SoxProspects News
|
|
|
|
Legal
Forum Ground Rules
The views expressed by the members of this Forum do not necessarily reflect the views of SoxProspects, LLC.
© 2003-2024 SoxProspects, LLC
|
|
|
|
|
Forum Home | Search | My Profile | Messages | Members | Help |
Welcome Guest. Please Login or Register.
4/26-4/28 Red Sox vs. Rays Series Thread
|
Post by jimed14 on Apr 29, 2019 9:18:18 GMT -5
Maybe we can have the same conversation after every error this season. We get it. You see him as a 1B. He's not going to switch this year.
|
|
|
Post by James Dunne on Apr 29, 2019 9:23:22 GMT -5
Maybe we can have the same conversation after every error this season. We get it. You see him as a 1B. He's not going to switch this year. Every player who makes an error should swtich positions, and every reliever who gives up a run should be DFA. Also, every player in the minor leagues will be able to switch positions to fill that hole, and the pitchers in the minor leagues will stabilize the bullpen.
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Apr 29, 2019 9:45:33 GMT -5
And a year ago, Yoan Moncada couldn't lay off a breaking ball. There's a longstanding and fairly widespread consensus among scouts and other prospect watchers that Devers at least has the physical tools to be a decent MLB third baseman. All the statistical hairsplitting is besides the point as long as those fundamental factors (that he has the tools and that he's still super young) are still true. I don't see it. His arm accuracy was rated really poorly last year and has looked to have gotten worse (we won't get this year's numbers until the end of this year). His release is also rated very poorly. Both of these things seem to be headed in the wrong direction eye test wise, like regressing instead of progressing. Getting the ball out of the glove and throwing it are huge problems that aren't going to be solved overnight. Certainly isn't getting fixed this season. Moncada always put up good at bats regardless of his offspeed struggles and it's one month. Like a position switch needs to be considered in the future. Youk was once a third baseman turned gold glove first baseman. What would be the problem with that if you thought that was possible for Devers? The errors hurt them, but it's something you kind of have to put up with. He has the abilities to be a good 3b. I remember there was a play he made that doesn't get much mention - but it was huge and it was against the Dodgers in the 9th inning of Game 4 of the World Series. Kimbrel was making everybody nervous, quickly turning a 9-4 lead into a 9-6 game and there was a runner on with one out. Machado scalded a ball down the line that looked like it would get past Devers and bring up the tying run. The slow motion shows how he at the last instant got his glove in position to make the difficult snag and then righted himself and threw a perfect strike to Pearce (as Machado stepped on Pearce's heel this time by accident) to get the 2nd out and deflate the Dodgers' rally. What that play showed was that the guy has an ability to become an average to good 3b. The tools are there. He has range, a good arm, and in that play fast hands. His footwork still is an issue and he's error prone. It's hard to remember that he's really only 22, and it's not like the Red Sox have a gold glove 3b forcing his way up. Chavis is error prone, too, and his defense is even more questionable. Maybe Dalbec forces Devers over to 1b eventually, but Dalbec is in AA and older than Devers, and is hardly a guarantee to make enough contact to even become a viable regular. So in the near future you're probably looking at Devers and Chavis at the corners. Frankly, I'd stick Chavis at 1b before I would Devers. And also as that play illustrated, when things were at their most important, Devers make that play - just as the defensively challenged Nunez made his crucial play (with help from Pearce) to beat the Yankees. When it's your year, stuff like that happens. When it's a year like 2019, these kinds of errors kill you. Timing is everything in life.
|
|
|
Post by fenwaythehardway on Apr 29, 2019 11:24:18 GMT -5
And a year ago, Yoan Moncada couldn't lay off a breaking ball. There's a longstanding and fairly widespread consensus among scouts and other prospect watchers that Devers at least has the physical tools to be a decent MLB third baseman. All the statistical hairsplitting is besides the point as long as those fundamental factors (that he has the tools and that he's still super young) are still true. I don't see it. We know. But that doesn't prove it isn't there. You know what would prove that Devers will never be a decent 3b? Nothing, because he's super young and player development is inherently unpredictable. It's an untenable position.
|
|
ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,941
|
Post by ericmvan on Apr 29, 2019 12:00:50 GMT -5
I don't think I'll have time to look at the game on my DVR. Is there any explanation for why he was awful for 2 innings and dominant for 5? Was he just slow in figuring out what to throw? I dont think he was awful at all. 2 runs were unearned. He allowed a .410 xwOBA and .419 wOBA through the first 4 innings. That's completely awful. He limited the damage by situational pitching.
