SoxProspects News
|
|
|
|
Legal
Forum Ground Rules
The views expressed by the members of this Forum do not necessarily reflect the views of SoxProspects, LLC.
© 2003-2024 SoxProspects, LLC
|
|
|
|
|
Forum Home | Search | My Profile | Messages | Members | Help |
Welcome Guest. Please Login or Register.
6/21-6/23 Red Sox vs. Blue Jays Series Thread
|
Post by jimed14 on Jun 21, 2019 22:43:28 GMT -5
8-1 in last 9 is great.
2 games back of Tampa now.
They have gained 6 games on them in last 10.
|
|
|
Post by telson13 on Jun 21, 2019 22:46:00 GMT -5
My feelings as well and Marcus Wilson has been impressive recently. That’s the nice added bonus. Marcus Wilson looks like he could push for a starting job in a couple of years. Whiff rate is ugly. But the tools are definitely there. He’s getting a little old for high-A (23 in 2 months), but I like him, too. Had a bomb today and he’s hitting something like .330, slugging .550 or so? Here’s hoping the Sox’s position-player development monster churns out another winner. Def has the skills to stay in CF.
|
|
|
Post by dirtdog on Jun 21, 2019 22:46:20 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by soxjim on Jun 21, 2019 22:48:24 GMT -5
Since we're all crowing about being right -- Xander was the guy I wanted to sign the most this offseason. I thought his production at SS was too valuable to pass up.
What I've been wrong about? Too many things to count!!!! I wanted Pearce and Eovaldi back for example. Though this isn't over. Yet obviously the money could have been much better spent. But there are others too.
|
|
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Jun 21, 2019 22:48:31 GMT -5
That’s the nice added bonus. Marcus Wilson looks like he could push for a starting job in a couple of years. Whiff rate is ugly. But the tools are definitely there. He’s getting a little old for high-A (23 in 2 months), but I like him, too. Had a bomb today and he’s hitting something like .330, slugging .550 or so? Here’s hoping the Sox’s position-player development monster churns out another winner. Def has the skills to stay in CF. Well, the demotion appears to be doing wonders for him. Hopefully they’ll promote him again soon and can carry that confidence to AA. If he can handle himself there then there’s a chance he can fulfill his potential. This team needs a bit of luck on the farm.
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Jun 21, 2019 22:50:34 GMT -5
Between Wilson and Duran, I think the Red Sox aren't in a horrible place for letting JBJ go as a free agent. But not before then.
|
|
|
Post by kevfc89 on Jun 21, 2019 22:50:38 GMT -5
Bogey has been something special this year. I’m glad he’s joining the elite of the elite short stops, especially after signing a contract extension. Along with the bullpen surprise, and given Chavis’s cooling off (though he’s def made some adjustments), Bogey’s post-extension continuation breakout building on last year (and all the years, really), is the highlight of this season. His run at my prediction, and seeing what Taylor, Brewer, et al do for the second half, is what has me really excited for the second half. I really think Bogey has an MVP in him, as tough as it is with Trout out there. He just seems so happy with where he’s at, in all the ways. can't leave out Devers offensive and defensive leaps forward on best stories of the year!
|
|
|
Post by redsoxfan2 on Jun 21, 2019 22:50:43 GMT -5
Since we're all crowing about being right -- Xander was the guy I wanted to sign the most this offseason. I thought his production at SS was too valuable to pass up. What I've been wrong about? Too many things to count!!!! I wanted Pearce and Eovaldi back for example. Though this isn't over. Yet obviously the money could have been much better spent. But there are others too. I wanted him the most only because you have nothing at SS and the potential drop off from a very good SS to an average one is huge. It’s an ugly position to fill. Him becoming an absolute monster is such an awesome bonus.
