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Post by redsox04071318champs on Mar 17, 2024 14:22:32 GMT -5
A hot month by Valdez wouldn't change a thing for me. It's about the next six years, the 2b on the next great Red Sox team. If not then they spent 17 million to trade away their best pitcher, which would make no sense. They could sent Grissom down under the thought of doing a rehab and acclimating him to 2b defensively but when push comes to shove he will be their long term 2b. If Valdez has a hot start he could become trade bait eventually. I sure as hell wouldn't take the next six years of Valdez's career over the next six years of Grissom's career. I’m not sure it’s this clear cut. Story will have 3 years left after this. Mayer could potentially push him off SS for all 3 of those years. Yorke is almost ready, and Valdez looks more capable of making routine plays. Not to mention the possibility of Rafaela seeing more time in the MIF (whichbecomes more likely if Bleis shines), or a breakout from Cespedes or Zanetello, who are both higher ceiling players than Grissom who could logically project into 2B. If Grissom doesn’t separate himself and show himself deserving of the spot, I don’t expect it to be handed to him. And his competition is quite stiff, both now, and later. I would hope the Sox wouldn't be this impatient with Grissom. I'm sorry but no player in the Sox system was a .320 hitter (while being a young player as opposed to some 25 year old getting his numbers off 21 year old kids). Grissom is a pretty damn good bet to be a really good hitter. The next really good Red Sox team is likely to have Grissom atop the order than an aging Trevor Story playing a key role. Mayer won't be up this year and probably wont start the 2025 season in Boston either. Story has probably 1.5 to 2 seasons left before he moves off SS for Mayer and if he does he could wind up his last season in Boston as a 3b if he's not traded first. Not too hard to see Breslow wishing to reallocate Story's salary. Again, the Sox could have kept Sale for another season given their crying need for front line starting pitching or they could have dumped virtually his entire salary, but instead paid a huge chunk of it to invest in Grissom, who they obviously have big plans for as he fits the long term criteria building block they're looking for. They're not going to give up on that because he's going to miss a month. He's a long term investment. Otherwise what's the point of that if you change your mind so damn quickly? So what if Valdez has a good April? Does that mean he is going to be acceptable defensively long term and handle lefties acceptably so he doesn't require a platoon partner? If it was all about April, Alex Verdugo would be a HOFer. My overarching point is Grissom will and should get a lot of rope to work with. If the Sox can be patient with Casas they can be as well for Grissom because over the next six years he will be better than Valdez, Story, and Yorke. I know I'm putting myself out there because I feel strongly about this. Just like when there was talk before last season that the Sox might consider dealing Casas in the right deal and I was strong in my opinion that they need to hang onto Casas. I feel almost as strongly about Grissom and his hit tool and feel his defense at 2b will come around with experience.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Mar 17, 2024 15:05:10 GMT -5
Valdez is a statue and is at best a stop gap while we wait for Grissom.
I also wouldn't write Mayer over Story at SS in ink jut yet. ADD: Even if Mayer progresses like we all hope.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Mar 17, 2024 15:11:09 GMT -5
"Statue" seems a bit harsh.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Mar 17, 2024 15:17:14 GMT -5
It's a common expression for a player that lacks mobility.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Mar 17, 2024 15:33:11 GMT -5
"Statue" is certainly a derisive term & I haven't seen/read enough of E Valdez's defense to know how accurate it is.
Early returns suggested he was erratic defensively but I didn't notice he couldn't move adequately for the position.
Maybe your scouting is better than mine. Or maybe it's merely more judgmental.
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Post by scottysmalls on Mar 17, 2024 17:18:56 GMT -5
Grissom is also a notoriously bad defender, how big is the gap really between he and Valdez on that side?
I do agree though that Mayer forcing Story off short isn’t a given, but regardless one of those guys being at 2B in a couple years is pretty plausible too.
