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Benintendi traded to KC in 3-way deal w/ NYM
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Apr 2, 2021 13:08:33 GMT -5
Now that I'm thinking about it... here's a little bit of a speculative theory: given the weirdness of 2020, there may be unusually high variance among prospects - young, developing guys who haven't played a real game in ~18 months - coming into 2021. If the Red Sox have a list of, say, 3 guys from the Mets system to choose from, they may be making the calculation that at least one of them will look surprisingly good, having made improvements that the industry hasn't been able to really observe yet. If so, then it would be a decent wager to accept a list of a few prospects rated slightly lower than Lee to choose from with the hope that one of them would look really good early in the minor league season. I think this is spot on. The current industry rankings might move a ton this year and I doubt the Sox were paying much attention to them when making this trade. I highly doubt we get a highly ranked guy back from the Mets which may upset some fans initially, but I'd also wager we get a guy with a decent-sized up arrow next to his name. Agree. It is also becoming very clear that Bloom values, at least at present as he rebuilds the farm, depth. I think given the choice between (in a theoretical vacuum that doesn't exist and in the real world would be case-specific) two 40+'s on FG's scale and a 45, he might be inclined to take the two 40+'s before factoring player-specific considerations. Think of it this way - we all have talked plenty about how (a) Dombrowski traded all of the prospects, but that (b) most of them turned out to be nothing. You know who might wind up being one of the best non-Moncada/Kopech players he traded? Gregory Santos, who went to the Giants with Shaun Anderson for Eduardo Nunez. You know how much we all knew about him before he did? Absolutely nothing. He wasn't even ranked in our top 60! But the Giants probably had good intel on him from their DR academy folks and got a pretty good prospect who Longenhagen put a 50 on in the 2021 rankings (he is, admittedly, way higher on Santos than, say, BA, where he's 23rd in the SF system, or MLB.com, where he's 13th with a 45 grade, but it's a really good system). My point is that there might be something to taking the two lottery tickets that have slightly worse odds than the single lottery ticket, but at the very least, Bloom is so far showing an inclination in that direction.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Apr 2, 2021 13:18:00 GMT -5
I get what you're saying but say Beni returns to 2018 Beni - that's a really good player, but we won't be lumping this in the Bagwell/Andersen deal or the Lyle/Cater category. We don't even know if Beni can be the Beni we enjoyed the most. But say he is. The Red Sox would have to decide to spend big bucks to keep him or risk losing him after two seasons, which are kind of going to be rebuilding seasons in which they hope to be competitive. I'd say it's well worth the risk. They don't lose much. That's why I used the Yelich comparison because short of him being that I don't think there will be much regret factor in the deal. Beni is a guy who I think has less of a ceiling than I used to think he had. Perhaps Cordero is that as well, but I'm willing to take the chance with Cordero over Benintendi at this point, especially with the extra year of control baked in because by then the Sox should have serious playoff aspirations and if Cordero develops he'd be a part of that. I’m on the same page, I think. There is 0% chance of Bagwell-esque burn. I think there won’t be much regret no matter what, because Beni is likely to be a replaceable guy... though I’m not sure this *trade* brings that replacement. I do think there is a good chance, as I said, that it becomes a no-one-gets-much trade. But I have a hard time, like you, seeing it being a sore point statistically. The sore point — and this is not meant to get things rolling! — is the context. For those of us who care deeply about culture and continuity, seeing Beni and JBJ go is upsetting... so if, for example, Beni is decent and Cordero is meh, it will feel like an understandable but highly *clinical* move, which is not endearing. In other words, the Sox *need* to be clear winners in the trade in order fully to justify it. I get what you're saying, but it's inevitable. I honestly didn't foresee Beni and JBJ as being part of the next great Red Sox team that's two or three years away. As fans we get attached to the players and develop irrational likes and dislikes as if we personally know them. I always want guys to stick around. You almost want so many guys to be like