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Jun 21, 2019 22:52:52 GMT -5
Along with the bullpen surprise, and given Chavis’s cooling off (though he’s def made some adjustments), Bogey’s post-extension continuation breakout building on last year (and all the years, really), is the highlight of this season. His run at my prediction, and seeing what Taylor, Brewer, et al do for the second half, is what has me really excited for the second half. I really think Bogey has an MVP in him, as tough as it is with Trout out there. He just seems so happy with where he’s at, in all the ways. can't leave out Devers offensive and defensive leaps forward on best stories of the year! The Red Sox are Mookie and JDM playing like it's 2018 away from being a better team than they were in 2018.
|
|
|
Post by soxjim on Jun 21, 2019 22:54:05 GMT -5
Since we're all crowing about being right -- Xander was the guy I wanted to sign the most this offseason. I thought his production at SS was too valuable to pass up. What I've been wrong about? Too many things to count!!!! I wanted Pearce and Eovaldi back for example. Though this isn't over. Yet obviously the money could have been much better spent. But there are others too. I wanted him the most only because you have nothing at SS and the potential drop off from a very good SS to an average one is huge. It’s an ugly position to fill. Him becoming an absolute monster is such an awesome bonus. Yessss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
|
|
|
Post by telson13 on Jun 21, 2019 23:02:10 GMT -5
Since we're all crowing about being right -- Xander was the guy I wanted to sign the most this offseason. I thought his production at SS was too valuable to pass up. What I've been wrong about? Too many things to count!!!! I wanted Pearce and Eovaldi back for example. Though this isn't over. Yet obviously the money could have been much better spent. But there are others too. Lol, I remember that...I thought you were nuts for prioritizing him over Mookie. But it was a good read, he wanted to stay, and there sure aren’t many SS out there like him. He’s been healthy, too, his whole career (tho he shouldn’t have played through that wrist injury). His deal is going to border on exceptional value, imo. I think he puts up a bunch of 5-8 WAR seasons in those 6 years. That’s $40-$64M in FA equivalent value for $20M a year. At one point over the winter I asked, with the salary crunch, would you let Bogey go (instead of paying a presumptive 7/$175M or so) and insert Lin, then sign Gerrit Cole with the 7/175? The estimate was that Lin (1.5-2 WAR) and Cole (4-6 WAR) would provide similar value to Bogey (4-6 WAR) and a low-cost starter (? WAR). My preference was to keep Bogey, but I was curious how people valued him. On his deal, tho, it’s a no-brainer, and my WAR estimate looks like it’ll end up low.
|
|
|
Post by telson13 on Jun 21, 2019 23:05:20 GMT -5
Whiff rate is ugly. But the tools are definitely there. He’s getting a little old for high-A (23 in 2 months), but I like him, too. Had a bomb today and he’s hitting something like .330, slugging .550 or so? Here’s hoping the Sox’s position-player development monster churns out another winner. Def has the skills to stay in CF. Well, the demotion appears to be doing wonders for him. Hopefully they’ll promote him again soon and can carry that confidence to AA. If he can handle himself there then there’s a chance he can fulfill his potential. This team needs a bit of luck on the farm. Read somewhere they ID’d a swing flaw right away in Salem after he’d struggled in Portland, and he’s been killing it since. I think they probably want him to reduce the K’s, and that might be the promotion trigger. Hell, he’s doing everything else.
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Jun 21, 2019 23:08:28 GMT -5
Since we're all crowing about being right -- Xander was the guy I wanted to sign the most this offseason. I thought his production at SS was too valuable to pass up. What I've been wrong about? Too many things to count!!!! I wanted Pearce and Eovaldi back for example. Though this isn't over. Yet obviously the money could have been much better spent. But there are others too. Lol, I remember that...I thought you were nuts for prioritizing him over Mookie. But it was a good read, he wanted to stay, and there sure aren’t many SS out there like him. He’s been healthy, too, his whole career (tho he shouldn’t have played through that wrist injury). His deal is going to border on exceptional value, imo. I think he puts up a bunch of 5-8 WAR seasons in those 6 years. That’s $40-$64M in FA equivalent value for $20M a year. At one point over the winter I asked, with the salary crunch, would you let Bogey go (instead of paying a presumptive 7/$175M or so) and insert Lin, then sign Gerrit Cole with the 7/175? The estimate was that Lin (1.5-2 WAR) and Cole (4-6 WAR) would provide similar value to Bogey (4-6 WAR) and a low-cost starter (? WAR). My preference was to keep Bogey, but I was curious how people valued him. On his deal, tho, it’s a no-brainer, and my WAR estimate looks like it’ll end up low. OK here write this down. I prioritize signing Devers over Mookie. Mookie has to adjust to every pitcher pitching him offspeed outside like they did to Xander now and he is having trouble being elite doing it. But Devers can hit anything in any spot to any direction. I think Devers is the next Papi and while he can be good to better at 3B, imagine how many MVPs that could be.