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Post by sxfan on Mar 17, 2024 19:18:01 GMT -5
I laughed for 2 minutes straight at this. Devers lives in Yankees fans heads even in video games. Thought this was relevant watching today's spring training game, watching Devers blasting one over the Yankees again.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Mar 17, 2024 19:45:33 GMT -5
Grissom is described as athletic and several people have commented that they have confidence that he will be a good defender. I have no opinion of my own there. Yorke is a better defender now than Valdez will ever be, that's my opinion. Your mileage may vary.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Mar 17, 2024 19:55:39 GMT -5
Grissom is described as athletic and several people have commented that they have confidence that he will be a good defender. I have no opinion of my own there. Yorke is a better defender now than Valdez will ever be, that's my opinion. Your mileage may vary. Grissom is a horrible defensive SS. Fortunately the Red Sox didn't acquire him to play SS. They acquired him to play 2b. He has bad numbers in a limited number of games/innings as a 2b. Big deal. Let him acclimate to 2b. Give him time. He won't be great at first but there's a reasonable chance he can be adequate if not better than that at 2b. It's not like he's 25 and what you see is what you get. I think it's more likely that Grissom turns into an acceptable 2b than Valdez does. But as you say, YMMV.
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Mar 17, 2024 20:12:26 GMT -5
Grissom is described as athletic and several people have commented that they have confidence that he will be a good defender. I have no opinion of my own there. Yorke is a better defender now than Valdez will ever be, that's my opinion. Your mileage may vary. Grissom is a horrible defensive SS. Fortunately the Red Sox didn't acquire him to play SS. They acquired him to play 2b. He has bad numbers in a limited number of games/innings as a 2b. Big deal. Let him acclimate to 2b. Give him time. He won't be great at first but there's a reasonable chance he can be adequate if not better than that at 2b. It's not like he's 25 and what you see is what you get. I think it's more likely that Grissom turns into an acceptable 2b than Valdez does. But as you say, YMMV. I'd be thrilled if Grissom developed into as good a defender as Meidroth. The bat is for real. To me, how this is all going to shake out is pretty much a whole lot of speculation and ultimately what will happen when both Story and Mayer are on the same roster. I don't believe any of the candidates has a defensive ceiling as good as Story at either SS or 2B.
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Post by redsox04071318champs on Mar 17, 2024 20:36:48 GMT -5
Grissom is a horrible defensive SS. Fortunately the Red Sox didn't acquire him to play SS. They acquired him to play 2b. He has bad numbers in a limited number of games/innings as a 2b. Big deal. Let him acclimate to 2b. Give him time. He won't be great at first but there's a reasonable chance he can be adequate if not better than that at 2b. It's not like he's 25 and what you see is what you get. I think it's more likely that Grissom turns into an acceptable 2b than Valdez does. But as you say, YMMV. I'd be thrilled if Grissom developed into as good a defender as Meidroth. The bat is for real. To me, how this is all going to shake out is pretty much a whole lot of speculation and ultimately what will happen when both Story and Mayer are on the same roster. I don't believe any of the candidates has a defensive ceiling as good as Story at either SS or 2B. I look at it this way. Story is the SS in 2024, his age 31 season and probably starts the 2025 season as the SS, his age 32 season. If he retains his job for 2026 and Mayer is finally fully ready to take over, you're talking about a 33 year old SS who by then is likely to have lost a step or two in range and is probably ready to move over to 2b or 3b. By 2026, I would anticipate/hope a 25 year old Grissom has established himself with the bat and is an adequate 2b if not better, and somebody the Sox have no desire to dislodge from the lineup. Story is 31 and we hope the health will be the sole reason why the numbers have slipped offensively, but over the next two years, you're now talking about a 33 year old whose bat is likely to decline and whose defense at SS isn't what it once was. I don't think there are a lot of 33 year old SS, so he either gets traded or moves to 2b or 3b. 3b is possible as perhaps by then they're ready to shift Devers over to DH. Maybe by 2026 Cespedes is pushing his way up the ladder as the #1 Sox prospect, who knows? Maybe by 2028 he's ready to grab 3b, so maybe Story keeps it warm until then? Moving from SS to 3B is a common move for an aging SS. That's kind of how I see it shaking out, but who really knows?
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Mar 17, 2024 21:34:13 GMT -5
And Ceccini will force Middlebrooks to first base causing a logjam with Anderson.
But it is fun to speculate with pieces this good.
