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Pedroia Suffers "Significant" Setback With Knee Injury/Rehab
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Post by GyIantosca on Jan 21, 2020 16:08:57 GMT -5
He will never get this kind of money again. Unless the Sox tell him we are honoring your deal he is going to keep training and giving it a chance.
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Post by jimed14 on Jan 21, 2020 16:43:39 GMT -5
He will never get this kind of money again. Unless the Sox tell him we are honoring your deal he is going to keep training and giving it a chance. They are clearly at the point where the team is not going to insist that he keeps attempting to come back if he wants to get paid. They can work out an injury settlement like has been done many times before for other players. Prince Fielder comes to mind. When I say 'settlement', I'm not talking about a discount. Fielder got $106 million after his last game and will be paid through this season. Johan Santana was paid a lot after retirement as well.
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Post by jerrygarciaparra on Jan 21, 2020 18:03:16 GMT -5
Mostly just feel terrible for the guy. Had a great career and missed some significant time. At this point the setbacks have to be terribly depressing for him.
I think he should collect every remaining dime on the contract. The only thing I won't ever understand, and i will give him the benefit of the doubt, was his reaction to the retributive punishment the Sox engaged in on his behalf. Other than that, all time great for the Sox, IMO.
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Post by chrisfromnc on Jan 21, 2020 18:55:08 GMT -5
Mostly just feel terrible for the guy. Had a great career and missed some significant time. At this point the setbacks have to be terribly depressing for him. I think he should collect every remaining dime on the contract. The only thing I won't ever understand, and i will give him the benefit of the doubt, was his reaction to the retributive punishment the Sox engaged in on his behalf. Other than that, all time great for the Sox, IMO. Agree. It puzzled me how he disassociated himself from when the Sox (wasn’t it specifically Matt Barnes?) threw at Machado. I’m generally opposed to throwing at batters in nearly every circumstance. Im not even crazy about Red Sox pitchers throwing at Machado who is the professional baseball player I loathe more than any other and it isn’t close. My thought is that once your teammate takes that action on your behalf, the time for a public discussion about it (yelling to Machado from the dugout) is over. If he’s irritated with Barnes, or the manager about it, say that in the clubhouse later. If he wants to apologize to Machado, do that privately. I just thought it was a bad look for Pedey. I think thats the the only time I can say that about him as he is easily one of my all time favorite Sox players. I have mentioned several times that we named our cat after him. That is an honor few players get from me. He was tremendously fun to watch.
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Post by jimed14 on Jan 21, 2020 19:01:03 GMT -5
Why would anyone apologize to Machado? When MLB does not protect players from his actions, MLB players need to enact their own justice. If MLB doesn't like it, MLB should protect players from his actions.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jan 21, 2020 19:16:13 GMT -5
I don’t understand this Pedroia would make a good manager sentiment... maybe I’m miss remembering but he kind of sucked in the leadership role he got thrust into after Ortiz retired.
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Post by congusgambler33 on Jan 21, 2020 19:46:33 GMT -5
I know that Pedey is a gamer, but he is not helping the team with all his setbacks. I know retiring is going to be hard on him, but it really is time to think sincerely about it. Machado really altered his career dramatically to this point and it is hard to accept. I would venture a proposition of making him a bench coach. He probably would decline, but the playing career appears over sad to say.
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mobaz
Veteran
Posts: 2,765
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Post by mobaz on Jan 21, 2020 20:32:51 GMT -5
I remember quite a few hitters and a few pitchers quoting his help on making adjustments. Only one part of coaching but part of the sentiment I'm sure.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jan 21, 2020 20:48:43 GMT -5
I don’t understand this Pedroia would make a good manager sentiment... maybe I’m miss remembering but he kind of sucked in the leadership role he got thrust into after Ortiz retired. I think he'd make an excellent coach, but I don't really think he'd necessarily be a good manager. Either way, I'd anticipate seeing him in the Red Sox organization after he does retire, and I'm glad about that. Certain guys, like Pedroia, like Tek, Pedro, Ortiz, Tiant, Rice, Wakefield, and Pedroia, Dwight Evans, (and of course Yaz) just belong in the organization for life.