|
|
|
Post by telson13 on Jun 21, 2019 23:08:57 GMT -5
Along with the bullpen surprise, and given Chavis’s cooling off (though he’s def made some adjustments), Bogey’s post-extension continuation breakout building on last year (and all the years, really), is the highlight of this season. His run at my prediction, and seeing what Taylor, Brewer, et al do for the second half, is what has me really excited for the second half. I really think Bogey has an MVP in him, as tough as it is with Trout out there. He just seems so happy with where he’s at, in all the ways. can't leave out Devers offensive and defensive leaps forward on best stories of the year! Dang, you’re right and that was really lame on my part. For me, it’s especially about the defense cuz I always thought he’d hit. But his defense has been awesome since May. He’s actually positive (+1.0) runs defensively per fg calculations, after being well negative through just a few weeks ago. Looking at the cumulative numbers doesn’t remotely reflect how transformative it’s been. It’s like a switch flipped.
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Jun 21, 2019 23:20:12 GMT -5
I hope that Xander doesn't opt out in 2022 and that's just based on my hopes and dreams that he's worth the contract and doesn't want to leave.
|
|
|
Post by telson13 on Jun 21, 2019 23:25:01 GMT -5
Lol, I remember that...I thought you were nuts for prioritizing him over Mookie. But it was a good read, he wanted to stay, and there sure aren’t many SS out there like him. He’s been healthy, too, his whole career (tho he shouldn’t have played through that wrist injury). His deal is going to border on exceptional value, imo. I think he puts up a bunch of 5-8 WAR seasons in those 6 years. That’s $40-$64M in FA equivalent value for $20M a year. At one point over the winter I asked, with the salary crunch, would you let Bogey go (instead of paying a presumptive 7/$175M or so) and insert Lin, then sign Gerrit Cole with the 7/175? The estimate was that Lin (1.5-2 WAR) and Cole (4-6 WAR) would provide similar value to Bogey (4-6 WAR) and a low-cost starter (? WAR). My preference was to keep Bogey, but I was curious how people valued him. On his deal, tho, it’s a no-brainer, and my WAR estimate looks like it’ll end up low. OK here write this down. I prioritize signing Devers over Mookie. Mookie has to adjust to every pitcher pitching him offspeed outside like they did to Xander now and he is having trouble being elite doing it. But Devers can hit anything in any spot to any direction. I think Devers is the next Papi and while he can be good to better at 3B, imagine how many MVPs that could be. Duly noted 🤣 I do agree that Devers has an elite ceiling as a hitter and a reasonable shot at getting there. I also think his defense (and a lot of it is how he looks, body type stuff from when he was younger, etc) is going to be terminally underrated for a *while*. But yeah, if he’s putting up .330/.410/.590 seasons and playing even just slightly better defense than he has the past month, he should be in some MVP races for sure. I think Mookie will make some adjustments. Same thing happened after his first breakout. I also think the contract being an issue was a good point. Sure seems like he’s pressing and not really having fun. I mean, Mookie put up 8-WAR and 10-WAR seasons, so that’s a high bar. But Devers, yes, has a shot at reaching those levels. He does get to everything, even 102.8 at the letters 😜 Thing is, they’re not mutually exclusinve. Mookie will be expensive but damn, Devers might sign a 10/$100M deal right now. Idk...seems like they should be locking up this core all-around. JBJ’s probably gone but hopefully Duran or Wilson is ready in 2021. They don’t need a star, just a 2-3 WAR guy. Wrap up Devers, Mookie, Benintendi, Rodriguez. Porcello leaves, Panda’s deal is gone, JBJ gone... Nunez, Pearce, now you’ve got $60M. Comes pretty close to covering the core.
|
|
|
Post by telson13 on Jun 21, 2019 23:28:22 GMT -5
I hope that Xander doesn't opt out in 2022 and that's just based on my hopes and dreams that he's worth the contract and doesn't want to leave. I thought it was a straight 6-yr deal, no funny business?
