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Where did things go wrong?
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Post by orcoaster on Dec 11, 2022 13:56:54 GMT -5
Maybe so. But Bloom's press conference today rings hollow. He says he knew prior to the "heavy discussions" that Bogaerts was not signing with them. Why then at the airport did he need a minute? And another minute? And another minute after that? Why did his voice crack? That is not the reaction of someone hearing what they expected to hear. It is one of shock and surprise. Whatever. I understand that when a GM talks to the team's fans, he's also talking to every other league GM and every player's agents. A GM can't be 100% transparent ever. But it seems to me in this case Bloom was caught in an unfiltered, raw human moment. He can't explain it away. But maybe it will all work out. Fingers crossed. My take was that he actually did care about Xander and knows what he means to fans. He was suddenly having to process Bogaerts definitively not being in Boston anymore, and all that came with that. The meetings seem so fast-paced that even if they knew for a day or so that they were likely to lose him it might not have had a moment to really sink in. Like, imagine you have a beloved relative in the hospital with an illness. They seem like they're getting better, but the day before things took a turn for the worse. You might know they could die, but it's all going to sink in once you see that flatline, and you're going to feel all sorts of stuff. Obviously Bogie isn't dead, but he mattered to millions of people, and Bloom was the guy most responsible for him leaving. Imagine if, in the metaphor, you were the one who got that relative sick in the first place. It probably would hit even harder. Agree though - just gotta cross our fingers and see if it works out You could be right. Maybe when the news broke the weight of the new reality hit him. Still, I think his reaction was stronger than that. When you're expecting bad news, it's not a surprise when it comes. Let me offer a different metaphor. You've applied for a job. You don't expect to get it. In fact, the interviewer tells you there are better candidates and you shouldn't expect a call back. The next day you find out you didn't get it. How do you feel? Do you need a minute? Probably not. Now imagine instead the interviewer tells you everything looks great. You're a perfect fit. In fact, here's the names of a couple good real estate agents to help you with the move. You're excited but you can't say anything yet. The next day you find out you didn't get it. How do you feel? Need a minute? Yeah, you probably do. The other thing that bothers me about Bloom's post Xander statement was the leaking. It's a matter of pride with his office that they do not leak. Ever. In fact, earlier that week when a rumor surfaced that Xander had cut ties with the Red Sox, Sam Kennedy was sent out there immediately to deny it. Not surprising. Why then were the Red Sox content to let the stories about them fly unabated on Wednesday afternoon/evening with no pushback? Especially when, as Bloom now acknowledges, those stories were intended to drive up the price. Doesn't fit the MO. OK, maybe he likes to see a competitor pay more than they have to. Maybe he's happy to help Xander get more money than he would have otherwise. But why would he have "needed a minute" (three actually) when this thing that he expected to happen, and in fact helped to happen, actually happened? Doesn't add up.
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Post by Smittyw on Dec 11, 2022 14:10:46 GMT -5
I'm just not going to read too much into the "Bloom needed a minute" supposed bombshell one way or the other. (He was probably thinking "11 YEARS?? DEAR GOD, PRELLER, WHAT THE $%&@!")
If anything, this whole affair has been a reminder of how little idea most of these sportswriters and talking heads have of what's really going on behind the scenes.
