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Post by keninten on Dec 3, 2023 23:40:07 GMT -5
I don't see why the Sox can't sign both Montgomery and Yamamoto. The Sox should be willing to go a good distance over the tax limit. They need two topflight starters. Montgomery might kind of fall into their laps considering his wife's work situation, but if the Sox said, we have Montgomery so we don't need to go all out to sign Yamamoto, then shame on them. If they'd rather trade away some of their top prospects to get a top starter, that wouldn't make sense. Hell even if they signed both Yamamoto and Montgomery, if a reasonable trade fell into their laps the Sox should go for it. If they could get Burnes for Crawford, Houck, and a prospect not in the top 5, they should consider it, and make it 3 starters added. Not that it's very likely at all, but could you imagine a rotation of Yamamoto, Burnes, and Montgomery along with Bello and Sale and Pivetta for when Sale breaks down? Anyways, the main reason for my post here is the realization that eventually Breslow whether it's this winter or next will have some decisions to make regarding the composition of the lineup. As it stands now, Devers and Casas are their two main guys. They're locked into Yoshida. Duran and Verdugo are there for now along with Abreu. It's highly unlikely they could try Valdez at 2b if he could get his defense up to mediocre. And they have Mayer, Anthony, and Teel rapidly ascending toward the majors in 2025 potentially. So say an unlikely scenario occurs and the Sox trade away Yorke and Valdez winds up at 2b as Story gets hurt or declines precipitously. Teel takes over behind the plate. Mayer takes over SS, Anthony takes over RF, and Duran somehow sticks around in CF with Yoshida is the DH and apparently in this silly scenario Rafaela was the one dealt, not Duran. So it's Dec 2024, Soto has finished up his season as a Blue Jay and is now a free agent and the suddenly spend willing Sox descend upon Soto and sign him to a huge deal to guard the Monster for the next decade. So the Sox have an outfield of Soto/Duran/Anthony, and infield of Casas/Valdez/Mayer/Devers and Teel behind the plate. Congrats the Sox. They now have an all lefthanded lineup!! Yes, this has been a silly exercise in extremes but it goes to illustrate how lefty they are and how that might preclude them from trying to land Soto next year. I mean, how could you not want Soto if he becomes a free agent? And a trade to Toronto would likely make that a reality, which would leave the Yankees salivating (and the Mets and the Dodgers, etc) given that the Yankees didn't want to deal away anybody. In reality either Yorke or Story by 2025, probably winds up at 2b and Rafaela, if he can hit enough, probably lands in CF, so that's two RH hitters, neither of whom are hitters you'd want to stuff in the middle of the order to separate Devers from Casas, so eventually there's probably some scenarios where Breslow will be doing some trading just to balance the composition of the lineup out. This year he probably brings back Turner (I'd prefer JD Martinez), and potentially Duval. None of Hernandez or Gurriel or anybody really excites. Maybe there's a premier RH hitter next offseason to be had? Hard to imagine they'd have the impact of Soto and I'd hate to think the Sox cannot make a legit run at Soto if he were available just because they lean too lefty heavy already, but that's one of the things Breslow will probably be looking at. Houck and Crawford are decent trade chips but what about Whitlock? Just because of his injury history I`d rather trade him.
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Post by soxheater5 on Dec 4, 2023 9:25:32 GMT -5
If the Sox bring in two starters Whitlock certainly looks like the guy who should be left out.
Signing #1 Signing #2 Bello Sale Kutter/Houck
Walter Murphy Wikelman/Mata Bernardino Winckowski Pivetta Schreiber Martin Kenley
Plenty of options and depth without Whitlock. Given Houck/Whit/Kutter are all righties I'd guess whitlock is out with some of Breslow's comments.
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Post by 0ap0 on Dec 4, 2023 9:53:32 GMT -5
Houck and Crawford are decent trade chips but what about Whitlock? Just because of his injury history I`d rather trade him. That's also why you're not going to get (as) much for him.