Williams, Yaz, Rice, Tek, or Pedroia and play their entire careers with the Red Sox. You want guys to come to Boston and fall in love with it and stay like Wakefield and Ortiz did, but that's a lot more the exception than the rule. I'm just old enough to remember Lynn and Fisk go (just misssed seeing Tiant and Lee go). My three favorite Sox of the 1980s were Clemens, Boggs, and Evans, and all wound up leaving, although it sounds like Evans had no choice and I do believe Boggs that he wasn't given a choice. Those departures were tough on me. I hated seeing Mo Vaughn go. Strangely enough as huge a fan I was of both Nomar and especially Pedro, I was actually ok with them leaving when they did. I guess since then the only "loss" that really bothered me is the one that bothered you but I can even rationalize that somewhat. At this point, more than watching the continuity of personnel remaining with the team, I'd rather watch a long-lasting window of serious contention and hopefully another championship or more. What does make it easier for me is seeing things like Nomar coming back for a day to retire, Clemens rekindling something of a relationship with the team, Pedro coming back to work with the Red Sox, Vaughn, Burks, and Papelbon rejoining the team working for NESN....stuff like that makes it easier because once Red Sox, they're always Red Sox, even if the Sox don't capture their entire playing careers. And of course I'll have to remind myself this if/when X opts out and wants Lindor money and I have to remind myself that his future is not as a SS, but as a 3b, and if he leaves....well maybe X will be an exception
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Apr 2, 2021 13:19:03 GMT -5
I'm still surprised that the Red Sox were able to get 5 guys for Benintendi who is loaded with question marks himself. Kind of reminds me of the Von Hayes trade many years ago in which the Phillies got a really good player from the Indians but surrendered 5 guys, one of whom wound up every bit as good if not better - Julio Franco. It seems to me it's not crazy to think that Franchy Cordero by himself winds up equal to if not better than Benintendi and they have an extra year of control on him. Cordero strikes me as an intelligent guy who will be somebody who helps himself rather than hinders himself with his work ethic and attitude. I think he's just has some incredibly bad luck with injuries. He will struggle against lefties but it's not like Benintendi hit them well either.k Then the Sox get 4 other guys as well which could really make the trade lopsided. Winchowki looks like he can be a useful bullpen arm, if not back end starter, and it looks like the Sox will get three lower level prospects hoping to hit big on at least one of them. The only way this backfires is if Benintendi turns into Yellich, Cordero continues to be an enigma, Winckowski winds up being marginal and Bloom goes 0-3 on his prospect evaluations. I like the odds of the Red Sox succeeding in this deal more than the above paragraph reaching fruition. It is a big haul and will almost certainly end in a plus, but... it *could* easily backfire short of Beni being Yellich! If Beni is even just Beni from a few years ago, then Cordero HAS to work out... no longer just a hope-so proposal. I am not high on Cordero, meaning I don’t think his production ever lives up to his physical potential.... but I also have a hard time imagining he can’t be ok enough for this to be fine on paper. And there remains the big question: can Beni even be Beni? There is another possible outcome: no one works out and in a few years it is a footnote trade of a bunch of guys who are no longer factors. Would I be crazy to think of Cordero as Willy Mo Pena 2.0? I mean, in terms of the same level of lottery ticket.
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Post by manfred on Apr 2, 2021 13:26:44 GMT -5
It is a big haul and will almost certainly end in a plus, but... it *could* easily backfire short of Beni being Yellich! If Beni is even just Beni from a few years ago, then Cordero HAS to work out... no longer just a hope-so proposal. I am not high on Cordero, meaning I don’t think his production ever lives up to his physical potential.... but I also have a hard time imagining he can’t be ok enough for this to be fine on paper. And there remains the big question: can Beni even be Beni? There is another possible outcome: no one works out and in a few years it is a footnote trade of a bunch of guys who are no longer factors. Would I be crazy to think of Cordero as Willy Mo Pena 2.0? I mean, in terms of the same level of lottery ticket. As I said, I am not bullish.... but I think he has more going for him than Wily Mo did. In the sense that he could bust? Yeah. But if he busts, it’ll be different.
