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Post by umassgrad2005 on Oct 1, 2023 17:50:48 GMT -5
Zappe just has better pocket movement skills to be able to throw in pocket with a crap OL and pocket awareness than Mac Jones. Jones is much better with a clean pocket, which he basically never gets.
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rasimon
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Post by rasimon on Oct 1, 2023 17:51:55 GMT -5
The Patriots season is going to be a lot worse than the red Sox season. 5-12 perhaps? Before the season, I predicted 7-10 and I'm sticking with that. I had 6 should-be losses (today being one of those), 5 should-be wins, and 6 maybes. The crappiness of the OL makes it tempting to decrease that predicted win total, but I had the two Jets games in the maybe column and that was before Aaron Rogers went down. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Oct 1, 2023 18:10:21 GMT -5
The Patriots season is going to be a lot worse than the red Sox season. 5-12 perhaps? Before the season, I predicted 7-10 and I'm sticking with that. I had 6 should-be losses (today being one of those), 5 should-be wins, and 6 maybes. The crappiness of the OL makes it tempting to decrease that predicted win total, but I had the two Jets games in the maybe column and that was before Aaron Rogers went down. Well let’s see what the Judon and Gonzalez injuries are because if those 2 are out this defense falls off a cliff quickly. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Oct 1, 2023 18:11:25 GMT -5
Zappe just has better pocket movement skills to be able to throw in pocket with a crap OL and pocket awareness than Mac Jones. Jones is much better with a clean pocket, which he basically never gets. I mean let’s not judge Zappe when he’s playing against a defense in a blowout. |
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Oct 1, 2023 18:21:36 GMT -5
Zappe just has better pocket movement skills to be able to throw in pocket with a crap OL and pocket awareness than Mac Jones. Jones is much better with a clean pocket, which he basically never gets. I mean let’s not judge Zappe when he’s playing against a defense in a blowout. 4-9 ain’t awe-inspiring either An embarrassing effort today. Mac’s worst game of his career imo. Looks like we will have to look at QB’s in the draft. Need an OL tho |
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Oct 1, 2023 19:14:27 GMT -5
Bill once again being a complete ass post-game for no reason. The shtick doesn't work when you're a loser coach, because that's what he is without Brady.
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Oct 1, 2023 19:16:40 GMT -5
If they lose next week it wouldn’t shock me if the seat started getting toasty
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Oct 1, 2023 19:46:05 GMT -5
If they lose next week it wouldn’t shock me if the seat started getting toasty I think the seat is starting to get toasty. A loss to either the Saints or Raiders I think gets the ball rolling. |
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Post by soxfansince67 on Oct 1, 2023 21:26:24 GMT -5
last place Red Sox. last place Patriots? Going to be up to the Bs and the Cs.
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Post by marrcus on Oct 1, 2023 21:56:11 GMT -5
They always had a chance to be mediocre, but Pats had to stay healthy and not do anything stupid (like the Airport incident). Now they have had key inj's (Judon) and their secondary without the Jones boys and Gonzales scares nobody.
Eventually Bill is going to have to get Kraft's ok on moving Mac for a pick. He can be decent in a perfect situation but it's not going to be that for a long time -here- the talent level just isn't that high. My guess is Judon requires a long rehab and at best, bottom-third finish looks certain.
