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Should the Red Sox trade Dustin Pedroia?
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Post by jrffam05 on Jul 22, 2014 11:59:59 GMT -5
Where was the union on the Pede deal?
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Post by jimed14 on Jul 22, 2014 12:07:28 GMT -5
Where was the union on the Pede deal? absent, which is why they're here now.
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Post by larrycook on Jul 22, 2014 22:54:58 GMT -5
Where was the union on the Pede deal? They were in San Fran, which is where pedroia news to be. He is clearly in decline and needs a change of scenery by July 31.
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Post by iakovos11 on Jul 23, 2014 7:21:36 GMT -5
Where was the union on the Pede deal? They were in San Fran, which is where pedroia news to be. He is clearly in decline and needs a change of scenery by July 31. Can you stop with the Pedroia to SF trade in every other post, please. It's old. And wasting time and space.
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Post by sibbysisti on Jul 23, 2014 8:25:50 GMT -5
Is he in decline or just having an off-season? Pedey is signed to a team friendly contract which makes it even more attractive to a contending team needing a second baseman. And there is no shortage of potential replacements in Betts, Coyle, Holt, Asuaje and Gragnani, though, except for Betts, not equivalent replacement value.
But there is the lingering issue of trust and loyalty. Dustin has been a big part of two WS championships, is loved by the fans, and signed an accommodating contract. The latter could turn off potential FAs.
I dunno. Pedroia has Jeter-like qualities, such as fire and passion for the game, which endear him to his manager, teammates and fans alike. If 2B were not such a strong position in this organization I wouldn't even consider moving him.
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Post by jrffam05 on Jul 23, 2014 8:45:07 GMT -5
Wow, I was just trying to make a joking comment about the Lester contract negotiations, didn't mean bringing up a Pedroia trade.
A trade for Pedroia might have some merit on paper, but it is not something I would ever want to see happen, and something I think has a 0% chance of happening, unless Pedroia gets all Nomar on us and starts requesting a trade. His marketability alone will make up his salary to the Red Sox. I mean without him I probably would not have a piece of furniture in my house or be addicted to D&D Iced coffee.
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Post by jimed14 on Jul 23, 2014 9:02:10 GMT -5
It's embarrassing really. This is pretty much the reason I'm on board with letting Lester walk, because I don't want to be in this position with another player the minute he's not living up to his contract. For Lester, that's probably day one.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jul 23, 2014 13:57:25 GMT -5
Pedey is in decline. Whether it's due to injury or not he hasn't been producing and he's in danger of being a shell of himself. I still don't want him traded though as he's a hell of a defensive player and a great competitor.
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Post by gregblossersbelly on Jul 24, 2014 8:18:46 GMT -5
I think the Yankees would take him.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,842
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Post by nomar on Jul 24, 2014 21:01:26 GMT -5
Trading someone who took that much of a hometown discount is just a bad look for the org too in the eyes of other players. Easily in decline though and I have little faith that it'll get much better than this.
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Post by grandsalami on Jul 24, 2014 21:46:36 GMT -5
Trading someone who took that much of a hometown discount is just a bad look for the org too in the eyes of other players. Easily in decline though and I have little faith that it'll get much better than this. Yup. You trade him and no player will sign a discount for the sox. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Post by amfox1 on Jul 24, 2014 22:06:26 GMT -5
If the union gets its way, no player will sign at a discount ever again. I think this issue is highly overrated.
I think you should aim to trade him as soon as the production falls to or below his contract (which is not the case right now).
I do note, however, that Pedroia becomes a 10-and-5 guy during the 2016 season, and I don't think he will agree to be traded after that point. He does have a limited no-trade currently.
So, short answer - you don't trade him now; you consider trading him after 2015 if his production drops further. My guess is that he's a Red Sox for life.
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Post by izzy on Jul 26, 2014 14:46:48 GMT -5
Through July 26, 2012, Pedroia only had a .319 OBP. He finished the year with a .290/.347/.449 line. Both Steamer and Zips predict that Pedroia will finish the year with over 4 WAR. I don't think it makes any sense to trade a player that is both still productive and that represents Boston so well.
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Post by larrycook on Jul 26, 2014 21:36:11 GMT -5
Washington looking for a second baseman. Now is the time to move pedroia!
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Post by redsox4242 on Jul 26, 2014 22:49:51 GMT -5
He's not in decline, he is a hall of fame player. Dustin is having a bad year, what? he isn't entitled to ONE bad year? Did we forget about how GREAT he is defensively? ?
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,842
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Post by nomar on Jul 27, 2014 14:20:27 GMT -5
He's not in decline, he is a hall of fame player. Dustin is having a bad year, what? he isn't entitled to ONE bad year? Did we forget about how GREAT he is defensively? ? Pretty impossible to justify saying he isn't declining. It's been a pretty clear decline. He's doll a valuable player because of his defense, but he's been below average elsewhere.
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Post by ctfisher on Jul 28, 2014 14:28:49 GMT -5
He's not in decline, he is a hall of fame player. Dustin is having a bad year, what? he isn't entitled to ONE bad year? Did we forget about how GREAT he is defensively? ? Pretty impossible to justify saying he isn't declining. It's been a pretty clear decline. He's doll a valuable player because of his defense, but he's been below average elsewhere. He might be declining, but I doubt the trajectory we've seen this season and last year is the one we'll see for the rest of his career. He'll be 31 in August, so he shouldn't be out of his prime, and he's had a bizarrely sharp decline for someone of his age the past couple of years. Also, just taking a quick look at his batted ball stats, and it looks like he's had some awful batted ball luck this year. He's hitting .274 with a .304 BABIP, but his LD % is 25.8% (career high) and his HR/FB is 3.8%, which is incredibly low. I'm not saying some of his decline isn't real, or that he hasn't lost some power- some of it doesn't seem to be ever coming back. But I'd be very surprised if he doesn't post some substantially better numbers next year
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Post by klostrophobic on Aug 1, 2014 22:22:07 GMT -5
He's definitely declining, but his defense is still stellar and he will continue to be a 3-4+ win player for the next few years at least, but he wouldn't be the first elite second baseman to fall off a cliff at 31-33. As long as he avoids the Marcus Giles aging curve, he should still be worth his contract more or less. Trading him would be a nightmare. I'd like it in a universe where emotions don't matter and future free agent signings aren't altered by your trading away a guy who took less than market-rate to stay, because damn Mookie Betts would look nice at second next year.