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jimoh
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Post by jimoh on Apr 2, 2021 13:42:49 GMT -5
Fangraphs has a new writeup of the Mets' top 30 prospects out today; a few people in the teens fit in the category "interesting guy I'd like to see on the field after missing a year" e.g. 17. Robert Dominguez, SP Signed: July 2nd Period, 2019 from Venezuela (NYM) Age 19.3 Height 6′ 4″ Weight 200 "was a 17-year-old Venezuelan righty .. who sat 90-93, ...Then he was 94-97 at an event in the summer" "Between when Dominguez was waiting for his contract to be approved and the end of Dominican instructs, he continued to sit in the mid-90s and hit 99, flashing a plus breaking ball at times. A scout who saw him during that period indicated he would “blow the doors off” of the GCL this time next summer. He’s only thrown a handful of times since the velo spike and not even all of the Mets upper level decision makers have seen him yet, but the talent level is on par with a compensation or second-round pick." 18. Freddy Valdez, RF Signed: July 2nd Period, 2018 from Dominican Republic (NYM) Age 19.3 Height 6′ 3″ Weight 250 "thunderous raw power with pretty crude feel for contact coming from a swing that scouts don’t really like.... I’m more inclined to move a guy like this after he performs on paper and I think Valdez is physically mature enough to be tested in full-season ball this year" blogs.fangraphs.com/top-30-prospects-new-york-mets/
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Post by rasimon on Apr 2, 2021 14:25:25 GMT -5
I'm not so optimistic about Cordero. He already 26, only 2 months younger than AB, and for his career FC has generated bWAR of 0.3 (to AB's 10.2). But this could still be a winner of a trade depending on who the Sox get from KC and NYN. If they could get Dominguez from NYN, plus Alec Marsh + Ben Hernandez from KC, plus they already got Wisniewski. Four decent pitching prospects would be a pretty solid haul.
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Post by Soxfansince1971 on Apr 3, 2021 20:06:10 GMT -5
I'm not so optimistic about Cordero. He already 26, only 2 months younger than AB, and for his career FC has generated bWAR of 0.3 (to AB's 10.2). But this could still be a winner of a trade depending on who the Sox get from KC and NYN. If they could get Dominguez from NYN, plus Alec Marsh + Ben Hernandez from KC, plus they already got Wisniewski. Four decent pitching prospects would be a pretty solid haul. The whole trade with corresponding moves was Benintendi (saved $3.8 million) for Cordero (cost $800,000), Winckowski, three prospects (which I think will be better than people think as I do not buy into the RS thinking Cordero is any kind of long term answer), and the other $3 million saved and used for M. Gonzalez. The net effect is Benintendi for six players!! It would be assumed that the 3 yet named players are minor leaguers and have extended controllability as with Winckowski, and Cordero for two years controllability for Beni.
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Post by dyoungteach on Apr 3, 2021 23:47:09 GMT -5
I'm not so optimistic about Cordero. He already 26, only 2 months younger than AB, and for his career FC has generated bWAR of 0.3 (to AB's 10.2). But this could still be a winner of a trade depending on who the Sox get from KC and NYN. If they could get Dominguez from NYN, plus Alec Marsh + Ben Hernandez from KC, plus they already got Wisniewski. Four decent pitching prospects would be a pretty solid haul. The whole trade with corresponding moves was Benintendi (saved $3.8 million) for Cordero (cost $800,000), Winckowski, three prospects (which I think will be better than people think as I do not buy into the RS thinking Cordero is any kind of long term answer), and the other $3 million saved and used for M. Gonzalez. The net effect is Benintendi for six players!! It would be assumed that the 3 yet named players are minor leaguers and have extended controllability as with Winckowski, and Cordero for two years controllability for Beni. Didn’t Red Sox also include money in this deal? To lazy to look it up but I thought it was a chunk of change.
