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2016 Boston Celtics Offseason Thread
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Post by texs31 on May 2, 2016 13:57:45 GMT -5
Figured I'd start this up now that the season is over and we can look forward to the draft, free agency and trades.
Since I knew we weren't winning any championships this year, the worst part about our 1st round loss is NOT that we didn't advance. It's that, instead of being distracted with a fun run into subsequent rounds, I have to wait THAT much longer to get to the draft lottery, the draft and free agency. You guys are going to get sick of me without that distraction, I'm guessing.
Anyways, I thought I'd kick us off with a little prediction exercise. Not necessarily asking for everyone to do the same but it seemed an easy way to summarize some thoughts. Here we go:
- Top Draft Choice (assuming current position remains) = Outside of #1 or #2, I'd be willing to trade this pick in a deal for a stud but, if Boston picks #3, I say Dragan Bender. While Jamal Murray or Buddy Hield might be a better bet to help Boston next year, I see Danny being in love with this guy (as I've said before). He can be stashed in Europe for another year (though I'm not sure he wants that) especially if they can somehow lure a top Free Agent or 2 (doubtful, but still).
- Free Agent Signed - Paul Pierce . . . BORING. I'm not going to get lulled into Kevin Durant dreams or even the likes of Al Horford (and, with him, I'm worried about him being THE guy they go after and pay max). Pierce says he has 1 more year left and I could see a reunion with Boston for 1 more run. Especially if Turner signs elsewhere, he'd fit nicely on the 2nd unit (albeit in a different role than ET)
- Free Agent Re-signed - Including the Non-Guarantee guys I'll go with Amir Johnson. It's a no-brainer. If we aren't including him and Jerebko, I'll say Tyler Zeller. He's restricted and less of an odd fit than Sullinger (I'm not even sure WHAT's going to happen there).
- Free Agent Lost - Evan Turner - I just think he's going to get a LOT of money and, potentially, a starting gig somewhere. Unless Boston packages a lot of current bodies (including 2 top rotational wing players/ball handlers) in a trade for a star, I'm not sure they'll re-sign him.
- Trade Target - Jimmy Butler - despite what we've heard (and what I've pieced together), I think this is a pipe dream. But, if I'm to come up with 1 guy, I'll go here.
It's going to be a long couple of weeks (until the lottery) and months (until the draft and free agency).
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Post by texs31 on May 3, 2016 8:33:46 GMT -5
The fact that PP is not actually a free agent might make my 'prediction' challenging. Doh!
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nomar
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Post by nomar on May 3, 2016 12:38:27 GMT -5
I hate Demarcus Cousins and I'm really afraid we will trade for him. A head case chucker center. Every advanced metric hates him, and that's ignoring the distractions and the fact hat officials hate the guy.
Trading for Butler and going all in for KD after is an option people keep discussing, though I think that's pretty unrealistic.
If we don't get a top 2 pick, I'm fine with trading it with Crowder for Butler and then signing someone like Batum.
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rjp313jr
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Post by rjp313jr on May 4, 2016 8:11:37 GMT -5
I'm not even getting my hopes up for a top 2 pick. It depresses me. The Celtics NEVER have any lottery luck. That being said, I don't know what to do with the pick. I love how patient Danny and ownership are so I'm confident they are not going to screw this up by going all in on secondary pieces because they have the room. They have a lot of young developing talent and a great young coach and an exciting team so they can keep on the patient path and keep their cap room flexibility and continue the slow growth.
There was a good article in the Globe today about Rozier and his potential to develop into a star type player and I can certainly see it. The guy has shown nice flashed and it appears his will and work ethic is off the charts. I just got infinitely more excited about him. The roster is young and exciting with upside growth so there's no closing window to be worried about and panic on bad moves that's a plus.
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rjp313jr
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Post by rjp313jr on May 4, 2016 8:20:30 GMT -5
Keeping the above in mind, I think the right play is going all in for Durant. It's a long shot but who cares? It's the right move for the Celtics to try because he's the one guy who is guaranteed to be the star they need. If that doesn't pan out you shift to the trade market or simply repeat this past season with the rookies and continued development.
