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6/26-6/28 Red Sox @ Rays Series Thread
atzar
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Post by atzar on Jun 27, 2015 16:55:59 GMT -5
Good outing for Miley. It's a shame the offense thought it was a 7:05 start time.
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nomar
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Posts: 10,830
Member is Online
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Post by nomar on Jun 27, 2015 16:57:03 GMT -5
Not over yet
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ianrs
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Post by ianrs on Jun 27, 2015 16:59:39 GMT -5
Not if Matt Barnes has anything to say about it. "Here Rene Rivera, take this cookie."
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atzar
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Posts: 1,817
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Post by atzar on Jun 27, 2015 17:02:42 GMT -5
Not if Matt Barnes has anything to say about it. "Here Rene Rivera, take this cookie." Can't get away with that thing at any level of baseball.
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radiohix
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'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
Posts: 6,345
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Post by radiohix on Jun 27, 2015 17:17:28 GMT -5
De Aza may actually get us something at the trade deadline. Maybe that was Ben's plan all along.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jun 27, 2015 17:31:44 GMT -5
Is it that much to ask that we can draft and develop one guy who can fill a spot in the bullpen? The record is very poor and that falls directly on the front office.
Taz...and that's about it. Shameful.
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radiohix
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'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
Posts: 6,345
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Post by radiohix on Jun 27, 2015 17:35:03 GMT -5
1-1 We'll get them tomorrow...Oh wait!
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jun 27, 2015 17:36:59 GMT -5
Trotting out Putz De Leon is another abomination. The injuries were bad, but is that all there really is out there? No other options?
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Post by soxfan06 on Jun 27, 2015 17:44:43 GMT -5
Another season, another joke of a team.
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Post by ray88h66 on Jun 27, 2015 17:45:26 GMT -5
Trotting out Putz De Leon is another abomination. The injuries were bad, but is that all there really is out there? No other options? Hannigan due back this week thankfully. I thought they might send Swihart down, but no reason to now. Let him stay up and work on his game. It's been tough watching Leon hit like a pitcher and catch like a pitcher. Give me Buggs Bunny over him any day.
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radiohix
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'At the end of the day, we bang. We bang. We're going to swing.' Alex Verdugo
Posts: 6,345
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Post by radiohix on Jun 27, 2015 17:52:43 GMT -5
Trotting out Putz De Leon is another abomination. The injuries were bad, but is that all there really is out there? No other options? Hannigan due back this week thankfully. I thought they might send Swihart down, but no reason to now. Let him stay up and work on his game. It's been tough watching Leon hit like a pitcher and catch like a pitcher. Give me Buggs Bunny over him any day. Yeah man, but we know how depth (of mediocre players) is important for Ben, It's the new market inefficiency!!!
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jun 27, 2015 18:00:36 GMT -5
Another season, another joke of a team. Agree. I have tried to take it easy, but there is a lot wrong with this team. They can't win more than 1 or 2 at a time. I don't see how heads aren't rolling in management. They find the time to change pitching coaches, send players down, etc...etc. But nobody has lost their job, that we are aware of, in the front office. If your going to play the heavy with under performance with players and coaches, how 'bout showing that people in charge of putting this mess together that there is accountability also. These are getting to be desperate times here.
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Post by johnsilver52 on Jun 27, 2015 18:02:53 GMT -5
Playing Leon no more than 1 game per week would have helped a lot also these past 3-4 weeks also after Swihart learned more and more about the pitching staff and MLB life in general. Leon really only has his throwing arm as a positive attribute, the rest of his game is a detriment to the team and should be getting limited exposure.
Would a team place a claim on him if he was waived over Swihart? The bigger answer is.. Would it really matter.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jun 27, 2015 18:07:25 GMT -5
Playing Leon no more than 1 game per week would have helped a lot also these past 3-4 weeks also after Swihart learned more and more about the pitching staff and MLB life in general. Leon really only has his throwing arm as a positive attribute, the rest of his game is a detriment to the team and should be getting limited exposure. Would a team place a claim on him if he was waived over Swihart? The bigger answer is.. Would it really matter. Further on that....was this the only option to begin with? I mean, there had to be another way.
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Post by bigpupp on Jun 27, 2015 18:43:48 GMT -5
Is it that much to ask that we can draft and develop one guy who can fill a spot in the bullpen? The record is very poor and that falls directly on the front office. Taz...and that's about it. Shameful. And they didn't even draft Taz. Have to go back to Bard, Papelbon and Delcarmen to find players the Sox have drafted that found sustained success in the bullpen.
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Post by station13 on Jun 27, 2015 19:38:37 GMT -5
Alex Wilson is thriving in Detroit.
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Post by arzjake on Jun 27, 2015 19:38:48 GMT -5
Is it that much to ask that we can draft and develop one guy who can fill a spot in the bullpen? The record is very poor and that falls directly on the front office. Taz...and that's about it. Shameful. And they didn't even draft Taz. Have to go back to Bard, Papelbon and Delcarmen to find players the Sox have drafted that found sustained success in the bullpen. And look what they did to Bard.. Doing the same with Barnes. Barnes needs to start much like Bard needed to continue relieving.. Since the Team is in Florida. Hey John, take a ride to Disney and ask your GM Mickey Mouse what his next move is, in baseball ops.
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Post by gregblossersbelly on Jun 27, 2015 19:39:23 GMT -5
Another season, another joke of a team. Apathy will set in if we have many more seasons like 3 of the last 4. You won't be able to charge very high ticket prices to watch a bumbling, stumbling product too much longer.
