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Post by station13 on Apr 22, 2015 20:50:41 GMT -5
If they'd just left Kelly in we'd probably be leading 5-4. And break Kelly? He is coming off an injury. Threw a lot of pitches in his previous start.
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Post by pedey on Apr 22, 2015 20:52:05 GMT -5
When you take your starter out of the game without getting an out in the 6th inning, you need to also remember you are giving the final 12 outs to the relievers, who are often not as good pitchers. Thanks Mujica.
Still, red Sox starters seriously need to start working deeper into games and working out of jams. I'm seeing glimpses of the 2011-12 pitching staff.
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Post by mgoetze on Apr 22, 2015 20:56:34 GMT -5
If they'd just left Kelly in we'd probably be leading 5-4. And break Kelly? He is coming off an injury. Threw a lot of pitches in his previous start. I'm not saying make him go 118 again, but he was at 84!
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Post by FenwayFanatic on Apr 22, 2015 21:01:06 GMT -5
The umps were also squeezing the hell out of Kelly for some reason.
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Post by dcsoxfan on Apr 22, 2015 21:04:59 GMT -5
Am I the only one who thinks Xander might need some time at AAA? What a 22 year old fails to do in the big leagues is no indictment, but you have to wonder if he wouldn't be better served learning how to get out of slumps in a slightly easier environment.
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Post by mgoetze on Apr 22, 2015 21:06:59 GMT -5
Definitely out at 1st, not sure about 3rd.
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Post by mgoetze on Apr 22, 2015 21:09:39 GMT -5
Great play by Napoli, not a lot of first basemen who can make such a powerful throw.
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Post by mgoetze on Apr 22, 2015 21:17:39 GMT -5
Big Papi sucks, bring in a pinch hitter!
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Post by grandsalami on Apr 22, 2015 21:22:17 GMT -5
These umps were incompetent tonight
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Apr 22, 2015 21:22:48 GMT -5
OMG... the first walk given up by Kelly (having thrown only two balls in that PA), he's at 80 pitches or so, and now we get Craig Breslow? You've got to be kidding me, Farrell. Bases loaded and no outs-- you need a strikeout pitcher in that situation. And even if you really like Breslow, he sure isn't a strikeout pitcher. im surprised you posted this. He's not going to manage this game like it's the 2nd game of the ALCS. Breslow's job was to get outs and limit damage...and despite protestations about his roster spot....he had done a good job of that this year....until tonight. If you want strikeout guys in that situation....you need hard throwing strikeout guys. A underrepresented attribute in the current bullpen composition.
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Post by pedey on Apr 22, 2015 21:25:34 GMT -5
The Rays employ a strategy that is rarely used in major league baseball: bringing in their best relief pitcher at critical points in the game, even if it isn't a save situation. They say the last three outs of a game are the hardest to get, but the Rays seem to get out of a lot of jams, whether it be the 6,7,8, or 9th inning.
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Post by rangoon82 on Apr 22, 2015 21:25:45 GMT -5
Tough loss. Listening to the EEI feed, how was that person shrieking not asked to leave?
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wcp3
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Posts: 3,827
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Post by wcp3 on Apr 22, 2015 21:35:27 GMT -5
Am I the only one who thinks Xander might need some time at AAA? What a 22 year old fails to do in the big leagues is no indictment, but you have to wonder if he wouldn't be better served learning how to get out of slumps in a slightly easier environment. Lol.
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Post by grandsalami on Apr 22, 2015 21:42:52 GMT -5
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Post by mgoetze on Apr 22, 2015 21:44:56 GMT -5
im surprised you posted this. He's not going to manage this game like it's the 2nd game of the ALCS. Breslow's job was to get outs and limit damage...and despite protestations about his roster spot....he had done a good job of that this year....until tonight. Have you considered that there might possibly have been some validity to those protestations, and that 9.2 IP doesn't really tell you everything about a pitcher? This makes no sense at all. What on earth is wrong with getting strikeouts from a 78 mph splitter when the bases are loaded?
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Post by bookiemetts on Apr 22, 2015 23:29:43 GMT -5
Man those umpire strike maps are confusing at first glance. It's really nice to have the data but can they really not do better than that horrible excuse for a legend?
Also, Mujica is not very good.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Apr 22, 2015 23:35:32 GMT -5
im surprised you posted this. He's not going to manage this game like it's the 2nd game of the ALCS. Breslow's job was to get outs and limit damage...and despite protestations about his roster spot....he had done a good job of that this year....until tonight. Have you considered that there might possibly have been some validity to those protestations, and that 9.2 IP doesn't really tell you everything about a pitcher? This makes no sense at all. What on earth is wrong with getting strikeouts from a 78 mph splitter when the bases are loaded? 1). Any post that you make regarding Breslow should have the following disclaimer attached - I HATE CRAIG BRESLOW 2). To the extent that any pitch can get a major league hitter out...I'd rather have guys in the bullpen that throw 95 mph heat....you apparently would rather have 78 mph splitters...