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Jun 21, 2019 23:29:18 GMT -5
OK here write this down. I prioritize signing Devers over Mookie. Mookie has to adjust to every pitcher pitching him offspeed outside like they did to Xander now and he is having trouble being elite doing it. But Devers can hit anything in any spot to any direction. I think Devers is the next Papi and while he can be good to better at 3B, imagine how many MVPs that could be. Duly noted 🤣 I do agree that Devers has an elite ceiling as a hitter and a reasonable shot at getting there. I also think his defense (and a lot of it is how he looks, body type stuff from when he was younger, etc) is going to be terminally underrated for a *while*. But yeah, if he’s putting up .330/.410/.590 seasons and playing even just slightly better defense than he has the past month, he should be in some MVP races for sure. I think Mookie will make some adjustments. Same thing happened after his first breakout. I also think the contract being an issue was a good point. Sure seems like he’s pressing and not really having fun. I mean, Mookie put up 8-WAR and 10-WAR seasons, so that’s a high bar. But Devers, yes, has a shot at reaching those levels. He does get to everything, even 102.8 at the letters 😜 Thing is, they’re not mutually exclusinve. Mookie will be expensive but damn, Devers might sign a 10/$100M deal right now. Idk...seems like they should be locking up this core all-around. JBJ’s probably gone but hopefully Duran or Wilson is ready in 2021. They don’t need a star, just a 2-3 WAR guy. Wrap up Devers, Mookie, Benintendi, Rodriguez. Porcello leaves, Panda’s deal is gone, JBJ gone... Nunez, Pearce, now you’ve got $60M. Comes pretty close to covering the core. Oh yell yeah, I agree they're not mutually exclusive. I was just making a point of how high I am on Devers. He's my Red Sox jesus. lol But Mookie has also filled that role.
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Jun 21, 2019 23:30:11 GMT -5
I hope that Xander doesn't opt out in 2022 and that's just based on my hopes and dreams that he's worth the contract and doesn't want to leave. I thought it was a straight 6-yr deal, no funny business? Opt out 3 years in and 7th year option for 535 plate appearances in 6th year.
|
|
|
Post by telson13 on Jun 21, 2019 23:47:42 GMT -5
I thought it was a straight 6-yr deal, no funny business? Opt out 3 years in and 7th year option for 535 plate appearances in 6th year. Well... Shit. Still, hopefully he wants to stick around. He’s kind of my ideal Red Sox player. He’s durable, affable, way above average, and he wants to play in Boston, having loyalty to the team and its fanbase. Should be a lifer.
|
|
|
Post by jimed14 on Jun 21, 2019 23:50:56 GMT -5
Opt out 3 years in and 7th year option for 535 plate appearances in 6th year. Well... Shit. Still, hopefully he wants to stick around. He’s kind of my ideal Red Sox player. He’s durable, affable, way above average, and he wants to play in Boston, having loyalty to the team and its fanbase. Should be a lifer. The fact that he signed it means he wants to be in Boston. So we only hope that he continues to want that. It seems like a really fair deal for the team. Hope he has some MVP voting bonuses in it.
|
|
|
Post by Oregon Norm on Jun 22, 2019 0:02:11 GMT -5
There's an object lesson for all of us in Vazquez' emergence as a hitter. How many times have we heard it said that catching is different? It's just a helluva a lot of work learning the game from the back of the plate, managing pitch sequences and developing the rich defensive skill-set needed for the position. It can take catchers a long time to come around with the bat given that focus, and some of them never do. It doesn't seem to matter. If they're good behind the dish, they can be middling standing beside it and many still get careers in MLB. The history of the game is littered with those players. Vazquez has a track record. He did this sort of thing in Greenville at the age of 20: Year | Age | AgeDif | Tm | Lg | Lev | Aff | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | SB | CS | BB | SO | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | TB | GDP | HBP | SH | SF | IBB |
---|
2011 | 20 | -1.4 | Greenville | SALL | A | BOS | 105 | 444 | 392 | 71 | 111 | 27 | 3 | 18 | 84 | 1 | 1 | 43 | 84 | .283 | .358 | .505 | .863 | 198 | 10 | 5 | 0 | 4 | 2 |
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original TableGenerated 6/21/2019. Of course, that's a long way from Boston and I'm not talking air miles. Not unlike Bogaerts he seems to have taken the multi-year learning track once he made it to the bigs. There was a small taste of the power when he did the same thing to the Yankees a few years back, blasting a game-winner high over the wall in left center. But most of that development was figuring out how to cover the outside part of the plate and figuring out what pitchers are trying to do to him. Having done that he can bring pitchers to him and he's doing it with a vengeance. We'll be able to tell that they got the memo if they start pitching around him and the OBP starts to rise. He has good plate discipline but he hasn't needed it this year. That may start to change. Who knows? There could be an all-star year or two hiding in that squat frame.
