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Post by Oregon Norm on Oct 10, 2014 0:53:36 GMT -5
This is just inane theorizing, the sort of navel gazing that's nothing but space filler. It's the baseball equivalent of palm reading and numerology.
I spent years working with scientists in one of the toughest fields imaginable, ecosystems analysis. If you hypothesized, you needed mounds of solid evidence, and a coherent framework to hang it on. Otherwise your happy talk got pounded to dust.
This, this is just a lot of hot air, nothing but cherry picking. As just one example, Wong completely crapped out last year in his 60 AB's, whereupon the team used him as a pinch runner in a must win WS game, and he got picked off. He still hasn't cleared .700 OPS, playoff HR aside.
Players learn by playing, don't you know.
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Post by Steve Henley on Oct 10, 2014 1:10:00 GMT -5
James touched on some of this, but that's a terrible article. "Xander Bogaerts was handed the starting third base job late in the 2013 season and held it through the World Series. He entered 2014 as the starting shortstop for the defending World Series champion, then struggled to a .240/.297/.362 triple slash line"Bogaerts - .240/.297/.362 (OPS+ 85) - FAILURE! Wong - .249/.292/.388 (OPS+ 89) - SUCCESS! Grichuk - .245/.278/.400 (OPS+ 87) - SUCCESS! Clearly there's more to baseball than hitting. Wong and Grichuk are both very good defenders whereas Bogaerts is below-average. I realize this - you realize this. However, the author doesn't mention defense once in the entire article. Actually, he mentioned it once only to completely ignore it's value. "Catcher Christian Vazquez is just 200 plate appearances into his MLB career, but he was handed the starting spot too without a plan to work the defensive standout in slowly. Not known for his offensive prowess, a .240/.308/.309 triple slash line is abysmal — even for a backstop."That is simply a false statement. That line is not abysmal if you are an elite defensive catcher. Also, there was a plan to work Vazquez in slowly, but David Ross got hurt so things changed. Vazquez, 55 games over 1 season - 1.1 bWAR, 75 OPS+ Descalso, 529 MLB games over 5 seasons - 1.1 bWAR , 81 OPS+ Kozma, 199 MLB games over 4 seasons - 0.9 bWAR, 71 OPS+ Vazquez earned as much value in 55 games as Cardinals' successes Daniel Descalso and Pete Kozma have in their entire career. Daniel Nava is also ignored in the article, which is a pretty big omission.
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Post by Guidas on Oct 10, 2014 8:00:24 GMT -5
@georgeofman Are the Dodgers shopping Puig? You bet and the Cubs are one of several teams interested.
If true forget Stanton - open the doors and ask which 4 prospects does Colletti want. DO IT NOW, BEN - BEFORE NED GETS CANNED!!!
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Post by WindyCityRedSox169 on Oct 10, 2014 10:42:55 GMT -5
@georgeofman Are the Dodgers shopping Puig? You bet and the Cubs are one of several teams interested. If true forget Stanton - open the doors and ask which 4 prospects does Colletti want. DO IT NOW, BEN - BEFORE NED GETS CANNED!!! Why? Stanton is better than Puig.
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Post by stevedillard on Oct 10, 2014 10:47:45 GMT -5
I think the Dodgers did a disservice to Puig by having him skip AAA. /random thought. First post
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Oct 10, 2014 14:34:56 GMT -5
I think the Dodgers did a disservice to Puig by having him skip AAA. /random thought. First post Well, technically it was a non sequitur post made in another thread that was moved to this one.
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Post by sarasoxer on Oct 10, 2014 14:54:08 GMT -5
Well, technically it was a non sequitur post made in another thread that was moved to this one. So...it was ex post facto?....another vitiated rubric.
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Post by templeusox on Oct 10, 2014 15:02:09 GMT -5
Get Puig at an cost*
*That doesn't involve trading anything valuable.
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Post by jimed14 on Oct 10, 2014 20:52:59 GMT -5
@georgeofman Are the Dodgers shopping Puig? You bet and the Cubs are one of several teams interested. If true forget Stanton - open the doors and ask which 4 prospects does Colletti want. DO IT NOW, BEN - BEFORE NED GETS CANNED!!! Why? Stanton is better than Puig. Puig is controlled until 2018?
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Post by stevedillard on Oct 14, 2014 12:58:29 GMT -5
Alex Speier retweeted Marc Topkin ?@tbtimes_Rays 7m7 minutes ago BREAKING: Andrew Friedman is leaving #Rays for #Dodgers. Matt Silverman will take over Rays baseball operations.
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Post by jdb on Oct 14, 2014 13:05:09 GMT -5
It's going to be a fun offseason.
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Post by pedroelgrande on Oct 14, 2014 13:08:45 GMT -5
Well bye bye Rays. It wasn't that fun having you around.
