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Celtics 2023-24 Season Thread
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Post by Don Caballero on May 23, 2024 21:42:31 GMT -5
player performances are volatile from half to half and game to game. A 30 ppg scorer isn’t going to score 15 points every single half. That’s why it’s generally good to look at somebody’s averages for the year or at least the playoffs instead of picking apart a small segment of subpar basketball. Seems crazy I know, but it does lead you to conclusions that are not idiotic. I thought Tatum was bad because he played shit defense, the offense comes and goes but Tatum is a fantastic defender. When he’s not having any impact on that end, you know he’s having a bad game. He was fantastic in the second half. I see some potential for him as a small ball 5 against the Pacers.
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Post by rjp313jr on May 23, 2024 21:42:52 GMT -5
Wow Brissett was quietly +18? Hopefully we see more of him and less Hauser. ![](https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20240524/539aa2338eb70db1e3cbe127a8fdffce.jpg)
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Post by Don Caballero on May 23, 2024 21:44:27 GMT -5
Don't know what Carlisle was thinking, no Siakam and starters, waving the white flag with 4 plus minutes left and a 13-point deficit? I don't get it. Cutting his losses with Haliburton out I suppose Got to keep his guys fresh for Cancun!
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Post by rjp313jr on May 23, 2024 21:47:12 GMT -5
It is Haliburton’s hamstring… rough for him, that’s a tough one.
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Post by philarhody on May 23, 2024 21:53:30 GMT -5
Can we just all come to grips with the fact that:
1. Jayson Tatum is not Michael Jordan.
2. Jayson Tatum is really great at basketball.
It’s ok if people complain or are frustrated that he isn’t Kobe or Michael. He was scoring in the mid 20’s with elite shooting percentages before he could buy a beer, so I for one am still wondering if there’s another gear there as an offensive hub.
With that said, if there is not another gear, no one is saying he isn’t a top ten player in the sport. He has no major holes in his game, he’s basically never hurt, and seems to care more about winning than anything else. I think if he wins a championship, maybe he relaxes a little and the shooting returns to an elite level and he becomes one of the three greatest forwards ever.
Until then, fans and media alike will be frustrated when the offense stalls out through his isolations, especially with a plethora of creation around him.
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Post by bg23 on May 23, 2024 21:55:06 GMT -5
What a difference maker Jrue has been so far this playoffs. Absolutely elite on both ends and gives the team exactly what they need.
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 14,637
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Post by cdj on May 23, 2024 21:55:51 GMT -5
What a difference maker Jrue has been so far this playoffs. Absolutely elite on both ends and gives the team exactly what they need. I was about to say Haliburton has been the 3rd best PG in this series behind Jrue and Derrick in that order
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Post by philarhody on May 23, 2024 21:56:10 GMT -5
player performances are volatile from half to half and game to game. A 30 ppg scorer isn’t going to score 15 points every single half. That’s why it’s generally good to look at somebody’s averages for the year or at least the playoffs instead of picking apart a small segment of subpar basketball. Seems crazy I know, but it does lead you to conclusions that are not idiotic. I thought Tatum was bad because he played shit defense, the offense comes and goes but Tatum is a fantastic defender. When he’s not having any impact on that end, you know he’s having a bad game. He was fantastic in the second half. I see some potential for him as a small ball 5 against the Pacers. I feel like Tatum as a small ball 5 would really open up the Celtics offense and destroy Indiana’s constant actions as Boston switches everything. Even with Halliburton, Indiana doesn’t really create in isolation.