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Post by James Dunne on Dec 4, 2023 10:58:52 GMT -5
Doesn't seem sensible at all to sell low on Whitlock. He's not making big money, and I certainly don't see trouble finding innings for him.
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Post by scottysmalls on Dec 4, 2023 13:07:03 GMT -5
Any winter meetings predictions? Last year we signed Jansen and Yoshida (and Martin immediately before). I'll predict that we make a bigger total cash guarantee to one player during these meetings than we did to those three collectively last year and that we make one MLB level trade.
If I were to get into specifics the most likely candidates for each of those seem to be Montgomery and Verdugo respectively.
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Post by ematz1423 on Dec 4, 2023 13:10:24 GMT -5
Any winter meetings predictions? Last year we signed Jansen and Yoshida (and Martin immediately before). I'll predict that we make a bigger total cash guarantee to one player during these meetings than we did to those three collectively last year and that we make one MLB level trade. If I were to get into specifics the most likely candidates for each of those seem to be Montgomery and Verdugo respectively. I'm with you on Montgomery, I think they get him signed in the next couple days and I'll also predict they make a trade for a 2nd baseman and maybe they make one more signing of a guy like Bader. At least I sure hope something kicks off in the next couple days for the Sox. We can be pretty assured that there will at least be some big MLB news in the next few days either way, gotta love the winter meetings hot stove.
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Post by julyanmorley on Dec 4, 2023 13:15:24 GMT -5
Any winter meetings predictions? Last year we signed Jansen and Yoshida (and Martin immediately before). I'll predict that we make a bigger total cash guarantee to one player during these meetings than we did to those three collectively last year and that we make one MLB level trade. If I were to get into specifics the most likely candidates for each of those seem to be Montgomery and Verdugo respectively. Montgomery + Imanaga + low stakes trade for a righty MI that can play SS like Kyle Farmer + Verdugo traded for our new #11 ranked prospect
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Post by asm19 on Dec 4, 2023 15:29:57 GMT -5
As noted in the MLB 2024 draft thread, the lottery is tomorrow (Tuesday). It's obviously a new thing (introduced two years ago at this point?). Does the draft lottery have any impact on the timing of trades? I would assume it has almost no impact whatsoever - but if you're like the Red Sox or Yankees, in theory you might change your approach of what assets to trade this winter if you go from a mid 1st round pick to all of a sudden winning getting the 1% luck needed to getting pick #1?
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Post by rico6 on Dec 4, 2023 16:07:36 GMT -5
Hopefully, the improvement to the roster will be significant. While true that the current roster has to be better, there needs to be some significant additions and not just players they think they can fix or find some magical pitch they need to feature more. I feel like Cora has said the players have to be better all of last season.
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Dec 4, 2023 18:54:17 GMT -5
Cora is a genius. His players didn’t play up to his expectations or ours. Who knew??
Had he not mentioned that Sale, Storey, Houck, Whitlock and others were recovering from injuries he would have been a last place finger pointing manager. Not good form. That Bello, Casas, Yoshida, Duran, Wong, Valdez and others were in hybrid rookie/sophomore seasons needed mention. Of course they will play better. And frequently humiliated tough love guy was a top RF gold glove guy, playing injured, with periods of winning AB’s. He will be happy to leave. IMO most of us would. And his use and abuse of young SP’s and RP’s remains a mystery.
I simply can’t understand why Cora is still considered: 1. A players’ manager. 2. A winning manager. 3. Capable of maximizing the newly launched pitching program. 4. A key figure in determining the future of this team.
