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Post by voiceofreason on Aug 4, 2021 16:18:21 GMT -5
Are we really going to litigate this again?? MLB warned and warned and warned and nobody took them serious until they came down with the new rules. Everyone just ignored the warnings. This isn't kindergarten is it? Play by the rules just doesn't seem to resonate in America these days, it is more like do what ever the f$$k you want and deal with the fallout later. So tired of it, their are rules for a reason and one of the biggest reasons is that people will do what ever it takes to succeed, fairly or not!! The only way it could even be considered unfair was if MLB singled out Richards while allowing others to continue to use grip enhancers. They didn't. They made the decision unilaterally. For what it's worth, my two cents is that it's all between Richard's ears. He has enough movement and enough arm to win at the major league level, he just has it in his mind that he can't compete without the sticky. You pair lack of confidence with a rabid fanbase who demands performance, and contrition when you fail to perform and you get an ugly cocktail. Not saying this to advocate rampant sticky use and ignoring of rules, but I really don't think on the whole the ban has done anything other than ostracize pitchers vs. batters. There is still a ton of swing and miss in the current game which I detest. The league/players are going to have to find a way to encourage more than the 3 true outcomes or the product will continue to be stale, and only appeal to old farts like myself who grew up on it. You know what Shaggy, the man has had his moments where he wasn't that bad during this time of nonsticky stuff. He really could get beyond it but I am not confident he will soon enough for the Sox.
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shagworthy
Veteran
My neckbeard game is on point.
Posts: 1,505
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Post by shagworthy on Aug 4, 2021 16:20:41 GMT -5
The only way it could even be considered unfair was if MLB singled out Richards while allowing others to continue to use grip enhancers. They didn't. They made the decision unilaterally. For what it's worth, my two cents is that it's all between Richard's ears. He has enough movement and enough arm to win at the major league level, he just has it in his mind that he can't compete without the sticky. You pair lack of confidence with a rabid fanbase who demands performance, and contrition when you fail to perform and you get an ugly cocktail. Not saying this to advocate rampant sticky use and ignoring of rules, but I really don't think on the whole the ban has done anything other than ostracize pitchers vs. batters. There is still a ton of swing and miss in the current game which I detest. The league/players are going to have to find a way to encourage more than the 3 true outcomes or the product will continue to be stale, and only appeal to old farts like myself who grew up on it. You know what Shaggy, the man has had his moments where he wasn't that bad during this time of nonsticky stuff. He really could get beyond it but I am not confident he will soon enough for the Sox. Agreed.. I think he needs a soft landing in a market like KC or St. Louis where he doesn't have to deal with the additional pressure cooker that a Boston or New York is. Hell, if he was on the Rays this year he'd probably have 12 wins right now. Some guys just don't thrive in the brightest of lights.
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Post by voiceofreason on Aug 4, 2021 16:42:18 GMT -5
You know what Shaggy, the man has had his moments where he wasn't that bad during this time of nonsticky stuff. He really could get beyond it but I am not confident he will soon enough for the Sox. Agreed.. I think he needs a soft landing in a market like KC or St. Louis where he doesn't have to deal with the additional pressure cooker that a Boston or New York is. Hell, if he was on the Rays this year he'd probably have 12 wins right now. Some guys just don't thrive in the brightest of lights. I do believe that Boston and the pressure is not everyones cup of tea.
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ericmvan
Veteran
Supposed to be working on something more important
Posts: 8,931
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Post by ericmvan on Aug 4, 2021 18:06:18 GMT -5
In terms of explanations, folks are over-reacting to a small sample here. Three starts ago he was pitching his best game of the season until his last few hitters.
His stuff still plays. It's just command, command, command. You don't need a psychological explanation to explain command coming and going--it's universal. He just needs more of the former.
And he's soon going to be 7th on the depth chart, anyway.
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Post by tyler3 on Aug 4, 2021 21:40:17 GMT -5
Worth a shot right?
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Post by Underwater Johnson on Aug 4, 2021 22:11:58 GMT -5
Don't nobody sleep on my boy Connor, yo. If he does that a couple more times, he could at the very least be another candidate to reprise the Whitlock role. Come playoff time (in the 21st century), it's all about covering innings. If you've got a Whitlock, a Seabold, a Houck, all throwing 2-3 IP every 3 days... with a 4-man playoff rotation, now you're shortening almost every game and only need one or two of your starters to go more than 5 IP and these kids get you to the 8th or 9th.
I tell ya, it all looks a lot better after a W...
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Post by bosoxnation on Aug 5, 2021 3:03:59 GMT -5
Don't nobody sleep on my boy Connor, yo. If he does that a couple more times, he could at the very least be another candidate to reprise the Whitlock role. Come playoff time (in the 21st century), it's all about covering innings. If you've got a Whitlock, a Seabold, a Houck, all throwing 2-3 IP every 3 days... with a 4-man playoff rotation, now you're shortening almost every game and only need one or two of your starters to go more than 5 IP and these kids get you to the 8th or 9th.
