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2017-18 Celtics Season Thread
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Post by Don Caballero on May 1, 2018 21:55:18 GMT -5
Death, taxes and the Toronto Raptors choking.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 2, 2018 10:28:28 GMT -5
I'm comparing him to Harden in year 3, same as Rozier. You just can't seem to do that. You just see Harden for who he is now and what he became. The Thunder certainly didn't think he'd be this good or they wouldn't have traded him. This is so false. Harden was only traded because OKC couldn’t afford to keep him. They already signed Westbrook, Durant and Ibaka. They wouldn’t give Harden the max deal he wanted, deserved and got. It had nothing to do with them not thinking he was a great player. Don’t forget he was the sixth man on those teams and he was already on Team USA. There’s a reason Roziers name has never been brought up around Team USA. Do you really think teams would give Rozier a max contract right now if he were eligible? Let me get this right they didn't resign a young player who according to you they knew was going to be MVP level over 4.5 million and not willing to include a trade kicker? They liked him, he was a very good young player, but they didn't think he'd be this good. Wanna know how I know? Simple no team trades an MVP level player unless the player wants out and certainly not so they can keep Ibaka. The GM looked at Harden and Ibaka as similar players and choose the better fit. He was dead wrong and destroyed that team. Nevermind like you talk about with Rozier below, they didn't have to trade him. Still had a year left on his rookie deal and then restricted free agency. Just remember why I brought up Harden and that trade. It wasn't to say Rozier is the next Harden or you'll get a return like that. It was because you don't think Rozier is worth a top 10 pick. Which is crazy given Minnesota was going to trade its pick last year for Bradley untill they made the Butler deal. Once you get by the tier one players in the draft, trading for Rozier makes total sense. He has all star upside, is still very young and a lot less risky. He's ready to start right now and lead a team. If Rozier was a free agent right now would a team offer him a max deal to pry him away from the Celtics? Yes I think a team would. If your the Suns or Magic why wouldn't you? Porter Jr. was offered a max deal to try and pry him away from the Wizards, I think Rozier has shown more than he did last year. Rozier with his upside is the exact type of player crappy teams will pay hoping he reaches his full potential. We see it all the time. Nets offering almost a max deal for Crabbe, a player that didn't have close to Roziers upside or production. |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 2, 2018 10:31:08 GMT -5
Ohh boy, I started this argument. I was just wondering what everyone's perspective of Rozier's trade value was. Lol.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 2, 2018 10:34:57 GMT -5
Death, taxes and the Toronto Raptors choking. Playoff chocking to the Cavs especially. For some reason the Raptors curl into the feedle position when they see LeBron in the playoffs. That picture you got with Horford and Embid could be applied to LeBron being the daddy of the Raptors. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 2, 2018 11:17:43 GMT -5
Is anyone really surprised that the Raptors can't beat the Cavs? I just don't see how that Raptor team is built to win a championship. They are one player away and it's been like that for years. They remind me of the Pistons before they got Wallace.
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Post by Don Caballero on May 2, 2018 11:48:49 GMT -5
Is anyone really surprised that the Raptors can't beat the Cavs? I just don't see how that Raptor team is built to win a championship. They are one player away and it's been like that for years. They remind me of the Pistons before they got Wallace. I'm surprised they even beat the Wizards, it really shows just how overrated Scott Brooks truly is. I don't even think they're one player away, if they do lose to the Cavs I think they should blow it up. Lowry and DDR are not going to win them anything, they play way too small in the big moments. They didn't deserve to win last night, and frankly after seeing Valanciunas going for that last rebound in the 4th that could have won them the game with just his left hand for whatever reason I don't think they deserve to win any game. Heck, they gave Lebron of all people a good look with half a second left, how incompetent do you have to be? More than anything it was a terrible game. It was exciting, but it was kind of like 2 drunk people fighting it off. Both teams suck and if the Celtics survive the 6ers I'm feeling pretty good about a Finals trip. The Pelicans and Warriors game afterwards was such a palette cleanser. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 2, 2018 12:21:37 GMT -5
It's just the difference in confrences frankly. The East is built on D mainly, the West is all offense. All offense is always going to be a lot more enjoyable to watch. That game was the number one and third rated offenses in the league. At the same time the Finals should be interesting because two styles will collide.