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Post by costpet on Mar 18, 2024 7:40:07 GMT -5
It’s interesting that 33 is considered “old”. What I would give to be that old again.
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Post by incandenza on Mar 18, 2024 7:58:18 GMT -5
Last season only 6 out of 49 shortstops (min. 200 PAs) were 33 or older. Only Brandon Crawford (36) was over 34.
But also only 3 out of 30 second basemen were 33 or over, and none were over 34. Crawford and Longoria were the only two players across 2B, SS, 3B, and CF who were over 34.
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Post by patford on Mar 18, 2024 9:22:09 GMT -5
Grissom is a horrible defensive SS. Fortunately the Red Sox didn't acquire him to play SS. They acquired him to play 2b. He has bad numbers in a limited number of games/innings as a 2b. Big deal. Let him acclimate to 2b. Give him time. He won't be great at first but there's a reasonable chance he can be adequate if not better than that at 2b. It's not like he's 25 and what you see is what you get. I think it's more likely that Grissom turns into an acceptable 2b than Valdez does. But as you say, YMMV. I'd be thrilled if Grissom developed into as good a defender as Meidroth. The bat is for real. To me, how this is all going to shake out is pretty much a whole lot of speculation and ultimately what will happen when both Story and Mayer are on the same roster. I don't believe any of the candidates has a defensive ceiling as good as Story at either SS or 2B. According to people who know a lot more about playing defense than any of us there's no reason Grissom can not become at least a good defensive player. He just has to put in the work. www.mlb.com/news/vaughn-grissom-learning-shortstop-from-ron-washington
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Post by julyanmorley on Mar 18, 2024 10:59:00 GMT -5
Chris Murphy getting an elbow MRI
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cdj
Veteran
Posts: 14,164
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Post by cdj on Mar 18, 2024 12:02:04 GMT -5
“Elbow MRI”, my least favorite words to see in March!
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Post by julyanmorley on Mar 19, 2024 8:28:58 GMT -5
Bello named opening day starter
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Post by julyanmorley on Mar 19, 2024 8:48:31 GMT -5
Not sure if they'd carry Murpy on the 40 if he got TJS. Awful situation for him.
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Post by grandsalami on Mar 19, 2024 8:55:36 GMT -5
Becoming a pitcher is a dangerous job these days.
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nomar
Veteran
Posts: 10,888
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Post by nomar on Mar 19, 2024 9:01:17 GMT -5
Jansen not throwing again today. He’s going to be collecting rent all year. Should have traded him months ago
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Post by itinerantherb on Mar 19, 2024 9:22:43 GMT -5
I feel like we're living through a UCL injury epidemic. To the extent that it's caused by the increased emphasis on velocity, I wonder if there's a point at which teams decide that the additional 2 or 3 MPH isn't worth the attrition.
I related news, the SP depth is getting uncomfortable, even if Murphy was only something like 8th in line.
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Post by asm18 on Mar 19, 2024 9:34:37 GMT -5
Jansen not throwing again today. He’s going to be collecting rent all year. Should have traded him months ago
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Post by ematz1423 on Mar 19, 2024 9:48:19 GMT -5
Not sure if they'd carry Murpy on the 40 if he got TJS. Awful situation for him. Do you mean next offseason or right now they'd DFA him? It wouldn't seem to make much sense to DFA him when they can just 60 day IL him and open his 40 man roster slot anyway for this season. Even if he doesn't need TJ, by the sounds of it he's a safe bet to end up on the 60 day IL anyway. I do imagine if TJ is needed that he could very easily be a 40 man casualty next offseason.
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Post by sxfan on Mar 19, 2024 9:55:34 GMT -5
[] Not sure if they'd carry Murpy on the 40 if he got TJS. Awful situation for him. Do you mean next offseason or right now they'd DFA him? It wouldn't seem to make much sense to DFA him when they can just 60 day IL him and open his 40 man roster slot anyway for this season. Even if he doesn't need TJ, by the sounds of it he's a safe bet to end up on the 60 day IL anyway. I do imagine if TJ is needed that he could very easily be a 40 man casualty next offseason. He's talking a non tender once the season is over or a DFA if they need a roster spot even quicker in the off-season.
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