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Post by rjp313jr on Oct 2, 2023 5:48:43 GMT -5
If they lose next week it wouldn’t shock me if the seat started getting toasty I think the seat is starting to get toasty. A loss to either the Saints or Raiders I think gets the ball rolling. There will be a ton of outside pressure but I’m not a fan of moving on from him at all. |
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Oct 2, 2023 7:52:25 GMT -5
I think the seat is starting to get toasty. A loss to either the Saints or Raiders I think gets the ball rolling. There will be a ton of outside pressure but I’m not a fan of moving on from him at all. I think the problems started more thanthe last 4 years. I remember not caring about Brady leaving all that much because he looked like he was becoming old. Then he goes and have an MVP season with Tampa. At the time I just couldn't believe there was no succession plan, which they ended up getting 2 years after Brady left because Mac just happened to fall to them. I'd hate to think where this team would be if someone had traded up or grabbed him and I'm not a Mac guy. I think he's too good of a coach to tank and too bad of a GM to rebuild a winner. |
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Post by rjp313jr on Oct 2, 2023 8:03:27 GMT -5
There will be a ton of outside pressure but I’m not a fan of moving on from him at all. I think the problems started more thanthe last 4 years. I remember not caring about Brady leaving all that much because he looked like he was becoming old. Then he goes and have an MVP season with Tampa. At the time I just couldn't believe there was no succession plan, which they ended up getting 2 years after Brady left because Mac just happened to fall to them. I'd hate to think where this team would be if someone had traded up or grabbed him and I'm not a Mac guy. I think he's too good of a coach to tank and too bad of a GM to rebuild a winner. Guy built 6 SB teams, saying he’s too bad a GM to rebuild a winner is…. Something |
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Oct 2, 2023 8:20:36 GMT -5
I think the problems started more thanthe last 4 years. I remember not caring about Brady leaving all that much because he looked like he was becoming old. Then he goes and have an MVP season with Tampa. At the time I just couldn't believe there was no succession plan, which they ended up getting 2 years after Brady left because Mac just happened to fall to them. I'd hate to think where this team would be if someone had traded up or grabbed him and I'm not a Mac guy. I think he's too good of a coach to tank and too bad of a GM to rebuild a winner. Guy built 6 SB teams, saying he’s too bad a GM to rebuild a winner is…. Something I think he’s failing to adapt without Brady, there is zero high end talent on offense and that’s been the case for years. Couple that with the team playing dumb, undisciplined football the last few years and I think he’s losing his touch. Nolan Ryan wouldn’t throw 100 if you put him on the mound today. That doesn’t change his greatness. Same thing applies to Belichick. Father Time is undefeated. He’s still the best coach of all time. But everybody has a shelf life, him included |
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Oct 2, 2023 8:37:38 GMT -5
I think the problems started more thanthe last 4 years. I remember not caring about Brady leaving all that much because he looked like he was becoming old. Then he goes and have an MVP season with Tampa. At the time I just couldn't believe there was no succession plan, which they ended up getting 2 years after Brady left because Mac just happened to fall to them. I'd hate to think where this team would be if someone had traded up or grabbed him and I'm not a Mac guy. I think he's too good of a coach to tank and too bad of a GM to rebuild a winner. Guy built 6 SB teams, saying he’s too bad a GM to rebuild a winner is…. Something With the greatest QB of all-time. I'm not saying Bill was always bad though. He made some elite defenses, but over the last 4 years he's 7-9 10-7 -- made the playoffs only to get historically blown out in the first round 8-9 1-3 I don't think this season is going to get better and if Mac isn't the guy (which is more likely the case every day) his losing record is going to continue to climb. Judon is the only real talent on this team with hopes that maybe Christian Gonzalez and Jack Jones can reach that level. Maybe even Pop Douglas too. The OL is a complete disaster. Bill thought it was a good idea last year to put a defensive coach as the OC. He went over his scouts to take N'Keal instead of Deebo Samuel. He's very bad these past 5 years. Brady left because the team didn't want to pay him. We got a year of Cam Newton because of that. I don't think team building is in his Wheelhouse anymore. Just like Danny Ainge. At one point I thought Ainge was untouchable, but then he became stagnant and terrified to make big moves. |