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 14,637
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Post by cdj on May 23, 2024 21:56:43 GMT -5
Can we just all come to grips with the fact that: 1. Jayson Tatum is not Michael Jordan. 2. Jayson Tatum is really great at basketball. It’s ok if people complain or are frustrated that he isn’t Kobe or Michael. He was scoring in the mid 20’s with elite shooting percentages before he could buy a beer, so I for one am still wondering if there’s another gear there as an offensive hub. With that said, if there is not another gear, no one is saying he isn’t a top ten player in the sport. He has no major holes in his game, he’s basically never hurt, and seems to care more about winning than anything else. I think if he wins a championship, maybe he relaxes a little and the shooting returns to an elite level and he becomes one of the three greatest forwards ever. Until then, fans and media alike will be frustrated when the offense stalls out through his isolations, especially with a plethora of creation around him. People are absolutely saying he’s not top 10 in the sport, somebody like 20 min ago said he’s not a superstar lmao
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Post by redsoxfan2 on May 23, 2024 21:58:46 GMT -5
Can we just all come to grips with the fact that: 1. Jayson Tatum is not Michael Jordan. 2. Jayson Tatum is really great at basketball. It’s ok if people complain or are frustrated that he isn’t Kobe or Michael. He was scoring in the mid 20’s with elite shooting percentages before he could buy a beer, so I for one am still wondering if there’s another gear there as an offensive hub. With that said, if there is not another gear, no one is saying he isn’t a top ten player in the sport. He has no major holes in his game, he’s basically never hurt, and seems to care more about winning than anything else. I think if he wins a championship, maybe he relaxes a little and the shooting returns to an elite level and he becomes one of the three greatest forwards ever. Until then, fans and media alike will be frustrated when the offense stalls out through his isolations, especially with a plethora of creation around him. People are absolutely saying he’s not top 10 in the sport, somebody like 20 min ago said he’s not a superstar lmao Maybe we differ on what a super star is. My impression is a top 10 player.
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Post by philarhody on May 23, 2024 22:00:36 GMT -5
Can we just all come to grips with the fact that: 1. Jayson Tatum is not Michael Jordan. 2. Jayson Tatum is really great at basketball. It’s ok if people complain or are frustrated that he isn’t Kobe or Michael. He was scoring in the mid 20’s with elite shooting percentages before he could buy a beer, so I for one am still wondering if there’s another gear there as an offensive hub. With that said, if there is not another gear, no one is saying he isn’t a top ten player in the sport. He has no major holes in his game, he’s basically never hurt, and seems to care more about winning than anything else. I think if he wins a championship, maybe he relaxes a little and the shooting returns to an elite level and he becomes one of the three greatest forwards ever. Until then, fans and media alike will be frustrated when the offense stalls out through his isolations, especially with a plethora of creation around him. People are absolutely saying he’s not top 10 in the sport, somebody like 20 min ago said he’s not a superstar lmao Well, then ignore those people. I haven’t heard anybody say he’s not top 10. If a superstar means he can carry his team to the finals, maybe not yet.
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Post by danredhawk on May 23, 2024 22:00:56 GMT -5
Say what you want about the Celtics opponents, but they’re 10-2 in three PLAYOFF series with a +135 differential. That seems unreasonably good but I am not an NBA expert. How often would a run like that happen in any given regular season, let alone a playoff season?
I am sure the news outlets will assure me that tomorrows three-point T-Wolves win (following their three-point loss) illustrates exactly how far ahead of Boston both Western teams clearly are…
I’ve never seen a team blowing out all comers - regular season & post-season - regarded like this before. And yes, when they get stagnant it bugs me too, but that happens to everyone…
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Post by benogliviesbrother on May 23, 2024 22:03:20 GMT -5
People are absolutely saying he’s not top 10 in the sport, somebody like 20 min ago said he’s not a superstar lmao Maybe we differ on what a super star is. My impression is a top 10 player. Well, he was just voted 1st team All NBA, which makes him Top 5. Although for me, while a no doubt all-star player, I don't consider that a superstar. Glad we have him. If he doesn't get us over the hump, and get over his petulance, we can always trade him for a huge haul & build around JB & the crew. Win win.
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Post by philarhody on May 23, 2024 22:06:56 GMT -5
Say what you want about the Celtics opponents, but they’re 10-2 in three PLAYOFF series with a +135 differential. That seems unreasonably good but I am not an NBA expert. How often would a run like that happen in any given regular season, let alone a playoff season? I am sure the news outlets will assure me that tomorrows three-point T-Wolves win (following their three-point loss) illustrates exactly how far ahead of Boston both Western teams clearly are… I’ve never seen a team blowing out all comers - regular season & post-season - regarded like this before. And yes, when they get stagnant it bugs me too, but that happens to everyone… The cause for concern with Minnesota is that it might be a legit series. This series against Indiana should not be close, considering Indiana is one of the worst defensive teams in all of basketball. Minnesota had a middling regular season offense but one of the better defenses in recent memory. They can make your life really tough if you start settling for contested shots, which is a favorite pastime of the Celtics. However, if Jrue and White continue to initiate the actions, this year’s team may be different.
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Post by philarhody on May 23, 2024 22:15:23 GMT -5
This is the Celtics collective point guard line tonight:
50 points 18 assists 67% fg 64% 3
That’s good, right?
