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Post by redsoxfan2 on Dec 18, 2022 22:21:43 GMT -5
So this is where we’re at - many people somewhat excited about a 38 year old DH/Occasional Corner Guy who’s declining so rapidly that the guy many of you couldn’t wait to get rid of - JDM - is replacing him in LA? Really? Thank you - THIS. I was just coming to post that. We have utterly lowered our expectations for this team to complete mediocrity or worse. Ouch. We've become Pirates fans.
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Post by crossedsabres8 on Dec 18, 2022 22:30:07 GMT -5
So this is where we’re at - many people somewhat excited about a 38 year old DH/Occasional Corner Guy who’s declining so rapidly that the guy many of you couldn’t wait to get rid of - JDM - is replacing him in LA? Really? Are people not allowed to be happy about this deal? They could've done any number of other things this offseason and this would still he a good idea, so I don't know what the rest of the offseason has to do with the Justin Turner thread. JD makes sense for the Dodgers, who has heavier splits than Turner, since they have multiple guys who can play the corners and more of a need to have a lefty masher. Turner makes more sense from the Red Sox, who need an everyday DH and also someone who can spell Casas at first and maybe Devers occasionally. Turner is better and more valuable than JD so he got a better contract, but the AAV was only $1M more so it's really not a big deal.
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Post by wcsoxfan on Dec 18, 2022 22:31:39 GMT -5
Unfortunately statcast has JD at 26.1 ft/sec as opposed to 25 ft/sec for Turner. But Turner has had much more base running value pretty consistently so maybe he’s a smarter runner or gets better reads on the ball? Seems to be the case. Turner is 41/51 as opposed to 25/36 in career stolen bases - although we don't know how many of those SB were uncontested and CS were hit-and-runs.
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Post by kingofthetrill on Dec 18, 2022 22:32:19 GMT -5
I'm surprised that Turner got more than Martinez. That kind of defeated the point imo.
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Post by scottysmalls on Dec 18, 2022 22:36:13 GMT -5
But Turner has had much more base running value pretty consistently so maybe he’s a smarter runner or gets better reads on the ball? Seems to be the case. Turner is 41/51 as opposed to 25/36 in career stolen bases - although we don't know how many of those SB were uncontested and CS were hit-and-runs. I’m specifically looking at UBR which also captures first to thirds and such, but yeah SBS too.
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Post by awalkinthepark on Dec 18, 2022 22:53:24 GMT -5
I'm surprised that Turner got more than Martinez. That kind of defeated the point imo. Turner has a lot more positional flexibility than JDM. I really think the days of pure DHs are going away. You have to be a really, really good hitter to get a spot on a major league roster if you can't play defense anywhere. Heck even Yordan played some outfield last year.
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Post by johnsilver52 on Dec 18, 2022 22:59:59 GMT -5
Can't really complain about the deal. pretty sure his middle IF days are long gone. 3b/dh.. Maybe a few 1b, should they give him some time there in ST in 2023. Sox felt like spending the money tho? i'd have rather seen them tag another 14m, on top of what Turner will cost and fix a real hole at catcher by resigning Vazquez, who really wanted to return.
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Dec 18, 2022 23:11:22 GMT -5
So this is where we’re at - many people somewhat excited about a 38 year old DH/Occasional Corner Guy who’s declining so rapidly that the guy many of you couldn’t wait to get rid of - JDM - is replacing him in LA? Really? I think most here, based on what I’ve read, also would have been about equally okay if they brought JD back instead. He’s a good hitter who fits a role the team needed why shouldn’t people be “somewhat excited”? Agreed. Also, I feel pretty certain that Chaim and Co offered JD the same contract as the Dodgers, but he opted for LA as they’re a guaranteed shoe in for a deep playoff run // probably wanted a change of scenery.
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Dec 18, 2022 23:13:12 GMT -5
I'm surprised that Turner got more than Martinez. That kind of defeated the point imo. Turner has a lot more positional flexibility than JDM. I really think the days of pure DHs are going away. You have to be a really, really good hitter to get a spot on a major league roster if you can't play defense anywhere. Heck even Yordan played some outfield last year. Another great point. At least Turner can man the hot corners while JD is a miserable outfielder whenever given the opportunity. It was truly painful watching him defensively in 2021.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2022 23:28:57 GMT -5
I like the signing of Turner. Seems like JDM really hit a wall last year in his career and Turner hasn't. Time will tell and until we compare their numbers at the end of the year it's all speculation it like a trade nobody knows yet.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2022 0:00:58 GMT -5
I'm surprised that Turner got more than Martinez. That kind of defeated the point imo. Turner has a lot more positional flexibility than JDM. I really think the days of pure DHs are going away. You have to be a really, really good hitter to get a spot on a major league roster if you can't play defense anywhere. Heck even Yordan played some outfield last year. I think it got untenable last year when it got to the point that Devers had the hamstring injury in July/August and JD couldn’t just play the OF for a week to let Raffy DH. JD played literally 0 games in the field (which, given his history of back stuff, I get) in ‘22. That’s fine if you’re an Ortiz-level offensive beast - but if you’re merely good, and your All-Star 3B is playing on one leg, I need you to be able to pick up a glove for a few hours lol
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Post by keninten on Dec 19, 2022 0:07:32 GMT -5
JDM won`t play the OF anymore, especially with 2nd base being larger.
