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Post by dmaineah on Apr 24, 2013 5:36:01 GMT -5
Bard being called back up today.
Am I the only one who thinks this seems rushed?
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Post by amfox1 on Apr 24, 2013 6:03:27 GMT -5
It's only until Sunday, he's only going to pitch in a blowout, and there is no one else feasibly to call up to replace Wright, so I think it is the right (and, frankly, only) choice, short of adding someone to the 40-man roster.
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Post by bluechip on Apr 24, 2013 9:12:06 GMT -5
It's not like the team is required to use him late in close situations. They are not going to lose someone they value (and the team DOES value Hassan since it protected him in the rule five) by removing him from the 40 man roster for the seventh reliver. At least they won't lose someone when it's avoidable.
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Post by MLBDreams on Apr 24, 2013 11:13:37 GMT -5
Bard being called back up today. Am I the only one who thinks this seems rushed? Not only you, I think it's too rush for him to call up. I doubt he'll be regain with old form with few games in AA level recently. He was awful from last yr with Sept call up after sent down in whole summer time. I see him same issues as Craig Hanson, Scott Kazmir (not on RS), Cla Meredith, Andrew Miller & others (all mental & control issues & difficult to fix for correction). So, I'm mixed up by his call up.
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Post by gregblossersbelly on Apr 24, 2013 11:24:53 GMT -5
He's one of the few arms who can pitch a few innings who are on the 40. He's not getting promoted because he's straightened out. We need a bullpen arm until Hanrahan comes back after the homestand. Probably sent down right after Hanrahan is activated. Lackey will replace A.Wilson. Aceves days are numbered IMO. When Franklin Morales is ready. I think he's gone. Or, maybe when Breslow is ready.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2013 12:15:23 GMT -5
Right as Adam and Greg indicated they need another arm in that bullpen as Wright probably can't pitch until Friday and in any case he was a disaster last night. The only other options, Britton and DeLarosa would not be available to pitch tonight. Franklin Morales was supposed to pitch Monday night but did not so who knows when he's coming back.
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Post by elguapo on Apr 24, 2013 13:22:55 GMT -5
Per Farrell via ESPNBoston/SP twitter, Bard is here to be a regular.
I think he should be ok as a low leverage guy. But that spells the end for another of our current slackers: Aceves, Miller.
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Post by grandsalami on Apr 24, 2013 13:25:31 GMT -5
Per Farrell via ESPNBoston/SP twitter, Bard is here to be a regular. I think he should be ok as a low leverage guy. But that spells the end for another of our current slackers: Aceves, Miller. Miller will stay, Ace will be traded or DFAD
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Apr 24, 2013 13:47:26 GMT -5
I don't think they'd have called him up just for a short term solution. Remember, the whole reason he went to Portland rather than Pawtucket was to send the message that this wasn't a short-term project (and to work with Kipper of course).
In his last 3 appearances, he'd allowed 3 baserunners in 4 innings. And really, the work he was doing down there wasn't about results - it was about getting out there in game situations and working on the mechanics - that's why he was basically throwing every other day for an inning. My guess is that it reached a point where they felt he had to come up to continue his progress. It helps that he'll be able to work with Nieves and Farrell.
I do agree, however, that he's working the low-leverage innings at this point. In case anyone's curious, gmLI (leverage index when entering) so far:
Uehara 1.95 Bailey 1.68 Tazawa 1.58 Hanrahan 1.30 Miller 0.86 Wilson 0.67 Aceves (as a RP) 0.49 Mortensen 0.48 Wright 0.10
I see Bard somewhere in that <0.50 group for now.
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Post by Matt Huegel on Apr 24, 2013 14:37:24 GMT -5
Using that as a general outline of who is most likely to come in in important situations, I would put him between Wilson and Miller right now. In other words, all things being equal, Bard gets in an important inning over Wilson, but after all those other guys.
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Post by DesignatedForAssignment on Apr 24, 2013 15:35:29 GMT -5
Per Farrell via ESPNBoston/SP twitter, Bard is here to be a regular. I think he should be ok as a low leverage guy. But that spells the end for another of our current slackers: Aceves, Miller. Miller will stay, Ace will be traded or DFAD Aceves still has an option. The only downside is that he will blow a gasket. You would think that optioning him and trading him makes more sense, gives team leverage, over DFA and trade.