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 14,637
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Post by cdj on May 23, 2024 22:16:13 GMT -5
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Post by danredhawk on May 23, 2024 22:21:18 GMT -5
Say what you want about the Celtics opponents, but they’re 10-2 in three PLAYOFF series with a +135 differential. That seems unreasonably good but I am not an NBA expert. How often would a run like that happen in any given regular season, let alone a playoff season? I am sure the news outlets will assure me that tomorrows three-point T-Wolves win (following their three-point loss) illustrates exactly how far ahead of Boston both Western teams clearly are… I’ve never seen a team blowing out all comers - regular season & post-season - regarded like this before. And yes, when they get stagnant it bugs me too, but that happens to everyone… The cause for concern with Minnesota is that it might be a legit series. This series against Indiana should not be close, considering Indiana is one of the worst defensive teams in all of basketball. Minnesota had a middling regular season offense but one of the better defenses in recent memory. They can make your life really tough if you start settling for contested shots, which is a favorite pastime of the Celtics. However, if Jrue and White continue to initiate the actions, this year’s team may be different. Minnesota looks strong and deep. They may be the only threat left to Boston’s title run. But it seems to me they’ve come from relative obscurity while the Celtics have been under the microscope all season long… Expectations play a huge role in how teams and players are viewed. The Celtics are expected to be perfect, so when they’re only dominant people question them. Especially sports talk/everyday media. Dallas is good. The T-Wolves are very dangerous. But how anyone could watch these playoffs and not think the Cs are the dominant threat and most impressive team - and without KP! - escapes me…
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 23, 2024 22:22:28 GMT -5
Blah blah blah Tatum this, blah blah blah Tatum that, Jaylen Brown looks like a superstar! He's so much better than last year! So much more focused on D. Has he played two better back to back playoff games?
BTW Tatum is superstar. Yeah he has faults, but there's no argument he's not one. What's up for debate is his all-time ranking and that's TBD!
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Post by redsoxfan2 on May 23, 2024 22:23:13 GMT -5
Maybe we differ on what a super star is. My impression is a top 10 player. Well, he was just voted 1st team All NBA, which makes him Top 5. Although for me, while a no doubt all-star player, I don't consider that a superstar. Glad we have him. If he doesn't get us over the hump, and get over his petulance, we can always trade him for a huge haul & build around JB & the crew. Win win. Maybe the language used in frustration wasn't appropriate but never meant he sucked. He's been very efficient. I'm just expecting. "Carry the entire team on his back. I'm a top 5 player in the NBA so watch me go off against these injured teams". That kind of stuff. Without Brown being Superman this round the Celtics might be 0-2. That's not saying Tatum sucks. It's saying my opinion is so high that I'm disappointed he's not hitting that level. I also feel he's going to need to hit that gear in the Finals for them to bring home a ring.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 23, 2024 22:24:12 GMT -5
The cause for concern with Minnesota is that it might be a legit series. This series against Indiana should not be close, considering Indiana is one of the worst defensive teams in all of basketball. Minnesota had a middling regular season offense but one of the better defenses in recent memory. They can make your life really tough if you start settling for contested shots, which is a favorite pastime of the Celtics. However, if Jrue and White continue to initiate the actions, this year’s team may be different. Minnesota looks strong and deep. They may be the only threat left to Boston’s title run. But it seems to me they’ve come from relative obscurity while the Celtics have been under the microscope all season long… Expectations play a huge role in how teams and players are viewed. The Celtics are expected to be perfect, so when they’re only dominant people question them. Especially sports talk/everyday media. Dallas is good. The T-Wolves are very dangerous. But how anyone could watch these playoffs and not think the Cs are the dominant threat and most impressive team - and without KP! - escapes me… Funny because I think Minnesota biggest issue is depth.
