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Post by thelavarnwayguy on Feb 24, 2015 1:46:09 GMT -5
I'm still in shock as I thought the Yankees would move mountains to sign Moncada. They needed a youth infusion and a new "star" prospect to replace Jeter in the minds of fans ( not to mention Cano ). They had something like $330 freaking million a year coming in from the Yes Network alone, plus all those $25,000 box seats. I will get down on my knees tonight for a sincere prayer, to give thanks: Thank you god for Hank Steinbrenner...Thank you God for Hank Steinbrenner!
What an imbecile. Which should come as no surprise being a Steinbrenner. For all those yankee fans who think George was a genius, we have exhibit A in Hank. They need some genetics lessons. Go freaking Hank! Can we give Hank even more power and control over the Yanks? Hank is going to need that pope mobile Guidas was talking about to even think about going to a game in the Bronx.
I haven't heard how long the deal is for. Assuming we don't see Moncada for 2 years ( big assumption ), a 6 year deal ends up being 4 years in mlb at over $15 mil per year for a prospect. Hank does have one thing right. They could maybe have used that money to sign a guy like James shield this year. There is some logic to going with the sure thing. If I'm the yanks though, I'm covering the roulett table. They have the cash and they need to turn the turnstiles and keep Yes network fans stoked.
This is about MAYBE getting the next superstar. Rolling the dice for MAYBE that kind of top talent who can make plays in the world series and help to bring the cup home. Michael Jordan. Lebron James. It's no surprise the Sox went out and got Sandoval this winter. It's all about making plays against top competion. I call it the Napoli factor. The Ortiz attribute. They say the kid has insane bat speed. We'll take it.
It just now makes sense to also land a special pitcher to complement the entire package. Will Coyle / Cechinni get it done for Hamels now! I'm expecting miracles from now on.
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Post by Oregon Norm on Feb 24, 2015 2:28:28 GMT -5
He's on a minor league contract. The money was simply to get him signed. That means he gets the same treatment as any other minor league player who gets to the majors. If and when he makes it, he'll be subject to the same salary rules, eventually reaching arbitration. The caveat is that, if he proves to be a real gem, the Sox would want to sign him to an early extension, buying out those years. But for now, he's a minor league player working his way to a major league gig.
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Post by soxfanatic on Feb 24, 2015 2:41:56 GMT -5
Remember when the Sox idea of a splashy international play was signing New Zealand softball players? Good times ... whatever happened to that guy? Beau Bishop. He was released a while ago, but was actually picked up by Milwaukee last week. |
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Post by philsbosoxfan on Feb 24, 2015 3:30:17 GMT -5
From the nnyfans thread:
Cashman: "You only have so much money to spend. We have massive financial commitments and when you make those you have to live with them.''
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Post by burythehammer on Feb 24, 2015 6:04:29 GMT -5
Hastings: "“Listen, Yoan would’ve gone to the Yankees, had the Yankees beaten everyone else,” Hastings said. “He liked the Yankees. He liked the Dodgers. He liked San Diego. He liked all these teams. When you like every team, and one is like, ‘We’re going to offer you $1 million more, or $2 million more, or $3 million more,’ it’s kind of a no-brainer.”"
Man, it's so clear that this guy doesn't have experience as an agent/in baseball. The honesty is actualy kind of refreshing.
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Post by artfuldodger on Feb 24, 2015 6:21:51 GMT -5
Moncada should fare well. Like many, I wonder where he will play in 2 years. Is there a scouting report available for Carlos Mesa?
