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8/26-8/29 Red Sox vs. Blue Jays Series Thread
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Post by wildsox on Aug 26, 2024 15:00:46 GMT -5
When do we start holding Cora accountable for the same garbage in August and September every year
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kwodes
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Post by kwodes on Aug 26, 2024 15:01:35 GMT -5
When do we start holding Cora accountable for the same garbage in August and September every year I feel like it's less of a Cora problem and more of a pitching depth problem.
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Post by soxfansince67 on Aug 26, 2024 15:01:46 GMT -5
I can see this...phone rings. " Hi Alex? This is Craig. You must get Garcia or Sims the high leverage spots. They were our big trade deadline moves".
Alex..." WTF? Are you nuts?"
Craig " Do it"
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Post by prospectjunkie21 on Aug 26, 2024 15:01:53 GMT -5
Martin getting loose. Must win game really at this point with how they've been playing. 1 run game. Let's sit him down and go to serial arsonist luis garcia. Is cora trying to get fired to keep all the money but not have to manage here?
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Post by rhswanzey on Aug 26, 2024 15:02:32 GMT -5
So basically, the season totally fell apart when a rule 5 reliever went on the IL - by the way, that was framed as a 15-day minimum maintenance stint sandwiched around the all star break.
Look, if your whole pitching staff totally unravels because of a rule 5 reliever, it wasn’t a good plan.
I still appreciate what a fun summer it’s been. And I’d really appreciate if they play .500 ball next month instead of a repeat of 9-19.
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Post by incandenza on Aug 26, 2024 15:06:37 GMT -5
I am incandescently angry about this game. Oh good, Rafaela making weak contact on yet another pitch out of the zone to ground out.
...Duran's homer might have tied the game if Cora had not brought in literally the worst possible pitcher in the worst possible situation.
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Post by oldfaithful2019 on Aug 26, 2024 15:07:48 GMT -5
When do we start holding Cora accountable for the same garbage in August and September every year Apparently not for 3 years.
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kwodes
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Post by kwodes on Aug 26, 2024 15:08:23 GMT -5
So basically, the season totally fell apart when a rule 5 reliever went on the IL - by the way, that was framed as a 15-day minimum maintenance stint sandwiched around the all star break. Look, if your whole pitching staff totally unravels because of a rule 5 reliever, it wasn’t a good plan. I still appreciate what a fun summer it’s been. And I’d really appreciate if they play .500 ball next month instead of a repeat of 9-19. Agreed, it just seems like a complete lack of depth problem. They need some more horses to get them through the year. That's why I think they should sign Flaherty + a Scherzer/Buehler type. They can go into next year with Flaherty, Scherzer, Houck, Kutter, Bello, Giolito, Whitlock, Fitts, Priester, Criswell, Sandlin as starting options. More than enough to get them through a full 162 game season.
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shagworthy
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Post by shagworthy on Aug 26, 2024 15:09:51 GMT -5
I have been away for work in NYC and not following too closely, and it looks like I made the right decision. This team is such a Jekyll and Hide act. These past two years it has been monumentally difficult to watch them defensively, they burn through anyone in the pen who has even brief success faster than throwing kerosine on a gas grill that is already lit. You dance with the date you brought, but JFC. We need a paper bag as well to even do that.
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Post by incandenza on Aug 26, 2024 15:11:22 GMT -5
So basically, the season totally fell apart when a rule 5 reliever went on the IL - by the way, that was framed as a 15-day minimum maintenance stint sandwiched around the all star break.Look, if your whole pitching staff totally unravels because of a rule 5 reliever, it wasn’t a good plan. I still appreciate what a fun summer it’s been. And I’d really appreciate if they play .500 ball next month instead of a repeat of 9-19. This is kinda gliding over the fact that they had already lost 40% of the starting rotation for the season at this point.