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Post by sarasoxer on Apr 24, 2013 18:07:24 GMT -5
Let's face it. At the earliest opportunity, if any, Aceves is gone. He is a tie and an anchor to the recent, horrid past.
I am concerned whether Bard can be effective at 92-94 because he has never had great control. Portland's gun had him at 93-96 but that gun is notoriously 'fast'. Some guys, for reasons yet undetermined, lose velocity even at young ages. Bard appears to be one such guy. As such, I don't see him as a high leverage, dominant reliever for the Sox.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Apr 24, 2013 18:56:37 GMT -5
Let's face it. At the earliest opportunity, if any, Aceves is gone. He is a tie and an anchor to the recent, horrid past. I am concerned whether Bard can be effective at 92-94 because he has never had great control. Portland's gun had him at 93-96 but that gun is notoriously 'fast'. Some guys, for reasons yet undetermined, lose velocity even at young ages. Bard appears to be one such guy. As such, I don't see him as a high leverage, dominant reliever for the Sox. Most guys, in fact. With pitchers in general and relievers in particular, the aging curve tends to be less of a bell and more of a cliff.
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Post by grandsalami on Apr 24, 2013 21:59:53 GMT -5
with aceves being DFAD (aka good as gone as he wont be in the minors) I think Bard is staying unless he craps the bed
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Post by bentossaurus on Apr 25, 2013 10:32:41 GMT -5
Aceves still has an option.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Apr 25, 2013 12:47:54 GMT -5
Bard being called back up today. Am I the only one who thinks this seems rushed? No, I'm with you on this. I do think this is kind of soon. He has four good outings and now he's suddenly ready to go back to the majors? I hope he gets straightened out, but I have a strong feeling that his BB/9 IP will wind up resulting in some ugly numbers. I hope I'm wrong, but I think the Daniel Bard that we all knew and loved is gone. If watching Andrew Miller is maddening, (and it certainly is) I expect roughly the same from Bard. With Miller, Bard, and Hanrahan soon returning, that's a lot of walks the bullpen will be yielding. I would have felt better if I'd see maybe 25 innings with god control to go along with the improved mechanics, but I guess we'll see what happens. Bard will be pitching in middle inning/low leverage situations.
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Post by gatortough on Apr 25, 2013 17:01:09 GMT -5
I think it's way too early, it's strange because JF and or the FO are sending mixed signals. They send him all the way down to AA to send a message that he's "not close to being ready" and then he's not only back after four decent to good, not great outings, but he's apparently up to stay. It would make sense if it was a desperation move because they needed BP help and he would be subsequently send down after reinforcements arrive, but the fact that it's supposedly a permanent call up just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Apr 25, 2013 23:47:06 GMT -5
Not sure why I didn't think of this, but it probably helps that Houston is the closest thing MLB has to a Triple-A team. Good squad for him to come back up and get his confidence back against.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Apr 26, 2013 12:36:06 GMT -5
Not sure why I didn't think of this, but it probably helps that Houston is the closest thing MLB has to a Triple-A team. Good squad for him to come back up and get his confidence back against. If the idea is that he's only up for this series and he gets sent down to make room for a returning pitcher (although I doubt it as I think only Lackey is ready and Lavarnway will go down to make room for him.) then that would make some sense, although I'm not sure being optioned down would make him feel better. The more likely scenario is that they're hoping he's "recovering" and will put him in low leverage situations, but then it comes down to whether you believe he has conquered his control issues. Houston leaves after three more games. Toronto has hardly been a world beater, but they aren't mistaken for a AAA team. Sooner or later, if Bard hasn't conquered his control issues, he will struggle mightily and I don't know if that will help his confidence. I'd prefer to see him pitch better for a longer period of time in AA or even AAA first.
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Post by jmei on Apr 26, 2013 12:51:58 GMT -5
They might just be desperate for a reliever and don't see any better options out there, even if it means relying on a Bard who isn't totally back to form. I mean, even if they cleared a 40-man spot, are there any better options in the organization? Is Chris Carpenter or Jose De La Torre or Chris Martin or Pete Ruiz really better than Bard at 60% effectiveness or whatever? If all Bard needs are reps and he's as good or better than any of the alternatives, might as well have him work out his kinks in low-leverage situations in the majors.