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Post by mgoetze on Apr 23, 2015 5:26:02 GMT -5
2). To the extent that any pitch can get a major league hitter out...I'd rather have guys in the bullpen that throw 95 mph heat....you apparently would rather have 78 mph splitters... Look, I'm not thrilled about the 78 mph splitters, but saying you would rather have Jason Garcia up with the bases loaded than Koji Uehara is just silly.
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Post by jimed14 on Apr 23, 2015 6:31:44 GMT -5
Have you considered that there might possibly have been some validity to those protestations, and that 9.2 IP doesn't really tell you everything about a pitcher? This makes no sense at all. What on earth is wrong with getting strikeouts from a 78 mph splitter when the bases are loaded? 1). Any post that you make regarding Breslow should have the following disclaimer attached - I HATE CRAIG BRESLOW 2). To the extent that any pitch can get a major league hitter out...I'd rather have guys in the bullpen that throw 95 mph heat....you apparently would rather have 78 mph splitters... I'd be using Breslow in the least leveraged situations at all times. He was literally my last choice to bring in there. The only way I'd be fine with Breslow there is if the bases were empty and they were up by 4.
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Apr 23, 2015 6:35:45 GMT -5
Yeah we could have brought Holt in and gotten the same result.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Apr 23, 2015 7:11:32 GMT -5
1). Any post that you make regarding Breslow should have the following disclaimer attached - I HATE CRAIG BRESLOW 2). To the extent that any pitch can get a major league hitter out...I'd rather have guys in the bullpen that throw 95 mph heat....you apparently would rather have 78 mph splitters... I'd be using Breslow in the least leveraged situations at all times. He was literally my last choice to bring in there. The only way I'd be fine with Breslow there is if the bases were empty and they were up by 4. And if the situation your describing doesn't come up for 10 straight games....do you think your doing your bullpen a favor by running everyone else out there? He's not the long guy in the pen....he's a part of the (already heavily taxed) bullpen. He had given up 3 hits in 9+ innings and 8 k's prior to last night's appearance. He's on the roster...you have to use him....and thinking your only going to use him low lev situations is silly.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Apr 23, 2015 7:19:32 GMT -5
2). To the extent that any pitch can get a major league hitter out...I'd rather have guys in the bullpen that throw 95 mph heat....you apparently would rather have 78 mph splitters... Look, I'm not thrilled about the 78 mph splitters, but saying you would rather have Jason Garcia up with the bases loaded than Koji Uehara is just silly. There's a guy in AAA right now that we could enjoy throwing 95+ darts....Matt Barnes. I know that won't be a popular opinion...but he is there and he could fill that role.
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Post by brianthetaoist on Apr 23, 2015 7:53:08 GMT -5
Yeah we could have brought Holt in and gotten the same result. Wow, it's like there was a split in the multiverse last night, and I went off into another dimension from some of y'all ... so, just for comparison's sake, in my universe, Breslow came in when two lefties were scheduled, gave up a soft liner, an infield pop-up, and got a K. Unfortunately, that soft liner found a hole, but you know the only reliable way to get out of a bases-loaded, no-out jam without giving up runs? Don't get into that situation in the first place. Breslow actually pitched pretty well. On the more general point, it's an issue with the Sox bullpen that they don't have guys who can reliably get Ks. Tazawa's probably the best guy to bring in there, but he had pitched the previous two days and wasn't really available. So, who's left? Ogando? Maybe ... But, on an even more general point, I think the underrated factor on bullpen management is the warm-up of pitchers. I think it's probably the primary reason for the "roles" pitchers play. In this case, the situation got out of hand so quickly, that it went from "probable early reliever situation, better get Breslow up" to "oh hell, this is maybe the key point in the game" in the space of a couple batters. If you warm up your key relievers every time a situation may get out of hand, you will burn them out.
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Post by mgoetze on Apr 23, 2015 8:08:39 GMT -5
came in when two lefties were scheduled, Well, the pinch hitting move was not hard to find. Maybe should have brought in Robbie Ross and hoped his reverse splits are real. Anyway, Breslow is not a guy with large splits, so meh, that's not really the point. On the other hand, Joe Kelly has been averaging more than one K per inning so far this year.
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Post by brianthetaoist on Apr 23, 2015 8:27:18 GMT -5
came in when two lefties were scheduled, Well, the pinch hitting move was not hard to find. Maybe should have brought in Robbie Ross and hoped his reverse splits are real. Anyway, Breslow is not a guy with large splits, so meh, that's not really the point. Yeah, not my main point either (although as an aside, the pitcher's split is only half the equation) ... which I think was obvious, no?
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