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Post by jimed14 on Apr 2, 2015 13:24:12 GMT -5
I mean, there is a lot of hindsight in this. Bonds ended up signing a deal that made him the highest paid player in the league, a deal that the Giants ownership at the time did not guarantee. If the Yankees knew the stats he'd put up over the next 11 season they would of fronted the money no problem. Think of the Pujolz or Cano deals as comps. 10 Year deals didn't exist back then, but it came down to teams not willing to guarantee a long term deal for one of the best players in the league. Afterwords it's easy to make a judgement, at the time not so much. You could fault the Red Sox ownership for letting Clemens go too, or the 6 GM's who didn't draft Bonds when they could have. If Moncada busts, it won't be the Yankees who look like idiots. You could also blame the Rays in 2008 for not signing Bonds to be their DH. They lost the WS that year. Bonds hit .276/.480/.565 the year he retired. He wanted to play more but no one would sign him. He was Bud Selig's blood sacrifice for ignoring steroids for so long. |
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Post by jrffam05 on Apr 2, 2015 13:29:39 GMT -5
Let me add this article from September of last year. It has to do with Yankees generating revenue by putting up winning seasons. www.crainsnewyork.com/article/20140912/PROFESSIONAL_SERVICES/140919951/missing-playoffs-again-would-hit-yanks-bottom-lineSo the Yankees lose out on ~ 50M dollars a year when they don't make the playoffs. As much as Moncada might be a good value long term, he does nothing to the current equation. So if a fringe playoff team Yankees takes on 20M dollars of Hamels during the season and that pushes them into the playoffs, they'll end up with making more money, depending on how much they profit on that 50M, where as an investment in Moncada won't start paying dividends for around 2-3 years. In the Yankees case, their payroll will start clearing up by the time Moncada starts seeing MLB action, so they can start spending on the Stratsburgs of the world to keep their team relevant and their ticket prices high. This is the reason why Yankees value current results more than future. We should tell Steinbrenner how stupid his team is next time we see him sailing by on his yacht. |
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Post by ctfisher on Apr 2, 2015 19:10:16 GMT -5
So the Yankees lose out on ~ 50M dollars a year when they don't make the playoffs. As much as Moncada might be a good value long term, he does nothing to the current equation. So if a fringe playoff team Yankees takes on 20M dollars of Hamels during the season and that pushes them into the playoffs, they'll end up with making more money, depending on how much they profit on that 50M, where as an investment in Moncada won't start paying dividends for around 2-3 years. In the Yankees case, their payroll will start clearing up by the time Moncada starts seeing MLB action, so they can start spending on the Stratsburgs of the world to keep their team relevant and their ticket prices high. This is the reason why Yankees value current results more than future. We should tell Steinbrenner how stupid his team is next time we see him sailing by on his yacht. I think that's a good point that I've never really considered, but it's also a shortsighted way to run a baseball team, and the Yankees are one of the most profitable franchises in sports, so the difference between what they were offering and what the sox offered is kindof a drop in the bucket, or should be viewed as such. Plus, adding salary at the major league level has luxury tax implications that signing Moncada doesn't (more significant than the tax on exceeding the international bonus pool cause of the repeater penalties). And, given their lack of impact prospects with which they might acquire someone like Cole Hamels on a potentially below (or even at) market deal, they're going to be stuck with paying big dollars for free agents, you'd think they might consider a different approach, given how they wound up where they are now |
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Apr 3, 2015 2:17:21 GMT -5
So, why did the Sox value Moncada more than the Yankees? Some informed speculation. There's probably no club in MLB that places a greater emphasis on prospect "makeup" than the Sox do, and I believe the track record shows that no club has done a better job of evaluating it. I'm sorry, but I have to ask. How do we know that no club in MLB places a greater emphasis on prospect "makeup" than the Sox do? 1) Did I say that we did?2) I didn't make it perfectly clear in that sentence, but (as I said subsequently) I meant "emphasis on correctly assessing makeup" rather than how much you would value makeup versus tools in some hypothetical overall value formula. Having said that, I think that if you've done the work on evaluating makeup, that work is going to tell you how much to value it in such a formula. 3) "There is no greater" admits many equals. I phrased that carefully. The Cubs, obviously, value it as much. I have no idea how many other clubs do. 4) I know for a fact that the Sox under Theo considered it supremely important. I'm not sure it's possible to value it more, once you decide that it's the key to successful drafting and development. You decide that you will do the best possible job assessing makeup, and assessing how much to value that makeup in an overall prospect evaluation. You and whichever clubs have had the same insight end up essentially in the same boat. You're confusing makeup with character. The two aren't that closely related, and in fact some personality traits that contribute to positive makeup can contribute to negative character. Being extremely competitive, low on self-doubt, and high on agreeableness and loyalty to teammates are all pretty good traits for a member of a criminal gang to have. |
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radiohix
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'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
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Post by radiohix on Apr 13, 2015 15:56:54 GMT -5
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Apr 13, 2015 16:20:49 GMT -5
Kind of silly to call that his "debut," as he was playing in minor league games during spring training, which are pretty much the same as games in Extended.