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Post by rjp313jr on Feb 24, 2015 9:35:34 GMT -5
So my new future prospect dream team looks like: C Swihart 1B Devers 2B Chavis SS Bogaerts 3B Moncada LF Castillo CF Margot RF Betts DH Travis I normally hate this exercise but it's hard to not think about it in this case. All prospect lineup: C Swihart 1B Devers 2B Chavis SS Bogaerts 3B Moncada LF Betts CF Margot RF Castillo DH Cecchini 2017 lineup: C Swihart 1B Pablo 2B Pedey SS Bogaerts 3B Moncada LF Cecchini CF Castillo RF Betts DH Hanley |
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Post by jmei on Feb 24, 2015 9:38:07 GMT -5
With the team we put together of guys in their prime, or pre-prime, I don't see where he fits in. Someone is going to get tradedx and there is a lot of investment in thr infield. Pablo Doesn't WANT to dh despite what ppl seem to think he'll so gladly Accept. He wants to play third. I can dig that considering how good he can be there. Pedey is not moving off second unless he god forbid serves into Fenway park, and bogaerts is believed to be our next middle of the order power bat. If the outfield implodes and Moncada wants to play left in 3 years, color me pinstripes and call me stupid explains the flaws in this logjam argument: |
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Post by GyIantosca on Feb 24, 2015 9:45:10 GMT -5
Is this guy Mesa his mentor? I don't care but this kid got paid well. Is this guy more like a big brother or is it more than that? When listening to the podcast I thought there was more than meets the eye with this guy. I don't care really but I don't want Mesa to be a distraction either.
Another thing Hal was very confident in his offer . Maybe he thought he was led to believe the kid wanted to go there and if the Yankees were close the kid would of went there. I read a bullshit article in Bleacher Report ( I know that a lot of people here don't care for the site). That this kid really wanted to go to the Yankees. But I felt better reading the other article about the process . The kid liked all the places and it came down to the last dollar. The Dodgers were funny just wait till July we'll give you 35. They got a lot of nerve also. They probably have ten guys signed already. The Yankees still shut out of Cuba. Who would of thought that?
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Post by gatorgreenwell on Feb 24, 2015 10:15:35 GMT -5
Per George A. King III of the New York Post:
According to people with knowledge of the situation, Moncada wants his future team to sign his mentor, a 27-year-old outfielder who played in Cuba for two years as a teenager, was inactive for three seasons, spent three years in the lower levels of the Pirates system and last season worked for Camden (Independent League).
“You might have to keep [Mesa] around to help him,’’ a source said.
Doesn't seem like much there. Sounds like he'll be in ST to hang with Moncada. My guess is he might play A ball with Yoan to help him get acclimated, but I doubt it goes beyond that. Pure speculation, but that's my guess.
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Smittyw
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Post by Smittyw on Feb 24, 2015 10:54:29 GMT -5
Per George A. King III of the New York Post: According to people with knowledge of the situation, Moncada wants his future team to sign his mentor, a 27-year-old outfielder who played in Cuba for two years as a teenager, was inactive for three seasons, spent three years in the lower levels of the Pirates system and last season worked for Camden (Independent League). “You might have to keep [Mesa] around to help him,’’ a source said. Doesn't seem like much there. Sounds like he'll be in ST to hang with Moncada. My guess is he might play A ball with Yoan to help him get acclimated, but I doubt it goes beyond that. Pure speculation, but that's my guess.