I agree Lowry and DeRozan aren't good enough to be your top players. At the same time take out Ibaka and give them Horford and that would be a scary team. Find a way to add Cousins to that team and watch out. I could go on and on. It's the hardest thing to do though, add that one more piece when your maxed out and don't have high picks. They have to do something though.
Scott Brooks isn't a bad coach, but he's not a top coach either. I'd actually give him credit this year, not sure you could do a lot more with that talent. It's a deep team, they just lack difference makers. Heck even a Morris type coming off the bench would be a huge upgrade.
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Post by Don Caballero on May 2, 2018 16:37:03 GMT -5
Yeah it's going to be really rough for the Raptors to add another top piece and it's even tougher because I feel their current team could make a run for it if Lowry and DeRozan played up to it. Maybe they will, the series is far from over, but considering the history they already have I'd mark that as doubtful.
I don't see it about Brooks, their teams always feel unspectacular despite the talent. I actually thought last year was his best work yet, but this year the Wizards looked terrible later in the season. He's a little bit like Nate McMillan, but I like McMillan's defense better.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 2, 2018 16:52:51 GMT -5
I had a brain fart, we were talking about the Raptors and you brought him up and I for some dumb reason thought he was the coach of the Raptors. That's my mistake and you're 100% right he didn't do a good job this year. The Wizards have a ton of talent.
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Post by Don Caballero on May 2, 2018 20:37:54 GMT -5
I had a brain fart, we were talking about the Raptors and you brought him up and I for some dumb reason thought he was the coach of the Raptors. That's my mistake and you're 100% right he didn't do a good job this year. The Wizards have a ton of talent. Ah I get it now lol Dwane Casey is actually a very fine coach, kudos to Toronto for sticking with him even with the rough early goings because he's getting better year by year. It's another thing that makes me feel bad for the Raptors, the organization seems very competent and they do all the right things but the team just melts under pressure. It's sad. |
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Post by telson13 on May 2, 2018 22:07:19 GMT -5
Blocks and steals isn't a great way overall, but almost every impactful defender will get them. Add in that rebounding is a big part of D and Semi is below average, waaay below average when he's playing PF. He also doesn't get any calls because he's a nobody right now. Which right now is probaly his best chance to make plays. He should have got a lot of charging calls last series. He didn't and that won't change against the Sixers. He just posted a 2.3 per over the last 7 games. Along with negative box score numbers on both offense and defense. I'm not slamming him either just pointing out facts. In time I think he'll improve, but based on stats he's most likely the worst player overall playing the type of minutes he's been playing in the whole playoffs, by a wide margin. All you have to do is look at what the Greek Freaks numbers were with Semi on him and you realize he had a part in changing the direction of the series. Just like with Smart defense can't always be quantified by stats. I’m definitely one to put weight on statistical measures (at least, multiple ones, in concert), but I agree with you here. Sometimes it’s just too complex to quantify and the eyeball test really is the kicker. Semi played Antetokuonmpo about as well as I think is possible. Totally disrupted his game, when he was basically the isolated scoring option. |
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Post by rjp313jr on May 3, 2018 6:44:21 GMT -5
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Post by rjp313jr on May 3, 2018 6:52:48 GMT -5