Just realized that was JDM last game in the outfield.
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Post by julyanmorley on Dec 19, 2022 0:08:31 GMT -5
Kinda hope they just play Devers at DH 80 times next year as long as we have another 3B/DH who is just about as good as him in the field.
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Post by keninten on Dec 19, 2022 0:14:12 GMT -5
Kinda hope they just play Devers at DH 80 times next year as long as we have another 3B/DH who is just about as good as him in the field. Wonder if they could do that? Devers would lose alot of value. I could see him sitting out if they pulled something like that.
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Post by benzinger on Dec 19, 2022 0:16:30 GMT -5
Thank you - THIS. I was just coming to post that. We have utterly lowered our expectations for this team to complete mediocrity or worse. Ouch. We've become Pirates fans. Lol. It’s not THAT bad. I’d say we’ve become Twins fans. Or maybe Mariners fans.
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Post by julyanmorley on Dec 19, 2022 0:17:25 GMT -5
Kinda hope they just play Devers at DH 80 times next year as long as we have another 3B/DH who is just about as good as him in the field. Wonder if they could do that? Devers would lose alot of value. I could see him sitting out if they pulled something like that. Well, they announced Turner as a 1B/DH, so they're treading carefully. Still, Devers winces in pain like every third game and I'm gonna be yelling on the internet about giving him time off at DH when he does
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Post by keninten on Dec 19, 2022 0:26:41 GMT -5
Wonder if they could do that? Devers would lose alot of value. I could see him sitting out if they pulled something like that. Well, they announced Turner as a 1B/DH, so they're treading carefully. Still, Devers winces in pain like every third game and I'm gonna be yelling on the internet about giving him time off at DH when he does I like Turners defense better than Devers by the eye test.
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Dec 19, 2022 0:32:24 GMT -5
Well, they announced Turner as a 1B/DH, so they're treading carefully. Still, Devers winces in pain like every third game and I'm gonna be yelling on the internet about giving him time off at DH when he does I like Turners defense better than Devers by the eye test. Without looking at UZR and DRS, I have to agree with you. But as someone astutely pointed out, I’m sure Devers would take issue with playing less 3B as it would negatively affect his FA value.
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Post by kingofthetrill on Dec 19, 2022 0:33:52 GMT -5
I guess this puts the nail in the coffin of Yoshida at DH and having a good defensive OF.
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Post by bosoxnation on Dec 19, 2022 0:35:00 GMT -5
Steve Pearce vibes
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Post by incandenza on Dec 19, 2022 0:55:22 GMT -5
about a month ago the Sox lost out on Jose Abreu, then more recently were rumored to be interested in a reunion with JD. Turner seems like option C as a piece to a larger plan. Not sure what that is at this point Dalbac trade? Devers trade?? Casas trade??? So this is where we’re at - many people somewhat excited about a 38 year old DH/Occasional Corner Guy who’s declining so rapidly that the guy many of you couldn’t wait to get rid of - JDM - is replacing him in LA? Really? Guys, Turner got the bigger contract. The market decreed he is the better player. And for good reason - better recent history, slightly better offensive projection, and he can actually play some positions in the field. Boston upgraded and LA downgraded.
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Post by oldfaithful2019 on Dec 19, 2022 1:07:23 GMT -5
Turner is still a very good hitter and every day player. We were short a couple of those. Another high on base hitter for the top end of the order. I like this move.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Dec 19, 2022 1:26:08 GMT -5
Being out here on the West coast, I've watched quite a few Dodgers games. Turner is a favorite, so I'm biased. But I do have a few numbers to back me up.
The issue has been injuries as you might expect for someone pushing past 35. But if he's healthy he hits. After missing two weeks at the end of July last year, he absolutely raked from his return on Aug 9th to the end of the season: .319/.384/.503
Martinez could only hope for that kind of finish. This is a small move but if he's healthy it could pay big dividends. He's a professional all the way.
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Dec 19, 2022 2:39:18 GMT -5
Being out here on the West coast, I've watched quite a few Dodgers games. Turner is a favorite, so I'm biased. But I do have a few numbers to back me up. The issue has been injuries as you might expect for someone pushing past 35. But if he's healthy he hits. After missing two weeks at the end of July last year, he absolutely raked from his return on Aug 9th to the end of the season: .319/.384/.503 Martinez could only hope for that kind of finish. This is a small move but if he's healthy it could pay big dividends. He's a professional all the way. As another west coast exile, my Sox allies have often wished he could play at Fenway. True blue Dodger fans are sad to see him go. I like JDM but feel we may have won this swap, And certainly didnât lose it. A high OBP with pop and a good glove and arm. With Turner, Yoshida, Casas, a healthy Devers, Storey, Kiké, Verdugo and a new SS, we got this.
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Post by gerry on Dec 19, 2022 2:43:30 GMT -5
I know I am about to get bashed for daring to see this, or anything, as a positive. What can I say, it’s a game and our team is better than expected with more good moves to come.
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