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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Dec 10, 2014 11:41:46 GMT -5
Everyone on here sounds like a bunch of cry babies. Lester has no ties to Boston, he was born across the country and lives in Georgia. He was offered a SUBSTANTIAL amount more money to sign with the Cubs. To turn that money down would be stupid and irresponsible. Agreed
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Post by soxfan06 on Dec 10, 2014 11:42:44 GMT -5
Everyone on here sounds like a bunch of cry babies. Lester has no ties to Boston, he was born across the country and lives in Georgia. He was offered a SUBSTANTIAL amount more money to sign with the Cubs. To turn that money down would be stupid and irresponsible. I don't think a single person on here has suggested once that Lester should have signed here over Chicago for the amount each team offered. Try reading the actual posts.
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Post by jimed14 on Dec 10, 2014 11:42:54 GMT -5
Everyone on here sounds like a bunch of cry babies. Lester has no ties to Boston, he was born across the country and lives in Georgia. He was offered a SUBSTANTIAL amount more money to sign with the Cubs. To turn that money down would be stupid and irresponsible. He's the one who is so freaking worried about not hurting our feelings or someone calling him greedy. None of us give a damn when we know someone who isn't hiding his obvious desire to go to the highest bidder actually does just that. But Lester had to go on and on to prove he wasn't like that. And he sure does seem to be like that.
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Post by dcsoxfan on Dec 10, 2014 11:48:37 GMT -5
At the end of the day, Lester just took the most money when you consider state taxes and the option year. I was wondering why he picked Chicago over the Giants and that would seem to explain it. The fact that he was obsessing over something like taxes I think highlights the fact it really was about money all along. I doubt the hometown discount stuff was ever true. Between this, Theo, and Maddon it will be very easy to root against the Cubs. What did Lester and Theo do to become unlikable? Lester: nothing Theo: traded the Red Sox' top prospect -- to himself.
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Post by bsout2 on Dec 10, 2014 11:51:20 GMT -5
Everyone on here sounds like a bunch of cry babies. Lester has no ties to Boston, he was born across the country and lives in Georgia. He was offered a SUBSTANTIAL amount more money to sign with the Cubs. To turn that money down would be stupid and irresponsible. He's the one who is so freaking worried about not hurting our feelings or someone calling him greedy. None of us give a damn when we know someone who isn't hiding his obvious desire to go to the highest bidder actually does just that. But Lester had to go on and on to prove he wasn't like that. And he sure does seem to be like that. But from all indications the Red Sox were in play to the end. It's now being reported he will receive a $30 million dollar bonus on top of the contract and the option year contains a $10 million dollar buy out. The contract is essentially $195 million over six years! In the end Lester had to go to the Cubs
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Post by amfox1 on Dec 10, 2014 12:04:11 GMT -5
It's now being reported he will receive a $30 million dollar bonus on top of the contract and the option year contains a $10 million dollar buy out. The contract is essentially $195 million over six years! Not true. The signing bonus ($20mm of which is paid upfront and the other $10mm is paid over the life of the contract) and buyout are included in the $155mm. If the 7th year option is exercised (based on vesting clauses), the contract goes to $170mm. Also, he gets a full no-trade.
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Post by dmaineah on Dec 10, 2014 12:07:28 GMT -5
The bonus is for $30MM, Jayson Stark of ESPN.com reports, amongst other updates regarding the precise workings of the deal. That includes $20MM up front and another $10MM spread over the life of the deal. Lester also receives a full no-trade clause, Stark reports. The vesting clause is actually for $25MM and comes with a $10MM buyout. It can vest with a 200-inning season in 2020 or if Lester racks up 400 total frames over 2019-20
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Post by soxfan06 on Dec 10, 2014 12:10:39 GMT -5
That's just not a contract I wanted the Red Sox to match. I said it days ago. Glad we didn't give him a blank check.
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Post by seadogs on Dec 10, 2014 12:14:35 GMT -5
Cliff Lee, Mike Hampton, Barry Zitto, CC, Pedro (you can go on) all show signing pitchers to 6 year deals after a walk year is like signing Gerald Wallace to a long term $14M contract per annum. Did we survive without Jacoby? We just won a championship 16 months ago. It will be all right.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Dec 10, 2014 12:15:39 GMT -5
Like others have said, people understand Lester going to the Cubs.
