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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Sept 15, 2016 16:46:04 GMT -5
It appears that this is for the Pomeranz deal and there's nothing else happening there, so the Sox don't get recompense. Before the freakout I predict that'll happen in here because the Red Sox aren't getting anything out of this, I ask this: Do you really think anything would have gone differently in the Pomeranz deal had they known his arm was sore? It's not like there's some bombshell that the Padres failed to disclose here. This doesn't have to do with Kimbrel (the report is they started this in Spring Training), and it wasn't like there was some significant issue that happened after the deal like with Rea. Per the reports when this first came up, the Red Sox weren't looking for a modification of the deal, which also makes me think this wasn't a major issue beyond a significant breach of etiquette. Chris, it seems to me that this is more more than a significant breach of etiquette with MLB suspending Preller for 30 days. Would the Red Sox have pushed for different players to be included in the deal if the Padres followed the expected medical reporting protocols? We don't know. But there should be some additional team penalties, similar to what the Red Sox had imposed with violating the international signing bonus limits.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Sept 15, 2016 16:47:24 GMT -5
It's a terrible way to do business, and I can't believe people would participate thinking it would never be found out.
As far as Sox compensation, it may be had to argue they deserve anything because Pomeranz is healthy and pitching well now, but we can't just assume that is going to be the case later. If MLB is doing this properly, they have access to both files, and if something is in the internal file that is not in the "trade" file, then the Sox are an injured party and deserve recompense. Maybe in the form of a SD draft pick or a Minor league player...that's how serious this should be considered.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Sept 15, 2016 17:01:33 GMT -5
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Post by adiospaydro2005 on Sept 15, 2016 17:06:26 GMT -5
The fact that Preller is a repeat offender probably played into his suspension. However, the Padres should also have some type of penalties including fines and loss of draft picks.
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Post by jimed14 on Sept 15, 2016 17:22:03 GMT -5
How the hell does the league decide punishments? This is way worse than the international signings violation. Preller's suspension is literally no punishment to the team, even though the entire team was in on it.
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sdl
Rookie
Who the hell is Stan Papi?
Posts: 135
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Post by sdl on Sept 15, 2016 17:52:47 GMT -5
We keep Pomeranz.
We get Espinoza back.
We get a draft pick from the Padres.
We can give the Padres Sandoval.
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Post by jmei on Sept 15, 2016 17:57:47 GMT -5
The key question is whether the Red Sox were materially disadvantaged by not receiving access to that additional medical information. That's a question that we don't know the answer to. If the additional information was immaterial-- if, say, he got extra stretching after his starts, or he took an oral analgesic to alleviate soreness, and it could not have reasonably affected the Red Sox' decision-making process, then the Red Sox really should not receive any compensation.
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Post by jmei on Sept 15, 2016 18:05:49 GMT -5
How the hell does the league decide punishments? This is way worse than the international signings violation. Preller's suspension is literally no punishment to the team, even though the entire team was in on it. You can't claim, with a straight face, that the entire team was in on it. Some of the front office and the medical staff was in on it. The players certainly weren't, and the coaches and ownership probably weren't. I think it's a fair comparison to make to the Red Sox international signings penalty, but I don't know that this is "way worse." The penalty is certainly less, but it may have been a lesser violation-- e.g., if it was just omitting to tell other teams about extra stretching or aspirin or hot tubs and the like.
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Post by amfox1 on Sept 15, 2016 18:36:35 GMT -5
Ken Rosenthal @ken_Rosenthal 3m3 minutes ago Sources: Pomeranz and other players traded by #Padres were taking oral medications that SD did not disclose.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Sept 15, 2016 18:48:01 GMT -5
That was the take on MLB TV/radio, that it wasn't just the Sox but an ongoing problem that other teams had experienced. Rosenthal, who was calling in by phone, was just about to name the other teams, I believe, when the connection went dead.
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sdl
Rookie
Who the hell is Stan Papi?
Posts: 135
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Post by sdl on Sept 15, 2016 19:09:02 GMT -5
We received damaged goods. Preller *knowingly* sent us a player who was not at 100%. Espinoza should be returned to us and in return, two (at the most) lower tier minor leaguers should be sent to San Diego. Since Preller also pulled this stunt with the Marlins (Colin Rea), his suspension should be longer. We should receive another player from the Padres as well.
If Manfred ends this thing now, Dombrowski should go to the courts over this. Preller's suspension doesn't change the fact that he knowingly did this.
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sdl
Rookie
Who the hell is Stan Papi?
Posts: 135
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Post by sdl on Sept 15, 2016 19:09:53 GMT -5
That was the take on MLB TV/radio, that it wasn't just the Sox but an ongoing problem that other teams had experienced. Rosenthal, who was calling in by phone, was just about to name the other teams, I believe, when the connection went dead. Phone goes dead at that moment...? Interesting....
