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Boston Sportswriters: The Good, The Bad, The Ugly
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Post by texs31 on Aug 8, 2023 10:25:03 GMT -5
General comment but I think the Sports Media Industry is consuming itself. Too many people trying to say things and not enough things to say. Bosses pushing their reporters/writers to produce content which forces even the best ones to produce rubbish (well written rubbish, in some cases, but rubbish none the less). That's why we get so many "hot takes" and "Rushed Reports".
"Consuming itself" is probably the wrong phrase bc that implies that it will end up completely swallowed up (I may have taken that analogy too far). It won't. It's just REALLY hard to find those that are consistently good.
I tend to follow those that provide information that I don't have access to. Give me that, and I'm yours. I'm a reasonably intelligent man (insert your joke here). I don't need someone to sell me on their opinion via articles, spots on the radio/tv, etc. Just give me the info so I can formulate my own.
[Leaps off soapbox]
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Post by patford on Aug 8, 2023 11:31:20 GMT -5
The Boston sports writers are for the most part horrible and to such a degree they hurt the team. I understand the idea that players are professional athletes making a tremendous amount of money and should be able to ignore the pressure that comes from endless criticism but the fact is players are human and it's the exception not the rule that people respond well to relentless abuse.
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Post by beasleyrockah on Aug 8, 2023 14:50:30 GMT -5
The Boston sports media operates the way it does because Boston sports fans respond to it.
The dialogue and analysis is top tier on this site, but many posters here still regularly share awful takes they don't respect from Twitter/talk radio/etc just to mock it. Instead of ignoring a dumb take, they give the person a click and then post it here, which only increases that person's platform and is exactly what they want you to do. If people simply stopped clicking and tuning in, the type of coverage would shift to what the fan responds to. It's pretty clear people in sports media have figured out it's easier to get attention through outrage and disagreement. For example, if you're making a list of the best baseball players right, you will get a lot more attention and clicks by ranking Ohtani 6th than 1st. Too many people will still fall for the obvious bait.
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mobaz
Veteran
Posts: 2,774
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Post by mobaz on Oct 3, 2023 13:40:54 GMT -5
Speier reflecting on Shank reflecting on 50 years of covering Boston sports. Not gonna read since I A) don't have a sub and B) don't care, but in my head Shaughnessy has been about 57 years old for the past 25 years, so I'm somehow surprised he must be in his 70s.
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Post by pk on Oct 3, 2023 14:17:29 GMT -5
I'm not at all versed in the statistical analysis that so many of the others here are adept with, but I find the dialogue here - and to a significant extent, at SOSH - informative, straight forward and largely free of the snark and personality conflicts in other threads (hello BSJ). Mods do a great job of keeping us all on topic. So, yes, Sox Prospects is a wonderful alternative venue for information exchange and meaningful discussion. In traditional media, I vote yes on Speier and Reiss, esp. Speier's minor league coverage, and also Sean McAdams, if I can ever figure out who he's posting with at the moment. Gammons for sheer amusement at his intelligent analysis, although he's a bit frozen in time now. On the Index Librorum Prohibitorum, there's CHB. He's not funny, he indulges in creating unsubstantiated rumors, usually by negative inference, and expanding on them once they go live, in general, the kind of guy you see occasionally in a crowded bar mocking the short guy with thick glasses and trying to provoke a fight. The problem is, he's influenced some of the younger Globe staff writers to emulate him (Abraham and Finn, to varying degrees). But we're talking about baseball writer, and if he ever was one, he's far past his sell by date. Thoroughly agree on McAdams being very solid (Masslive), and I do miss Gammons. Buckley is a great guy and good writer as well. Reiss for Patriots beat is outstanding. Maz lost me with the constant negativity, but that’s why he is making a lot more money than I.
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Post by jbur521 on Oct 3, 2023 21:00:03 GMT -5
I don't expect a deluge of "likes" for this post, lol. But the extreme Tomase hate is pretty silly. He screwed up badly in his job 20 years ago. He let his competitiveness and desire to break a big story override his caution. But it was 20 friggin' years ago. Has anyone on here not screwed up in their job once in the last 20 years? It's not like his careless mistake caused the rest of the NFL or fans to think that HC NEP was a cheater. That cake was already baked. The journalistic screwup was akin to accusing Willie Sutton of robbing a bank that he didn't really rob. It was neutral in terms of affecting anyone's reputation. I don't dislike him for that one story...it's all the other crappy takes for twenty years.