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Post by rjp313jr on Apr 14, 2015 9:22:48 GMT -5
I'm sorry, but I have to ask. How do we know that no club in MLB places a greater emphasis on prospect "makeup" than the Sox do? 1) Did I say that we did?2) I didn't make it perfectly clear in that sentence, but (as I said subsequently) I meant "emphasis on correctly assessing makeup" rather than how much you would value makeup versus tools in some hypothetical overall value formula. Having said that, I think that if you've done the work on evaluating makeup, that work is going to tell you how much to value it in such a formula. 3) "There is no greater" admits many equals. I phrased that carefully. The Cubs, obviously, value it as much. I have no idea how many other clubs do. 4) I know for a fact that the Sox under Theo considered it supremely important. I'm not sure it's possible to value it more, once you decide that it's the key to successful drafting and development. You decide that you will do the best possible job assessing makeup, and assessing how much to value that makeup in an overall prospect evaluation. You and whichever clubs have had the same insight end up essentially in the same boat. You're confusing makeup with character. The two aren't that closely related, and in fact some personality traits that contribute to positive makeup can contribute to negative character. Being extremely competitive, low on self-doubt, and high on agreeableness and loyalty to teammates are all pretty good traits for a member of a criminal gang to have. May be true, but at some point you just take the risk because talent takes over and it's worth a shot at that point in the draft. |
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Post by soxfan06 on Apr 14, 2015 16:25:54 GMT -5
Obviously they aren't going to rush him, but how long do you think he lasts in XST?
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Post by mgoetze on Apr 14, 2015 16:39:12 GMT -5
Obviously they aren't going to rush him, but how long do you think he lasts in XST? What do I look like, a meteorologist?  |
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Post by grandsalami on Apr 15, 2015 19:21:45 GMT -5
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Post by Oregon Norm on Apr 15, 2015 22:58:11 GMT -5
Damn, I hope this isn't too much of a circus.
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Post by burythehammer on Apr 16, 2015 5:21:17 GMT -5
Lol, what? Because he posted a selfie?
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Post by Oregon Norm on Apr 16, 2015 7:56:39 GMT -5
No, I mean the media buzz. I'm sure its going to be a big deal, no matter where he goes from XST.
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wcp3
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Post by wcp3 on Apr 16, 2015 8:00:53 GMT -5
Mirror selfie=a gateway to scandalous selfies.
Consider me very, very worried.
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Apr 16, 2015 9:14:57 GMT -5
No, I mean the media buzz. I'm sure its going to be a big deal, no matter where he goes from XST. Well let's see what's going on in the world of Boston sports 1) Aaron Hernandez 2) Chiarelli Fired 3) Red Sox SP woes 4) Celtics playoffs 5) 233545) Yoan Moncada Selfie I'd be surprised if this is a talking point at all |
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Apr 16, 2015 9:19:16 GMT -5
Moncada is going to be scrutinized off of the field. If he's a dynamic talent, he'll be put under the microscope that Puig has been. Puig has done some dumb things, but everything gets overplayed for sure. Happens with Harper too. So I can see where Norm is coming from. This is a small thing, but he will garner a lot of attention in due time. Betts may too, although he doesn't seem to be the crazy type so I'm not worried in his case.
Phenom stories get a lot of viewers. These kids are money for media outlets.
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Post by jrffam05 on Apr 16, 2015 10:09:01 GMT -5
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Apr 16, 2015 10:31:38 GMT -5
GIVE ME SHIRTLESS SANDOVAL SELFIES #breaktheinternet #breakthescale
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Post by ramireja on Apr 16, 2015 11:00:05 GMT -5
Its official, the Yoan Moncada thread just became NOT SAFE FOR WORK
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Post by klostrophobic on Apr 16, 2015 16:52:57 GMT -5
Are those prescription glasses? Dude needs a nicer phone.
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Smittyw
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Post by Smittyw on May 8, 2015 15:32:03 GMT -5
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Post by jimed14 on May 8, 2015 15:36:19 GMT -5
Wow, that article is an example of a whiny brat who gets older but never grows up.
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Post by pedroelgrande on May 8, 2015 15:53:00 GMT -5
Totally strange. It's not like he hasn't played much Baseball in a while and the season is about a month old. They must be having buyers remorse.
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Post by wcsoxfan on May 8, 2015 15:54:59 GMT -5
He made these two statements within a few lines of each other. Does this mean he doesn't believe in peripheral statistics or that his editor was sleeping on the job? |
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Guidas
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Post by Guidas on May 8, 2015 16:02:46 GMT -5
Abraham is the spiritual and intellectual heir apparent to Nick Cafardo. I think that's all I need to say. |
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