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pd
Rookie
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Post by pd on Sept 15, 2016 19:47:21 GMT -5
We keep Pomeranz. We get Espinoza back. We get a draft pick from the Padres. We can give the Padres Sandoval. This is the only thing that makes sense.
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Post by memphis44 on Sept 15, 2016 19:51:40 GMT -5
We keep Pomeranz. We get Espinoza back. We get a draft pick from the Padres. We can give the Padres Sandoval. I had a dream that was just like this...
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Post by bigpupp on Sept 15, 2016 19:51:47 GMT -5
Ken Rosenthal @ken_Rosenthal 3m3 minutes ago Sources: Pomeranz and other players traded by #Padres were taking oral medications that SD did not disclose. This makes me feel better. Also explains why we didn't try to receive any compensation. Pomeranz isn't "damaged goods," but MLB needed to know that the Padres weren't being completely forthcoming in their dealings.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Sept 15, 2016 19:51:57 GMT -5
Being realistic, this is Boston. MLB isn't giving anything to the Red Sox.
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Post by bluechip on Sept 15, 2016 20:21:47 GMT -5
The key question is whether the Red Sox were materially disadvantaged by not receiving access to that additional medical information. That's a question that we don't know the answer to. If the additional information was immaterial-- if, say, he got extra stretching after his starts, or he took an oral analgesic to alleviate soreness, and it could not have reasonably affected the Red Sox' decision-making process, then the Red Sox really should not receive any compensation. I did not expect the Red Sox to get anything from this. I did expect the punishment to be more severe or actually punish the team which benefited from the blantant misconduct and unfair/deceptive practices. MLB has the ability to be punitive to discourage what appears to be a growing trend of deception (Padres), rule breaking ( Red Six international signings), and even illegal activities (Cardinals) among front offices.
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Post by mannofsteele on Sept 15, 2016 21:35:53 GMT -5
Preller should lose his job over this. What complete garbage. Espinoza should be returned for this.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Sept 15, 2016 21:46:39 GMT -5
The key question is whether the Red Sox were materially disadvantaged by not receiving access to that additional medical information. That's a question that we don't know the answer to. If the additional information was immaterial-- if, say, he got extra stretching after his starts, or he took an oral analgesic to alleviate soreness, and it could not have reasonably affected the Red Sox' decision-making process, then the Red Sox really should not receive any compensation. I don't see how you can't think they were materially disadvantaged. They recieved, what amounts to, fraudulent information. I don't know how the Sox could even determine the decision making process if they had the information, it's not at all a part of the trade equation as it went down. Preller was suspended for 30 days for this trade. I think MLB finds it easier to just suspend him, as compensation in the form of players or draft picks could set a precedent they don't want to get into, which I view as cowardly.
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Post by jmei on Sept 15, 2016 22:13:41 GMT -5
The key question is whether the Red Sox were materially disadvantaged by not receiving access to that additional medical information. That's a question that we don't know the answer to. If the additional information was immaterial-- if, say, he got extra stretching after his starts, or he took an oral analgesic to alleviate soreness, and it could not have reasonably affected the Red Sox' decision-making process, then the Red Sox really should not receive any compensation. I don't see how you can't think they were materially disadvantaged. They recieved, what amounts to, fraudulent information. I don't know how the Sox could even determine the decision making process if they had the information, it's not at all a part of the trade equation as it went down. Preller was suspended for 30 days for this trade. I think MLB finds it easier to just suspend him, as compensation in the form of players or draft picks could set a precedent they don't want to get into, which I view as cowardly. You don't know that. If the information that was not disclosed was, say, that Pomeranz took aspirin after his starts, do you really think that affects Boston's decision-making process?
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nomar
Veteran
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Post by nomar on Sept 15, 2016 22:29:53 GMT -5
A suspension is pointless, because Preller is fired. You can't employ a GM that nobody trusts. Kiss trades goodbye if you do.
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atzar
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Post by atzar on Sept 15, 2016 22:30:20 GMT -5
So I'm not going to shout "Return Espinoza!" or whatever... But what does the suspension of Preller even do? "Go play golf for a month." Meanwhile the trade deadline is in the rearview mirror and the Padres have long been out of any playoff race. Maybe I'm oversimplifying Preller's role, but it doesn't seem to me that he's needed for the next month anyway. So what's the point?
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Post by bigpupp on Sept 15, 2016 22:37:58 GMT -5
A suspension is pointless, because Preller is fired. You can't employ a GM that nobody trusts. Kiss trades goodbye if you do. Padres said today that they're not firing him.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,787
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Post by nomar on Sept 15, 2016 22:47:26 GMT -5
A suspension is pointless, because Preller is fired. You can't employ a GM that nobody trusts. Kiss trades goodbye if you do. Padres said today that they're not firing him. Oh bold move going the "were stupid" route.
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Post by Don Caballero on Sept 15, 2016 22:58:03 GMT -5
I would say the Padres should be banned over this, but they don't compete ever so who cares.
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