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Post by rasimon on Apr 4, 2021 2:25:52 GMT -5
Fangraphs has a new writeup of the Mets' top 30 prospects out today; a few people in the teens fit in the category "interesting guy I'd like to see on the field after missing a year" e.g. 17. Robert Dominguez, SP Signed: July 2nd Period, 2019 from Venezuela (NYM) Age 19.3 Height 6′ 4″ Weight 200 "was a 17-year-old Venezuelan righty .. who sat 90-93, ...Then he was 94-97 at an event in the summer" "Between when Dominguez was waiting for his contract to be approved and the end of Dominican instructs, he continued to sit in the mid-90s and hit 99, flashing a plus breaking ball at times. A scout who saw him during that period indicated he would “blow the doors off” of the GCL this time next summer. He’s only thrown a handful of times since the velo spike and not even all of the Mets upper level decision makers have seen him yet, but the talent level is on par with a compensation or second-round pick." 18. Freddy Valdez, RF Signed: July 2nd Period, 2018 from Dominican Republic (NYM) Age 19.3 Height 6′ 3″ Weight 250 "thunderous raw power with pretty crude feel for contact coming from a swing that scouts don’t really like.... I’m more inclined to move a guy like this after he performs on paper and I think Valdez is physically mature enough to be tested in full-season ball this year" blogs.fangraphs.com/top-30-prospects-new-york-mets/I wonder if Mauricio might be available considering the Mets just signed Lindor to a 10 year deal and they have a few other 3b prospects. He's not my favorite prospect but I'm not really excited about any Mets prospects other than Alvarez Allen and PCA none of whom I expect will be available. At very least Mauricio is highly rated and could be useful trade capital.
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Post by Soxfansince1971 on Apr 4, 2021 7:46:08 GMT -5
The whole trade with corresponding moves was Benintendi (saved $3.8 million) for Cordero (cost $800,000), Winckowski, three prospects (which I think will be better than people think as I do not buy into the RS thinking Cordero is any kind of long term answer), and the other $3 million saved and used for M. Gonzalez. The net effect is Benintendi for six players!! It would be assumed that the 3 yet named players are minor leaguers and have extended controllability as with Winckowski, and Cordero for two years controllability for Beni. Didn’t Red Sox also include money in this deal? To lazy to look it up but I thought it was a chunk of change. Yes, $2.8 million (Beni was owed $6.6 million), so by trading him they used the $3.8 million saved on Cordero and Gonzalez (not sure what the exact $ are for Winckowski and the 3 PTBN, but it is not very much).
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Post by unitspin on Apr 4, 2021 8:37:20 GMT -5
I'm not so optimistic about Cordero. He already 26, only 2 months younger than AB, and for his career FC has generated bWAR of 0.3 (to AB's 10.2). But this could still be a winner of a trade depending on who the Sox get from KC and NYN. If they could get Dominguez from NYN, plus Alec Marsh + Ben Hernandez from KC, plus they already got Wisniewski. Four decent pitching prospects would be a pretty solid haul. This trade is one that will be talked about in 5 years how it turned out bcs of the lottery pic prospects in tow. But as of looking at it as a Benny vs francy, I think ppl will be disappointed bcs francy could very well be in AAA once they give Duran a shot with the big club. We know Kiké, marwin and hunter can hit so if franchy struggles out the gate he might be looking at limited playing time.
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Post by manfred on Apr 4, 2021 8:58:10 GMT -5
I'm not so optimistic about Cordero. He already 26, only 2 months younger than AB, and for his career FC has generated bWAR of 0.3 (to AB's 10.2). But this could still be a winner of a trade depending on who the Sox get from KC and NYN. If they could get Dominguez from NYN, plus Alec Marsh + Ben Hernandez from KC, plus they already got Wisniewski. Four decent pitching prospects would be a pretty solid haul. This trade is one that will be talked about in 5 years how it turned out bcs of the lottery pic prospects in tow. But as of looking at it as a Benny vs francy, I think ppl will be disappointed bcs francy could very well be in AAA once they give Duran a shot with the big club. We know Kiké, marwin and hunter can hit so if franchy struggles out the gate he might be looking at limited playing time. I suspect this trade will barely be remembered in 5 years unless the Mets send a guy who really pans out. Beni looks like he might be toast and what we got back (as of now) will hardly be memorable.
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Post by kevfc89 on Apr 6, 2021 12:19:34 GMT -5
It's still very early, but if the trends continue it's got to be one of the more sudden and surprising collapses of a once talented hitter.
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Post by fenwaydouble on Apr 6, 2021 12:50:33 GMT -5
It's still very early, but if the trends continue it's got to be one of the more sudden and surprising collapses of a once talented hitter. As you said, it's too early to really make judgments. But this has me worried about his general health. 26-year-olds aren't supposed to suddenly lose their athleticism.
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Post by incandenza on Apr 6, 2021 13:07:18 GMT -5
I had the same thought - it's odd that it's not a more jagged line like you'd expect if he were changing approaches or something; more like a steady degeration of ability.