I had a brain fart, we were talking about the Raptors and you brought him up and I for some dumb reason thought he was the coach of the Raptors. That's my mistake and you're 100% right he didn't do a good job this year. The Wizards have a ton of talent. Ah I get it now lol Dwane Casey is actually a very fine coach, kudos to Toronto for sticking with him even with the rough early goings because he's getting better year by year. It's another thing that makes me feel bad for the Raptors, the organization seems very competent and they do all the right things but the team just melts under pressure. It's sad. One overlooked aspect of what Ainge does is he gets players who have a thirst for competition and improvement. Yea, he’s missed on some draft picks who lacked that drive when he went for the upside play (Melo, Johnson, Young), but guys like Smart, Rozier and Bradley were all drafted because they were athletic but had the compete level. He knew they could impact the game defensively and that they’d have the drive to work on the rest of their game. Same is true for free agents they’ve brought in. Yes Stevens is great at getting guys to buy in and he’s great at putting guys in spots to succeed and he’s great at keeping them involved (by frustrating us with weird lineups in January), but no matter how good a coach is he cannot completely change a players personality. Yes, he can help but there’s certain traits a player needs inside and Danny seems to do a better job than many of identifying those traits and players. He won’t and hasn’t batted 1.000 but he does well. Even Tatum and Brown fit this. Brown was drafted too high by most accounts (inc me) but besides his athleticism, I can guarantee you Danny’s motivation was his work ethic, intelligence, coach-ability and drive. Tatum is a basketball junkie and this is probably why they had him number 1 over a guy like Fultz who’s skill set was sexier but his passion questioned. Danny was an all heart player and he looks for those things. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 3, 2018 11:43:06 GMT -5
James Young is still just 22. Still think he takes the Gerald Green route and becomes an NBA player in time. Still like that pick at that point in the draft. You pick the 18 year old with crazy upside, sweet stroke, very athletic and a monster 7 foot wingspan. He had everything put work ethic that you wanted.
Melo still upsets me, because it seems Danny has stopped going after raw super athletic bigs and that's exactly what we need. I still don't hate the pick, he was exactly what we needed and with multiple first round picks it allows you to gamble.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 3, 2018 11:44:45 GMT -5
Brown is still doubtful for game 2. Looks like maybe game 3 we will see him, best case scenario.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 3, 2018 11:45:06 GMT -5
Can you imagine what our D would look like with a truly great defensive center?
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Post by Don Caballero on May 3, 2018 11:45:32 GMT -5
One overlooked aspect of what Ainge does is he gets players who have a thirst for competition and improvement. Yea, he’s missed on some draft picks who lacked that drive when he went for the upside play (Melo, Johnson, Young), but guys like Smart, Rozier and Bradley were all drafted because they were athletic but had the compete level. He knew they could impact the game defensively and that they’d have the drive to work on the rest of their game. Same is true for free agents they’ve brought in. Yes Stevens is great at getting guys to buy in and he’s great at putting guys in spots to succeed and he’s great at keeping them involved (by frustrating us with weird lineups in January), but no matter how good a coach is he cannot completely change a players personality. Yes, he can help but there’s certain traits a player needs inside and Danny seems to do a better job than many of identifying those traits and players. He won’t and hasn’t batted 1.000 but he does well. Even Tatum and Brown fit this. Brown was drafted too high by most accounts (inc me) but besides his athleticism, I can guarantee you Danny’s motivation was his work ethic, intelligence, coach-ability and drive. Tatum is a basketball junkie and this is probably why they had him number 1 over a guy like Fultz who’s skill set was sexier but his passion questioned. Danny was an all heart player and he looks for those things. Agreed and this is spot on on how Danny does it. There are a lot of stories about how tough Danny and the house he grew up in and that really translates on the team. Watching Lowry and DDR shying away from the moment had me thinking if Danny would ever allow that. I think he would storm the court and beat the crap out of them, or more probably he'd trade them in the off-season. Stevens is obviously a great coach, but this insane aggressive demeanor comes from the FO. Heck even Stevens sounds more stern today than he did when he was hired, though that's probably headcanon. There are a few interviews I watched of him this season and yeah he does not play around, it's all business and it's all winning. He has that stare. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 3, 2018 11:47:50 GMT -5
