|
Post by pappyman99 on Jan 8, 2024 19:27:25 GMT -5
Something underrated here. If Sale finished top 10 in Al cy young voting his option automatically would have vested I think there are only 8-10 SPs in the Al that received votes…. You don’t think an NY writer or another Al east city right would have thrown him a a vote knowing that? No, this isn't the 1930's, I think they value their reputation more than helping the "hometown" team if he truly sucked or blew out his elbow or something. It wasn't even that onerous an option, he clearly still had some trade value this winter despite his lack of innings and success since 2019. If anything I think it would have been more likely done as a favor to his agent than the local team, but that would still probably cost the writer his voting rights unless it was a little justifiable, in which case we probably would have picked it up. I mean this just isn’t reality. What credibility do any writers have now. They would absolutely do this
|
|
|
Post by awalkinthepark on Jan 8, 2024 20:39:14 GMT -5
I just hope Breslow isn't Bloom 2.0. Bloom hindered had ownership vs Breslow hindered by the same ownership? If ownership’s part or all of problem you may well have a similar result. That said, I like trading Verdugo for Fitts & company, O’Neil for RH bullpen depth, Giolito in, and Sale out for Grissom moves. IMO, they have all been good moves that head the team in the right (literally all are RH, lol) direction. Whenever the topic of Breslow vs. Bloom vs. any Sox executive comes up, I always think of my favorite John Henry quote from an interview he did in ST 2015:
Granted he was talking about Lucchino here. But I have always felt that Sox ownership was heavily involved in the decision making process for baseball ops. Would also explain why they are comfortable hiring executives with little experience - Theo, Bloom and Breslow.
|
|
|
Post by Underwater Johnson on Jan 8, 2024 22:40:12 GMT -5
Something underrated here. If Sale finished top 10 in Al cy young voting his option automatically would have vested I think there are only 8-10 SPs in the Al that received votes…. You don’t think an NY writer or another Al east city right would have thrown him a a vote knowing that? No, this isn't the 1930's, I think they value their reputation more than helping the "hometown" team if he truly sucked or blew out his elbow or something. It wasn't even that onerous an option, he clearly still had some trade value this winter despite his lack of innings and success since 2019. If anything I think it would have been more likely done as a favor to his agent than the local team, but that would still probably cost the writer his voting rights unless it was a little justifiable, in which case we probably would have picked it up. I applaud you for purging the 1999 AL MVP vote from your memory, when two NY writers left Pedro off their ballots entirely, handing the award to Ivan Rodriguez in a squeaker. The same Pedro who had 313 Ks and 37 BBs in 213.1 IP, to cite just a couple of his historic stats. Their lame excuse was that they both happened to believe that the MVP should only be for position players (which was not borne out by their prior voting records). The same two jamokes probably still have post-season award votes -- you don't think they'd do it again?
|
|
|
Post by fisk75 on Jan 9, 2024 8:49:26 GMT -5
I have not read this entire thread so if this is a repeat I apologize.
What if another right handed outfield bat is already on the roster? Grissom and Masa handle DH and LF. Then trade for Drury or Polanco for 2B. I think this lineup would be solid. This buys us another year to sort out the future of the middle infield and it keeps the cost down and hopefully they can allocate more money to the rotation.
|
|
|
Post by bluechip on Jan 9, 2024 9:11:01 GMT -5
Bloom hindered had ownership vs Breslow hindered by the same ownership? If ownership’s part or all of problem you may well have a similar result. That said, I like trading Verdugo for Fitts & company, O’Neil for RH bullpen depth, Giolito in, and Sale out for Grissom moves. IMO, they have all been good moves that head the team in the right (literally all are RH, lol) direction. Whenever the topic of Breslow vs. Bloom vs. any Sox executive comes up, I always think of my favorite John Henry quote from an interview he did in ST 2015:
Granted he was talking about Lucchino here. But I have always felt that Sox ownership was heavily involved in the decision making process for baseball ops. Would also explain why they are comfortable hiring executives with little experience - Theo, Bloom and Breslow. Correct me if I’m wrong but ,Lucchino in his role had oversight and involvement with baseball ops, over Theo and Cherington. They then split Lucchino’s role between two people with Dombroski getting a lot of the power of both Chertington and Lucchino. Bloom did not have the same autonomy as Dombromski
|
|
|
Post by likethewhiskey on Jan 9, 2024 9:22:36 GMT -5
I have not read this entire thread so if this is a repeat I apologize. What if another right handed outfield bat is already on the roster? Grissom and Masa handle DH and LF. Then trade for Drury or Polanco for 2B. I think this lineup would be solid. This buys us another year to sort out the future of the middle infield and it keeps the cost down and hopefully they can allocate more money to the rotation.
