinals popped up in McCadam's report, I immediately thought of Matthew Liberatore who Bloom had in his system in Tampa Bay.
That and along with a Harrison Bader in a package, is interesting.
Maybe you have to include Vazquez or maybe you agree to take most of Carlos Martinez's contract. There's ways of getting to that point of getting a Liberatore.
I don't think Benintendi alone gets you to that point.
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Post by rasimon on Jan 12, 2021 21:36:45 GMT -5
Id much rather just hold on to beni than trading him for a bust in moniak and a triple a pitcher from an organization that doesn't have much in the farm. Moniak? Yuk How about Spencer Howard or mick abel
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Jan 12, 2021 21:43:47 GMT -5
He hasn’t really produced a whole lot in the minors but let’s hold off on calling Moniak a bust- he made the majors this past year at 22. I’m willing to reserve a little judgement and hope that there is some untapped potential there
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jan 12, 2021 21:55:17 GMT -5
They are not going to significantly downgrade LF. This only makes sense if they are signing either Brantley or Rosario. Since both of those are possible 1-year guys, this makes a 2- or 3-year deal for JBJ make more sense; they get an option year on the new guy and decide a year from now if Duran takes his place.
There is still the fact that they are probably selling low on Benny. There are five things that might offset this, only two of which are incompatible with one another. In order of likelihood:
2) They are higher on Brantley or Rosario than their projections would lead you to believe, either because of a fit for Fenway park, or value unmeasured by the projections (clutch hitting, hitting good pitchers well, etc.)
I can do my version of #2 tonight. Or immediately (less a 50-minute conversation with my brother), if my ex passes on watching tonight's movie with me! (Older foreign film in mono, perfect for headphones after her bedtime.)
As I suspected, Michael Brantley is a situational stud. He's a perfect fit, too.
Career wRC+ splits with bases empty 107, runners on 129.
By leverage low, medium, high: 113, 119, 126. B-Ref, presumably using different buckets, has OPS of 783, 780, 849.
.278 / .331 / .401 vs. SP the first time .286 / .364 / .426 vs. relievers the first time
Typical hitter: + .015 OBP, no change SA. Given the leverage splits, the improvement seems very likely to be against good pitchers rather than mop-up guys.
But here's the best part:
.257 / .325 / .286 (80 PA) career vs. Sox pitching at home .358 / .384 / .550 (125 PA) in Fenway
Wow on that.
He's been an average defender the last two years, and his platoon split is big enough that you'd platoon him with Renfroe pretty regularly.
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manfred
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Post by manfred on Jan 12, 2021 23:22:00 GMT -5
They are not going to significantly downgrade LF. This only makes sense if they are signing either Brantley or Rosario. Since both of those are possible 1-year guys, this makes a 2- or 3-year deal for JBJ make more sense; they get an option year on the new guy and decide a year from now if Duran takes his place.
There is still the fact that they are probably selling low on Benny. There are five things that might offset this, only two of which are incompatible with one another. In order of likelihood:
2) They are higher on Brantley or Rosario than their projections would lead you to believe, either because of a fit for Fenway park, or value unmeasured by the projections (clutch hitting, hitting good pitchers well, etc.)
I can do my version of #2 tonight. Or immediately (less a 50-minute conversation with my brother), if my ex passes on watching tonight's movie with me! (Older foreign film in mono, perfect for headphones after her bedtime.)
As I suspected, Michael Brantley is a situational stud. He's a perfect fit, too.
Career wRC+ splits with bases empty 107, runners on 129.
By leverage low, medium, high: 113, 119, 126. B-Ref, presumably using different buckets, has OPS of 783, 780, 849.
.278 / .331 / .401 vs. SP the first time .286 / .364 / .426 vs. relievers the first time
Typical hitter: + .015 OBP, no change SA. Given the leverage splits, the improvement seems very likely to be against good pitchers rather than mop-up guys.
But here's the best part:
.257 / .325 / .286 (80 PA) career vs. Sox pitching at home .358 / .384 / .550 (125 PA) in Fenway
Wow on that.
He's been an average defender the last two years, and his platoon split is big enough that you'd platoon him with Renfroe pretty regularly.
Ok. Wouldn’t be a debacle, but it puts a huge amount of pressure on Duran. If they do a one year deal on, say, Brantley with the idea of Duran/Bradley/Vertugo, the back up plan might get touchy. But... if the plan is to trade Beni, this is likely the best case scenario. And... with Beni’s tailing off, there might be no especially low risk path. Maybe this scenario coupled with some somewhat helpful piece back for AB might be the best way forward.
