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Post by bsout2 on Aug 22, 2014 13:18:35 GMT -5
Our entire infield is composed of right handed hitters. And, now - after a truly inexplicable series of trade deadline deals - We now also have three high paid right handed hitting outfielders. Unless Cecchini enters the mix, the Red Sox enter next season with 8 right handed bats and Ortiz. Couple that with all the young pitching and consequent growing pains and next season should be seen clearly for what it's going to be - A bridge year. Or not. The Red Sox will sign a FA pitcher or two. If they had any intention of a so called "bridge year", they would have traded Uehara. The Red Sox will be good next year, bookmark it!
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Post by amfox1 on Aug 22, 2014 13:21:09 GMT -5
Our entire infield is composed of right handed hitters. And, now - after a truly inexplicable series of trade deadline deals - We now also have three high paid right handed hitting outfielders. Unless Cecchini enters the mix, the Red Sox enter next season with 8 right handed bats and Ortiz. Couple that with all the young pitching and consequent growing pains and next season should be seen clearly for what it's going to be - A bridge year. Four (Craig, Cespedes, Victorino, Castillo).
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 22, 2014 13:38:31 GMT -5
An interesting sidenote, if I'm interpreting all this correctly, BC might have one upped BC because without the little Steven Drew deal (which was initiated by Cashman),the Sox couldn't have structured the deal like they did without exceeding the cap.
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Post by redsox1534 on Aug 22, 2014 13:45:09 GMT -5
Feels like were gonna get the Cuban who cant play up to his contract, the most overrated one and because of this not make a strong play for the studs as we could when the opportunity arises. Just like we did with YU Darvish.
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Post by sammo420 on Aug 22, 2014 13:50:33 GMT -5
I'm somewhat indifferent on this signing. I'm always for adding talent, especially at the cost of nothing more than money that's not even mine, but personally don't think he'll have the impact of a Puig or Abreu(feel free to prove me wrong, kid). The $$$ are nothing really.
I wish we could get an accurate report on him, though. Does he have the plus-plus speed mentioned earlier or the above average speed also mentioned earlier?
One thing I know for sure is it's going to be a busy off-season and I'm expecting some surprise moves.
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Post by amfox1 on Aug 22, 2014 13:56:22 GMT -5
Eno Sarris @enosarris · Aug 20 Rusney Castillo hit .332/.401/.545 with 16 HR & 22 sB in 2013. Huzzah! The Davenport Translation on that is .237/.276/.390 9HR/15SB. Egads!
Eno Sarris @enosarris · 3h Castillo for $12m/yr? His best year in Cuba translates to .220/.247/.362 in America & Davenport has been fairly money
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Post by sammo420 on Aug 22, 2014 14:04:02 GMT -5
What self respecting reporter uses "egads" these days?
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Post by amfox1 on Aug 22, 2014 14:04:36 GMT -5
Ask godot. He's our resident expert on the word.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 22, 2014 14:12:24 GMT -5
Red Sox Stats ?@redsoxstats 4m
Tigers GM Dave Dombrowski on XM says, "We were told Monday morning we were out on Castillo.Thought 15 HR, lots of steals, all-around type."
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Post by bettsonmookie on Aug 22, 2014 14:31:55 GMT -5
Insurance is not a free commodity in the real world, nor is it in the baseball industry. I don't think comparing Castillo as a player strictly against his salary (especially compared to other recent Cuban defectors) is entirely fair. I'm not exactly sure what the conversion ratio is, but the fact that the sox won't relinquish a compensation pick probably got Castillo a few extra bucks. Furthermore, the FO can now conduct business from an insanely advantageous position, given their loaded wallets and farm system. When I look at BC's body of work thus far (albeit a relatively SSS for a GM) the thing that stands out most to me is his timing.
I think the old business cliche "you have to pay to play the game" applies to an extent here, and I think this signing helps shift the team into am even more favorable spot in the market going into the offseason. If that led to an extra 10M getting tacked onto this contract, at the end of the day, I'm okay with that. I think it's something to keep in mind when evaluating Rusney as a player moving forward.
