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7/20-7/22 Red Sox @ Tigers Series Thread
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Post by jimed14 on Jul 20, 2018 22:01:06 GMT -5
I feel like it'll be hard to be less than disappointed with a .700 winning percentage this year. haha
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Post by sarasoxer on Jul 20, 2018 22:07:18 GMT -5
You have to also remember games like this when you're so worried about the bullpen. I'll remember that the Sox avoided Kelly and for good reason. Honestly I heard you the first time...☺️
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 20, 2018 22:25:09 GMT -5
I'll remember that the Sox avoided Kelly and for good reason. Honestly I heard you the first time...☺️ Lol did I say it twice? Maybe back in my Matt Barnes reference in the 8th inning?
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Post by patford on Jul 20, 2018 22:25:40 GMT -5
You have to also remember games like this when you're so worried about the bullpen. I'll remember that the Sox avoided Kelly and for good reason. Kelly will be great again for a stretch. It's who he is. It's not nerves with him. His mechanics just go out of whack and with that his control. Hopefully he gets hot again at the right time.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 20, 2018 22:28:49 GMT -5
I'll remember that the Sox avoided Kelly and for good reason. Kelly will be great again for a stretch. It's who he is. It's not nerves with him. His mechanics just go out of whack and with that his control. Hopefully he gets hot again at the right time. Yeah you're probably right, just not the best guy to trust in a big spot. I hope you're right in fact. He has to figure things out before he sees a important inning again.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 20, 2018 22:31:50 GMT -5
Hembree warmed up in the 6th and was used in the 7th against lousy hitters, so it's hard to know how much to make of that.
What they could do is mix and match him, Thornburg, Brasier, and Workman in the 7th based on their matchup projections, while trying to get Kelly back on track in low leverage. Meanwhile, they can see if one of the quartet seizes the 7th.
Folks are probably surprised to see that Kelly has actually been above average in consistency and less inconsistent than Barnes (according to the simple metric I cooked up earlier), but that's because you notice the bad outings of a guy who is streaky more than those who scatter them. Inconsistent and streaky is probably better than inconsistent at random. If they can get Kelly back into his good groove, he's a valuable guy.
Meanwhile, with Holt likely out for a few days, I wonder whether they'll send Poyner down and select Phillips. They can move Pedroia to the 60-day DL.
Better yet, there's no reason not to trade for Dozier right now.
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Post by patford on Jul 20, 2018 22:40:29 GMT -5
Kelly will be great again for a stretch. It's who he is. It's not nerves with him. His mechanics just go out of whack and with that his control. Hopefully he gets hot again at the right time. Yeah you're probably right, just not the best guy to trust in a big spot. I hope you're right in fact. He has to figure things out before he sees a important inning again. At this point I would not let him into a game without having another arm warming along side him. One walk and he's coming out. Still, recall that after that awful first game he was tremendously good for a long while. So good that some were wondering if he could replace Kimbrel. He can't. He always turns back into a pumpkin. Frustrating because when he is going good he is extremely good.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 20, 2018 22:41:15 GMT -5
Meanwhile, with Holt likely out for a few days, I wonder whether they'll send Poyner down and select Phillips. They can move Pedroia to the 60-day DL.
Better yet, there's no reason not to trade for Dozier right now.
Devers is going to be activated. Poyner is going down after tonight's game.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 20, 2018 23:14:24 GMT -5
Meanwhile, with Holt likely out for a few days, I wonder whether they'll send Poyner down and select Phillips. They can move Pedroia to the 60-day DL.
Better yet, there's no reason not to trade for Dozier right now.
Devers is going to be activated. Poyner is going down after tonight's game. I was going to say "oh, good!," but is it ever good when Nunez is moving back to 2B?
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redsox04071318champs
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jul 20, 2018 23:16:07 GMT -5
Pomeranz will be coming up soon. He's lined up to pitch on the 24th and then again on the 29th - the game I go to (fingers crossed that it's the good Pomeranz).