He's 28 and that's about when catchers who have some hitting chops start to come into their own. It does lengthen this lineup. And yes, the juiced ball seems to be to his liking as well.
|
|
|
Post by soxjim on Jun 22, 2019 1:22:50 GMT -5
Lol, I remember that...I thought you were nuts for prioritizing him over Mookie. But it was a good read, he wanted to stay, and there sure aren’t many SS out there like him. He’s been healthy, too, his whole career (tho he shouldn’t have played through that wrist injury). His deal is going to border on exceptional value, imo. I think he puts up a bunch of 5-8 WAR seasons in those 6 years. That’s $40-$64M in FA equivalent value for $20M a year. At one point over the winter I asked, with the salary crunch, would you let Bogey go (instead of paying a presumptive 7/$175M or so) and insert Lin, then sign Gerrit Cole with the 7/175? The estimate was that Lin (1.5-2 WAR) and Cole (4-6 WAR) would provide similar value to Bogey (4-6 WAR) and a low-cost starter (? WAR). My preference was to keep Bogey, but I was curious how people valued him. On his deal, tho, it’s a no-brainer, and my WAR estimate looks like it’ll end up low. OK here write this down. I prioritize signing Devers over Mookie. Mookie has to adjust to every pitcher pitching him offspeed outside like they did to Xander now and he is having trouble being elite doing it. But Devers can hit anything in any spot to any direction. I think Devers is the next Papi and while he can be good to better at 3B, imagine how many MVPs that could be. For the record-- I never thought the Sox had a shot at Mookie. I think he wants to test the market and there's nothing Sox can do about it. I wanted Xander over Sale and I wanted him over an extension of JDM. Also- I remember after 2017 season a great friend of mine suggested Sox need to trade Xander. I can remember yelling "No!!!" I told him his big slip in 2017 was all John Farrell. I can't believed I loved how amazing he was in 2013 and then over the years and in 2017 I just thought he went completely nuts. As for Devers -- I love him. I can recall I believe the late Nick Cafardo - a nice man and I enjoyed listening to him on NESN but wow was he teh typical "win now at all costs" type of sportswriter. I think he was all-in to trade Devers for an aging star. And I think he wanted to trade Mookie and Swihart for Hamels. I say NO and Hell No! And as much as I like Fangraphs the writers are just like us. I think last year during the season they soured a bit on him too much because of"recency bias." He was 21 years old throughout the season - his bday in Oct. Cody Bellinger had a big dip in year 2 and he was a year older than Devers. I think Devers is an absolute stud. As for Mookie in 202, can we afford him if SOx are trying to get under the tax? Does this mean both JDM and Porcello must go? But if JDM opts in, can Sox still afford Mookie?
|
|
|
Post by philsbosoxfan on Jun 22, 2019 1:25:20 GMT -5
Whiff rate is ugly. But the tools are definitely there. He’s getting a little old for high-A (23 in 2 months), but I like him, too. Had a bomb today and he’s hitting something like .330, slugging .550 or so? Here’s hoping the Sox’s position-player development monster churns out another winner. Def has the skills to stay in CF. Well, the demotion appears to be doing wonders for him. Hopefully they’ll promote him again soon and can carry that confidence to AA. If he can handle himself there then there’s a chance he can fulfill his potential. This team needs a bit of luck on the farm. I wrote about a change in Wilson's approach in the minors game day thread. The differences are pretty substantial.
|
|
|
Post by pedrofanforever45 on Jun 22, 2019 2:12:53 GMT -5
I thought it was a straight 6-yr deal, no funny business? Opt out 3 years in and 7th year option for 535 plate appearances in 6th year. Yes. Contract doesn't start until next season though.
|
|
|