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Post by julyanmorley on Mar 19, 2024 9:55:40 GMT -5
60 day IL gives him a major league salary, so it's not a freebie if you're not going to keep him through the offseason
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Post by scottysmalls on Mar 19, 2024 9:56:53 GMT -5
They should add a couple long term IR spots for the off-season. It could be restricted to only players a) already under team control (and perhaps who had been for at least 6-12 months) when b) they required a surgery with some known return timeline beyond say 6 months.
No one benefits from the Red Sox not wanting to keep Murphy rostered because of TJ surgery.
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Mar 19, 2024 10:00:14 GMT -5
Another question, can you DFA injured players? Not sure I really recall it happening but I guess I don't see why not.
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Post by julyanmorley on Mar 19, 2024 10:03:23 GMT -5
Another question, can you DFA injured players? Not sure I really recall it happening but I guess I don't see why not. You can DFA them but you can't waive them at the end of the DFA, you have to just release them.
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Post by sxfan on Mar 19, 2024 10:03:41 GMT -5
They should have expanded the 40 man roster to a 42 man roster once they expanded the 25 man roster to 26. That would have cost small market owners like poor Oakland an extra 1.4 million.
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Post by James Dunne on Mar 19, 2024 10:09:37 GMT -5
DFAing an injured Chris Murphy because you want to get out from his $749,000 would be extraordinarily bad form.
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Post by grandsalami on Mar 19, 2024 11:48:56 GMT -5
Don't let your kids become pitchers...
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Post by asm18 on Mar 19, 2024 11:52:46 GMT -5
Cue the "Spidermans-pointing-at-each-other" meme
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Post by Chris Hatfield on Mar 19, 2024 12:27:26 GMT -5
Would they even get out from Murphy's contract? I know if arb guys get cut before a certain point the team only owes 1/6th (J.D. Davis). Not sure about team control guys.
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Post by julyanmorley on Mar 19, 2024 13:55:47 GMT -5
Murphy doesn’t have a big league deal, he’s not getting paid 750k if he’s in AAA. The A’s just released a player in a similar spot.
We paid Wyatt Mills last year in a similar spot and maybe possibly he felt a little obligated to choose Boston when he became a minor league free agent in the winter.
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Post by capesox on Mar 19, 2024 15:32:46 GMT -5
so, the options for Murphy if he has surgery. (I believe this is correct from seeing it with other teams)
1. put him on the 60 IL and pay him 760k, get a extra 40 roster spot when needed, will collect service time
2. send him down to minors, dont have to pay him 760k only minors wage, but cant put him on IL so no extra 40 man spot. doesn't get service time.
3. DFA him off 40 man roster, hope he doesn't get picked, he either gets taken by another team or can go back Red Sox minors.
I guess we will find out if the Red Sox think he is worth keeping at 760k and how they value him long term. Don't think he would still be on 40 man roster and a SP depth option if they didn't think he was worth the 760k. Although maybe they think they can get around it basically losing a 40 man spot?
The SP options if more injuries happen look very thin to me for the 1st half of the season. Maybe Fitts, Gambrell or Dobbins could fill in, but it feels like Walter is the only one ready to go in AAA. (assuming Criswell and Wink are in the pen)
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mobaz
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Post by mobaz on Mar 19, 2024 16:22:29 GMT -5
The SP options if more injuries happen look very thin to me for the 1st half of the season. Maybe Fitts, Gambrell or Dobbins could fill in, but it feels like Walter is the only one ready to go in AAA. (assuming Criswell and Wink are in the pen) Remember, schedule is 10 game West Coast road trip with only one off day, travel day back for home opener, then 13 straight games (home and then Pittsburgh) so pitching can get thin really fast that way. Heck, if they sign a depth starter today they likely aren't even ready until the end of that cycle (April 22). Such poor planning this year.