But the 2020 and 2021 data points combined represent only 71 plate appearances, so we probably need to give it a minute...
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Post by rasimon on Apr 6, 2021 13:29:39 GMT -5
Fangraphs has a new writeup of the Mets' top 30 prospects out today; a few people in the teens fit in the category "interesting guy I'd like to see on the field after missing a year" e.g. 17. Robert Dominguez, SP Signed: July 2nd Period, 2019 from Venezuela (NYM) Age 19.3 Height 6′ 4″ Weight 200 "was a 17-year-old Venezuelan righty .. who sat 90-93, ...Then he was 94-97 at an event in the summer" "Between when Dominguez was waiting for his contract to be approved and the end of Dominican instructs, he continued to sit in the mid-90s and hit 99, flashing a plus breaking ball at times. A scout who saw him during that period indicated he would “blow the doors off” of the GCL this time next summer. He’s only thrown a handful of times since the velo spike and not even all of the Mets upper level decision makers have seen him yet, but the talent level is on par with a compensation or second-round pick." 18. Freddy Valdez, RF Signed: July 2nd Period, 2018 from Dominican Republic (NYM) Age 19.3 Height 6′ 3″ Weight 250 "thunderous raw power with pretty crude feel for contact coming from a swing that scouts don’t really like.... I’m more inclined to move a guy like this after he performs on paper and I think Valdez is physically mature enough to be tested in full-season ball this year" blogs.fangraphs.com/top-30-prospects-new-york-mets/wondering if newly signed Latin players are off the list of possible PTBNLs. What more would the Sox know about them in June that they don't know now? What sort of intelligence could the Sox gather?
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Apr 6, 2021 14:24:13 GMT -5
Fangraphs has a new writeup of the Mets' top 30 prospects out today; a few people in the teens fit in the category "interesting guy I'd like to see on the field after missing a year" e.g. 17. Robert Dominguez, SP Signed: July 2nd Period, 2019 from Venezuela (NYM) Age 19.3 Height 6′ 4″ Weight 200 "was a 17-year-old Venezuelan righty .. who sat 90-93, ...Then he was 94-97 at an event in the summer" "Between when Dominguez was waiting for his contract to be approved and the end of Dominican instructs, he continued to sit in the mid-90s and hit 99, flashing a plus breaking ball at times. A scout who saw him during that period indicated he would “blow the doors off” of the GCL this time next summer. He’s only thrown a handful of times since the velo spike and not even all of the Mets upper level decision makers have seen him yet, but the talent level is on par with a compensation or second-round pick." 18. Freddy Valdez, RF Signed: July 2nd Period, 2018 from Dominican Republic (NYM) Age 19.3 Height 6′ 3″ Weight 250 "thunderous raw power with pretty crude feel for contact coming from a swing that scouts don’t really like.... I’m more inclined to move a guy like this after he performs on paper and I think Valdez is physically mature enough to be tested in full-season ball this year" blogs.fangraphs.com/top-30-prospects-new-york-mets/wondering if newly signed Latin players are off the list of possible PTBNLs. What more would the Sox know about them in June that they don't know now? What sort of intelligence could the Sox gather? Yeah I don't think anyone signed in January would be on the list. I'm not even sure those guys can be PTBNLs anyway. (I presume your thoughts were something of a non sequitur from the post you quoted, which discusses players signed in 2019 and 2018?)
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Apr 7, 2021 9:22:14 GMT -5
This trade is one that will be talked about in 5 years how it turned out bcs of the lottery pic prospects in tow. But as of looking at it as a Benny vs francy, I think ppl will be disappointed bcs francy could very well be in AAA once they give Duran a shot with the big club. We know Kiké, marwin and hunter can hit so if franchy struggles out the gate he might be looking at limited playing time. I suspect this trade will barely be remembered in 5 years unless the Mets send a guy who really pans out. Beni looks like he might be toast and what we got back (as of now) will hardly be memorable. And then Franchy goes 3/6, 2 2B (both perfect Fenway hits) in two wins over the Rays, tosses in two outstanding wall-challenging defensive plays despite just 14 previous innings in LF in Fenway, and now sports the 3rd best hitting line on the team.