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Post by grandsalami on Oct 5, 2023 10:32:03 GMT -5
No comment
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Post by Smittyw on Oct 5, 2023 11:39:23 GMT -5
*pasting comment to a more appropriate thread*
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Post by trajanacc on Oct 5, 2023 11:40:59 GMT -5
The Boston sports media operates the way it does because Boston sports fans respond to it. The dialogue and analysis is top tier on this site, but many posters here still regularly share awful takes they don't respect from Twitter/talk radio/etc just to mock it. Instead of ignoring a dumb take, they give the person a click and then post it here, which only increases that person's platform and is exactly what they want you to do. If people simply stopped clicking and tuning in, the type of coverage would shift to what the fan responds to. It's pretty clear people in sports media have figured out it's easier to get attention through outrage and disagreement. For example, if you're making a list of the best baseball players right, you will get a lot more attention and clicks by ranking Ohtani 6th than 1st. Too many people will still fall for the obvious bait. You're spot on here...click-based media and the fact that appealing to our worst natures seems to be what makes money is certainly causing a lot of these problems. But the fact that we are the ones clicking shouldn't excuse the journalists. There are plenty of jobs in which a professional has to make a moral decision between doing what is right and what will make him the most money. Since journalists have so much power to shape public opinion and, in some cases, even policy, shouldn't we hold them to the same high standard that we would doctors, police officers, politicians, etc? If journalists are making us stupider and making us argue with each other, we need to figure something else out besides relying on thousands of individuals with umpteen other problems to think about to just refuse to click.
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Post by grandsalami on Oct 5, 2023 15:15:35 GMT -5
Exhibit B You could say that about the O's or the Reds or MIA prior to this season.. But that would require critical thinking which hacks like the above do not have
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Post by grandsalami on Oct 6, 2023 9:50:03 GMT -5
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Oct 6, 2023 10:04:12 GMT -5
Exhibit B You could say that about the O's or the Reds or MIA prior to this season.. But that would require critical thinking which hacks like the above do not have I don't like Tomase and in the context of all the other crap he's put out it's certainly some spin, but he's not entirely wrong here. It's easy for you to cite the Orioles, Reds, or Marlins in hindsight, but if we were discussing a free agent at the beginning of last year's offseason, would you really have said any of those teams were logical destinations? Probably not, especially not Cincinnati. That's not to say I think the Red Sox will do poorly next year, but if winning is a priority, Boston is very obviously a less desirable destination than with teams like the Mariners or the Dodgers who, last I checked, have been doing pretty well lately.
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Post by julyanmorley on Oct 6, 2023 11:07:04 GMT -5
It's bad on purpose to make you click
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Post by patford on Oct 6, 2023 11:47:54 GMT -5
No comment Who needs reporters when you can just go to any social media forum and read the comments made by fans who think they should be managers, coaches and executives.
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mobaz
Veteran
Posts: 2,774
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Post by mobaz on Oct 11, 2023 6:32:44 GMT -5
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Post by grandsalami on Oct 25, 2023 20:57:25 GMT -5
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 14,031
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Post by cdj on Oct 25, 2023 21:15:49 GMT -5
Classic hack
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Post by jodyreidnichols on Oct 25, 2023 21:19:11 GMT -5
I don't expect a deluge of "likes" for this post, lol. But the extreme Tomase hate is pretty silly. He screwed up badly in his job 20 years ago. He let his competitiveness and desire to break a big story override his caution. But it was 20 friggin' years ago. Has anyone on here not screwed up in their job once in the last 20 years? It's not like his careless mistake caused the rest of the NFL or fans to think that HC NEP was a cheater. That cake was already baked. The journalistic screwup was akin to accusing Willie Sutton of robbing a bank that he didn't really rob. It was neutral in terms of affecting anyone's reputation. That’s not a screwup, what he did completely lacked in ethics. He is also terrible at radio despite having a face for it. He also clearly hasn’t learned www.concordmonitor.com/Sports/Patriots-Blog/Tomase-confirms-reality-is-upside-downHe is a total moron and he should’ve been out of journalism for good about 2 decades ago. The fact he has a job in this city is insane. Loved the line, "he is also terrible at radio despite have a face for it". Best line here today.
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ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,928
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Post by ericmvan on Oct 26, 2023 3:41:38 GMT -5
Man, Ian Browne is usually solid at MLB.com, but his birthday appreciation for Pedro was pathetic. Let me translate:
Pedro Martinez, arguably the best pitcher to ever wear a Red Sox uniform, = very likely the best pitcher in MLB history
He won the American League’s Cy Young Award in '98 and '99 with two of the best seasons in franchise history = with the two most dominating seasons in MLB history, and perhaps in any American major team sport
Yes, and Bill Russell was one of the most consistent winners in Celtics history, Tom Brady was one the best Patriots QB's ... you can do Williams and Orr yourself!
Just an embarrassment.