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nomar
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Post by nomar on Feb 24, 2015 12:14:32 GMT -5
With the team we put together of guys in their prime, or pre-prime, I don't see where he fits in. Someone is going to get tradedx and there is a lot of investment in thr infield. Pablo Doesn't WANT to dh despite what ppl seem to think he'll so gladly Accept. He wants to play third. I can dig that considering how good he can be there. Pedey is not moving off second unless he god forbid serves into Fenway park, and bogaerts is believed to be our next middle of the order power bat. If the outfield implodes and Moncada wants to play left in 3 years, color me pinstripes and call me stupid explains the flaws in this logjam argument: This is pretty much perfect. This is how deep you want to be, not a detrimental logjam. We'd be lucky if we have excess talent and end up engaging in trade to recycle talent. I love where we're at. |
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Post by jmei on Feb 24, 2015 12:56:08 GMT -5
I split off the international draft discussion-- let's keep this thread to Moncada specifically.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2015 12:56:24 GMT -5
Muahaha, I know know one gives a shit about Felger and Mazz, but Mazz just this signing is an indictment on the farm system. And Felger is hinting that he is on roids. That's funny, how I found soxprospects Dale Arnold and Bob Newmyer had a segment on WEEI list your Three favorite sport websites you visit a lot. Dale had this site in his top Three. That explain why Felger knows nothing about redsox prospects and Dale Arnold does. |
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Post by bluechip on Feb 24, 2015 13:24:54 GMT -5
Muahaha, I know know one gives a shit about Felger and Mazz, but Mazz just this signing is an indictment on the farm system. And Felger is hinting that he is on roids. That's funny, how I found soxprospects Dale Arnold and Bob Newmyer had a segment on WEEI list your Three favorite sport websites you visit a lot. Dale had this site in his top Three. That explain why Felger knows nothing about redsox prospects and Dale Arnold does. There is a reason why Gammons flipped out on Felger back in the day. The guy does No homework on baseball and does not really know the game. |
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Post by ancientsoxfogey on Feb 24, 2015 15:15:14 GMT -5
The interesting thing about Carlsey's recital is that after 2015 the Sox do not have a true 1B other than maybe Craig. Perhaps the defensive lightning in a bottle the Sox caught in moving Napoli to full-time 1B has them thinking that they'll simply figure out 1B as they go along. But it might behoove the organization to start working out 1B options among the available pieces, in practice if nowhere else, sometime this year.
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Post by m1keyboots on Feb 24, 2015 16:31:52 GMT -5
With the team we put together of guys in their prime, or pre-prime, I don't see where he fits in. Someone is going to get tradedx and there is a lot of investment in thr infield. Pablo Doesn't WANT to dh despite what ppl seem to think he'll so gladly Accept. He wants to play third. I can dig that considering how good he can be there. Pedey is not moving off second unless he god forbid serves into Fenway park, and bogaerts is believed to be our next middle of the order power bat. If the outfield implodes and Moncada wants to play left in 3 years, color me pinstripes and call me stupid explains the flaws in this logjam argument: I always appreciate your input, as it's usually backed up and we'll articulated. Moncada being some time away (or perhaps not much time at all), with uncertainty on whether he'll even pan out to even a poor man's neil walker (despite people rahrah-ing about his tools) just worries me. We lowballed lester then took huge chances in terms of money (relatively) and time, twice with the two imports. With what amounts to paying around 100 ish milion total to a guy who was literally an average player in a league where SOME pitchers throw high 70's, low 80's with some junk (albiet at 17) and has been out of baseball for a year. It just seems overkill. Was anyone as devastated when we didn't sign a abreu/puig/tomas as they seem to be ecstatic and over the moon about this? I can see FO strategy regarding scoring runs, and understand other people's arguements for signing Moncada and hopefully somehow all these signings net us Jzimm, or Cueto. I don't question BC's strategy as much as the blind support for basically committing that much time and money to a guy who hasn't done much. I hope I'm wrong and in 4 years panda is smiling at first/dh, moncada is doing his machado impression at third etc etc and bingo was his name-o. In some people's response to my previous posts, YM would stay in MILB, and then we'd have devers margot bogey betts Moncada at 22 etc and being happy about it. Then what good apart from ticket sales at providence did YM do? He could easily test the market and make bank if hes a great player, and were thr team that paid him that much to season him and get a few years of his ability at most in that scenario. And as far as veterans having to deal with moving off a comfortable postion, there have been many examples of someone moving positions and being disgruntled, ineffective and dare I say cancerous. Sole thrive, but the ones that come to mind are HOF caliber players. It's hard to debate this with people that seem to have an answer for everything (not you jmei), I just can't see how saying 30,60,100 mil ain't that important if he's cano. Well of course it isnt, then let's pay devers a bundle of money now (impossible but the only example I can think of) Whew. If YM was a couple years older, a bit more proven, and ml ready i would certainly agree with stockpiling offense and asking questions later when it comes to this. |