Meanwhile, the other 8 starters on the Royals have a combined 175 wRC+ and Benny is 8. Not a typo.
This may not be meaningful, either.
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Post by manfred on Apr 7, 2021 9:36:22 GMT -5
I suspect this trade will barely be remembered in 5 years unless the Mets send a guy who really pans out. Beni looks like he might be toast and what we got back (as of now) will hardly be memorable. And then Franchy goes 3/6, 2 2B (both perfect Fenway hits) in two wins over the Rays, tosses in two outstanding wall-challenging defensive plays despite just 14 previous innings in LF in Fenway, and now sports the 3rd best hitting line on the team.
Meanwhile, the other 8 starters on the Royals have a combined 175 wRC+ and Benny is 8. Not a typo.
This may not be meaningful, either.
Franchy could work out, but he has also hit doubles and home runs before. I did say “suspect” — when I write anticipatory posts, I’m not issuing Papal Bulls... I’m usually playing odds. I am rarely so dogmatic as to deny other scenarios. Add: It does look like Beni might be toast, which is really tragic. Whatever went wrong there, I feel awful for him. I never thought he’d be a superstar, but I did think he could be, well, about what Verdugo was last year. A very good player.
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Post by stevedillard on Apr 7, 2021 9:53:08 GMT -5
For all the "dismantling the 2018 outfield of Benintendi/Bradley/Betts" distress,
Bradley is 1/16 with 7 Ks Benintendi is 3/18 with 1 walk and 5 ks.
(and Betts has only 1 RBI /ducks)
The volatility does suggest that not getting locked into players for a long time, like TB has done, may be the better route. Get a couple good years out of a guy, then move him.
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Post by sarasoxer on Apr 7, 2021 10:10:30 GMT -5
Waay too early on Beni demise...4 games into the season. As someone pointed out, players don't lose their athleticism at 26....unless unknown mental or physical circumstances intervene.
Were the Sox given a concrete list of players to choose from for PTBNLs or is that list dependant on Beni's performance?
As to the others 'gone missing' JBJ is streaky...so he'll come out of it. He hit in the .280s last year.... ...And Mookie is Hall of Fame material.
With Cordero's apparent uppercut, 'launch angle' swing, he looks to me a bit like a left hand hitting Chavis.......having a good sized hole with high and hard.
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Post by manfred on Apr 7, 2021 10:16:32 GMT -5
For all the "dismantling the 2018 outfield of Benintendi/Bradley/Betts" distress, Bradley is 1/16 with 7 Ks Benintendi is 3/18 with 1 walk and 5 ks. (and Betts has only 1 RBI /ducks) The volatility does suggest that not getting locked into players for a long time, like TB has done, may be the better route. Get a couple good years out of a guy, then move him. I have been pretty open about hating the Rays’ never-win-a-ring model. Looking at this team the last two days, I am shocked they were in the series last year. It doesn’t look like they’ll be back for a while. But if the Sox follow that model fully, they trade X instead of paying him, let ERod walk, and trade Devers in the next few years. Then they plug in... who? Letting Beni and JBJ go might work as practical matters — though let’s face it, letting go of guys who aren’t going to help only to replace them with Renfroe et al is not *improving* — but it doesn’t provide a rule to follow. If the Rays made money, would they still be constant sellers? Is it strategy or necessity?
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Post by stevedillard on Apr 7, 2021 10:54:24 GMT -5
I have been pretty open about hating the Rays’ never-win-a-ring model. Looking at this team the last two days, I am shocked they were in the series last year. It doesn’t look like they’ll be back for a while. But if the Sox follow that model fully, they trade X instead of paying him, let ERod walk, and trade Devers in the next few years. Then they plug in... who? Letting Beni and JBJ go might work as practical matters — though let’s face it, letting go of guys who aren’t going to help only to replace them with Renfroe et al is not *improving* — but it doesn’t provide a rule to follow. If the Rays made money, would they still be constant sellers? Is it strategy or necessity? Oh, I agree that rooting for an ever shifting group is far less pleasing than having your guys. I also agree that the TB model is not what a large market like Boston should follow. But what it shows is that one should be pretty selective about longer term commitments. I would say that Bradley and Benintendi do show how the system should work -- develop players and use them for 5 years. Right now they are replacing with fungible other guys like Renfroe/Gonzalez, but if they can get the farm back in balance, it would be youngsters ready for their 4 year run. I only cited the outfield as an example of how quickly a "core" can go stale. Betts is the exception, of course, and I think once the luxury penalties are over, and the Sox have some cheaper homegrown core ready to compete, the Sox will dole out a $300 million deal on a free agent. But first Chaim wants to get pitching rotation and Duran/Downs/Casas in place.