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Post by amfox1 on Aug 22, 2014 14:42:13 GMT -5
Red Sox Stats ?@redsoxstats 4m Tigers GM Dave Dombrowski on XM says, "We were told Monday morning we were out on Castillo.Thought 15 HR, lots of steals, all-around type." Outfielders with 19+ SB and 12-18 HR (listed by SB): 2013:Alex Rios (RF) Sterling Marte (LF) Nate McLouth (LF) Shane Victorino (RF) Alejando de Aza (LF) Desmond Jennings (CF) Dexter Fowler (CF) 2012:Desmond Jennings (CF) Drew Stubbs (CF) Shin Soo-Choo (LF) 2011:Drew Stubbs (CF) Peter Bourjos (CF) Melky Cabrera (CF) Johnny Damon (LF) Shane Victorino (CF) Looks to me that the three best comps are Jennings, Stubbs and Victorino, based on DD's description. Jennings is about the same age as Castillo and has averaged 2.7 oWAR over the past three years. Stubbs would be a lower end comp, averaging 1.7 oWAR over the past five years. Victorino has averaged 2.9 oWAR over his career.
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Post by redsox1534 on Aug 22, 2014 14:49:12 GMT -5
One thing is for sure this signing is gonna be this a crazy winter. We need a 3B if Bogaerts is gonna stick at SS. Castillo is gonna start in CF. Cespedes and Craig would be the corner OF's with JBJ and Betts ready for the bigs and Victornino still on the roster. Craig could replace Napoli at 1B if we decided to move him and not Craig which I wouldnt want. I no the Reds would love to get a big bat. I no we could offer one or two now. Craig has a affordable contract fits them as a LF and and big bat they need. They have tons of SP. Cueto is injury prone, Id want Latos who I think can continue to get better and turn into the next Max Sherzer to a extent, success wise. Craig, Marrero, Ranuado/Webster?
Id explore trading for a top young SP. Like Syndaagard or T-Walker some one who is ready.
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Post by ramireja on Aug 22, 2014 14:49:28 GMT -5
Wow I guess the sentiment around here is Stanton Or Bust. How is everyone's fantasy league teams holding up by the way?
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Aug 22, 2014 14:54:48 GMT -5
Like the player, but the contract was a lot more then I thought he should get. His value seems inflated by the other great Cuban players that have come over recently. Lets hope the streak of impressive Cuban players continues.
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Post by ramireja on Aug 22, 2014 15:01:38 GMT -5
Eno Sarris @enosarris · Aug 20 Rusney Castillo hit .332/.401/.545 with 16 HR & 22 sB in 2013. Huzzah! The Davenport Translation on that is .237/.276/.390 9HR/15SB. Egads! Eno Sarris @enosarris · 3h Castillo for $12m/yr? His best year in Cuba translates to .220/.247/.362 in America & Davenport has been fairly money So he would have had to hit .420/.540/.700 in Cuba to be worth this contract? Yeah, that seems fair. Also, isn't the Cuban season much shorter, meaning you can't just compute a fraction of his 16 HR and 22 SB total in Cuba and call it the MLB equivalent?
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badfishnbc
Veteran
Doing you all a favor and leaving through the gate in right field since 2012.
Posts: 428
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Post by badfishnbc on Aug 22, 2014 15:09:34 GMT -5
Red Sox Stats ?@redsoxstats 4m Tigers GM Dave Dombrowski on XM says, "We were told Monday morning we were out on Castillo.Thought 15 HR, lots of steals, all-around type." Outfielders with 19+ SB and 12-18 HR (listed by SB): 2013:Alex Rios (RF) Sterling Marte (LF) Nate McLouth (LF) Shane Victorino (RF) Alejando de Aza (LF) Desmond Jennings (CF) Dexter Fowler (CF) 2012:Desmond Jennings (CF) Drew Stubbs (CF) Shin Soo-Choo (LF) 2011:Drew Stubbs (CF) Peter Bourjos (CF) Melky Cabrera (CF) Johnny Damon (LF) Shane Victorino (CF) Looks to me that the three best comps are Jennings, Stubbs and Victorino, based on DD's description. Jennings is about the same age as Castillo and has averaged 2.7 oWAR over the past three years. Stubbs would be a lower end comp, averaging 1.7 oWAR over the past five years. Victorino has averaged 2.9 oWAR over his career. Not going to get into the deep sabermetrics, but you could have the same conversation regarding Ellsbury, and look at the deal he got.
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Post by sarasoxer on Aug 22, 2014 15:10:00 GMT -5
Some of the perceived value of Cespedes and Castillo could be as an inducement to future Cuban players to join the Sox (assuming 'highest bidder' is not the sole criteria).
As a poster noted above, we were willing to pay Drew 10MM so why is this price so "over-inflated"? True Castillo probably does not have the talent of his predecessors BUT given they proved themselves, they were signed at a discount to the MLB free agent market. Perhaps Castillo just brings future Cubans into line.
