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Post by itinerantherb on Mar 31, 2024 11:41:28 GMT -5
Feels to me like pivetta would be looking at something in the range of what ERod. I don't see any crazy contract coming his way. I'd offer him 4/80 and see if he'd bite. If they believe the massive step forward is real, this is a risk worth taking. If he can maintain his current form over a entire season, he'll be in line for an even bigger payday.
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Post by ematz1423 on Mar 31, 2024 11:57:40 GMT -5
Feels to me like pivetta would be looking at something in the range of what ERod. I don't see any crazy contract coming his way. I'd offer him 4/80 and see if he'd bite. If they believe the massive step forward is real, this is a risk worth taking. If he can maintain his current form over a entire season, he'll be in line for an even bigger payday. I'm not sure he's got that big a payday coming his way even with a great year. Look at Snell he literally won the Cy Young and didn't get the large deal he wanted. Perhaps part of it was boras holding out for a mega deal and the bottom dropping out of his market but still doesn't feel like a strong 1.5 year stretch fot pivetta as a starter will have teams lining up to pay him 100+M
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Post by incandenza on Mar 31, 2024 12:02:17 GMT -5
If they believe the massive step forward is real, this is a risk worth taking. If he can maintain his current form over a entire season, he'll be in line for an even bigger payday. I'm not sure he's got that big a payday coming his way even with a great year. Look at Snell he literally won the Cy Young and didn't get the large deal he wanted. Perhaps part of it was boras holding out for a mega deal and the bottom dropping out of his market but still doesn't feel like a strong 1.5 year stretch fot pivetta as a starter will have teams lining up to pay him 100+M Plus he'll be 32. I think the major takeaway from this past free agent class is that there is a STEEP discount for older players. That's undoubtedly part of what was going on with the tepid markets for Snell and Montgomery, and Pivetta will be a year older than they were.
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Post by ematz1423 on Mar 31, 2024 12:27:03 GMT -5
I'm not sure he's got that big a payday coming his way even with a great year. Look at Snell he literally won the Cy Young and didn't get the large deal he wanted. Perhaps part of it was boras holding out for a mega deal and the bottom dropping out of his market but still doesn't feel like a strong 1.5 year stretch fot pivetta as a starter will have teams lining up to pay him 100+M Plus he'll be 32. I think the major takeaway from this past free agent class is that there is a STEEP discount for older players. That's undoubtedly part of what was going on with the tepid markets for Snell and Montgomery, and Pivetta will be a year older than they were. Yea, now that I rethink I'm not sure I'd offer 4/80 for a pivetta extension. Maybe 3/60 would be more in the ballpark or 3/45 with incentives.
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Post by bishop on Mar 31, 2024 12:53:41 GMT -5
I would get a little creative with Pivetta to make it make sense for both sides. What about 2/$30m with a $20m then a $25m club option that vest if he pitches 150 innings the previous season? Maybe you even toss in some high value incentives like $2.5m if he makes the All-Star team and $5m if he finishes top 5 in Cy Young voting? That way he's set for life even if he blows out an elbow or turns into a pumpkin, he's not wildly underpaid if he is as good as his last 20 starts, and the advantage for the Sox is they can go year to year in his age 34 and 35 seasons.
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Post by itinerantherb on Mar 31, 2024 13:29:39 GMT -5
Plus he'll be 32. I think the major takeaway from this past free agent class is that there is a STEEP discount for older players. That's undoubtedly part of what was going on with the tepid markets for Snell and Montgomery, and Pivetta will be a year older than they were. Yea, now that I rethink I'm not sure I'd offer 4/80 for a pivetta extension. Maybe 3/60 would be more in the ballpark or 3/45 with incentives. You might be right. I'm not yet sure to what extent the "tepid market" this past offseason reflects a long-term shift in how teams value older pitchers versus Boras' misreading of the markets for Montgomery and Snell. Nola still got a huge 7-year deal (I know, DD), and I genuinely wonder what the Boras Two would have received if their asking price had come down a lot earlier, when teams still had financial flexibility. And I know there's never a guarantee with pitcher health, but unlike Snell, Pivetta has been really durable. But sure, maybe 4/80 is too rich.
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Post by incandenza on Mar 31, 2024 13:40:29 GMT -5
Yea, now that I rethink I'm not sure I'd offer 4/80 for a pivetta extension. Maybe 3/60 would be more in the ballpark or 3/45 with incentives. You might be right. I'm not yet sure to what extent the "tepid market" this past offseason reflects a long-term shift in how teams value older pitchers versus Boras' misreading of the markets for Montgomery and Snell. Nola still got a huge 7-year deal (I know, DD), and I genuinely wonder what the Boras Two would have received if their asking price had come down a lot earlier, when teams still had financial flexibility. Nola and Gray - no spring chickens - signed early and got toward the upper end of what all the original projections were. Meanwhile Snell and Montgomery were both looking for absurd deals that were like 60-70% above those projections, and in the end had to settle for dinky little short-term deals. I think that tells a pretty clear story about what happened this offseason.