Brown is still doubtful for game 2. Looks like maybe game 3 we will see him, best case scenario. Don't play him till he's 100%, not with that injury. Given the injury that could be game 3 or at worst game 4. |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 3, 2018 11:51:25 GMT -5
One overlooked aspect of what Ainge does is he gets players who have a thirst for competition and improvement. Yea, he’s missed on some draft picks who lacked that drive when he went for the upside play (Melo, Johnson, Young), but guys like Smart, Rozier and Bradley were all drafted because they were athletic but had the compete level. He knew they could impact the game defensively and that they’d have the drive to work on the rest of their game. Same is true for free agents they’ve brought in. Yes Stevens is great at getting guys to buy in and he’s great at putting guys in spots to succeed and he’s great at keeping them involved (by frustrating us with weird lineups in January), but no matter how good a coach is he cannot completely change a players personality. Yes, he can help but there’s certain traits a player needs inside and Danny seems to do a better job than many of identifying those traits and players. He won’t and hasn’t batted 1.000 but he does well. Even Tatum and Brown fit this. Brown was drafted too high by most accounts (inc me) but besides his athleticism, I can guarantee you Danny’s motivation was his work ethic, intelligence, coach-ability and drive. Tatum is a basketball junkie and this is probably why they had him number 1 over a guy like Fultz who’s skill set was sexier but his passion questioned. Danny was an all heart player and he looks for those things. He has that stare. I have no idea what you're talking about Don. i.ytimg.com/vi/01nFMAkuAus/maxresdefault.jpg |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 3, 2018 11:56:11 GMT -5
Can you imagine what our D would look like with a truly great defensive center? Probably one of the best in NBA history. |
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Post by Don Caballero on May 3, 2018 12:15:39 GMT -5
 He looks at journalists so intensely these days. Imagine you're Kyle Lowry and you look at the other team's bench and you see this dude staring at you like this. |
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Post by rjp313jr on May 3, 2018 12:18:31 GMT -5
Brown is still doubtful for game 2. Looks like maybe game 3 we will see him, best case scenario. Don't play him till he's 100%, not with that injury. Given the injury that could be game 3 or at worst game 4. With that injury, 100% won’t come for a while. Hamstring pulls are terrible, if they win tonight without him then I don’t play him until we are home again. Honestly, we aren’t winning on the road in all likelihood and it’s not that i wouldn’t not try to but these injuries are rough and the extra rest is more important. |
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on May 3, 2018 12:35:35 GMT -5
He looks at journalists so intensely these days. Imagine you're Kyle Lowry and you look at the other team's bench and you see this dude staring at you like this. I feel bad for Steven's wife when she cooks a bad dinner. That's all I got to say about that. Lol |
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Post by rjp313jr on May 3, 2018 12:39:35 GMT -5
He looks at journalists so intensely these days. Imagine you're Kyle Lowry and you look at the other team's bench and you see this dude staring at you like this. I feel bad for Steven's wife when she cooks a bad dinner. That's all I got to say about that. Lol Maybe he cooks dinner when he’s home. So presumptuous |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 3, 2018 12:41:28 GMT -5
Don't play him till he's 100%, not with that injury. Given the injury that could be game 3 or at worst game 4. With that injury, 100% won’t come for a while. Hamstring pulls are terrible, if they win tonight without him then I don’t play him until we are home again. Honestly, we aren’t winning on the road in all likelihood and it’s not that i wouldn’t not try to but these injuries are rough and the extra rest is more important. Where are you getting that information from? I've read a bunch of studies and there is a crap load of data out there because hamstring injuries are the most common injury in sports. They have come up with advanced treatment plans. If reports are true and it's only a grade one. Things get a lot different when you get into grade 2 and 3. Most seem to agree grade one a player can come back in 5 to 10 days at 100% with a low reinjury rate, if the right steps are taken. |
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