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ericmvan
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Post by ericmvan on Apr 7, 2021 10:56:27 GMT -5
For all the "dismantling the 2018 outfield of Benintendi/Bradley/Betts" distress, Bradley is 1/16 with 7 Ks Benintendi is 3/18 with 1 walk and 5 ks. (and Betts has only 1 RBI /ducks) The volatility does suggest that not getting locked into players for a long time, like TB has done, may be the better route. Get a couple good years out of a guy, then move him. I have been pretty open about hating the Raysâ never-win-a-ring model. Looking at this team the last two days, I am shocked they were in the series last year. It doesnât look like theyâll be back for a while. But if the Sox follow that model fully, they trade X instead of paying him, let ERod walk, and trade Devers in the next few years. Then they plug in... who? Letting Beni and JBJ go might work as practical matters â though letâs face it, letting go of guys who arenât going to help only to replace them with Renfroe et al is not *improving* â but it doesnât provide a rule to follow. If the Rays made money, would they still be constant sellers? Is it strategy or necessity? Necessity. You're describing the behavior of a team that can simply not afford to re-sign anyone to a long-term extension. That's not us.
As far as off-season decisions, the one thing that is open to real question is letting JBJ walk in order to sign both Kiké and Marwin. The three-man bench idea is a good one. Renfroe was always a best-fit for the Pillar role; only with the current roster does he become more of a regular. I've liked the Benny trade from the outset because there 's a real good chance that 3 years of Franchy is better than 2 of Benny, plus you get all the prospects.
It is, however, very much unclear that they wouldn't be better off with a straight Franchy / Renfroe, JBJ, Verdugo OF, with Kiké sharing 2B with Arroyo. Between Kiké's ability to play everywhere, Dalbec's ability to play 3B, Vazquez's ability to play 1B, 2B, and 3B in a pinch ... it's very unclear that the decrease in versatility with only 1 utility guy (plus going slightly over the tax limit, maybe) won't be offset by JBJ being substantially better than Kiké plus Renfroes' extra PA vs. RHP.
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Post by sarasoxer on Apr 7, 2021 10:56:57 GMT -5
For all the "dismantling the 2018 outfield of Benintendi/Bradley/Betts" distress, Bradley is 1/16 with 7 Ks Benintendi is 3/18 with 1 walk and 5 ks. (and Betts has only 1 RBI /ducks) The volatility does suggest that not getting locked into players for a long time, like TB has done, may be the better route. Get a couple good years out of a guy, then move him. I have been pretty open about hating the Rays’ never-win-a-ring model. Looking at this team the last two days, I am shocked they were in the series last year. It doesn’t look like they’ll be back for a while. But if the Sox follow that model fully, they trade X instead of paying him, let ERod walk, and trade Devers in the next few years. Then they plug in... who? Letting Beni and JBJ go might work as practical matters — though let’s face it, letting go of guys who aren’t going to help only to replace them with Renfroe et al is not *improving* — but it doesn’t provide a rule to follow. If the Rays made money, would they still be constant sellers? Is it strategy or necessity? I think the fear that the Sox will go all Rays is quite overblown. Bloom did what he had to do when he arrived to get a semblance of financial control and help rebuild the barren farm. Early on, he has made progress on both. The Beni situation seemed a careful assessment of talent level, money and potential return. JBJ, even if good, was how old?...and would he be a mainstay on the next championship pursuit? No question Bloom is clinical. Harsh as that can be, it's needed in today's baseball world. What a career pearl for Bloom to come to the Sox where there is finally financial largesse, not constraint. That had to be a huge inducement. His exposure to the Tampa Bay Rays way also was a shiny bauble for the Sox and what was needed. My prediction is that this was a best of both worlds amalgam that will produce a happy marriage for fandom.
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