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asm18
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Post by asm18 on Aug 26, 2024 15:14:29 GMT -5
So basically, the season totally fell apart when a rule 5 reliever went on the IL - by the way, that was framed as a 15-day minimum maintenance stint sandwiched around the all star break. Look, if your whole pitching staff totally unravels because of a rule 5 reliever, it wasn’t a good plan. I still appreciate what a fun summer it’s been. And I’d really appreciate if they play .500 ball next month instead of a repeat of 9-19. Was thinking about it earlier - I’d argue they’ve largely been LUCKY when it comes to pitching injuries. Giolito was hurt at the start of spring training with free agency still going - they just chose not to replace him! During the season Whitlock got season ending surgery, Pivetta/Bello had their injury hiatuses, Martin missed some time and Slaten has been out. Paxton was acquired for nothing and got hurt immediately. There are teams that have had it way worse. Look at like the Dodgers - they have fricken Glasnow and Yamamoto on the IL. Gerrit Cole missed 3 months for the Yankees. Lesson for Mr. Breslow - if you don’t fill up on pitching in the off-season you have to pay an arm and a leg for it in July… and it might not even be good
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Post by ixnayexxus on Aug 26, 2024 15:17:45 GMT -5
So basically, the season totally fell apart when a rule 5 reliever went on the IL - by the way, that was framed as a 15-day minimum maintenance stint sandwiched around the all star break. Look, if your whole pitching staff totally unravels because of a rule 5 reliever, it wasn’t a good plan. I still appreciate what a fun summer it’s been. And I’d really appreciate if they play .500 ball next month instead of a repeat of 9-19. Was thinking about it earlier - I’d argue they’ve largely been LUCKY when it comes to pitching injuries. Giolito was hurt at the start of spring training with free agency still going - they just chose not to replace him! During the season Whitlock got season ending surgery, Pivetta/Bello had their injury hiatuses, Martin missed some time and Slaten has been out. Paxton was acquired for nothing and got hurt immediately. There are teams that have had it way worse. Look at like the Dodgers - they have fricken Glasnow and Yamamoto on the IL. Gerrit Cole missed 3 months for the Yankees. Lesson for Mr. Breslow - if you don’t fill up on pitching in the off-season you have to pay an arm and a leg for it in July… and it might not even be good Or the Marlins; not that they would have been a playoff team, but they lost a recent CY Young winner, their ace coming into the season, their young phenom, and several other arms that could have resulted in the most exciting young rotation in the game. They went from that to featuring Vicente Bellozo as their ace at one point
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Post by melvinhoggs on Aug 26, 2024 15:19:16 GMT -5
So basically, the season totally fell apart when a rule 5 reliever went on the IL - by the way, that was framed as a 15-day minimum maintenance stint sandwiched around the all star break. Look, if your whole pitching staff totally unravels because of a rule 5 reliever, it wasn’t a good plan. I still appreciate what a fun summer it’s been. And I’d really appreciate if they play .500 ball next month instead of a repeat of 9-19. Was thinking about it earlier - I’d argue they’ve largely been LUCKY when it comes to pitching injuries. Giolito was hurt at the start of spring training with free agency still going - they just chose not to replace him! During the season Whitlock got season ending surgery, Pivetta/Bello had their injury hiatuses, Martin missed some time and Slaten has been out. Paxton was acquired for nothing and got hurt immediately. There are teams that have had it way worse. Look at like the Dodgers - they have fricken Glasnow and Yamamoto on the IL. Gerrit Cole missed 3 months for the Yankees. Lesson for Mr. Breslow - if you don’t fill up on pitching in the off-season you have to pay an arm and a leg for it in July… and it might not even be good 100% agree that the injury woes are consistently overstated on this forum.
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Post by dirtdog on Aug 26, 2024 15:20:26 GMT -5
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shagworthy
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Post by shagworthy on Aug 26, 2024 15:22:40 GMT -5
So basically, the season totally fell apart when a rule 5 reliever went on the IL - by the way, that was framed as a 15-day minimum maintenance stint sandwiched around the all star break.Look, if your whole pitching staff totally unravels because of a rule 5 reliever, it wasn’t a good plan. I still appreciate what a fun summer it’s been. And I’d really appreciate if they play .500 ball next month instead of a repeat of 9-19. This is kinda gliding over the fact that they had already lost 40% of the starting rotation for the season at this point. I know, I know, I am beating a dead horse, and as bad as the pitching has been, for me, I keep circling the wagon back to the defense. How demoralizing does it have to be to be on this staff and think you've made a pitch to get out of a jam only to watch (insert middle infielder name here) boot, kick, completely miss, or wildly throw a ball around the park. Yeah, mistakes happen, but this team makes an artform out of cocking up plays, it's like they are always the other team playing the Harlem Globetrotters, they are the foil, the butt to every joke. It's exhausting.
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Post by rhswanzey on Aug 26, 2024 15:22:50 GMT -5
So basically, the season totally fell apart when a rule 5 reliever went on the IL - by the way, that was framed as a 15-day minimum maintenance stint sandwiched around the all star break.Look, if your whole pitching staff totally unravels because of a rule 5 reliever, it wasn’t a good plan. I still appreciate what a fun summer it’s been. And I’d really appreciate if they play .500 ball next month instead of a repeat of 9-19. This is kinda gliding over the fact that they had already lost 40% of the starting rotation for the season at this point. We went into the offseason with the manager on the record responding to a question about needing two starting pitchers by saying “we might need three”. They signed one and traded one.