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Post by notstarboard on Dec 11, 2022 14:22:57 GMT -5
My take was that he actually did care about Xander and knows what he means to fans. He was suddenly having to process Bogaerts definitively not being in Boston anymore, and all that came with that. The meetings seem so fast-paced that even if they knew for a day or so that they were likely to lose him it might not have had a moment to really sink in. Like, imagine you have a beloved relative in the hospital with an illness. They seem like they're getting better, but the day before things took a turn for the worse. You might know they could die, but it's all going to sink in once you see that flatline, and you're going to feel all sorts of stuff. Obviously Bogie isn't dead, but he mattered to millions of people, and Bloom was the guy most responsible for him leaving. Imagine if, in the metaphor, you were the one who got that relative sick in the first place. It probably would hit even harder. Agree though - just gotta cross our fingers and see if it works out You could be right. Maybe when the news broke the weight of the new reality hit him. Still, I think his reaction was stronger than that. When you're expecting bad news, it's not a surprise when it comes. Let me offer a different metaphor. You've applied for a job. You don't expect to get it. In fact, the interviewer tells you there are better candidates and you shouldn't expect a call back. The next day you find out you didn't get it. How do you feel? Do you need a minute? Probably not. Now imagine instead the interviewer tells you everything looks great. You're a perfect fit. In fact, here's the names of a couple good real estate agents to help you with the move. You're excited but you can't say anything yet. The next day you find out you didn't get it. How do you feel? Need a minute? Yeah, you probably do. The other thing that bothers me about Bloom's post Xander statement was the leaking. It's a matter of pride with his office that they do not leak. Ever. In fact, earlier that week when a rumor surfaced that Xander had cut ties with the Red Sox, Sam Kennedy was sent out there immediately to deny it. Not surprising. Why then were the Red Sox content to let the stories about them fly unabated on Wednesday afternoon/evening with no pushback? Especially when, as Bloom now acknowledges, those stories were intended to drive up the price. Doesn't fit the MO. OK, maybe he likes to see a competitor pay more than they have to. Maybe he's happy to help Xander get more money than he would have otherwise. But why would he have "needed a minute" (three actually) when this thing that he expected to happen, and in fact helped to happen, actually happened? Doesn't add up. I don't think I would need a minute in either hypothetical. But, if I was the sole breadwinner for my family and this job was my only chance at putting food on the table, or something, I think both situations would hit me hard. The weight of the loss itself matters as much or more than the level of surprise. I can imagine the combination of personal sentimentality, or the thought of letting down millions of fans, or the dread of having to answer questions about this ad nauseum for the rest of the offseason, or even the mental calculus of going back through his other options, or simply wanting to collect his thoughts before speaking to a reporter, being enough to make him take a minute. You can't really do anything more than speculate on any of this, and that speculation is going to be heavily colored by your feelings about the move. If you think Xander leaving was ridiculous, a failure, etc. then you see the GM who is in over his head and has no clue what he's doing...because how else could he let Xander walk? If you're not particularly concerned, you understand the move, and you don't assume this needs a 4D chess move from Boras to make sense.
There hasn't been pushback from the Red Sox on the majority of the rumors this offseason. I thought Boras denied the rumor that the Sox had cut ties with X before Kennedy did? Are you sure it's not just the fact that the team was getting constantly bombarded by questions about X?
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Post by jmei on Dec 11, 2022 15:09:44 GMT -5
I think we’re all putting too much weight on a reporter’s subjective interpretation of how Bloom looked at an airport gate after a long winter meetings.
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Post by keninten on Dec 11, 2022 15:09:58 GMT -5
He also could have needed a minute because he wanted to think about and how to say what he wanted. I`m one who says too much without thinking and regret it later.
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Post by orcoaster on Dec 11, 2022 15:13:51 GMT -5
I'm just not going to read too much into the "Bloom needed a minute" supposed bombshell one way or the other. (He was probably thinking "11 YEARS?? DEAR GOD, PRELLER, WHAT THE $%&@!") If anything, this whole affair has been a reminder of how little idea most of these sportswriters and talking heads have of what's really going on behind the scenes.That's precisely why I think this story is so revelatory. We rarely, if ever, see persons in powerful positions as they truly are. This was not behind the scenes. It was a raw, unvarnished, unspun, human moment in real time right before our eyes. It's a window into who Bloom is. It's possible that Bloom learned from that tweet he had been royally played by Boras. If so, it was a huge, rookie error. Bloom succumbed to his own pride. That's a hard flaw to fix. Hopefully he learns from it. Rest assured the rest of the league has. Bloom has a weakness; unaddressed, it will be exploited again. And that's a problem for the Boston Red Sox. Or not. I could be wrong.