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Post by chrisfromnc on Jan 21, 2020 20:55:11 GMT -5
Why would anyone apologize to Machado? When MLB does not protect players from his actions, MLB players need to enact their own justice. If MLB doesn't like it, MLB should protect players from his actions. Pedroia kinda sorta was apologizing to him when he was telling Machado, “It wasn’t me.” Meaning the decision to throw at him was not something he asked to be done. He implied to Machado that he didn’t agree with the Sox throwing at him. It’s not a plain apology but he bordered on taking Machado’s side against his own pitcher. Pedey should empathize not not with the biggest turd in baseball but rather with his pitcher who might very well have been tasked by the manager to do something he didn’t want to do but did anyway solely to enforce some consequence on Machado.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jan 22, 2020 8:42:22 GMT -5
I don’t understand this Pedroia would make a good manager sentiment... maybe I’m miss remembering but he kind of sucked in the leadership role he got thrust into after Ortiz retired. I think he'd make an excellent coach, but I don't really think he'd necessarily be a good manager. Either way, I'd anticipate seeing him in the Red Sox organization after he does retire, and I'm glad about that. Certain guys, like Pedroia, like Tek, Pedro, Ortiz, Tiant, Rice, Wakefield, and Pedroia, Dwight Evans, (and of course Yaz) just belong in the organization for life. Just curious... why would he make an excellent coach? Let’s leave the organization ambassador role out of things. I mean on the field coach working with other players, communicating to them and teaching them the game etc. He’s not a new school guy, he’s old school hard work go 1,000 percent, no excuses balls to the wall type player. That doesn’t exactly translate. I agree he was a good lead by example player but that doesn’t translate to coaching. He’s not all that charismatic - he’s pretty blunt whether you like it or not. Sure he jokes and whatnot so I’m not saying he’s a stick up his ass guy, but he wasn’t a get along with everyone guy either. It bothered some teammates how close he was to Tito, he didn’t lead well from the front as a vocal leader when Ortiz left and it bothered teammates when he showed up the guys trying to stick up for him with Machado by publicly telling him during the game that he didn’t tell them to do it. None of that screams to me good future coach or manager. Now people change especially from different roles, but I don’t see any objective evidence that he’s good coaching material in the year 2020. He seems more like he’s 30-40 years too late.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jan 22, 2020 9:12:47 GMT -5
I think he'd make an excellent coach, but I don't really think he'd necessarily be a good manager. Either way, I'd anticipate seeing him in the Red Sox organization after he does retire, and I'm glad about that. Certain guys, like Pedroia, like Tek, Pedro, Ortiz, Tiant, Rice, Wakefield, and Pedroia, Dwight Evans, (and of course Yaz) just belong in the organization for life. Just curious... why would he make an excellent coach? Let’s leave the organization ambassador role out of things. I mean on the field coach working with other players, communicating to them and teaching them the game etc. He’s not a new school guy, he’s old school hard work go 1,000 percent, no excuses balls to the wall type player. That doesn’t exactly translate. I agree he was a good lead by example player but that doesn’t translate to coaching. He’s not all that charismatic - he’s pretty blunt whether you like it or not. Sure he jokes and whatnot so I’m not saying he’s a stick up his ass guy, but he wasn’t a get along with everyone guy either. It bothered some teammates how close he was to Tito, he didn’t lead well from the front as a vocal leader when Ortiz left and it bothered teammates when he showed up the guys trying to stick up for him with Machado by publicly telling him during the game that he didn’t tell them to do it. None of that screams to me good future coach or manager. Now people change especially from different roles, but I don’t see any objective evidence that he’s good coaching material in the year 2020. He seems more like he’s 30-40 years too late. I disagree. It's been known that he would work with players on their swing. I remember him trying to help Napoli. I think he even tried to help Ortiz. And there were other instances as well. I'm going from memory here, but I don't think he was as frigid with his teammates as you make him out to be. If he saw something that needed fixing, he wasn't shy going up to a teammate and offering to help out. Helping teammates improve their game is a good quality that a future coach has. A coach doesn't have to be everybody's buddy. He focuses in and helps whoever is willing to accept his help. A manager has to be more uniting of his team than a coach has to.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Jan 22, 2020 10:06:45 GMT -5
Something else to consider is that perhaps Pedroia truly didn't think that Machado's aim or intention was to hurt him, so after enough awkward/ridiculous looking attempts by his teammates to "protect" him, he was kind of embarrassed by it.
As a fan, it's easy to say, "I hate that dirty P.O.S Machado, etc....", but that might only be a fan's viewpoint.
And his teammates tried to do the right thing having his back, but after it went awry, maybe Pedroia thought it was time to let it go and actually try to concentrate on winning the game rather than worrying about revenge.
I don't know if any of the above is true but I suppose it's plausible. I had the pleasure of meeting Doug Mientkiewicz a couple of weeks ago and I asked him of his recollection of the day that he started at 2b for the Red Sox. You may remember he was a gold glove caliber 1b, but extremely inexperienced at 2b.
He told me and the audience of that night and mentioned the part about how Carlos Delgado leveled him trying to break up a DP. He mentioned that between Schilling and Pedro, they were both offering to hit Delgado, repeatedly. We laughed at the story and he said it made him feel good that his teammates has his back - and as a newcomer he felt like he was part of the team, and he did say that by far that 2004 team was the closest team he had ever been on.