The last three innings he had a .197 xwOBA and .068 wOBA.
|
|
ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,941
|
Post by ericmvan on Apr 29, 2019 12:14:17 GMT -5
And a year ago, Yoan Moncada couldn't lay off a breaking ball. There's a longstanding and fairly widespread consensus among scouts and other prospect watchers that Devers at least has the physical tools to be a decent MLB third baseman. All the statistical hairsplitting is besides the point as long as those fundamental factors (that he has the tools and that he's still super young) are still true. I don't see it. His arm accuracy was rated really poorly last year and has looked to have gotten worse (we won't get this year's numbers until the end of this year). His release is also rated very poorly. Both of these things seem to be headed in the wrong direction eye test wise, like regressing instead of progressing. Getting the ball out of the glove and throwing it are huge problems that aren't going to be solved overnight. Certainly isn't getting fixed this season. Moncada always put up good at bats regardless of his offspeed struggles and it's one month. Like a position switch needs to be considered in the future. Youk was once a third baseman turned gold glove first baseman. What would be the problem with that if you thought that was possible for Devers? Arm accuracy and release are skills. Arm strength is a tool. Range is composed of a lot of tools (and some skill). That he has plus range numbers with bad footwork tells you that his range tools are very good, which is what my eyeballs have been telling me since I saw him play a game for Salem.
So here's a guy with 55 arm strength and 60 (maybe 65) range tools who has woefully inconsistent skills but an excellent work ethic, and he's at an age where most prospects are still in the minors. (Matt Chapman at that age was in high-A ball.) And you think it's nearly time to give up on him and move him to 1B?
|
|
radiohix
Veteran
'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
Posts: 6,410
Member is Online
|
Post by radiohix on Apr 29, 2019 12:42:29 GMT -5
Jeez! Going through this thread is quite depressing heh Yes the start of the season has been frustrating but projecting what's coming depends from your perspective, it really is. Personnaly here's how I look to it: Before the season started there were few questions about the team and so far the indications are positive. Let me explain, on opening day the questions were - The Bullpen of course - Catcher, 2nd Base and 3rd Base were a black hole and needed to pick it up and componsate for the loss of wins that can affect Sale, Mookie and JD after their respective all world performances last year. Barnes is turning into 2017 Kimbrel, punching out half of the batter faced and drasticly cutting the walks, Brasier is here and Walden is good surprise and there's talent in the Minors and Wright would help too. Vazquez is starting to hit, Devers is laying down the foundation of a brilliant hitting season. We all know he can hit the heck out of a baseball if he narrows his hitting zone and so far so good, he's walking at an elite clip and cutting down his whiffs and the power will come and he'll carry that team for strechs if he sticks with his approach. For 2nd Base, the revelation of Chavis has been a life saver. I got to admit, I was very skeptical about his profile and thought of him as a Middlebrooks type of hitter but he showed great discipline that WMB can't even dream of, in this tiny sample size he's showing all the things you like: Good eye, good power and respectable contact. I think by DFAing Nunez and the help that Pedroia, Holt and Chavis, 2nd base could turn into an asset just like 3rd Base and to a lesser degree catcher. As for the other elements, Mitch Moreland is sporting a .183 BABIP!!!!! That's a 100 points lower than his career avg! He'll be alright. JBJ is walking at 10% clip and after struggling to start, he's back at spraying the ball like yesterday 2B and he stung some balls this week and I think he's on the right track to be back soon. It's gonna be a fun repeat year folks!
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 29, 2019 14:32:43 GMT -5
Maybe we can have the same conversation after every error this season. We get it. You see him as a 1B. He's not going to switch this year. Every player who makes an error should swtich positions, and every reliever who gives up a run should be DFA. Also, every player in the minor leagues will be able to switch positions to fill that hole, and the pitchers in the minor leagues will stabilize the bullpen. This is the song you should play whenever someone takes one point and completely takes it to the extreme out of context.
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 29, 2019 14:33:44 GMT -5
You know what would prove that Devers will never be a decent 3b? Nothing, Except for the metrics, and advanced metrics.