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Post by congusgambler33 on Jan 13, 2021 0:25:00 GMT -5
Trying to connect some dots and maybe this is out of left field, but once the Cardinals popped up in McCadam's report, I immediately thought of Matthew Liberatore who Bloom had in his system in Tampa Bay. That and along with a Harrison Bader in a package, is interesting. Maybe you have to include Vazquez or maybe you agree to take most of Carlos Martinez's contract. There's ways of getting to that point of getting a Liberatore. I don't think Benintendi alone gets you to that point. that would be interesting taking on Carlos martinez contract because he was originally signed by the Sox out of The Dominican Republic quite a few years ago, but the contract was voided because he used the wrong name and his age was suspect to questiion. the Sox had to give him up and i assume the Cardinals stepped in at some time to sign him. I think the name he signed with the Sox was Matias.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jan 13, 2021 3:06:20 GMT -5
Or immediately (less a 50-minute conversation with my brother), if my ex passes on watching tonight's movie with me! (Older foreign film in mono, perfect for headphones after her bedtime.)
As I suspected, Michael Brantley is a situational stud. He's a perfect fit, too.
Career wRC+ splits with bases empty 107, runners on 129.
By leverage low, medium, high: 113, 119, 126. B-Ref, presumably using different buckets, has OPS of 783, 780, 849.
.278 / .331 / .401 vs. SP the first time .286 / .364 / .426 vs. relievers the first time
Typical hitter: + .015 OBP, no change SA. Given the leverage splits, the improvement seems very likely to be against good pitchers rather than mop-up guys.
But here's the best part:
.257 / .325 / .286 (80 PA) career vs. Sox pitching at home .358 / .384 / .550 (125 PA) in Fenway
Wow on that.
He's been an average defender the last two years, and his platoon split is big enough that you'd platoon him with Renfroe pretty regularly.
Ok. Wouldn’t be a debacle, but it puts a huge amount of pressure on Duran. If they do a one year deal on, say, Brantley with the idea of Duran/Bradley/Vertugo, the back up plan might get touchy. But... if the plan is to trade Beni, this is likely the best case scenario. And... with Beni’s tailing off, there might be no especially low risk path. Maybe this scenario coupled with some somewhat helpful piece back for AB might be the best way forward. As I said, "They get an option year on the new guy and decide a year from now if Duran takes his place." No difference in pressure; Duran can take two years either way.
For almost anyone you would sign to a 1-year deal, and option would make sense.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jan 13, 2021 5:33:06 GMT -5
Ok. Wouldn’t be a debacle, but it puts a huge amount of pressure on Duran. If they do a one year deal on, say, Brantley with the idea of Duran/Bradley/Vertugo, the back up plan might get touchy. But... if the plan is to trade Beni, this is likely the best case scenario. And... with Beni’s tailing off, there might be no especially low risk path. Maybe this scenario coupled with some somewhat helpful piece back for AB might be the best way forward. As I said, "They get an option year on the new guy and decide a year from now if Duran takes his place." No difference in pressure; Duran can take two years either way.
For almost anyone you would sign to a 1-year deal, and option would make sense.
This is all well and good, but what do you think the chances are that the Sox feel Duran is going to be a starter this year ? He basically lost a year of development because of Covid, but the guy is almost 25 years old (24.5 season starts). Independent of signing one of the guys you are talking about, i wonder if people around here aren't taking into account Bloom's plans to integrate Duran into the 25 man this year, like as soon as they can. That alone may be the impetus to a Benintendi trade. Add: I don't think they want to wait on Duran for 2 years, just my opinion. This is taking into account he has not had enough development time in AA or AAA. However, Covid may force some agressive promotions. You start giving guys their first year when they are 26 years old, it almost post prospect status. If i am the Sox, i would like to find Duran 300 or 400 major league at bats this year, if things are aligned properly/
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Jan 13, 2021 8:28:37 GMT -5
My advice: Prepare to be underwhelmed by the Benintendi return
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Post by rminns10 on Jan 13, 2021 8:40:07 GMT -5
Id much rather just hold on to beni than trading him for a bust in moniak and a triple a pitcher from an organization that doesn't have much in the farm. I understand not wanting to trade him at a low point but Benni might also be a bust, so its a bust for bust trade.
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Post by jdb on Jan 13, 2021 9:02:25 GMT -5
With one of the first rumors having the Marlins involved now cooling, then recent rumors having them in on Wilson Contreras I’m curious if a Benintendi/Vazquez deal could happen?
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Jan 13, 2021 9:09:32 GMT -5
Id much rather just hold on to beni than trading him for a bust in moniak and a triple a pitcher from an organization that doesn't have much in the farm. I understand not wanting to trade him at a low point but Benni might also be a bust, so its a bust for bust trade. Maybe bust is too harsh a word maybe hes a late bloomer but Benintendis worst full year in the majors is better than any year that moniak has put up in the minors. If Moniak is the centerpiece of the deal for beni then I'd be extremely disappointed unless DD does what he does and trades 3 or 4 prospects with him.