I guess by then the Sox will judge whether Pomeranz has turned a corner or if they need to go get a backend starter in a deal.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 20, 2018 23:25:59 GMT -5
Pomeranz will be coming up soon. He's lined up to pitch on the 24th and then again on the 29th - the game I go to (fingers crossed that it's the good Pomeranz). I guess by then the Sox will judge whether Pomeranz has turned a corner or if they need to go get a backend starter in a deal. Lin will probably be up with the big club until Tuesday. Presumably Holt should be okay by then.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 20, 2018 23:26:29 GMT -5
Devers is going to be activated. Poyner is going down after tonight's game. I was going to say "oh, good!," but is it ever good when Nunez is moving back to 2B? You never know, maybe Lin will get some starts if Cora is smart.
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Post by dirtdog on Jul 20, 2018 23:57:14 GMT -5
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redsox04071318champs
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jul 21, 2018 0:07:42 GMT -5
So Devers is coming back. Pomeranz is coming back. Unfortunately Wright is not coming back anytime soon, which I think is a blow to their rotation Now the Sox have to hope E-Rod comes back or that Pomeranz can recapture what he did in 2017. Pomeranz, the forgotten man, becomes all the more important.
Today's win was impressive. The Sox blew many chances to blow the game wide open. Normally that would cost them the game. However the Tigers blew as many chances themselves so the Sox won another game that they normally (in other years) wouldn't win. This year's team seems to find ways to win the games that Sox teams in past seasons just wouldn't. That's why they'd win 93 instead of winning whatever total this year's team will win.
Price pitched well. The lineup he faced wasn't overly impressive. It was sad to see how badly diminished V-Mart's hitting skills are (not that I want him to hit the Sox) but it was noticeable. And even though the lineup wasn't impressive Price still has to execute pitches and he did. Much to his credit.
Hembree, Barnes and Kimbrel all did a good job. Credit to Barnes for keeping his composure when his first 2 Ks wound up as wild pitches.
Which makes me ask - why is there a rule that if 1b is already occupied the batter can't be safe at 1st on a wild pitch K even if the runner can move up all he wants? That makes no sense to me. I knew the rule. Apparently NESN didn't for a few minutes as their graphic had 1st and 3rd with none out before correcting themselves to 3rd with 1 out. It just seems like a stupid rule that makes no sense. It certainly helped the Sox today, but I just don't follow the logic. Does anybody else here get it?
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Post by orion09 on Jul 21, 2018 1:33:47 GMT -5
Which makes me ask - why is there a rule that if 1b is already occupied the batter can't be safe at 1st on a wild pitch K even if the runner can move up all he wants? That makes no sense to me. I knew the rule. Apparently NESN didn't for a few minutes as their graphic had 1st and 3rd with none out before correcting themselves to 3rd with 1 out. It just seems like a stupid rule that makes no sense. It certainly helped the Sox today, but I just don't follow the logic. Does anybody else here get it? I always wondered the same thing - turns out it's to prevent the defense from turning a double play. Kind of like the infield fly rule. link
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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Jul 21, 2018 6:38:41 GMT -5
That was such a messed sequence in the 8th inning, with Barnes striking out two and the balls getting away from Leon. A win is a win, although the Red Sox should have scored at least 2 or 3 more runs. They are fortunate their schedule after the break includes the Tigers, O’s and Twins.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 21, 2018 7:33:34 GMT -5
That was such a messed sequence in the 8th inning, with Barnes striking out two and the balls getting away from Leon. A win is a win, although the Red Sox should have scored at least 2 or 3 more runs. They are fortunate their schedule after the break includes the Tigers, O’s and Twins. There's nothing fortunate about their schedule after the break that wasn't equally unfortunate before the break, and vice versa. It might be good, but it's not lucky.
What is unfortunate is that they and the Yankees have 6 non-common games in their schedule, and the Sox have 5 games against contenders and the Yankees 1. The Sox are playing 85 win teams on average and the MFY's are playing 65 win teams. (I'm using my projected win totals that adjust for SOS properly.)