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Post by dcsoxfan15 on Aug 26, 2024 15:23:47 GMT -5
Legitimately think that if the Red Sox don’t win all of the next four, that’ll do it
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Post by soxfansince67 on Aug 26, 2024 15:25:33 GMT -5
We are at a low point for sure. Can't win at Fenway. Can't stop striking out
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Post by rhswanzey on Aug 26, 2024 15:26:09 GMT -5
Was thinking about it earlier - I’d argue they’ve largely been LUCKY when it comes to pitching injuries. Giolito was hurt at the start of spring training with free agency still going - they just chose not to replace him! During the season Whitlock got season ending surgery, Pivetta/Bello had their injury hiatuses, Martin missed some time and Slaten has been out. Paxton was acquired for nothing and got hurt immediately. There are teams that have had it way worse. Look at like the Dodgers - they have fricken Glasnow and Yamamoto on the IL. Gerrit Cole missed 3 months for the Yankees. Lesson for Mr. Breslow - if you don’t fill up on pitching in the off-season you have to pay an arm and a leg for it in July… and it might not even be good Or the Marlins; not that they would have been a playoff team, but they lost a recent CY Young winner, their ace coming into the season, their young phenom, and several other arms that could have resulted in the most exciting young rotation in the game. They went from that to featuring Vicente Bellozo as their ace at one point The Orioles have lost three starting pitchers to TJ during the season The Astros had a full rotation on the shelf at one point I fear an offseason where we are reassured that we have so many options already on hand. It’s a little like when we look at having ten players who can slot in at second base. Ok, there may be a lot of options, but we also are 30th in MLB in production from that position, so that should hold some weight, too. We did that with the rotation entering 2023 (8+ options in March!) and by the trade deadline, we had two bullpen games per turn.
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asm18
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Post by asm18 on Aug 26, 2024 15:26:40 GMT -5
Alex Cora to Brad Keller before he gives up 10 runs tonight:
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Post by dirtdog on Aug 26, 2024 15:27:51 GMT -5
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Post by incandenza on Aug 26, 2024 15:28:44 GMT -5
This is kinda gliding over the fact that they had already lost 40% of the starting rotation for the season at this point. We went into the offseason with the manager on the record responding to a question about needing two starting pitchers by saying “we might need three”. They signed one and traded one. I'm sort of in a weird spot in this debate because I agreed with the criticism in the offseason. But at that point I wasn't sure Houck could start and I didn't think Criswell would be so good. So in retrospect I was right for the wrong reasons - they did have a reasonable amount of depth, but the Giolito and Whitlock and later Paxton injuries undermined them.
I could say that I was right about how they ought to have signed Imanaga. But I also would've been happy if they had signed Montgomery or Maeda, so...
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Post by rhswanzey on Aug 26, 2024 15:34:48 GMT -5
We went into the offseason with the manager on the record responding to a question about needing two starting pitchers by saying “we might need three”. They signed one and traded one. I'm sort of in a weird spot in this debate because I agreed with the criticism in the offseason. But at that point I wasn't sure Houck could start and I didn't think Criswell would be so good. So in retrospect I was right for the wrong reasons - they did have a reasonable amount of depth, but the Giolito and Whitlock and later Paxton injuries undermined them.
I could say that I was right about how they ought to have signed Imanaga. But I also would've been happy if they had signed Montgomery or Maeda, so...
The team wasn’t sure Houck could start, either. He was one Giolito injury from not starting. I highlight the impact of Slaten’s injury being indicative of a poor plan, because whether it’s Slaten, Houck, or a few other examples, the team’s chances of contending were built entirely on outcomes that shouldn’t have been counted on. You can’t count on a rule 5 pick being ready for a real 7th-8th inning role. The organization’s approach during retool/bridge years is to hope to get lucky. If they don’t get some less than 50% probability outcomes from certain individual pitchers, it’s not a .500 team.
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Post by grandsalami on Aug 26, 2024 15:38:59 GMT -5
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Post by incandenza on Aug 26, 2024 15:41:37 GMT -5
Red Sox winning percentages under Cora:
| through July 31st
| August 1st and on
| 2018
| .688 | .627 | 2019 | .541 | .472 | 2021 | .594 | .518 | 2022 | .495 | .458 | 2023 | .528 | .393 | 2024
| .533
| .435
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Every single year!
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