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Post by redsox4242 on Aug 1, 2014 22:32:42 GMT -5
If Pedroia can perform at a level where he can produce a solid 290 avg, with his stellar defense and hussle, you keep him. Pedroia is a future hall of famer here. were not talking about Mark Bellhorn for petes sake! Pedroia is not going anywhere!
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Post by mattpicard on Aug 2, 2014 0:29:30 GMT -5
If Pedroia can perform at a level where he can produce a solid 290 avg, with his stellar defense and hussle, you keep him. Pedroia is a future hall of famer here. were not talking about Mark Bellhorn for petes sake! Pedroia is not going anywhere! Basically. He's so good defensively that he's still likely to eclipse 4.0 bWAR and fWAR this season. At $12.5 million in 2015 and $13 million in 2016, presuming his production doesn't decline a ton more, that's an absolute steal. Now, he's been a tick below league average at the plate this season by wRC+, and exactly average by OPS+, but both ZiPS and Steamer project him to be above average the rest of the season. I think we need to accept that at least some of his power is never coming back, but it's the ability to just get hits and retain a high walk rate that bear watching. He's actually hitting a lot more line drives than ever before, rather than continuing the intense spike in grounders last year. The issue is though, a lot of his liners seem to be pokes the other way, and despite their classification, he doesn't get much oomph on them and either get caught or drop in shallow. He's got to work on getting the barrel through the zone a little quicker in order to pull the ball, because be it line drives or fly balls, that's where he's going to get his extra base hits. As for his plate discipline, his contact is down slightly, but there's nothing concerning. I see no reason Pedroia can't remain a 100 wRC+ hitter with A-grade defense at an up-the-middle position for the next several seasons. If only we could find a position for Betts, this issue wouldn't be coming up at all. The length of Pedroia's contract is concerning, but there's nothing really crippling about it. We're a long way from Pedroia struggling to be a 3 WAR player.
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Post by gregblossersbelly on Aug 2, 2014 5:23:53 GMT -5
Was nice to see him drive a ball into the triangle last night. Also, ripped a double deep off the wall in left-center the other night. Hope he's coming around.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 2, 2014 8:41:24 GMT -5
The discussion should be more about moving him down in the batting order. And that's not even the case yet.
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Post by moonstone2 on Aug 5, 2014 14:06:22 GMT -5
I agree with that. Hold on to Betts and put him in AAA in 2015 playing CF and 2B. After the season, one out of Bradley, Pedroia, or Betts needs to go.
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Post by pedey on Aug 5, 2014 15:39:28 GMT -5
I think that even the discussion of trading Pedroia shows the disloyalty of some Boston fans. No, he isn't producing MVP numbers like he used to, but he still is a solid hitter who plays stellar defense. He is the heart and soul of this team, and his hustle and team spirit is a great influence on the younger guys. He is under a reasonable contract, and he LOVES Boston. He accepted a huge discount to stay in Boston long term. I think his hitting will improve, as he always does the last few months of the year. I hope he retires in a Boston uniform, even is he is hitting .250 in the final years.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 5, 2014 16:23:07 GMT -5
I think that even the discussion of trading Pedroia shows the disloyalty of some Boston fans. No, he isn't producing MVP numbers like he used to, but he still is a solid hitter who plays stellar defense. He is the heart and soul of this team, and his hustle and team spirit is a great influence on the younger guys. He is under a reasonable contract, and he LOVES Boston. He accepted a huge discount to stay in Boston long term. I think his hitting will improve, as he always does the last few months of the year. I hope he retires in a Boston uniform, even is he is hitting .250 in the final years. The Red Sox aren't going to deal Pedroia. They signed him to be the face of the franchise (or at least the other one besides Ortiz). It's crazy that 2b is such a strong position of strength in the organization. If Pedroia didn't act like Pedroia, I wouldn't have minded him being dealt on 7/31 to open up a spot for Mookie Betts, who might be the best all around 2b in the organization soon. But Pedroia is the guy who signed a long-term deal for a fraction of what he could have gotten on the open market, and if the Sox dealt him shortly after that, it would be hard to imagine other players leaving a ton of money on the table to sign a team friendly deal like Pedroia signed. Of course, I wondered the same thing when they dealt Bronson Arroyo, but this contract is more extreme. I worry that Pedroia plays so hard that he gets injured often, plays thru them, and isn't the same. I prefer to think that way because the alternative is that he's declining offensively. The power is just about gone and his hitting is inconsistent. His offense has been declining, although it is plenty acceptable for now. Don't know if we'll be saying the same thing by 2017 and it's a long way to go until 2021. A large part of his value is based on his top notch defense. I just hope 2014 is a down year or a season where he's hiding an injury and then he bounces back in 2015, but I'm not sure that's the case. I'd hate to see the Sox have to get rid of Mookie Betts and Rijo (at least Mookie can play other positions - Rijo can't) in the lower minors eventuall because 2b is locked down by somebody who could be not as good. My best hope is that Pedroia is to the Sox what Jeter has been the past decade to the Yankees but with better range.
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