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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 14, 2024 20:16:23 GMT -5
Game summary: Annoying.
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Post by thelpc on Aug 14, 2024 20:16:45 GMT -5
I’m so sick of Josh Winckowski
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Post by notstarboard on Aug 14, 2024 20:17:24 GMT -5
How many games post ASB has the bullpen given away? Hard to even just blame the pen...
Hamilton's error. Ceddanne's throw and Romy not helping him out. Cora using Martin for 1/3 of an inning and trying to roll with Winck for the 9th ("I'll be managing like every game is a playoff game" my ass, he was trying to save Martin for Baltimore and/or baby him). Devers not getting the out at first on that second infield hit. Laz Diaz. Duran and Devers getting thrown out on the bases.
It's absurd how much had to go wrong for them to piss that one away
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Post by notstarboard on Aug 14, 2024 20:18:00 GMT -5
10-14 record post all star break. 5-7 at home. 125 runs scored against us in those 14 games. 9 runs per game average! And with a merely average pen they are easily like 14-10 and in WC2 position.
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briam
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Posts: 1,180
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Post by briam on Aug 14, 2024 20:18:31 GMT -5
It’s the same damn song year after year and all they do is continue to dumpster dive at the deadline and in the off-season then act baffled when the pitching implodes.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Aug 14, 2024 20:20:35 GMT -5
Two thoughts:
Sogard at 2B and Hamilton at SS is back asswards.
I think Laz Diaz was molested as a child by a Sox fan wearing a Red Sox uni.
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Post by notstarboard on Aug 14, 2024 20:20:45 GMT -5
It’s the same damn song year after year and all they do is continue to dumpster dive at the deadline and in the off-season then act baffled when the pitching implodes. This is much more likely due to usage than moves or non-moves at the deadline. Some of that has been crappy rotations, some of that has been injuries, some of that has been a crappy manager.
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Post by congusgambler33 on Aug 14, 2024 20:21:18 GMT -5
good luck in Baltimore!!
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briam
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Post by briam on Aug 14, 2024 20:33:50 GMT -5
It’s the same damn song year after year and all they do is continue to dumpster dive at the deadline and in the off-season then act baffled when the pitching implodes. This is much more likely due to usage than moves or non-moves at the deadline. Some of that has been crappy rotations, some of that has been injuries, some of that has been a crappy manager. The usage is directly impacted by the moves. Of course usage is going to be higher when you don’t commit resources to a problem.
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Post by notstarboard on Aug 14, 2024 20:38:02 GMT -5
This is much more likely due to usage than moves or non-moves at the deadline. Some of that has been crappy rotations, some of that has been injuries, some of that has been a crappy manager. The usage is directly impacted by the moves. Of course usage is going to be higher when you don’t commit resources to a problem. It's not like they just sign worse relievers than the ones already on the roster every July and it forces extra guys to come out of the pen every night to bail them out. The pens are just gassed by August because they've been overused all year.
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Post by julyanmorley on Aug 14, 2024 20:40:36 GMT -5
I think three straight years of total collapse immediately after the trade deadline is enough, I'd like for that not to happen next season
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briam
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Post by briam on Aug 14, 2024 20:42:15 GMT -5
The usage is directly impacted by the moves. Of course usage is going to be higher when you don’t commit resources to a problem. It's not like they just sign worse relievers than the ones already on the roster every July and it forces extra guys to come out of the pen every night to bail them out. The pens are just gassed by August because they've been overused all year. Exactly… and why are they overused?
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pd
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Post by pd on Aug 14, 2024 20:50:03 GMT -5
The usage is directly impacted by the moves. Of course usage is going to be higher when you don’t commit resources to a problem. It's not like they just sign worse relievers than the ones already on the roster every July and it forces extra guys to come out of the pen every night to bail them out. The pens are just gassed by August because they've been overused all year. They did trade for a couple guys at the deadline in Sims and Garcia, but they haven't really helped. Seems they have plenty of arms, just not many of them are very good. Good pitching day down on the farm today, maybe soon we'll get some help from the there.
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art
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Post by art on Aug 14, 2024 20:57:23 GMT -5
The talent level in the bullpen below Jansen & Martin is pretty low. I'm not at all impressed with what they have at AAA or AA either. Lots of DFA candidates in the bullpen.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Aug 14, 2024 21:01:54 GMT -5
Don't forget - Weissert, Keller, Campbell, Joely, Uwasawa and...ta da! Yohan Ramirez lurk in Woo. How the hell did the Red Sox sink to this low level? Aside from Slaten, help is not particularly on the way.
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Post by notstarboard on Aug 14, 2024 21:06:41 GMT -5
It's not like they just sign worse relievers than the ones already on the roster every July and it forces extra guys to come out of the pen every night to bail them out. The pens are just gassed by August because they've been overused all year. Exactly… and why are they overused? Mostly because of injuries and managerial malpractice, as I already said.