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Oct 26, 2023 8:18:30 GMT -5
Man, Ian Browne is usually solid at MLB.com, but his birthday appreciation for Pedro was pathetic. Let me translate:
Pedro Martinez, arguably the best pitcher to ever wear a Red Sox uniform, = very likely the best pitcher in MLB history
He won the American League’s Cy Young Award in '98 and '99 with two of the best seasons in franchise history = with the two most dominating seasons in MLB history, and perhaps in any American major team sport
Yes, and Bill Russell was one of the most consistent winners in Celtics history, Tom Brady was one the best Patriots QB's ... you can do Williams and Orr yourself!
Just an embarrassment.
Counterpoint - you should be embarrassed for getting upset over what is perfectly reasonable writing lol
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Oct 26, 2023 11:56:51 GMT -5
Man, Ian Browne is usually solid at MLB.com, but his birthday appreciation for Pedro was pathetic. Let me translate:
Pedro Martinez, arguably the best pitcher to ever wear a Red Sox uniform, = very likely the best pitcher in MLB history He won the American League’s Cy Young Award in '98 and '99 with two of the best seasons in franchise history = with the two most dominating seasons in MLB history, and perhaps in any American major team sport Yes, and Bill Russell was one of the most consistent winners in Celtics history, Tom Brady was one the best Patriots QB's ... you can do Williams and Orr yourself! Just an embarrassment.
Counterpoint - you should be embarrassed for getting upset over what is perfectly reasonable writing lol Exactly. Pedro was the greatest I saw but he only pitched excellent or better for five years as he had an injury marred 2001 and was merely pretty damn good in 2004. But I saw Clemens and you could make an argument, given the length of his career that he might have been. Cy Young wasnt too bad himself. Lefty Grove was pretty damn amazing, too. Walter Johnson as well if you're actually allowed to think of somebody without Red Sox connections. Me personally, Pedro's 1999 and 2000 seasons are as good as it gets considering the era and his home ballpark but it's hardly crazy to leave a little wiggle room for disagreement, considering some people like pitchers who could throw 250 plus innings consistently. Not everything has to be in absolute terms.
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Post by incandenza on Oct 26, 2023 12:14:21 GMT -5
If you ignore longevity and just look at Pedro's 7-year peak run, 1997-2003, he had a 2.20 ERA and absurd numbers across the board.
But you know who had an even better ERA across 7 seasons? Clayton Kershaw: 2.10. Admittedly not right through the heart of the steroid era, nor in Fenway.
But you know who has the single best ERA in the last century? Clayton Kershaw. You can give Pedro the nod for best extended peak, but Kershaw really should be talked about as possibly the best pitcher in MLB history, given how good he's been for as long as he has.
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badfishnbc
Veteran
Doing you all a favor and leaving through the gate in right field since 2012.
Posts: 413
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Post by badfishnbc on Oct 26, 2023 12:17:49 GMT -5
Me personally, Pedro's 1999 and 2000 seasons are as good as it gets considering the era and his home ballpark but it's hardly crazy to leave a little wiggle room for disagreement, considering some people like pitchers who could throw 250 plus innings consistently. Not everything has to be in absolute terms. AND THAT'S WHY YOU'LL SEE ME STAN FOR OLD HOSS RADBOURN SEVEN DAYS A WEEK AND TWICE ON SUNDAY.
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Post by maxwellsdemon on Oct 26, 2023 12:58:44 GMT -5
I guess it depends on what you value most in a pitcher: Longevity = Clemens (but 'roid enhanced so who knows) ERA = Bob Gibson (but with a higher mound) Ks & No-Nos = Ryan Efficiency = Maddux But for me Pedro takes it based on those 6 no innings in 1999 versus a truly murderous Cleveland lineup without a fastball that could touch 90 due to a back injury. As for Kershaw, well here's an article (not) by Pedro for your enjoyment lol grantland.com/the-triangle/pedro-martinez-letter-to-clayton-kershaw/
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 14,031
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Post by cdj on Oct 26, 2023 13:33:00 GMT -5
If you ignore longevity and just look at Pedro's 7-year peak run, 1997-2003, he had a 2.20 ERA and absurd numbers across the board.
But you know who had an even better ERA across 7 seasons? Clayton Kershaw: 2.10. Admittedly not right through the heart of the steroid era, nor in Fenway.
But you know who has the single best ERA in the last century? Clayton Kershaw. You can give Pedro the nod for best extended peak, but Kershaw really should be talked about as possibly the best pitcher in MLB history, given how good he's been for as long as he has.
Turning into a back of the rotation guy in the playoffs kills his reputation, if he was merely good in the playoffs people would be talking about him as a generational talent….Which he probably still is, he’s just not discussed like one
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