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Post by puzzler on Mar 31, 2024 19:01:04 GMT -5
What about Tyler O'Neill. He'll be 29 in June - has a bad history with nagging injuries and not quite up to par production the last two years, but right now he looks like a really fantastic outfielder. He's a right handed power bat that this team desperately needs who is capable of playing gold glove defense in both Left Field and Right Field - he made several running plays that I don't think Abreu, Yoshida or maybe even Duran make. Obviously you don't want to sign him right now because he'd potentially be a really valuable trade piece, but if he's healthy at the All Star break do you attempt to extend him? No clue what it or he would take - but what about 4/$64m? Is the injury risk too high? He'd be 33 at the end of the deal. Would he take it? Is that too much?
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Apr 1, 2024 10:07:55 GMT -5
His off-season routine was aimed at being more limber in order to avoid future injuries. If he has indeed lowered injury risk he can be that speedy, high OBP, power, RHB, GG outfielder we dreamed on. The FO should know sooner than later as you state. iMHO Anthony in the wings doesn’t necessarily complicate things either.
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Post by ematz1423 on Apr 1, 2024 10:14:59 GMT -5
SSS and all I know but if one series is any indicator O'Neill is a very good fit for the OF as currently assembled with his RHH power and solid fielding ability. He is a guy I'd like to try and keep around if a reasonable contract can be agreed upon. Even with arguably their best prospect being an OFer in Roman Anthony, O'Neill still fits well with the long-ish term makeup of the team since Anthony is a LHH and they will need RHH pop from somewhere in the lineup. As far as I can tell it doesn't appear they have much if any RHH pop coming up through the minors in the next few years, certainly not in the OF.
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Post by asm18 on Apr 1, 2024 10:29:19 GMT -5
SSS and all I know but if one series is any indicator O'Neill is a very good fit for the OF as currently assembled with his RHH power and solid fielding ability. He is a guy I'd like to try and keep around if a reasonable contract can be agreed upon. Even with arguably their best prospect being an OFer in Roman Anthony, O'Neill still fits well with the long-ish term makeup of the team since Anthony is a LHH and they will need RHH pop from somewhere in the lineup. As far as I can tell it doesn't appear they have much if any RHH pop coming up through the minors in the next few years, certainly not in the OF. If he's a 25+ homer guy with good defense in the corners and looks to (finally) be healthy in 6 months, does O'Neill get QO'd?
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Post by ematz1423 on Apr 1, 2024 10:49:27 GMT -5
SSS and all I know but if one series is any indicator O'Neill is a very good fit for the OF as currently assembled with his RHH power and solid fielding ability. He is a guy I'd like to try and keep around if a reasonable contract can be agreed upon. Even with arguably their best prospect being an OFer in Roman Anthony, O'Neill still fits well with the long-ish term makeup of the team since Anthony is a LHH and they will need RHH pop from somewhere in the lineup. As far as I can tell it doesn't appear they have much if any RHH pop coming up through the minors in the next few years, certainly not in the OF. If he's a 25+ homer guy with good defense in the corners and looks to (finally) be healthy in 6 months, does O'Neill get QO'd? I'd debate offering him the QO, if he takes it a one year 21-22M deal wouldn't be a bad thing for the team.
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Post by threeifbaerga on Apr 1, 2024 10:49:39 GMT -5
SSS and all I know but if one series is any indicator O'Neill is a very good fit for the OF as currently assembled with his RHH power and solid fielding ability. He is a guy I'd like to try and keep around if a reasonable contract can be agreed upon. Even with arguably their best prospect being an OFer in Roman Anthony, O'Neill still fits well with the long-ish term makeup of the team since Anthony is a LHH and they will need RHH pop from somewhere in the lineup. As far as I can tell it doesn't appear they have much if any RHH pop coming up through the minors in the next few years, certainly not in the OF. If he's a 25+ homer guy with good defense in the corners and looks to (finally) be healthy in 6 months, does O'Neill get QO'd? Pivetta could also be a QO option, no? I was shocked the other day when I realized that all of Casas, Devers, Antony, Teel, and Mayer are left handed hitters. Wonder if there's a big trade somewhere just to try to acquire a good young righty?
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Post by jdb on Apr 1, 2024 10:52:24 GMT -5
Early on in the offseason it was said we were shying away from multi year deal with OFers bc of Ceddanne and Anthony on the way. I agree O Neil is a perfect righty fit for us and if we do resign him one of the lefty bats could be dealt for pitching.