Understand the thought process, but I just don't think they acquired Grissom with any intention of him getting any sort of OF or DH at bats, given their communication so far. Cotillo pointed out the "cost savings" part of this trade, i.e. getting a guy at 2B earning the minimum, but realistically, 17MM went out the door with Chris Sale, so for at least this year, Grissom's cost is high. I think the Sox looked at Polanco and Drury and their cost, and chose to acquire Grissom and closed the door elsewhere. Plus, Grissom isn't a known commodity at all in the OF despite playing a little fall/winter ball there.
|
|
|
Post by bishop on Jan 30, 2024 9:36:29 GMT -5
(Wasn't quite sure where to put this but seems the closest to a Vaughn Grissom thread.)
Looking up Colt Keith some places make him sound very similar to Grissom (listed as a 2B/3B but below average there, very good minor league stats every year, will start in MLB opening day) but with some more power and less defensive upside - a near certainty to move to 1B/LF vs Grissom who hopefully can stick at 2B.
- Some places like MLB.com have Keith as a top 25 prospect in baseball, what am I missing? Is his hit tool that good to carry him above where a power hitting 1B/LF like Triston Casas was ever ranked, or should he be closer to the 100th prospect? Even this deal seems like something a fringe top 100 prospect not a real top 25 one would sign...
- Would people be happy giving a deal like his to Grissom now? Slightly different scenario with Grissom not being in the organization - by all accounts a good kid with a good work ethic, but very understandable if we're hesitant to commit long term $$$ like that without having hands on experience seeing him grow as a player or be coachable, etc
I don't think it makes sense to give Grissom one now (if he'd even take it), but that seems like tantalizing upside on a contract like that especially given inflation trends. If he's showing the hit tool in MLB and average or even below average fielding but with obvious growth as he gets more time would people want to try and lock him in midseason? Or does it make sense to just wait until after the season and see where he, Story, Nick Yorke, Marcelo Mayer are?
|
|
gerry
Veteran
Enter your message here...
Posts: 1,666
|
Post by gerry on Jan 30, 2024 11:15:15 GMT -5
While hopes are quite high on Grissom at 2B imo it’s time to wait and see, as we just don’t know yet … and sadly $$$ are very tight right now. Would rather improve the team before ST.
|
|
|
Post by asm18 on Feb 27, 2024 14:04:55 GMT -5
Chill out, my dear Chris. It's February. This is how you get hurt!
|
|
|
Post by manfred on Feb 27, 2024 14:21:39 GMT -5
I hope Sale has a great year. I’m glad the Sox traded him as a move towards the future, but I have absolutely no bad feelings. It’d be fun if he came back strong.
|
|
|
Post by Oregon Norm on Feb 27, 2024 14:45:43 GMT -5
He was just starting to recover his velo at the end of last season. He gave the team everything he had so it's good to see him find his way back if that's what happens.
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Feb 27, 2024 17:19:45 GMT -5
I hope Sale has a great year. I’m glad the Sox traded him as a move towards the future, but I have absolutely no bad feelings. It’d be fun if he came back strong. I like Chris Sale. He was always accountable and you could tell it was killing him to collect a paycheck and not be able to pitch. I think Atlanta is a great place for him and he'll probably show about 125 innings of rebound this year. He should help them. Vaughn is a fantastic get for the Sox. I hope after his career is over, if he wants to eventually get into some kind of coaching (or do a bit of what Pedro does), that he lands back in the Red Sox organization.
|
|
|
Post by strike23 on Feb 27, 2024 19:04:18 GMT -5
I know the 97 MPH is the focus but I keep staring at the 55 inches of vertical break on the slider, thats insane even if its only at 76 mph and was taken for a ball. I'd love to see a bounce back year for Sale though the fan reaction if he's getting down ballot CY votes may sour that somewhat
|
|
|
Post by alexcorahomevideo on Feb 27, 2024 21:10:31 GMT -5
I know the 97 MPH is the focus but I keep staring at the 55 inches of vertical break on the slider, thats insane even if its only at 76 mph and was taken for a ball. I'd love to see a bounce back year for Sale though the fan reaction if he's getting down ballot CY votes may sour that somewhat I don't know about that. I feel like he was never going to do that here. Atlanta is the perfect place for him. Not a ton of media pressure and a team that wants to contend.
|
|