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Post by chaimtime on Mar 19, 2024 17:07:05 GMT -5
so, the options for Murphy if he has surgery. (I believe this is correct from seeing it with other teams) 1. put him on the 60 IL and pay him 760k, get a extra 40 roster spot when needed, will collect service time 2. send him down to minors, dont have to pay him 760k only minors wage, but cant put him on IL so no extra 40 man spot. doesn't get service time. 3. DFA him off 40 man roster, hope he doesn't get picked, he either gets taken by another team or can go back Red Sox minors. I guess we will find out if the Red Sox think he is worth keeping at 760k and how they value him long term. Don't think he would still be on 40 man roster and a SP depth option if they didn't think he was worth the 760k. Although maybe they think they can get around it basically losing a 40 man spot? The SP options if more injuries happen look very thin to me for the 1st half of the season. Maybe Fitts, Gambrell or Dobbins could fill in, but it feels like Walter is the only one ready to go in AAA. (assuming Criswell and Wink are in the pen) Even if Criswell and Winckowski are in the pen, they’re still more likely to get a spot start than any of those guys. They have plenty of bullpen depth to replace them.
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Post by patford on Mar 19, 2024 18:12:20 GMT -5
so, the options for Murphy if he has surgery. (I believe this is correct from seeing it with other teams) 1. put him on the 60 IL and pay him 760k, get a extra 40 roster spot when needed, will collect service time 2. send him down to minors, dont have to pay him 760k only minors wage, but cant put him on IL so no extra 40 man spot. doesn't get service time. 3. DFA him off 40 man roster, hope he doesn't get picked, he either gets taken by another team or can go back Red Sox minors. I guess we will find out if the Red Sox think he is worth keeping at 760k and how they value him long term. Don't think he would still be on 40 man roster and a SP depth option if they didn't think he was worth the 760k. Although maybe they think they can get around it basically losing a 40 man spot? The SP options if more injuries happen look very thin to me for the 1st half of the season. Maybe Fitts, Gambrell or Dobbins could fill in, but it feels like Walter is the only one ready to go in AAA. (assuming Criswell and Wink are in the pen) Murphy will be 26 in a couple of months. He's one of those players who by this point would seem to be a know commodity. I can't see keeping Murphy or David Hamilton on the 40 man as opposed to someone like Matta where there is still a possible considerable upside.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on Mar 19, 2024 19:47:24 GMT -5
Heads-up baserunning on display (it looked like "Spring Training":
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Mar 21, 2024 7:34:09 GMT -5
It's seeming increasingly likely if not locked in at this point that the Sox are going to go into the year with a $213M payroll $24M under the LT, and basically ownership is going to pocket that money.
I've tried not to be too much of a pessimistic angry fan but what a joke. I find no reason for them not to add another one or two guys like Clevinger, Duvall, Longoria, anyone in that class. Lorenzen just signed for 4.5M, they could have used him for that or probably slightly more since he signed with TX and no income tax but still it's baffling to me.
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Post by asm18 on Mar 21, 2024 8:46:09 GMT -5
It's seeming increasingly likely if not locked in at this point that the Sox are going to go into the year with a $213M payroll $24M under the LT, and basically ownership is going to pocket that money. I've tried not to be too much of a pessimistic angry fan but what a joke. I find no reason for them not to add another one or two guys like Clevinger, Duvall, Longoria, anyone in that class. Lorenzen just signed for 4.5M, they could have used him for that or probably slightly more since he signed with TX and no income tax but still it's baffling to me. 100% agree. Unless they are saving a buffer whereby they can allocate money for extensions (Casas, young outfielders, Pivetta? etc), it seems insane not to at least match last year's payroll. In 2021, they had a payroll of $209 mil for CBT purposes (a hair under the $210 CBT level) and that was despite the ballpark not being at full capacity for two months because of COVID. Three years later they are currently at ~ 177 mil real money payroll, with a CBT number of like 211-213 mil. (First CBT threshold is 237 mil.)