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Post by kwodes on Oct 2, 2023 9:08:33 GMT -5
Guy built 6 SB teams, saying he’s too bad a GM to rebuild a winner is…. Something With the greatest QB of all-time. I'm not saying Bill was always bad though. He made some elite defenses, but over the last 4 years he's 7-9 10-7 -- made the playoffs only to get historically blown out in the first round 8-9 1-3 I don't think this season is going to get better and if Mac isn't the guy (which is more likely the case every day) his losing record is going to continue to climb. Judon is the only real talent on this team with hopes that maybe Christian Gonzalez and Jack Jones can reach that level. Maybe even Pop Douglas too. The OL is a complete disaster. Bill thought it was a good idea last year to put a defensive coach as the OC. He went over his scouts to take N'Keal instead of Deebo Samuel. He's very bad these past 5 years. Brady left because the team didn't want to pay him. We got a year of Cam Newton because of that. I don't think team building is in his Wheelhouse anymore. Just like Danny Ainge. At one point I thought Ainge was untouchable, but then he became stagnant and terrified to make big moves. bill as a coach is the best there has ever been. In my opinion, the quality of your head coach sets the floor of the team while the QB and talent sets the ceiling. Over the last 3 years, many of those teams had no business being anywhere near 500. Now they obviously need a lot of talent added to the offense, it doesn't seem like Mac is the answer. |
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Oct 2, 2023 9:10:29 GMT -5
With the greatest QB of all-time. I'm not saying Bill was always bad though. He made some elite defenses, but over the last 4 years he's 7-9 10-7 -- made the playoffs only to get historically blown out in the first round 8-9 1-3 I don't think this season is going to get better and if Mac isn't the guy (which is more likely the case every day) his losing record is going to continue to climb. Judon is the only real talent on this team with hopes that maybe Christian Gonzalez and Jack Jones can reach that level. Maybe even Pop Douglas too. The OL is a complete disaster. Bill thought it was a good idea last year to put a defensive coach as the OC. He went over his scouts to take N'Keal instead of Deebo Samuel. He's very bad these past 5 years. Brady left because the team didn't want to pay him. We got a year of Cam Newton because of that. I don't think team building is in his Wheelhouse anymore. Just like Danny Ainge. At one point I thought Ainge was untouchable, but then he became stagnant and terrified to make big moves. bill as a coach is the best there has ever been. In my opinion, the quality of your head coach sets the floor of the team while the QB and talent sets the ceiling. Over the last 3 years, many of those teams had no business being anywhere near 500. Now they obviously need a lot of talent added to the offense, it doesn't seem like Mac is the answer. Bill the coach I don't really question. I just think the GM is holding back the coach and right now it's a bad fit because they won't be terrible enough to reload, but lacking in too many places to be a playoff team. |
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Post by kwodes on Oct 2, 2023 9:16:17 GMT -5
bill as a coach is the best there has ever been. In my opinion, the quality of your head coach sets the floor of the team while the QB and talent sets the ceiling. Over the last 3 years, many of those teams had no business being anywhere near 500. Now they obviously need a lot of talent added to the offense, it doesn't seem like Mac is the answer. Bill the coach I don't really question. I just think the GM is holding back the coach and right now it's a bad fit because they won't be terrible enough to reload, but lacking in too many places to be a playoff team. yea, this would be the year to be awful. Move on from Mac and draft Caleb. |
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Oct 2, 2023 9:41:51 GMT -5
Just because I have a growing annoyance with JuJu that I'm launching my one man crusade against and won't drop.
Meyers against the Steelers and the Broncos in those singular games this season has more yards than JuJu has cumulatively in 2023.
(Wasn't a banner week for him this week. Still slightly better though).
I just really need this guy to have one week where he just goes off. I'm trying to will it into existence with this negativity.
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Post by rjp313jr on Oct 2, 2023 10:27:52 GMT -5
They depleted their talent and assets in the final Brady years. It’s almost impossible to build super-bowl teams without a HOF QB, so spare me the “with Brady argument”.