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Post by scottysmalls on Apr 1, 2024 10:58:25 GMT -5
If O'Neill is fully healthy all year he's probably a QO guy. Not sure what kind of extension would make sense maybe would do like 3/45 with a team option?
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Post by julyanmorley on Apr 1, 2024 11:02:39 GMT -5
O'Neil just got traded for not much on a 1/6 deal. He's gonna need a good year to get 3/45.
Rafaela, Anthony, Duran, Abreu + a DH that plays a little OF likely takes the Red Sox out of the starting OF market, which O'Neil might not be end up in anyway. The young guys might disappoint though we'll see.
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Post by ematz1423 on Apr 1, 2024 11:16:46 GMT -5
O'Neil just got traded for not much on a 1/6 deal. He's gonna need a good year to get 3/45. Rafaela, Anthony, Duran, Abreu + a DH that plays a little OF likely takes the Red Sox out of the starting OF market, which O'Neil might not be end up in anyway. The young guys might disappoint though we'll see. That is still three LHH OFers in Anthony/Duran/Abreu and assuming you mean Yoshida then that's 4 LHH to only one RHH. Not to mention their two best hitters right now are LHH in Devers and Casas as well as their heir apparent SS in Mayer. Feels to me like Duran and Abreu are possibly placeholders on the roster if Mayer and Anthony are the real deal, not to mention Teel another LHH. If the lineup construction is going to work with all of Devers, Casas, Mayer, Anthony, Teel hitting from the left side they could really use a RHH starting caliber corner OFer. That could prove to be O'Neill or someone else but it does seem a need either way.
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Post by trotman on Apr 1, 2024 15:25:08 GMT -5
Could the extension candidate be Cora? Aside from Casas, Cora makes more sense from a contractual standpoint than the names we've discussed. Apologies if someone else mentioned Cora but I could see Breslow being a little cheeky referencing time with the organization in the original video. Ian Browne's recent article shows how highly Craig thinks of Cora: www.mlb.com/redsox/news/craig-breslow-red-sox-opening-day-2024-beer-shower
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Post by pappyman99 on Apr 1, 2024 17:04:14 GMT -5
O'Neil just got traded for not much on a 1/6 deal. He's gonna need a good year to get 3/45. Rafaela, Anthony, Duran, Abreu + a DH that plays a little OF likely takes the Red Sox out of the starting OF market, which O'Neil might not be end up in anyway. The young guys might disappoint though we'll see. Duran is probably gone soon enough, Abreu can be a super bench I think Duran is gone because I think he will never see his production from last year again. Long term if we extended O’Neill for 4 years, he is in LF, Rafaela in CF, Anthony in RF, Abreu as bench guy
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Post by bettsonmookie on Apr 1, 2024 18:25:32 GMT -5
IMO, what Bleis shows this year is step 1 in assessing the long-term strategy for RHH OF.
If he trends toward his upside scenario and looks like a possible Acuna/J-Rod type who could move through the system quickly, I think it immediately becomes a 2-year bridge situation til you have a Bleis/Rafaela/Anthony OF from left to right.
O'Neill could be a great option in that scenario.
If Bleis doesn't flash that type of potential, it becomes a more glaring long-term need, and an obvious spot to add a superstar level bat to the existing core.
How about Luis Robert? 3 years left after this, on a horrible team that could use a quantity over quality prospect package.
For all intents and purposes - I look at Duran and Abreu as temporary stopgaps, with most of their upside tied to their affordable controllability. I expect at least 1 of those 2 to be moved for arms by the time Roman is ready.
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Post by brendan98 on Apr 1, 2024 21:39:48 GMT -5
You have the right to your opinions, but I like what Duran’s ultra-athleticism brings to the club. I don’t expect an extension for him since he is under control into his 30’s, but I’m glad to have him for his prime.
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badfishnbc
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Post by badfishnbc on Apr 2, 2024 12:19:40 GMT -5
Jeez, I wonder if they can wrap some of these extensions quickly, particularly if they're pitchers who might think they're borderline Cy candidates if they can hold up over the course of 162 games.
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Post by sxfan on Apr 8, 2024 22:20:52 GMT -5
Cotillo mentions the Sox might be done now that Rafaela deal is done.
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Post by keninten on Apr 8, 2024 23:11:13 GMT -5
I hope next up is Pivetta.
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Post by dcsoxfan15 on Apr 9, 2024 1:22:14 GMT -5
I’ve seen it talked about a little, but I think O’Neill is someone that could get a lot of buzz if he’s healthy around the All-Star Break. There’s no right handed thump in this lineup without him, and there’s just about nothing coming up in the minors at the moment. High upside, really low floor because of the injury history, he may be a guy you can entice to extend, especially if he discovers that hitting at Fenway is enjoyable. If he stays healthy and produces I’d be okay offering something around 4-60 to have him play LF with Ceddanne and Anthony the next 4 years
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