Edit: SP innings is also a factor, but I put a lot of that on Giolito going down this year, and a secondary part on Cora's hook. The rotation hasn't been the problem for most of the year.
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Post by notstarboard on Aug 14, 2024 21:12:01 GMT -5
Don't forget - Weissert, Keller, Campbell, Joely, Uwasawa and...ta da! Yohan Ramirez lurk in Woo. How the hell did the Red Sox sink to this low level? Aside from Slaten, help is not particularly on the way. That's honestly pretty solid relief depth to have in AAA; there's a lot of MLB experience there. The main issue in my mind besides general overuse is not enough guys you can trust in high leverage. Slaten and Hendriks should help a lot with that, and that should in turn help a bit with overuse, as there should be fewer fires.
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Post by notstarboard on Aug 14, 2024 21:16:07 GMT -5
It's not like they just sign worse relievers than the ones already on the roster every July and it forces extra guys to come out of the pen every night to bail them out. The pens are just gassed by August because they've been overused all year. They did trade for a couple guys at the deadline in Sims and Garcia, but they haven't really helped. Seems they have plenty of arms, just not many of them are very good. Good pitching day down on the farm today, maybe soon we'll get some help from the there. Agreed (although I'm actually high on Sims) - I just mean that these guys are not the reason the pen sucks. If these guys weren't on the squad, it would be like Keller and Weissert instead, and it's hard to call that an upgrade. And they also haven't been here long enough to be the reason why guys like Booser, Bernardino, and Kelly are gassed / falling apart.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Aug 14, 2024 21:31:15 GMT -5
We were over 97% chance to win twice tonight.
The pain of the long ball - since the All Star break
Home runs by starters - 29 Home runs by the pen - 24
53 home runs in 24 games. Relivers nearly as many as the starters.
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asm18
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Post by asm18 on Aug 14, 2024 21:33:48 GMT -5
This pitching staff has to face a combination of Gunnar Henderson, Anthony Santander, Adley Rutschman, Jose Altuve, Alex Bregman, and Yordan Alvarez for seven straight days. Oh God
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briam
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Post by briam on Aug 14, 2024 21:45:28 GMT -5
Exactly… and why are they overused? Mostly because of injuries and managerial malpractice, as I already said.
Edit: SP innings is also a factor, but I put a lot of that on Giolito going down this year, and a secondary part on Cora's hook. The rotation hasn't been the problem for most of the year.
Last year the rotation hit a brick wall and in the offseason they lost 2 starters and added 2. One immediately got injured and they eventually brought back one of the guys from last year that broke down. It’s damn near the same exact rotation, OF COURSE it’s going to hit a wall just as it did last year and OF COURSE that’s going to tax the bullpen.
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Post by incandenza on Aug 14, 2024 21:59:17 GMT -5
People have pointed out that if any one of about 12 different things didn't go wrong at the end of this game, they would have won. But by my lights the real elegant detail, the writerly little flourish, was that if Sogard didn't get injured at that precise moment, they probably turn the double play to end the game.
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Aug 14, 2024 22:02:45 GMT -5
This pitching staff has to face a combination of Gunnar Henderson, Anthony Santander, Adley Rutschman, Jose Altuve, Alex Bregman, and Yordan Alvarez for seven straight days. Oh God Don’t forget Cowser who sees red whenever he sees Boston uniforms.
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asm18
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Post by asm18 on Aug 14, 2024 22:20:35 GMT -5
2024: 63-56, 2 GB wild card
2023: 63-56, 3 GB Wild Card (also 1 behind Seattle, who missed playoffs)
2022: 59-60, 5 GB Wild Card (while behind 3 other non-playoff teams)
Their playoff positioning is better than at this point last year despite the same record, but the thinness of the AL WC picture is really doing a lot of heavy lifting here. Only other real folks in the WC3 pool at the moment are KC and SEA (thank God we have the tiebreakers). Can we be two games better than KC (and no more than a game worse than Seattle) for the next month and a half 🤷♂️
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Aug 14, 2024 22:27:34 GMT -5
2024: 63-56, 2 GB wild card 2023: 63-56, 3 GB Wild Card (also 1 behind Seattle, who missed playoffs) 2022: 59-60, 5 GB Wild Card (while behind 3 other non-playoff teams) Their playoff positioning is better than at this point last year despite the same record, but the thinness of the AL WC picture is really doing a lot of heavy lifting here. Only other real folks in the WC3 pool at the moment are KC and SEA (thank God we have the tiebreakers). Can we be two games better than KC (and no more than a game worse than Seattle) for the next month and a half 🤷♂️ They can if they stop giving games away. They should but they're not giving me alot of faith that they will.
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