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 29, 2019 14:36:42 GMT -5
I don't see it. His arm accuracy was rated really poorly last year and has looked to have gotten worse (we won't get this year's numbers until the end of this year). His release is also rated very poorly. Both of these things seem to be headed in the wrong direction eye test wise, like regressing instead of progressing. Getting the ball out of the glove and throwing it are huge problems that aren't going to be solved overnight. Certainly isn't getting fixed this season. Moncada always put up good at bats regardless of his offspeed struggles and it's one month. Like a position switch needs to be considered in the future. Youk was once a third baseman turned gold glove first baseman. What would be the problem with that if you thought that was possible for Devers? Arm accuracy and release are skills. Arm strength is a tool. Range is composed of a lot of tools (and some skill). That he has plus range numbers with bad footwork tells you that his range tools are very good, which is what my eyeballs have been telling me since I saw him play a game for Salem.
So here's a guy with 55 arm strength and 60 (maybe 65) range tools who has woefully inconsistent skills but an excellent work ethic, and he's at an age where most prospects are still in the minors. (Matt Chapman at that age was in high-A ball.) And you think it's nearly time to give up on him and move him to 1B?
Yes. Great. Matt Chapman was in high A at the time. If Matt Chapman were promoted at that age, he probably would have been better defensively than Devers because he has superior athleticism.
|
|
|
Post by James Dunne on Apr 29, 2019 14:39:24 GMT -5
This is the song you should play whenever FTFY. It's really great. You really don't need to post three straight times arguing with every single person who disagrees with you. We all get what you think. But whether or not you do, you should listen to this. The whole Houses of the Holy record, really. I could personally do without D'yer Maker, but everything else is lovely.
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Apr 29, 2019 14:49:23 GMT -5
You know what would prove that Devers will never be a decent 3b? Nothing, Except for the metrics, and advanced metrics. So you think metrics predict the future of a very young player? Time to triple down.
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Apr 29, 2019 14:50:34 GMT -5
This is the song you should play whenever FTFY. It's really great. You really don't need to post three straight times arguing with every single person who disagrees with you. We all get what you think. But whether or not you do, you should listen to this. The whole Houses of the Holy record, really. I could personally do without D'yer Maker, but everything else is lovely. It is a great song, yes. I only posted because the board once again got sensitive all over again. I didn't even respond to every post, FWIW.
|
|
|
Post by kjkramer on Apr 29, 2019 18:43:11 GMT -5
Not being a Negative Nancy.... being a realist..... the Sox are done for 2019. I am officially on record as saying " they are done" Play Chavis daily at 2b. Trade Porcello. Let D. Hernandez have a rotation spot. Bring LAkins and Feltman up. Cut Nunez. Offer Betts one last contract and if he declines... trade him now. THose are starters...
|
|
|
Post by station13 on Apr 29, 2019 19:51:39 GMT -5
wrong thread
|
|
|
Post by redsox04071318champs on Apr 29, 2019 22:46:35 GMT -5
Not being a Negative Nancy.... being a realist..... the Sox are done for 2019. I am officially on record as saying " they are done" Play Chavis daily at 2b. Trade Porcello. Let D. Hernandez have a rotation spot. Bring LAkins and Feltman up. Cut Nunez. Offer Betts one last contract and if he declines... trade him now. THose are starters... You're being pre-mature. Yeah, it's very possible the Sox go nowhere in 2019, but it's still too damn early to make that determination. It's not like a team that goes 12-17 can't ever turn it around. The 1996 Red Sox were nowhere near as talented as this bunch and they started 3-15 and wound up 85-77 and just missed the playoffs. This team is better and not as bad off. As far as your other proclamations - other than playing Chavis daily at 2b, why would you screw up Hernandez's much needed development just so you can trade away Porcello? Do you really think you'd get a ton for him? And why would you waste Feltman's development? No need to rush them up right now. And why would you deal off Betts? You act like the Sox have no shot in 2020. They had a 2018 where everything that could go right went right. We're seeing a 2019 where everything that can go wrong is going wrong. My guess is 2020 will wind up somewhere in between and that's a 90 something win team. Why would you trade Betts away from a team that has a shot at winning another series, whether it's in 2019 or 2020? If anything, make sure they bring back JDM if he opts out. And the Sox should have the money to sign Betts. Way to early to give up, even as frustrating as they are. I mean, I don't have good vibes about this year's team, but it's just too damn early. I figure the Sox are going to need to play well, hope that Minnesota and Seattle are mirages, hope that either injuries finally catch up to NY or hope that Tampa isn't as good as they look, or that Oakland isn't that good. If 3 of those things happen and they play well, they have an opening for the Wild Card spot, and at least one of those things should happen, if not 2 or more. I'm not convinced on Seattle or Minnesota for example and perhaps the A's might struggle. It's possible that both wild cards come out of the AL East this year.
|
|
|