Bos 3 Atl (91) 1 Phi (90)
1 Sea (92) 1 ChW (55)
NYY
3 NYM (67) 1 Was (83) 1 Det (64) 1 KC (46)
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 21, 2018 7:55:40 GMT -5
If the Sox win tonight, they have a legitimate chance to sweep the series. Chris Sale is pitching in the last game versus whoever replaces Fulmer on the Detroit side. Surprised to see that Porcello didn't pitch on Sunday with Sale pitching in the allstar game.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 21, 2018 8:02:38 GMT -5
That was such a messed sequence in the 8th inning, with Barnes striking out two and the balls getting away from Leon. A win is a win, although the Red Sox should have scored at least 2 or 3 more runs. They are fortunate their schedule after the break includes the Tigers, O’s and Twins. No one has ever fanned 5 guys in an inning, but yesterday was the first time I've ever thought to myself that it could possibly be about to happen. Another K/reached on WP would have tied the game and put a runner on first, and then two more strikeouts would have made history. As it turned out, Barnes did face 5 batters, but only fanned three.
With the rising K rates it's bound to happen at some point.
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Post by jimed14 on Jul 21, 2018 8:10:27 GMT -5
I have to say it was pretty amazing that Barnes was getting those swings and misses on pitches that made it about 58 feet. Batters seem to have no recognition of it until it's too late.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Jul 21, 2018 8:12:56 GMT -5
That was such a messed sequence in the 8th inning, with Barnes striking out two and the balls getting away from Leon. A win is a win, although the Red Sox should have scored at least 2 or 3 more runs. They are fortunate their schedule after the break includes the Tigers, O’s and Twins. No one has ever fanned 5 guys in an inning, but yesterday was the first time I've ever thought to myself that it could possibly be about to happen. Another K/reached on WP would have tied the game and put a runner on first, and then two more strikeouts would have made history. As it turned out, Barnes did face 5 batters, but only fanned three. With the rising K rates it's bound to happen at some point.
Not true unless a third wild pitch on a strikeout happened because the second one just went as an out because first was occupied. He could have only tied the record at 4. Giving Leon a mulligan here, Barnes dirt curves were nasty.
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Post by m1keyboots on Jul 21, 2018 8:28:06 GMT -5
Hembree warmed up in the 6th and was used in the 7th against lousy hitters, so it's hard to know how much to make of that.
What they could do is mix and match him, Thornburg, Brasier, and Workman in the 7th based on their matchup projections, while trying to get Kelly back on track in low leverage. Meanwhile, they can see if one of the quartet seizes the 7th.
Folks are probably surprised to see that Kelly has actually been above average in consistency and less inconsistent than Barnes (according to the simple metric I cooked up earlier), but that's because you notice the bad outings of a guy who is streaky more than those who scatter them. Inconsistent and streaky is probably better than inconsistent at random. If they can get Kelly back into his good groove, he's a valuable guy.
Meanwhile, with Holt likely out for a few days, I wonder whether they'll send Poyner down and select Phillips. They can move Pedroia to the 60-day DL.
Better yet, there's no reason not to trade for Dozier right now.
Personally after seeing Kelly freeze 4 or 5 hitters now with a changeups (basically a decent Sinker from a starter, movement and velocity wise) my trust level has gotten higher with him. Of course it's not like my opinion matters much to the team. However, when he's throwing strikes with those two breaking balls and can drop in the off speed every now and then he becomes a much different pitcher than the 99 to 101 "here it is hit it type" I'm just happy the Redsox haven't gotten trigger Happy and splurged on guys like Sergio Romo, or Soria for Bullpen help. It would be nice to see if Thornburg can work out his issues and solve the problem that way, because Soria although he's saving games has looked so average this year, and I don't think 90 mile an hour to siemers with the odd cutter and curveball are going to do the job against lineups like the Yankees or Astros. It would be nice to see them add a guy like Keone Kela or Diekman. Guys with velocity, put away pitches and no problem throwing strikes. What a catch by JD last night!! I stand corrected that his defense is below average in right field. Edit I understand your thought process with Brian Dozier, especially with the green monster however watching twins games it just seems like he's hunting mistakes and has become more of a liability than ever if we're going to trade for him as a rental and give up some prospects. Maybe a guy like Yolmer Sanchez who will be have issues with playing time next year with mung Kata and Matt Davidson in front of him who can play third? Lefty or switch hitting type?