To lure Durant, you'll need a package deal likely with Horford. It may be a long shot but it's the one you go for.
Besides signing established stars, signing future stars is a way to go. The plus, is it's easier to get them and they may be cheaper then max deals the obvious negative is it takes projection. Evan Fournier and Harrison Barnes are two guys who if given the right situation could become star players. Barnes is playing 5th wheel in Golden State. I really like Fourniers size and shooting ability. Both are restricted free agents.
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Post by cto94 on May 4, 2016 8:45:50 GMT -5
I hate Demarcus Cousins and I'm really afraid we will trade for him. A head case chucker center. Every advanced metric hates him, and that's ignoring the distractions and the fact hat officials hate the guy. Trading for Butler and going all in for KD after is an option people keep discussing, though I think that's pretty unrealistic. If we don't get a top 2 pick, I'm fine with trading it with Crowder for Butler and then signing someone like Batum. I think that's short selling Cousins pretty hard, especially when you consider how dysfunctional that organization is. The guy put up 27 and 12 this year, started hitting 3s, is a good passer, excellent rebounder and post player. Assuming that Stevens can get him to play a little defense and not chirp refs all the time (which I don't think is too much of a stretch), I think he'd be a great fit for us. He's had 5 coaches in 6 seasons, and they fired the only one who he got along with/who was having any kind of success when they had like a 6 game losing streak cause Cousins was out with meningitis. That can't be an ideal situation |
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nomar
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Post by nomar on May 4, 2016 8:51:10 GMT -5
I hate Demarcus Cousins and I'm really afraid we will trade for him. A head case chucker center. Every advanced metric hates him, and that's ignoring the distractions and the fact hat officials hate the guy. Trading for Butler and going all in for KD after is an option people keep discussing, though I think that's pretty unrealistic. If we don't get a top 2 pick, I'm fine with trading it with Crowder for Butler and then signing someone like Batum. I think that's short selling Cousins pretty hard, especially when you consider how dysfunctional that organization is. The guy put up 27 and 12 this year, started hitting 3s, is a good passer, excellent rebounder and post player. Assuming that Stevens can get him to play a little defense and not chirp refs all the time (which I don't think is too much of a stretch), I think he'd be a great fit for us. He's had 5 coaches in 6 seasons, and they fired the only one who he got along with/who was having any kind of success when they had like a 6 game losing streak cause Cousins was out with meningitis. That can't be an ideal situation Highest usage rate in the NBA (35%), only a 103 ORtg, only 33% from 3, led the NBA in turnovers among centers. 5.7 Win Shares with a 35% usage rate is atrocious. Especially for a center. Hes overrated as they come. |
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Post by publius on May 4, 2016 11:23:54 GMT -5
My problem with Durant is how skinny he is. Playoff basketball gets very physical and he doesn't seem to hold up well under all the bumping, pushing and physicality. If you watch, at crucial moments, he'll eschew the drive (and, consequently, the chance to get fouled) in order to make a long 3. He's good at shooting but what you really want under those situations is to stop the clock and get free, extremely high percentage shots. This tendency partly (but only partly) explains the Thunder's penchant for kicking away leads down the stretch and losing games they should have won.
Maybe Stevens can fix this but maybe not too.
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Post by jmei on May 4, 2016 12:40:25 GMT -5
My problem with Durant is how skinny he is. Playoff basketball gets very physical and he doesn't seem to hold up well under all the bumping, pushing and physicality. If you watch, at crucial moments, he'll eschew the drive (and, consequently, the chance to get fouled) in order to make a long 3. He's good at shooting but what you really want under those situations is to stop the clock and get free, extremely high percentage shots. This tendency partly (but only partly) explains the Thunder's penchant for kicking away leads down the stretch and losing games they should have won. Maybe Stevens can fix this but maybe not too. Durant is eighth in the league in free-throw attempts per game and fourth in free throws made per game. I think he's plenty physical enough. The issue is less with Durant's style of play, it's that the Thunder run uninspired late-game plays that are more often than not simple pin-downs, pick-and-rolls, or isolations. Are you saying that if the Celtics had the opportunity to sign him, that they shouldn't? |
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Post by Don Caballero on May 4, 2016 13:14:34 GMT -5
The very idea of Durant being coached by Brad Stevens makes me smile.