Nick Folk run is the exception and maybe Russell Wilson but he was on his rookie deal and managed the stacked team well.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Oct 2, 2023 10:50:41 GMT -5
Zappe just has better pocket movement skills to be able to throw in pocket with a crap OL and pocket awareness than Mac Jones. Jones is much better with a clean pocket, which he basically never gets. I mean let’s not judge Zappe when he’s playing against a defense in a blowout. Why? That D kept its starters in and if anything that's a bad situation for Zappe, not a good one. Just that basic step up in pocket to get the ball to Parker. I don't think I've seen Jones do that all year! Same crap we saw last year and its why he outplayed him at points. If you could combine Jones and Zappe you'd have a good QB. Zappe is used to handling crap OL, Mac Jones is still adjusting. It was pointed out during the game when instead of moving a little bit inside pocket he bails and two TDs for defense. It was also pointed out he left many plays on field, throwing balls late because of his lack of pocket moving skills. He can't do it, keeping eyes down field and being ready to throw. Zappe can do that crap, Jones has the better arm talent. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Oct 2, 2023 10:59:18 GMT -5
Bill did this crap for years with Brady, but with Brady our down years were still rather good. You can't build elite teams year after year. That being said, you can blame Bill for our crap OL, which killed you last year and is killing you again this year. To even really tell how good Mac Jones is, he needs a very good OL and a strong running attack, he hasn't had either for two straight years.
Frankly it's why going up to the draft I was interested in mobile QBs, which makes things much easier and not guys like Cunningham either, he's a project. Players who can pass and run.
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Post by costpet on Oct 2, 2023 11:07:39 GMT -5
Just read that Russ Francis was killed in a plane crash. He was an all pro and a great TE for us in the 1970’s. RIP
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Post by redsoxfan2 on Oct 2, 2023 11:45:57 GMT -5
They depleted their talent and assets in the final Brady years. It’s almost impossible to build super-bowl teams without a HOF QB, so spare me the “with Brady argument”. Nick Folk run is the exception and maybe Russell Wilson but he was on his rookie deal and managed the stacked team well. I still believe Bill was instrumental in those 6 rings on 9 appearances. With that said, he's a sub-.500 coach without Brady. We're onto year 4 post-Brady and are trending in the wrong direction. This team was better 2 years ago than today. He depleted assets on mistakes. You don't need a HoF QB to have a winning record and get into the playoffs. I don't think anyone is asking for a Superbowl. They're asking that this team be able to win 10 games a year and occasionally win games against better competition or be able to win a game they're initially down. The record against playoff contenders or games they trail is horrific. The coaching also looks like it took a step back with the sloppiness in which they've been playing, but again, I still belive in Bill the coach. The Chiefs, Bills twice, and Miami in Miami I have as automatic losses. That gets them to 7 losses so they need to win every coin flip game this year to be respectable. I will credit Bill this year for coming in with a strong defense, but with season ending injuries to Marcus Jones and Matthew Judon and Jack Jones very likely dealing with a real hamstring injury and has already missed significant time as well as the unknown of Christan Gonzalez and Jonathan Jones just made it a whole lot softer. The offense hasn't shown really anything promising. The Eagles defense was suppose to be elite, but so far this season they've given up the following points (not sure how much is the result of a turnover) 20 @ NE 28 home vs Vikings 11 @ Tampa 31 home vs Commanders It was another bad offseason for Bill. He should have signed Hopkins. He should have signed Meyers. He should have drafted a LT. He should never have reached on Cole Strange. I don't think any of those statements are groundbreaking. Making these changes likely put them at 2-2 and in more confident in beating up the other mediocre teams in the league like the Saints and Raiders despite the injuries on defense. |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on Oct 2, 2023 14:27:42 GMT -5
Bills biggest recent mistake was literally not resigning Kerras, you then go best player available instead of Strange, many better players there. Followed up by not taking guys like Pickens and my binkie Doubs in 2nd round. Then going after the OT and OL depth we needed later in draft. There were many pieces that would have helped us and many that guys on this board talked about, instead he only took one in the 7th round, while taking two RBs and another QB.
You don't leave massive holes heading into the draft that force you to reach for players.
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