But he also got to the point, where it was like "Thanks guys, but it's ok. You don't keep having to hit Delgado". Maybe that's where Pedroia was at, and keep in mind, the way the Sox retaliated against Delgado looked professional and the way the Sox tried to retaliate against Machado looked like amateur hour.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jan 22, 2020 19:38:13 GMT -5
I’m not saying Pedroia was a bad teammate or didn’t get along with anyone. We will see. Some guys just can’t stop being around the game but if I made the money he’s made I wouldn’t be traveling around away from my kids to be a position coach over the course of an MLB schedule. Get your fix as a special assistant in Spring training.
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jimoh
Veteran
Posts: 3,967
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Post by jimoh on Jan 24, 2020 14:01:38 GMT -5
Can the Red Sox make Pedroia a coach and pay him 500k for that and negotiate a 500k reduction in his salary, removing that much from the taxable budget?
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Jan 24, 2020 17:03:09 GMT -5
Can the Red Sox make Pedroia a coach and pay him 500k for that and negotiate a 500k reduction in his salary, removing that much from the taxable budget? No. He's getting his salary, which will be on the books, until he retires. That should not happen until his contract runs out.
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Post by patford on Jan 25, 2020 9:52:32 GMT -5
Can the Red Sox make Pedroia a coach and pay him 500k for that and negotiate a 500k reduction in his salary, removing that much from the taxable budget? No. He's getting his salary, which will be on the books, until he retires. That should not happen until his contract runs out. This still isn't clear to me. What if he retires ? Is his salary then off the books ? And couldn't the Sox then sign him in some coaching capacity and pay him the same amount ? It's not like it would be a ruse. He clearly is never going to play again. At most I could see him getting back into one game so the fans could say goodbye.
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Post by swingingbunt on Jan 25, 2020 11:11:46 GMT -5
No. He's getting his salary, which will be on the books, until he retires. That should not happen until his contract runs out. This still isn't clear to me. What if he retires ? Is his salary then off the books ? And couldn't the Sox then sign him in some coaching capacity and pay him the same amount ? It's not like it would be a ruse. He clearly is never going to play again. At most I could see him getting back into one game so the fans could say goodbye. The fact that you're asking about paying Pedroia two times more than any other coach just to get him off the salary cap, kind of proves the point that it's a ruse.
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Post by patford on Jan 25, 2020 11:29:16 GMT -5
He certainly isn't faking the condition of his knee. If the pay seems out of line for a coach make him an assistant vice president.
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Post by jimed14 on Jan 25, 2020 12:10:25 GMT -5
Let's talk about Trey Ball instead.
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Post by swingingbunt on Jan 25, 2020 12:15:24 GMT -5
He certainly isn't faking the condition of his knee. If the pay seems out of line for a coach make him an assistant vice president. The fact that you're asking about paying Pedroia two times more than any other coach making him an assistant vice president just to get him off the salary cap, kind of proves the point that it's a ruse.
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Jan 25, 2020 15:33:23 GMT -5
David Wright, Prince Fielder, etc. This is how it goes down. He's not going to officially retire until his contract ends. Nor should he.
If he's done, question becomes whether the keep him on the roster or release him. Would depend on things like insurance. His CBT hit will remain the same though.
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Post by rjp313jr on Jan 26, 2020 10:51:13 GMT -5
He certainly isn't faking the condition of his knee. If the pay seems out of line for a coach make him an assistant vice president. I understand your thinking and the logic behind it BUT the league would step in and stop such a thing as it’s a circumvention if the luxury tax. This isn’t debatable whether it’s a real injury or a fake injury. We just need to accept it as fact and move on.
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Post by manfred on Jan 26, 2020 13:18:15 GMT -5
This is a basic question, but do players on the injured list count 100% towards the tax? Is there no break? I guess that’s rhetorical, as I’m sure there isn’t. But maybe there should be. It seems like it would be better for competition to give teams some sort of exception slot to replace guys who are out long term (so, for example, the Mets could have used it last year to help offset the sunk cost of Cespedes).
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Post by rjp313jr on Jan 26, 2020 14:37:59 GMT -5
This is a basic question, but do players on the injured list count 100% towards the tax? Is there no break? I guess that’s rhetorical, as I’m sure there isn’t. But maybe there should be. It seems like it would be better for competition to give teams some sort of exception slot to replace guys who are out long term (so, for example, the Mets could have used it last year to help offset the sunk cost of Cespedes). Yes they count 100% just the same as if they were not injured. The only teams it would help is high payroll teams that pay the tax. Lower payroll teams don’t benefit from that. It’s cut against the entire point of the luxury tax. The Mets were not a tax team therefore it wouldn’t help them at all.
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