OTOH, as desperate as the Yankees are, they bowed out. It concerns me when the Yankees are NOT the top bidder as much as when they are.
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Post by eagleeye9184 on Aug 22, 2014 15:17:34 GMT -5
Some of the perceived value of Cespedes and Castillo could be as an inducement to future Cuban players to join the Sox (assuming 'highest bidder' is not the sole criteria). As a poster noted above, we were willing to pay Drew 10MM so why is this price so "over-inflated"? True Castillo probably does not have the talent of his predecessors BUT once they proved themselves, they were signed at a discount to the MLB free agent market. Perhaps Castillo just brings future Cubans into line. OTOH, as desperate as the Yankees are, they bowed out. It concerns me when the Yankees are NOT the top bidder as much as when they are. Yankees would be paying a premium above and beyond Castillo's salary for being over the threshold. So it's not apples to apples on salary. Even the MFY have to be somewhat budget conscious.
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Post by bettsonmookie on Aug 22, 2014 15:17:51 GMT -5
So you can get 2 Rusney Castillo's for the price of 1 Jacoby Ellsbury? Sounds good to me
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Aug 22, 2014 15:18:03 GMT -5
You're making it sounds like they gave him 170 million instead of 70. In terms of AAV, Castillo is in the range of guys like David Dejesus, Stephen Drew, Dan Haren, Derek Jeter. So unless you think Castillo is a total bust (and feel free to provide evidence), or you think the Red Sox way outbid other teams, I fail to see how this is an overextend or goes against the philosophy of flexibility. Once again this comes down to the fact that the Red Sox value players differently than you do, Steve. That's what it's always been about with you. And that's fine, you're entitled to your philosophy, but don't try to say the Red Sox are contradicting themselves when they're not. You don't think there is even the remote possibility that the FO looked at next year and said. 1). Bradley and Betts may not be ready for full time gigs 2). Craig may not have good foot 3). Victorino may not play a full season!! Fuk!!!! We need help!!! and decided they needed this guy. To alot of people this year could just as easily be about reactions/contradictions..etc..etc.. than just valuations. I would love to know what the 2nd place bid was.
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Post by sammo420 on Aug 22, 2014 15:21:08 GMT -5
Eno Sarris @enosarris · Aug 20 Rusney Castillo hit .332/.401/.545 with 16 HR & 22 sB in 2013. Huzzah! The Davenport Translation on that is .237/.276/.390 9HR/15SB. Egads! Eno Sarris @enosarris · 3h Castillo for $12m/yr? His best year in Cuba translates to .220/.247/.362 in America & Davenport has been fairly money So he would have had to hit .420/.540/.700 in Cuba to be worth this contract? Yeah, that seems fair. Also, isn't the Cuban season much shorter, meaning you can't just compute a fraction of his 16 HR and 22 SB total in Cuba and call it the MLB equivalent? With as nanners as some of these stat guys are I'd assume all these factors are taken into consideratioin. That said, I agree that anything that attempts to predict something like this with as many variables as there should be taken with a grain of salt big enough to sink the titanic.
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Post by marrcus on Aug 22, 2014 15:32:11 GMT -5
Felger hit on the PED factor pretty hard in the last hour. It is a concern that he'll now have to pass tests...coming from a wide open island atmosphere.
It's a great signing if all goes well. Obviously Abreau was the guy to go all-in on last fall but all kinds of variables going on at the time including WS victory.
If Rusney can approach what the current Ellsbury does for the nyy I'm happy with the get. Am I expecting an AS, no.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 11,140
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Post by nomar on Aug 22, 2014 15:44:58 GMT -5
It'll be interesting to see if defensive metrics like his defense in CF. If he's Desmond Jennings that's perfectly fine. Victorino even better. If he's Stubbs well live.
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Post by juniorp90 on Aug 22, 2014 15:51:43 GMT -5
Like the player, but the contract was a lot more then I thought he should get. His value seems inflated by the other great Cuban players that have come over recently. Lets hope the streak of impressive Cuban players continues. Hopefully that!! Walk around Jose Miguel Fernandez, Yasmani Thomas, the latter already defected!!
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Post by johnsilver52 on Aug 22, 2014 15:55:23 GMT -5
Wow I guess the sentiment around here is Stanton Or Bust. How is everyone's fantasy league teams holding up by the way? Looks like it's holding up well in other fantasy areas also ![:D](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/grin.png)
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