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Post by njsox on Apr 26, 2013 13:04:58 GMT -5
Not sure why I didn't think of this, but it probably helps that Houston is the closest thing MLB has to a Triple-A team. Good squad for him to come back up and get his confidence back against. I thought that as I watched him last night. He continually fell behind and consistently missed his spots, as well as show nothing useful from his secondary offerings and yet Houston looked helpless against him. I'm not anxious to see how his 93-96 mph holds up against a good hitting team. I know under normal circumstances 93-96 is great stuff but I don't see anything better than mediocrity for Bard unless he sees an uptick in velocity.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Apr 26, 2013 13:55:22 GMT -5
Not sure why I didn't think of this, but it probably helps that Houston is the closest thing MLB has to a Triple-A team. Good squad for him to come back up and get his confidence back against. If the idea is that he's only up for this series and he gets sent down to make room for a returning pitcher (although I doubt it as I think only Lackey is ready and Lavarnway will go down to make room for him.) then that would make some sense, although I'm not sure being optioned down would make him feel better. The more likely scenario is that they're hoping he's "recovering" and will put him in low leverage situations, but then it comes down to whether you believe he has conquered his control issues. Houston leaves after three more games. Toronto has hardly been a world beater, but they aren't mistaken for a AAA team. Sooner or later, if Bard hasn't conquered his control issues, he will struggle mightily and I don't know if that will help his confidence. I'd prefer to see him pitch better for a longer period of time in AA or even AAA first. No, the idea was that he's up, but they figured now was a good time as he'd get to settle in against a team that could be historically bad. There are maybe two or three guys on that roster that would have made the Sox this year.
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Post by fenwaythehardway on Apr 26, 2013 19:53:06 GMT -5
If the idea is that he's only up for this series and he gets sent down to make room for a returning pitcher (although I doubt it as I think only Lackey is ready and Lavarnway will go down to make room for him.) then that would make some sense, although I'm not sure being optioned down would make him feel better.The more likely scenario is that they're hoping he's "recovering" and will put him in low leverage situations, but then it comes down to whether you believe he has conquered his control issues. Houston leaves after three more games. Toronto has hardly been a world beater, but they aren't mistaken for a AAA team. Sooner or later, if Bard hasn't conquered his control issues, he will struggle mightily and I don't know if that will help his confidence.I cannot stress enough how much I hate the idea that Bard's struggles are rooted in his precious, delicate fee-fees. Confidence won't allow him to throw 100 again. Throwing 100, on the other hand, would allow him to be confident again.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Apr 26, 2013 21:12:45 GMT -5
If the idea is that he's only up for this series and he gets sent down to make room for a returning pitcher (although I doubt it as I think only Lackey is ready and Lavarnway will go down to make room for him.) then that would make some sense, although I'm not sure being optioned down would make him feel better.The more likely scenario is that they're hoping he's "recovering" and will put him in low leverage situations, but then it comes down to whether you believe he has conquered his control issues. Houston leaves after three more games. Toronto has hardly been a world beater, but they aren't mistaken for a AAA team. Sooner or later, if Bard hasn't conquered his control issues, he will struggle mightily and I don't know if that will help his confidence.I cannot stress enough how much I hate the idea that Bard's struggles are rooted in his precious, delicate fee-fees. Confidence won't allow him to throw 100 again. Throwing 100, on the other hand, would allow him to be confident again. I'm not trying to paint a simplistic picture that if Bard's confidence returns, all is well. It's more complicated than that. A lot of his mess is mechanical AND mental in my opinion. He needs both to succeed. If he can throw 100 but displays the command he has since Sept 2011, then it won't matter how "confident" he is. He'd walk the ballpark. He needs to command his pitches, which is something that he seemingly forgot how to do in Sept 2011. Then the conversion to starter further messed with his head as he started to overthink the adjustments he would need to make to be a starter.
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Post by rjp313jr on Apr 27, 2013 9:11:23 GMT -5
Since his mechanics are messed up, it's impossible to tell why the velocity has dropped so much. I do not understand how bringing him up to pitch less is going to help him. Lets face it though. This isn't all about Bard. The team needs an arm for now and he's their best 40man option. He's probably going back down when Breslow or Morales is ready.
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