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Post by grandsalami on Dec 4, 2023 18:56:36 GMT -5
Cora is a genius. His players didn’t play up to his expectations or ours. Who knew?? Had he not mentioned that Sale, Storey, Houck, Whitlock and others were recovering from injuries he would have been a last place finger pointing manager. Not good form. That Bello, Casas, Yoshida, Duran, Wong, Valdez and others were in hybrid rookie/sophomore seasons needed mention. Of course they will play better. And frequently humiliated tough love guy was a top RF gold glove guy, playing injured, with periods of winning AB’s. He will be happy to leave. IMO most of us would. And his use and abuse of young SP’s and RP’s remains a mystery. I simply can’t understand why Cora is still considered: 1. A players’ manager. 2. A winning manager. 3. Capable of maximizing the newly launched pitching program. 4. A key figure in determining the future of this team. Jesus man, that benign quote from Cora really set you off?
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gerry
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Post by gerry on Dec 4, 2023 19:00:39 GMT -5
The benign quote hit me more as part of a pattern of his thinking and actions. Not a healthy pattern imo
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Post by thegoodthebadthesox on Dec 4, 2023 19:11:05 GMT -5
The benign quote hit me more as part of a pattern of his thinking and actions. Not a healthy pattern imo Or it’s a totally boilerplate manager quote and you’re blowing it out of proportions (I have my vote).
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Post by bellhorndingers21 on Dec 5, 2023 8:55:12 GMT -5
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Dec 5, 2023 8:57:12 GMT -5
A -1.2 fWAR trash can. We’re saved!
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Post by scottysmalls on Dec 5, 2023 8:58:14 GMT -5
for a coaching job not a playing one I hope
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Post by pappyman99 on Dec 5, 2023 9:00:41 GMT -5
for a coaching job not a playing one I hope At the very least a case study on how much catchers can actually impact pitchers This off-season is at a snails pace
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Post by asm19 on Dec 5, 2023 9:34:29 GMT -5
You know for all the feelings projected by the team that they're happy with going into next year with Wong/McGuire as the catching tandem, the team is projected for 3rd to last in WAR for catchers ahead of only the White Sox and Rockies: www.fangraphs.com/depthcharts.aspx?position=TeamBy xwOBA for 2023, you had: Connor Wong - .274 Martin Maldonado - .267 Reese McGuire - .242 I think in a vacuum a 37 year old catcher who had a negative WAR last year would be an ugly move... But if 1) they feel Kyle Teel isn't that far away, 2) they don't see that much of a drop-off between Martin and what they have (or in the case of handling a pitching staff, maybe an improvement?), and/or 3) they think they can get something good for Wong in a trade, I can kinda see it?
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Dec 5, 2023 10:55:49 GMT -5
Maldonado seems to have a ton of interest, says a lot about what teams think about him as a receiver and locker room leader
Im fine with the Mirabellian approach from a backup catcher. If they like him more than McGuire fine I guess.
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Post by bellhorndingers21 on Dec 5, 2023 10:58:08 GMT -5
Maldonado seems to have a ton of interest, says a lot about what teams think about him as a receiver and locker room leader Im fine with the Mirabellian approach from a backup catcher. If they like him more than McGuire fine I guess. Martin's going deep tonight!
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Post by James Dunne on Dec 5, 2023 11:07:07 GMT -5
A -1.2 fWAR trash can. We’re saved! Maldonado's basically replacement level at this point, but that feels like another great example of the way Fangraphs wildly, extravagantly overvalues pitch framing in its WAR calculations. It's quite simply broken.
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Post by rico6 on Dec 5, 2023 18:32:31 GMT -5
Looks like the 2B will be via trade and FA.
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Post by scottysmalls on Dec 5, 2023 18:58:06 GMT -5
Breslow and Cora both speaking really highly of Dalbec today, sounding like he is likely to have a roster spot
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jimoh
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Post by jimoh on Dec 5, 2023 19:25:43 GMT -5
Breslow and Cora both speaking really highly of Dalbec today, sounding like he is likely to have a roster spot Dalbec has an option so it’s hard to believe he won’t be in AAA as insurance. Unless he’s traded.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Dec 5, 2023 20:40:02 GMT -5
He gives the Sox a right-handed option at the corners and at DH. Maybe some of the spaghetti will stick.
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