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Post by mgoetze on Jun 27, 2015 19:45:33 GMT -5
And look what they did to Bard.. Doing the same with Barnes. Barnes needs to start much like Bard needed to continue relieving.. Well, that's just too bad for Barnes, because he's not good enough to start in the majors. Unless he wants to spend life as a AAAA player, he'd better figure out how to pitch out of the pen.
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Post by James Dunne on Jun 27, 2015 19:46:40 GMT -5
Alex Wilson is thriving in Detroit. 14% K rate? Meh. Don't judge relievers by ERA. He's adequate, but the Sox shouldn't be kicking themselves about it. One useful thing about Wilson, though, is it is nice to have a competent reliever who you can turn to for multiple innings in a low-leverage situation. Wilson has done that, with five outings with nine outs or more. It is also nice to have a manager who recognizes "hey, the score is 13-1, let's use Alex Wilson instead of Junichi Tazawa today." EDIT: Upon further review, one of those three-inning outings was a start. In which he gave up no runs and threw only 43 pitches. That's kinda weird.
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cdj
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Post by cdj on Jun 27, 2015 20:03:09 GMT -5
Seems like you're cherry picking stats a little too hard. Miley has a better ERA/FIP/ERA+ all while pitching in the American League. Stat cherry picking can work both ways. Rubby has not been all that impressive/different than anything we've seen before. He's got good stuff and gives up a ton of jacks. I don't think it is anything to be distraught over. I wouldn't say I'm distraught, it just felt like a meh deal all along (The Bailey deal, Lowrie deal, Lackey, Lester - yes, I was, and remain, distraught). And I didn't type the full stat lines but looked at them both. I agree with the AL/NL differential, however. To me it was swapping like assets with one guy having a bit more potential. That, and I didn't get the quick trigger on extension. Completely understand. The quick trigger on the extension before he even threw a pitch here was questionable to me as well. I can see where you are coming from with giving up the guy with more potential- I just feel coming into the season Ben was looking to have as few question marks as the rotation as possible and Miley at the time represented a more stable option (whether or not that will turn out to be true remains to be seen, but at least it isn't looking disastrous like the other deals you mentioned)
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Post by iakovos11 on Jun 27, 2015 20:05:08 GMT -5
And look what they did to Bard.. Doing the same with Barnes. Barnes needs to start much like Bard needed to continue relieving.. Well, that's just too bad for Barnes, because he's not good enough to start in the majors. Unless he wants to spend life as a AAAA player, he'd better figure out how to pitch out of the pen. Yeah, Barnes needs to focus on the bullpen. As for Bard, IIRC he ended up starting again because he insisted he wanted to after so much bullpen success, right? It wasn't the front office that said, hey why don't try starting again. I thought they did a good job recognizing his problems in the rotation and converting him to the bullpen successfully. They did pretty good with the Andrew Miller reclamation project, too.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jun 27, 2015 20:14:54 GMT -5
14% K rate? Meh. Don't judge relievers by ERA. He's adequate, but the Sox shouldn't be kicking themselves about it. One useful thing about Wilson, though, is it is nice to have a competent reliever who you can turn to for multiple innings in a low-leverage situation. Wilson has done that, with five outings with nine outs or more. It is also nice to have a manager who recognizes "hey, the score is 13-1, let's use Alex Wilson instead of Junichi Tazawa today." EDIT: Upon further review, one of those three-inning outings was a start. In which he gave up no runs and threw only 43 pitches. That's kinda weird. Great...It's pin the tail on the manager again. Couldn't be that Dombrowski saw usefulness that Ben Charlatan didn't? Let's blame the manager.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jun 27, 2015 20:17:12 GMT -5
Well, that's just too bad for Barnes, because he's not good enough to start in the majors. Unless he wants to spend life as a AAAA player, he'd better figure out how to pitch out of the pen. Yeah, Barnes needs to focus on the bullpen. As for Bard, IIRC he ended up starting again because he insisted he wanted to after so much bullpen success, right? It wasn't the front office that said, hey why don't try starting again. I thought they did a good job recognizing his problems in the rotation and converting him to the bullpen successfully. They did pretty good with the Andrew Miller reclamation project, too. Blind Squirrel....acorn. Broken Clock...correct time....etc...etc...
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Post by raindelay on Jun 27, 2015 20:23:36 GMT -5
Exactly how does Tampa Bay keep coming up with good pitching staffs year after year after year. They've lost Shields, Price, Cook, Moore, Odorizi and they still come up with the Archer's etc etc. All their pitchers seem to have fast ball command and a change up to get outs. They change the bullpen on a yearly basis and they come up with lefties, righties that do the job. Boxberger was a decent starter last year and he transitioned to closer, seamlessly. I think they were a team maybe 8-10 years ago that realized that were not going to compete with Boston, NY, Toronto by spending money so they totally concentrated pitching as the great equalizer. You notice Maddon went to the Cubs but Hickey must have been given enough money to stay. The scouts working for the Rays that spot pitchers must be something else. They've got pitchers, Longoria and a bunch of role players. How much are they paying Astrubal Cabrera or that little guy in left field? Not much, as compared to Panda and Hanley and Porcello. You have to think that the Sox organization is a complete mess right now. They kinda remind me of a college football team that loses a really good coach and hires a bad one. For the first year, maybe two years the bad coach gets by on the other guys talent. Then the whole thing just collapses, poor play, lack of discipline, poor recruiting, the whole program takes a nose dive that takes years to dig out of. That's what the Sox seem to me right now. Poor decisions, poor planning, little to no focus on how to go about winning. Everybody seems to be just winging it right now.
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