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Jan 13, 2021 9:13:52 GMT -5
With one of the first rumors having the Marlins involved now cooling, then recent rumors having them in on Wilson Contreras I’m curious if a Benintendi/Vazquez deal could happen? Miami is out on Benintendi per recent reports though. And I don’t see the point of trading Vazquez right now. Another hole you’ll have to fill more expensively. Then again for the right return I wouldn’t really hate it.
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Post by sarasoxer on Jan 13, 2021 9:16:28 GMT -5
Id much rather just hold on to beni than trading him for a bust in moniak and a triple a pitcher from an organization that doesn't have much in the farm. I understand not wanting to trade him at a low point but Benni might also be a bust, so its a bust for bust trade. Benni was a high pick and performed well for most of two MLB years. He finished second in Rookie of the Year voting. During his first season some even speculated that he might someday win a batting title...so good was his swing, strike zone judgment etc. He was a good fielder with a decent arm. He's 26....not 36. It's far from the norm for such a guy to suddenly lose it (Ok, yup, Stapleton and Nava). Some clubs will reasonably be induced to 'buy on the dip' of just a 2 month performance drop 2019-2020. Still, the prospect of becoming good again and at low salary will be enough that we should get a pretty fair return...or else we keep him. Otherwise, he is the type of guy the Sox might have picked up last year. But perhaps there are other factors warranting his departure.
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Post by sibbysisti on Jan 13, 2021 9:21:32 GMT -5
Id much rather just hold on to beni than trading him for a bust in moniak and a triple a pitcher from an organization that doesn't have much in the farm. I understand not wanting to trade him at a low point but Benni might also be a bust, so its a bust for bust trade. How can you call Benintendi a bust? Sure, he, like so many players in their careers, have had seasons where things did not go well, whether for physical or concentration or other issues as it did for him in 2020. . But check out his ML production since he broke in and show me where he is in the same boat as Moniak. And, at age 22 with only 8 ML games it's not fair to term Mickey a "bust".
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Post by rminns10 on Jan 13, 2021 10:24:49 GMT -5
I understand not wanting to trade him at a low point but Benni might also be a bust, so its a bust for bust trade. How can you call Benintendi a bust? Sure, he, like so many players in their careers, have had seasons where things did not go well, whether for physical or concentration or other issues as it did for him in 2020. . But check out his ML production since he broke in and show me where he is in the same boat as Moniak. And, at age 22 with only 8 ML games it's not fair to term Mickey a "bust". I worry more about how bad he was in 2019 than he was in 2020, but with that being said thats two straight seasons where he was pretty bad. Hes a bust because he was the #7 pick in the draft as well as the #1 prospect in all of baseball and now he cant hit, has no pop or speed, and is an average outfielder who can only play LF because of his arm. Im not analytical guy but from what ive read his analytics are really alarming.
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Jan 13, 2021 10:33:42 GMT -5
How can you call Benintendi a bust? Sure, he, like so many players in their careers, have had seasons where things did not go well, whether for physical or concentration or other issues as it did for him in 2020. . But check out his ML production since he broke in and show me where he is in the same boat as Moniak. And, at age 22 with only 8 ML games it's not fair to term Mickey a "bust". I worry more about how bad he was in 2019 than he was in 2020, but with that being said thats two straight seasons where he was pretty bad. Hes a bust because he was the #7 pick in the draft as well as the #1 prospect in all of baseball and now he cant hit, has no pop or speed, and is an average outfielder who can only play LF because of his arm. Im not analytical guy but from what ive read his analytics are really alarming. Most players drafted even in the first round never make a significant impact in the majors or even make it. He was a key member of the 2018 world series sox. To call him a bust seems very unfair.
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Post by blizzards39 on Jan 13, 2021 10:36:53 GMT -5
I worry more about how bad he was in 2019 than he was in 2020, but with that being said thats two straight seasons where he was pretty bad. Hes a bust because he was the #7 pick in the draft as well as the #1 prospect in all of baseball and now he cant hit, has no pop or speed, and is an average outfielder who can only play LF because of his arm. Im not analytical guy but from what ive read his analytics are really alarming. Most players drafted even in the first round never make a significant impact in the majors or even make it. He was a key member of the 2018 world series sox. To call him a bust seems very unfair. A bust no. Has t lived up to his potential. Yes. But there is still time, but that said maybe what he needs is a change of scenery. As for the return, it’s impossible to say but the is NO WAY that this FO is going to give him away.
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