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Post by grandsalami on Oct 14, 2014 13:10:43 GMT -5
“@ramonashelburne: Andrew Friedman will be the Dodgers president of baseball operations, sources said, and free to hire a GM”
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Post by grandsalami on Oct 14, 2014 13:13:49 GMT -5
“@mikedigiovanna: Would not be surprised if Joe Maddon is managing #Dodgers in 2016. His contract with TB expires after 2015. Maintains home in Long Beach.”
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Post by James Dunne on Oct 14, 2014 13:23:00 GMT -5
“@mikedigiovanna: Would not be surprised if Joe Maddon is managing #Dodgers in 2016. His contract with TB expires after 2015. Maintains home in Long Beach.” I'd be very surprised if Maddon takes over in LA in 2016. I'm guessing that Friedman either hires him this offseason or not at all. The 2015 season isn't going to hang around with a lame-duck managerial season because they don't want to trade the Mike Aviles-type it would take to get the Rays to release Maddon from his contract. The Dodgers already have about $200 million invested in the 2015 team, and just hired a supposedly smart president of baseball ops. They can put in a little bit more to get the right manager.
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Post by Guidas on Oct 14, 2014 13:28:26 GMT -5
If there was a scintilla of a chance of the Sox trading for Puig, as was rumored last week, it's gone now.
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Post by jclmontana on Oct 14, 2014 13:45:55 GMT -5
This is awesome. Finally get to find out what Friedman will do with a real budget, although it won't really be "his" team for a few years. There should be some pretty good drama out of both Tampa Bay and LA as the dust settles.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Oct 14, 2014 14:48:46 GMT -5
Is it correct to assume no one will ever get to pick LA's pocket the way the Sox did during Friedman's reign? Love Hatfield's tweet, and I'm sure someone's already on it. Safe to say the outfield picture will be much clearer going forward. I'm sort of glad they're on this side of the country - and in the other league.
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Post by jimed14 on Oct 14, 2014 14:52:33 GMT -5
Maybe this is why the Dodgers didn't get Price - he told them to hold onto Seager, Pederson and Urias.
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Post by grandsalami on Oct 14, 2014 15:02:53 GMT -5
“@buster_ESPN: Now the question is: Who will Friedman hire to be his GM? Theo Epstein has Jed Hoyer. Possible options: BOS's Mike Hazen, NYY's Billy Eppler”
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Post by grandsalami on Oct 14, 2014 15:12:43 GMT -5
“@joelsherman1: Heard Friedman will hire GM, but will act as an asst GM. Friedman will make the baseball decision. GM title is to lure best talent #dodgers”
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Oct 14, 2014 17:07:38 GMT -5
I can't wait until a couple years from now when people say the reason the Rays have fallen off is because Friedman left, when the reality will be that the ship was going down long before because it's been years since they drafted a useful major leaguer. Seriously, go look: their last good major leaguers were drafted in 2007 (Price, Moore), and the cupboard is getting pretty bare in the minors.
Friedman clearly saw the writing on the wall and got the heck out, imo. That franchise is going down, and hard.
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Post by johnsilver52 on Oct 14, 2014 19:08:04 GMT -5
Is it correct to assume no one will ever get to pick LA's pocket the way the Sox did during Friedman's reign? Love Hatfield's tweet, and I'm sure someone's already on it. Safe to say the outfield picture will be much clearer going forward. I'm sort of glad they're on this side of the country - and in the other league. He's got to prove it to me that can do it with money. Duequette, Minaya.. All came from small budget organizations with huge credentials that they could do wonders, none were ever popular in big market towns, even delivered any goods (Maybe Duquette did) and I have to see Friedman deliver, especially with the sad shape TB's farm system has been torpedoing downhill the last couple of years. Maybe there was more than one Beane didn't want anywhere near Boston so many years ago?
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Post by James Dunne on Oct 14, 2014 19:46:04 GMT -5
Duquette brought the Red Sox to the playoffs three times in his first five full seasons (there were no '94 playoffs, though the Red Sox were very unlikely to qualify), and he did while a division rival was in the midst of the greatest baseball dynasty of my lifetime. I've been pretty hard on Duquette, particularly in the way he drafted and developed players and the way he seemed to go into a downward-spiral panic mode in the 1998-99 offseason. But his ability to identify major league-ready talent stayed with him.
Minaya's credentials were junk before he took over the Mets. The Bartolo Colon trade he made with the Expos is one of the worst in baseball history.
I'm willing to take the argument that Friedman is horribly overrated, but the idea that a successful small-market GM won't have the skills to handle the large market is going to take a lot more convincing.
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Post by johnsilver52 on Oct 14, 2014 20:15:33 GMT -5
It could be said the Martinez trade was bad also. Point probably didn't make well enough was developing farm systems. Friedman/Beane/ Minaya and The Duke all did well at small market level with drafting, Minaya even made a name for himself as some kind of guru at it, still has that rep somehow, yet it's never been seen since his Expos days IMO.
As for trades James.. Whole heartedly agree with you. both Beane and Friedman would be the 2 are the ones to pick another team's pocket and Duquette the guy who can figure out dollar value guys and get best value out of what is lying around. Minaya shouldn't ever get another job in any FO again.
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