What we don't understand is why he lied about taking a hometown discount. Maybe he was willing to play here if we matched their offer, but thats not what a hometown discount is. It all makes sense now why he shut down negotiations with the Sox when they tried to re negotiate with him.
If he had pulled a Scherzer and just told everyone he was going to the highest bidder, everyone would've been better off.
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Post by thelavarnwayguy on Dec 10, 2014 12:31:14 GMT -5
It may be that he felt more comfortable signing with Theo and Jed as well, who were maybe there bigtime for him earlier in his career. When you get in a high stakes situation like this, where teams are matching each other's bids to a large degree, sometimes an edge can be given to the management group you feel most compelled to help. The ones who appear to appreciate you the most. That's effectively what he said after signing.
Good for Lester and Good for us IMO. Bring on Liriano, who I preferred to sign anyway. Way, way less money.
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Post by freddysthefuture2003 on Dec 10, 2014 12:33:06 GMT -5
It may be that he felt more comfortable signing with Theo and Jed as well, who were maybe there bigtime for him earlier in his career. When you get in a high stakes situation like this, where teams are matching each other's bids to a large degree, sometimes an edge can be given to the management group you feel most compelled to help. The ones who appear to appreciate you the most. That's effectively what he said after signing. Good for Lester and Good for us IMO. Bring on Liriano, who I preferred to sign anyway. Way, way less money. I don't think Pittsburgh is gonna turn around and trade him to us less than 24 hours after he signed . It must suck to be those guys, they get no attention when they sign.
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Post by soxfn24 on Dec 10, 2014 12:35:01 GMT -5
Liriano already agreed to a 3yr/39 mil deal with the Pirates.
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Post by jimed14 on Dec 10, 2014 12:37:38 GMT -5
The bonus is for $30MM, Jayson Stark of ESPN.com reports, amongst other updates regarding the precise workings of the deal. That includes $20MM up front and another $10MM spread over the life of the deal. Lester also receives a full no-trade clause, Stark reports. The vesting clause is actually for $25MM and comes with a $10MM buyout. It can vest with a 200-inning season in 2020 or if Lester racks up 400 total frames over 2019-20 That cannot possibly be in addition to the rest of the $155million. And what the hell is $10 million spread out over the life of the deal? I call that salary.
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Post by pedroelgrande on Dec 10, 2014 12:42:54 GMT -5
I do think there was a little disingenuousness in the home town discount thing. This is why I prefer they don't even mention it to avoid all this talk. I'm not gonna fault anyone for taking the better offer that's what most humans would do, including me.
He was a free agent so he gets to choose what ever he wants. To me it was clear tha he wanted to be a free agent, which is 100% with me. Just don't try to feed me that you couldn't talk about the contract extension during the season as if that's a distraction when that's what everyone is talking about anyways.
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Post by kman22 on Dec 10, 2014 12:45:26 GMT -5
So 6 years, $155M, $30M of which is bonus money. Then year 7 is a $25M salary or the $10M buyout.
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Post by tonyc on Dec 10, 2014 12:59:33 GMT -5
As I get older and delve more into philosophy such as Zen, it's apparent that multiple viewpoints- seeming exclusive all have "truth" or validity at the same time. This seems quite relevant to the complex Lester situation and the viewpoints here, all of which have some validity-"hypocritical mercenary who was not going for the biggest deal," true.. sympathetic hometown star who wanted to go into a situation where he felt comfort- and felt wanted-true..Front office screwing up, perhaps both initially and in the end, given what alternatives they'll be stuck with, true, front office displaying discipline to their principles (re) players over 30 and preventing themselves from a longterm ripoff true.
This multifaceted viewpoint seems to fly in the face of a website devoted often to making specific points and backing them with the most precise data, yet seems to be the only way to view all the aspects here.
While I felt a bit of a gutpunch, part of me did not want to win simply by spending close to what the Yankees did last year, and become more like them, with fans as spoiled as theirs, expecting that and winning it all every year..let's do it with intelligence/trades etc. Same part of me is delighted for Theo and those wonderful dedicated Cubs fans and is really pulling for them to go all the way- perhaps even if we go against them (I used to pray for one WS and we've got 3).
As an aside for pieces that may get traded, I was a bit disappointed in the recent podcast's report on Eduardo Rodriguez, as I had/have higher hopes for him than expressed via the inconsistency of his stuff, we'll see.