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Post by orcoaster on Dec 11, 2022 15:18:25 GMT -5
You could be right. Maybe when the news broke the weight of the new reality hit him. Still, I think his reaction was stronger than that. When you're expecting bad news, it's not a surprise when it comes. Let me offer a different metaphor. You've applied for a job. You don't expect to get it. In fact, the interviewer tells you there are better candidates and you shouldn't expect a call back. The next day you find out you didn't get it. How do you feel? Do you need a minute? Probably not. Now imagine instead the interviewer tells you everything looks great. You're a perfect fit. In fact, here's the names of a couple good real estate agents to help you with the move. You're excited but you can't say anything yet. The next day you find out you didn't get it. How do you feel? Need a minute? Yeah, you probably do. The other thing that bothers me about Bloom's post Xander statement was the leaking. It's a matter of pride with his office that they do not leak. Ever. In fact, earlier that week when a rumor surfaced that Xander had cut ties with the Red Sox, Sam Kennedy was sent out there immediately to deny it. Not surprising. Why then were the Red Sox content to let the stories about them fly unabated on Wednesday afternoon/evening with no pushback? Especially when, as Bloom now acknowledges, those stories were intended to drive up the price. Doesn't fit the MO. OK, maybe he likes to see a competitor pay more than they have to. Maybe he's happy to help Xander get more money than he would have otherwise. But why would he have "needed a minute" (three actually) when this thing that he expected to happen, and in fact helped to happen, actually happened? Doesn't add up. I don't think I would need a minute in either hypothetical. But, if I was the sole breadwinner for my family and this job was my only chance at putting food on the table, or something, I think both situations would hit me hard. The weight of the loss itself matters as much or more than the level of surprise. I can imagine the combination of personal sentimentality, or the thought of letting down millions of fans, or the dread of having to answer questions about this ad nauseum for the rest of the offseason, or even the mental calculus of going back through his other options, or simply wanting to collect his thoughts before speaking to a reporter, being enough to make him take a minute. You can't really do anything more than speculate on any of this, and that speculation is going to be heavily colored by your feelings about the move. If you think Xander leaving was ridiculous, a failure, etc. then you see the GM who is in over his head and has no clue what he's doing...because how else could he let Xander walk? If you're not particularly concerned, you understand the move, and you don't assume this needs a 4D chess move from Boras to make sense.
There hasn't been pushback from the Red Sox on the majority of the rumors this offseason. I thought Boras denied the rumor that the Sox had cut ties with X before Kennedy did? Are you sure it's not just the fact that the team was getting constantly bombarded by questions about X? Maybe it's not a job, but a dream house, a stock split, or -- heaven forbid -- a girl (or guy). YMMV. I'm probably tilting at windmills here, but I appreciate the discussion.
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Post by dirtywaterinla on Dec 12, 2022 0:23:47 GMT -5
Call me a fool, but I still think after much reflection it’s wise that the team isn’t going all in on top tier free agents. Look at the Mets, Rangers, Padres and Phillies in recent years.
Sure, 3 of these 4 teams made the playoffs in recent years, but do they have a WS title to show for it? No.
Simply put, you can’t buy yourself a title.
Signing a top tier free agent to fill key role is always wise (e.g. Correa), but signing mid-tier FAs w/ promise, developing talent and trading is the key to winning it all.
I’ll give Bloom (and yes, ownership too) the grace to put up or shut up in 2023.
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Post by grandsalami on Dec 12, 2022 1:22:04 GMT -5
Call me a fool, but I still think after much reflection it’s wise that the team isn’t going all in on top tier free agents. Look at the Mets, Rangers, Padres and Phillies in recent years. Sure, 3 of these 4 teams made the playoffs in recent years, but do they have a WS title to show for it? No. Simply put, you can’t buy yourself a title. Signing a top tier free agent to fill key role is always wise (e.g. Correa), but signing mid-tier FAs w/ promise, developing talent and trading is the key to winning it all. I’ll give Bloom (and yes, ownership too) the grace to put up or shut up in 2023. Or the yankees and their “death star”
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