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 21, 2018 8:29:08 GMT -5
If the Sox win tonight, they have a legitimate chance to sweep the series. Chris Sale is pitching in the last game versus whoever replaces Fulmer on the Detroit side. Surprised to see that Porcello didn't pitch on Sunday with Sale pitching in the allstar game. Sale is set up to open the 4-game MFY series. He'll be pitching on regular rest Sunday after throwing just 9 pitches in his last start, so there's no need to flop him and Porcello.
The MFY rotation now projects as Sale, Porcello, Pomeranz, Price, all on an extra day's rest, but they have the option of skipping Pomeranz and going Price, Johnson in games 3 and 4. Pomeranz will have had two starts (@ Bal, Min) to show that he's better than BJ.
Meanwhile, the Yankees have lined up Tanaka, Severino, Sabathia, and Luis Cessa, who is apparently coming up to take Domingo German's rotation slot on Wednesday in Tampa, after two outstanding starts for Scranton (13 6 1 1 1 14). Unlike Pomeranz, he'll have just one start to prove he's better than the alternative, Sonny Gray, who starts Thursday vs. KC. They have an off day on Monday the 30th and then have Cessa and Gray scheduled to pitch against the O's immediately before facing us. If they'd rather have Gray pitch the 4th game, they'd have to flop them then.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Jul 21, 2018 8:34:06 GMT -5
No one has ever fanned 5 guys in an inning, but yesterday was the first time I've ever thought to myself that it could possibly be about to happen. Another K/reached on WP would have tied the game and put a runner on first, and then two more strikeouts would have made history. As it turned out, Barnes did face 5 batters, but only fanned three. With the rising K rates it's bound to happen at some point.
Not true unless a third wild pitch on a strikeout happened because the second one just went as an out because first was occupied. He could have only tied the record at 4. Giving Leon a mulligan here, Barnes dirt curves were nasty. So, what I said wasn't true unless it was true? If he'd fanned Castellanos on another WP (Goodrum scores, Castellanos to first) and then fanned Hicks instead of walking him, that's 5.
The first two guys had fanned on curveballs that weren't just unhittable, but uncatchable. If it had happened a third straight time, you have 1 out and 3 K's already in the book.
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Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jul 21, 2018 8:34:22 GMT -5
If the Sox win tonight, they have a legitimate chance to sweep the series. Chris Sale is pitching in the last game versus whoever replaces Fulmer on the Detroit side. Surprised to see that Porcello didn't pitch on Sunday with Sale pitching in the allstar game. Sale is set up to open the 4-game MFY series. He'll be pitching on regular rest Sunday after throwing just 9 pitches in his last start, so there's no need to flop him and Porcello.
The MFY rotation now projects as Sale, Porcello, Pomeranz, Price, all on an extra day's rest, but they have the option of skipping Pomeranz and going Price, Johnson in games 3 and 4. Pomeranz will have had two starts (@ Bal, Min) to show that he's better than BJ.
Meanwhile, the Yankees have lined up Tanaka, Severino, Sabathia, and Luis Cessa, who is apparently coming up to take Domingo German's rotation slot on Wednesday in Tampa, after two outstanding starts for Scranton (13 6 1 1 1 14). Unlike Pomeranz, he'll have just one start to prove he's better than the alternative, Sonny Gray, who starts Thursday vs. KC. They have an off day on Monday the 30th and then have Cessa and Gray scheduled to pitch against the O's immediately before facing us. If they'd rather have Gray pitch the 4th game, they'd have to flop them then.
The Yankees will probably acquire someone before Cessa gets a sniff at the Sox.
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