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hank
Rookie
Posts: 102
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Post by hank on Dec 10, 2014 13:00:23 GMT -5
Like others have said, people understand Lester going to the Cubs. What we don't understand is why he lied about taking a hometown discount. Maybe he was willing to play here if we matched their offer, but thats not what a hometown discount is. It all makes sense now why he shut down negotiations with the Sox when they tried to re negotiate with him. If he had pulled a Scherzer and just told everyone he was going to the highest bidder, everyone would've been better off. To be fair Lester said he would take less to stay here when he was actually here, before he was offered 4/70 and before he was traded. If we had offered him a 5 year extension in Spring Training at $105m and he turned it down you'd have a point. As it is you don't.
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Post by kingofthetrill on Dec 10, 2014 13:01:02 GMT -5
I'm a little disappointed in the situation, but I do not blame Lester for taking Chicago's offer, nor do I want the Red Sox to sign Lester for what Chicago ultimately signed him for. I'd rather have Lester's contract than Sandoval's contract, not that they were mutually exclusive or that one effected the other, but at some point you have to be willing to walk away.
I am optimistic that we can still sign a FA SP and trade an OF+ for another, so I think we will have a good team for next season. I believe that the FO has earned my trust and while they are not immune from criticism, they generally do a good job at putting a good product on the field. They will get criticized from the Boston fan base regardless of what decision they make. People here will run their mouths either way, if they don't sign Lester, or if they sign Lester for what they believe is too much.
I thank you Jon Lester for your time in Boston and I wish you the best in Chicago. If the Red Sox don't win a WS in a given year, I hope that the Cubs will. At least once.
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Post by azblue on Dec 10, 2014 13:08:45 GMT -5
I am relieved that the Red Sox did not go six years on Lester, but I remain nervous about who the Sox will have to give up in a trade for one or more pieces to the starting rotation.
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Post by taftreign on Dec 10, 2014 13:14:07 GMT -5
So 6 years, $155M, $30M of which is bonus money. Then year 7 is a $25M salary or the $10M buyout. The 10 mil buyout is part of the 155 mil because he is guaranteed the 10 mil no matter what. So really 6 years @ 145 mil plus the 10 mil buyout to achieve the 155 mil or if the option is picked up its 7 years @ 170 mil.
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Post by dcsoxfan on Dec 10, 2014 13:16:16 GMT -5
Apparently you can get two Liriano class pitchers for one Lester/Scherzer class, and you can get them for half the years. Given the Red Sox quantity of starting pitcher prospects, many of whom, at least in the short run might be better served pitching from the bullpen, I hope the Red Sox go this route.
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Dec 10, 2014 13:17:46 GMT -5
Like others have said, people understand Lester going to the Cubs. What we don't understand is why he lied about taking a hometown discount. Maybe he was willing to play here if we matched their offer, but thats not what a hometown discount is. It all makes sense now why he shut down negotiations with the Sox when they tried to re negotiate with him. If he had pulled a Scherzer and just told everyone he was going to the highest bidder, everyone would've been better off. To be fair Lester said he would take less to stay here when he was actually here, before he was offered 4/70 and before he was traded. If we had offered him a 5 year extension in Spring Training at $105m and he turned it down you'd have a point. As it is you don't. We have now way of knowing if he would have taken that. My belief is he could have had that deal before opening day had he actually negotiated with the team.
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Post by sarasoxer on Dec 10, 2014 13:18:25 GMT -5
That's just not a contract I wanted the Red Sox to match. I said it days ago. Glad we didn't give him a blank check. Agreed. That was a wise business decision...for the future. Now I hope that we don't blow the farm on a couple of pitchers. We finally have position players in relative abundance and, when Nap, Papi, Victorino move on, we will be in outstanding positional shape. If I could bundle Cespedes and lower prospects for Cueto, great. Beyond that I would love for us to be patient rather than "win now" all the time. Unfortunately I fear that Margot and Devers will be gone and in 3-4 years the pitcher(s) we traded for will be on their way out. But, those prospects will be in their mid 20s kicking butt elsewhere. I pray that we keep Swihart.
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Post by jimed14 on Dec 10, 2014 13:23:37 GMT -5
Dan Shaughnessy ?@dan_Shaughnessy 12m12 minutes ago
This Lester fiasco reminds me of Haywood Sullivan losing Fisk after neglecting to mail his contract. Took years to recover from that. This??
ROFL! I underestimated how stupid the things he said would be.
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