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Post by m1keyboots on Feb 24, 2015 16:46:22 GMT -5
I need to seriously apologize, I completely forgot that his minor league contract takes absolutely no money out of the major league payroll. I was unaware of this. And as money was a big arguing point for me on this. I'm going to jump on this bandwagon a little bit late. ::walks behind the couch with tail tucked between legs::
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Post by Oregon Norm on Feb 24, 2015 17:13:48 GMT -5
OK! I'm going to put away my bullwhip, then. Seriously, you're not the only one who hadn't made the connection. This is a different beast, and you'll want to check out what John Henry said about the deal. He knows a little about risk and reward and he decided this was a good place to put his money. I can't argue with his logic. |
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Post by fernburger on Feb 24, 2015 17:45:21 GMT -5
The interesting thing about Carlsey's recital is that after 2015 the Sox do not have a true 1B other than maybe Craig. Perhaps the defensive lightning in a bottle the Sox caught in moving Napoli to full-time 1B has them thinking that they'll simply figure out 1B as they go along. But it might behoove the organization to start working out 1B options among the available pieces, in practice if nowhere else, sometime this year. The Sox do have some potential pieces that could move to first in Sandoval and Ramirez. In the minors we have Sam Travis who, while he does not project to be more than an average first baseman, will be entering his first full season. He has some power potential and was overshadowed a little by Schwarber at Indiana so he could turn into more than what we currently see. |
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danr
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Post by danr on Feb 24, 2015 18:13:13 GMT -5
Keith Law seems to be higher on Sam Travis than this board. He thinks Travis might make the top 100 prospects next year.
In any case, why should we assume that Napoli will not be extended? He has to make a comeback from his injuries, but assuming he does, the Sox probably could not do any better for the next couple of years after this season than to have him at first.
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danr
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Post by danr on Feb 24, 2015 18:16:11 GMT -5
Folks, a few paragraphs in long posts makes them much easier to read.
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TearsIn04
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Everybody knows Nelson de la Rosa, but who is Karim Garcia?
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Post by TearsIn04 on Feb 24, 2015 20:50:34 GMT -5
A lot of the scenarios being thrown out there on this board and in press stories casually say that Panda can move to DH or 1B if the left side of the IF gets too crowded. He had an OPS-plus of 111 last year. The average DH was 110 and the average 1B was 116.
Unless Panda turns around the decline his production has shown the last two years, he is neither a standout DH or 1B. We'd be paying $19.5 million a year for basically an average offensive player.
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Post by sarasoxer on Feb 24, 2015 21:08:14 GMT -5
A lot of the scenarios being thrown out there on this board and in press stories casually say that Panda can move to DH or 1B if the left side of the IF gets too crowded. He had an OPS-plus of 111 last year. The average DH was 110 and the average 1B was 116. Unless Panda turns around the decline his production has shown the last two years, he is neither a standout DH or 1B. We'd be paying $19.5 million a year for basically an average offensive player. Good point. But, it is what it is. Based upon the Panda's physique, the Sox had to have this in mind too. I feel that one component that may be missed here is that the Sox want guys who can hit good pitching in the playoffs. Unless memory fails me, that is the Panda man. |
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Post by soxfan06 on Feb 24, 2015 21:17:17 GMT -5
A lot of the scenarios being thrown out there on this board and in press stories casually say that Panda can move to DH or 1B if the left side of the IF gets too crowded. He had an OPS-plus of 111 last year. The average DH was 110 and the average 1B was 116. Unless Panda turns around the decline his production has shown the last two years, he is neither a standout DH or 1B. We'd be paying $19.5 million a year for basically an average offensive player. Good point. But, it is what it is. Based upon the Panda's physique, the Sox had to have this in mind too. I feel that one component that may be missed here is that the Sox want guys who can hit good pitching in the playoffs. Unless memory fails me, that is the Panda man. Not to mention having an average guy at a position isn't a horrible thing. It means you could theoretically upgrade the position, but it also means there are about 15 teams with worse players at the position. If you want to be successful you just have to offset having an average player at a typical offensively productive position by having above average players at positions where teams don't typically get above average output. |
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