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Post by itinerantherb on Mar 21, 2024 9:40:01 GMT -5
It's especially frustrating to watch Lorenzen sign a one-year deal for basically the price of a good reliever. He's someone they could have stretched out and then parked in the bullpen, where he's had success, until a starter went down. On the other hand, starting for playoff contender has to have a lot more attractive to him, so maybe the Sox couldn't have signed him for anything in that price neighborhood.
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Post by greenmonster on Mar 21, 2024 9:43:59 GMT -5
It's seeming increasingly likely if not locked in at this point that the Sox are going to go into the year with a $213M payroll $24M under the LT, and basically ownership is going to pocket that money. I've tried not to be too much of a pessimistic angry fan but what a joke. I find no reason for them not to add another one or two guys like Clevinger, Duvall, Longoria, anyone in that class. Lorenzen just signed for 4.5M, they could have used him for that or probably slightly more since he signed with TX and no income tax but still it's baffling to me. .. but to be fair you should factor in the money they are spending to bring back real Ketchup ...
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Mar 21, 2024 9:45:53 GMT -5
It's especially frustrating to watch Lorenzen sign a one-year deal for basically the price of a good reliever. He's someone they could have stretched out and then parked in the bullpen, where he's had success, until a starter went down. On the other hand, starting for playoff contender has to have a lot more attractive to him, so maybe the Sox couldn't have signed him for anything in that price neighborhood. Does Lorenzen even start for them for more than a handful of games though? Right now when he's up to speed he probably slots in at #5 behind Eovaldi, Gray, Heaney and Dunning. However this summer the Rangers probably expect Scherzer, Mahle and maybe De Grom back from surgeries. When the Rangers pitching is at full strength or even close to it Lorenzen probably doesn't crack their rotation. It's a good signing for them, can never have too much pitching and he basically got signed for peanuts. He has proven to be both a viable SP and a viable RP so he will help them no doubt, but you'd almost have to think if the Sox had offered something similar his path to being a starter all year for the Sox is more clear than for the Rangers. Seems like Sox had no interest though for whatever reason so it's a moot point.
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Post by julyanmorley on Mar 21, 2024 9:51:24 GMT -5
I got no interest in having Lorenzen on the roster. I'd rather start Winckowski if we had to win a game, and considering the five years of control I'd rather give Criswell a chance to start games too.
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Post by costpet on Mar 21, 2024 10:26:02 GMT -5
If we’re good, everyone will be surprised. If we’re bad, no one will be surprised. They expect Cora to make roses out of wallpaper paste. If he doesn’t, he gets fired. And he knows it. I like him, but he’s been given a raw deal. He’s as good as any they’ve ever had. I think it’s a shame. He’ll land somewhere else and do well.
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ematz1423
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Post by ematz1423 on Mar 21, 2024 10:31:40 GMT -5
If we’re good, everyone will be surprised. If we’re bad, no one will be surprised. They expect Cora to make roses out of wallpaper paste. If he doesn’t, he gets fired. And he knows it. I like him, but he’s been given a raw deal. He’s as good as any they’ve ever had. I think it’s a shame. He’ll land somewhere else and do well. Cora has one year left on his deal and by the way it sounds is going to be leaving at the end of the season one way or another so I doubt he would get fired since ownership seems to love him. If they are clearly on the downswing come Sept I could certainly see them coming to some sort of mutual agreement where he is "relieved" of his duties rather than an outright firing though. I guess that's kind of splitting hairs either way. I expect Cora's next job to be in some organizations front office as he has mentioned a desire to do so.
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Post by bellhorndingers21 on Mar 21, 2024 10:38:39 GMT -5
I got no interest in having Lorenzen on the roster. I'd rather start Winckowski if we had to win a game, and considering the five years of control I'd rather give Criswell a chance to start games too. With the modern handling of starters and bullpen options they'll need probably need more than Criswell and Wincowski. I don't love the idea of Walter getting a lot of innings or Gambrell, Fitts and Gonzalez getting put into roles they're not ready to hold.
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Post by grandsalami on Mar 21, 2024 10:50:07 GMT -5
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