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Post by soxfansince67 on May 23, 2024 22:27:16 GMT -5
This is the Celtics collective point guard line tonight: 50 points 18 assists 67% fg 64% 3 That’s good, right? 2 turnovers against those 18 assists. Only 28 shots to make those 50 points. That is very, very good indeed.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on May 23, 2024 22:36:34 GMT -5
The cause for concern with Minnesota is that it might be a legit series. This series against Indiana should not be close, considering Indiana is one of the worst defensive teams in all of basketball. Minnesota had a middling regular season offense but one of the better defenses in recent memory. They can make your life really tough if you start settling for contested shots, which is a favorite pastime of the Celtics. However, if Jrue and White continue to initiate the actions, this year’s team may be different. Minnesota looks strong and deep. They may be the only threat left to Boston’s title run. But it seems to me they’ve come from relative obscurity while the Celtics have been under the microscope all season long… Expectations play a huge role in how teams and players are viewed. The Celtics are expected to be perfect, so when they’re only dominant people question them. Especially sports talk/everyday media. Dallas is good. The T-Wolves are very dangerous. But how anyone could watch these playoffs and not think the Cs are the dominant threat and most impressive team - and without KP! - escapes me… I'd guess most observers consider them the most talented starting 5, or more. But, as many have noted, the Celtics might have the best players but they don't always play the best. Barkley has said several times that the C's take crazy bad shots, which they sometimes get away with because: a) sometimes they make them; and b) because other strengths rise up to offset the bad shots. Scal called them out all day yesterday on his SiriusXM show for playing lazy uninspired ball. He (rhetorically?) asked, "Can you think of an NBA champ that coasted during playoff games -- who does that?" I can't speak for other fans but I know I'm only ever frustrated with them when they play stupidly (or lazily), not when they play badly. JT puts up a lot of bad tape, absolutely kills several possessions per game, but he's immensely talented and, as another poster noted, in excellent shape, so he does a lot of good stuff too. It is what it is, Bill (who was spotted at the game) would say. Two & Oh is what I would say and that matters most. I've got all offseason to bitch, if necessary, so it seems silly to spend an even ounce of it now. I'll enjoy the wins -- you?
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Post by Don Caballero on May 23, 2024 22:47:28 GMT -5
What a difference maker Jrue has been so far this playoffs. Absolutely elite on both ends and gives the team exactly what they need. My man umass and I shared a concern about Jrue in the playoffs, because he wasn’t much to write home about in recent seasons with the Bucks. He’s proving us wrong, he’s balling out of his mind against Indiana. Good shooting, forcing the issue inside and of course his insane defense. He’s been what my heart tells me Marcus Smart was (Smart is my favorite player ever, strongly biased here lol).
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Post by danredhawk on May 23, 2024 22:47:56 GMT -5
Minnesota looks strong and deep. They may be the only threat left to Boston’s title run. But it seems to me they’ve come from relative obscurity while the Celtics have been under the microscope all season long… Expectations play a huge role in how teams and players are viewed. The Celtics are expected to be perfect, so when they’re only dominant people question them. Especially sports talk/everyday media. Dallas is good. The T-Wolves are very dangerous. But how anyone could watch these playoffs and not think the Cs are the dominant threat and most impressive team - and without KP! - escapes me… I'd guess most observers consider them the most talented starting 5, or more. But, as many have noted, the Celtics might have the best players but they don't always play the best. Barkley has said several times that the C's take crazy bad shots, which they sometimes get away with because: a) sometimes they make them; and b) because other strengths rise up to offset the bad shots. Scal called them out all day yesterday on his SiriusXM show for playing lazy uninspired ball. He (rhetorically?) asked, "Can you think of an NBA champ that coasted during playoff games -- who does that?" I can't speak for other fans but I know I'm only ever frustrated with them when they play stupidly (or lazily), not when they play badly. JT puts up a lot of bad tape, absolutely kills several possessions per game, but he's immensely talented and, as another poster noted, in excellent shape, so he does a lot of good stuff too. It is what it is, Bill (who was spotted at the game) would say. Two & Oh is what I would say and that matters most. I've got all offseason to bitch, if necessary, so it seems silly to spend an even ounce of it now. I'll enjoy the wins -- you? Am I giving you the impression I’m bitching and not enjoying the wins? All your points are valid, but they are only made because Boston is compared to ‘who everyone thinks they should be every night’ rather than the other teams left in the playoffs. Are the Celtics coming up short of perfection? Sure, but none of these issues escape any NBA team (they all take bad shots). Are they the best team left in the playoffs? Absolutely, IMO. The Heat, Cavs and Pacers may not be historic teams but they’re NBA playoff teams and the C’s are mauling them while coasting, taking bad shots and missing one of their most skilled and mismatched players…
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Post by Montana Lemonious-Craig on May 23, 2024 23:34:17 GMT -5
Imagine your favorite team being up 2-0 in the conference finals, only having lost twice during the postseason, and complaining that Tatum isn’t playing enough like a “superstar.” I swear some people just can’t be happy lmao
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