I tell ya, it all looks a lot better after a W...
Somebody’s getting carried away 😂
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Post by blizzards39 on Aug 5, 2021 14:53:11 GMT -5
I can’t watch anymore games Perez starts.
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Post by brendan98 on Aug 5, 2021 14:56:08 GMT -5
A couple more outings like that from Seabold and I'd be OK with the Sox giving him a look.
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Post by gregblossersbelly on Aug 5, 2021 17:41:09 GMT -5
A couple more outings like that from Seabold and I'd be OK with the Sox giving him a look. Let him get 5 more August starts. If he’s dealing, maybe Hauck to pen. I have Sale and Hauck replacing Perez and Richards.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 6, 2021 16:49:41 GMT -5
Cora announced Perez to the bullpen, insinuating that Houck is taking his spot.
Figure that Sale gets Richards' rotation spot as well.
Countermoves will be interesting.
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Post by Jason on Aug 6, 2021 17:17:49 GMT -5
Countermoves will be interesting.
I'm guessing they'll just take the easy route and option Rios and Davis to move Richards and Perez to the pen.
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Post by soxinsf on Aug 6, 2021 18:10:29 GMT -5
Cora announced Perez to the bullpen, insinuating that Houck is taking his spot. Figure that Sale gets Richards' rotation spot as well. Countermoves will be interesting. It would be easy to say *it is about time*, but I am happy simply to say that it makes sense for now and the future. Seabold is a different kettle of fish however. One start is just a teaser. He will need to pitch quality ball to get more than a token call up in September. Ort and Adames are interesting but are not on the 40 man roster. Their paths to a Sept call up look more complicated unless the Sox simply give up on someone like Perez, Davis or Robles.
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Post by Guidas on Aug 7, 2021 12:05:25 GMT -5
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Post by ematz1423 on Aug 7, 2021 12:12:46 GMT -5
So he's going to be arguably the best pitcher in the league when he's in his prime not bad haha. In reality though he's definitely going to be a key piece of the pitching staff going forward at least in my opinion. Hopefully as a starter but even as a multi inning reliever the way baseball is slanting these days that could arguably be just as important.
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Post by jmei on Aug 7, 2021 12:14:26 GMT -5
The velo bump from Houck across all his pitches has been very impressive. Certainly improves his ceiling.
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Post by Guidas on Aug 7, 2021 12:32:35 GMT -5
The velo bump from Houck across all his pitches has been very impressive. Certainly improves his ceiling. What they said about reaction time - I've read it gets almost exponential from the batter's perspective with every increase in MPH over 92. That it increases the disparity between the MPH of the slider coming out of the exact same arm slot doesn't stink, either.
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Post by Guidas on Aug 7, 2021 12:36:48 GMT -5
So he's going to be arguably the best pitcher in the league when he's in his prime not bad haha. In reality though he's definitely going to be a key piece of the pitching staff going forward at least in my opinion. Hopefully as a starter but even as a multi inning reliever the way baseball is slanting these days that could arguably be just as important. What will be interesting is to see how they handle him and Whitlock next year. Neither has pitched more than 70 innings in a season, yet both should be starters. Piggy backs for both of them might be the best strategy. Sadly, by the time both of them get up to 160 or so innings (if we are adding 15-20 each year), Sale will be likely be gone (opt out after 2022) or in his final year.
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Post by Canseco on Aug 7, 2021 12:54:19 GMT -5
Do you think Cora and/or Bloom will treat Richards’ contract the same way Lou Brown does Roger Dorn’s in “Major League”?
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 7, 2021 13:54:31 GMT -5
It seems obvious to me, if that Sale guy doesn't learn a third pitch, he's never going to be a top of the rotation guy. 5th starter at best.
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Post by jimed14 on Aug 7, 2021 14:29:21 GMT -5
This is nuts: There's just no preparing for that as a batter. It's basically a pitch that they have never faced before.
I wish that article would have showed the video when Brett Gardner swung at a slider that hit him.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 7, 2021 16:32:52 GMT -5
This is nuts: There's just no preparing for that as a batter. It's basically a pitch that they have never faced before. I wish that article would have showed the video when Brett Gardner swung at a slider that hit him. That's pretty much what eric said a year ago. And the stuff about release points, what Pitching Ninja said a year ago.
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Post by orion09 on Aug 7, 2021 18:12:49 GMT -5
It seems obvious to me, if that Sale guy doesn't learn a third pitch, he's never going to be a top of the rotation guy. 5th starter at best. Well, he does have a third pitch... around the time we traded for him, there was debate as to whether his slider or changeup was the better offspeed pitch. His changeup is supposed to be at least above-average, maybe plus, though it seems to me he hasn’t thrown it as much in the last few years
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Post by blizzards39 on Aug 7, 2021 18:26:58 GMT -5
Well if there is a positive right now it’s that Pivetta Houck Sale all look good today. We just have to get hitting.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Aug 8, 2021 10:04:05 GMT -5
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