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Post by cto94 on May 5, 2016 9:25:08 GMT -5
I think that's short selling Cousins pretty hard, especially when you consider how dysfunctional that organization is. The guy put up 27 and 12 this year, started hitting 3s, is a good passer, excellent rebounder and post player. Assuming that Stevens can get him to play a little defense and not chirp refs all the time (which I don't think is too much of a stretch), I think he'd be a great fit for us. He's had 5 coaches in 6 seasons, and they fired the only one who he got along with/who was having any kind of success when they had like a 6 game losing streak cause Cousins was out with meningitis. That can't be an ideal situation Highest usage rate in the NBA (35%), only a 103 ORtg, only 33% from 3, led the NBA in turnovers among centers. 5.7 Win Shares with a 35% usage rate is atrocious. Especially for a center. Hes overrated as they come. Only 33% from 3 when he'd never attempted more than about 20 and then took 210? That's pretty impressive for a guy who can dominate the post too. Also win shares are a volume stat and he missed a quarter of the season by the way, so I'm not sure how much weight I'm going to place on that. Frankly, you can cite all the advanced stats you want- Cousins is one guy at least where I'm buying the eye test. He's had poor coaching and mediocre talent at best around him and absolutely no stability. Those advanced stats aren't taking these things into account, and either way, if you watch a game when he's engaged, he's pretty much hands down the best center in the nba. I'm not even sure I can think of anyone who's really on his level in terms of skillset for centers, and the guy is also still 25. If he's available, they're going to do whatever they can to get him, and they'd be right to |
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 6, 2016 12:03:47 GMT -5
If you get Cousins you need players he will respect and listen to and I don't think this team has any of those players. You need a Pierce, Allen or KG type of Vet.
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Post by Don Caballero on May 6, 2016 13:40:34 GMT -5
Stein is reporting that the Spurs are getting serious about Durant, that gives me bad LMA flashbacks and could have Lebron on suicide watch. So now that that ship has likely sailed (let's be honest, it was never in the conversation but whatever), what about Paul George? Indiana could be blowing up and I think I'd trade the Nets pick for him regardless of where it ends.
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Post by texs31 on May 6, 2016 14:24:10 GMT -5
Admittedly, I didn't read the article but when I saw the headline about Spurs interest in KD, it seems like a article about nothing.
It's not too hard to list the teams that would be interested in Durant (try, all of them). We can further figure out who has room (quite a few) and then determine who are or have a chance to become contenders. Spurs were on that list before the article and are on it afterwards. Nothing surprising there.
On George, I can't decide which way to go on the Pacers. On the one hand, how do you trade a guy who is:
1. An Elite Player in his prime
2. Signed for 3 more years at what it likely to look like a reasonable number
3. Whose biggest negative is the devastating injury (which he seemed to show little, if any, lingering effects from
On the other, Indiana's situation seems typical of what happens when you get an elite player but aren't the type of draw for other elite players. The 1 guy is so good, your chance of getting another elite player through the draft or trade (by having picks/assets to offer a team) is very small. They did well to draft Turner but he's 6 years younger so their "windows" aren't exactly aligned. Meanwhile, their other 2 significant players are George Hill and Monta Ellis. Meh.
So how can a team like Indiana get better? Probably by trading George. It would just be really hard for Bird to do it.
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rjp313jr
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Post by rjp313jr on May 7, 2016 8:35:37 GMT -5
After watching the Thuder fumble around last night, Danny Ainge better be selling Stevens hard to Durant if he gets the chance (would anyone be shocked if the Cs don't even get a meeting?). Durant had never played for a very good coach in my opinion. That team is 3 guys and the offense is terrible. If you put Stevens on that bench the Thunder are winning that series. Obviously the Spurs play some of the best defense but still Durant had opportunity and he and Westbrook didn't work well together and as a team to take advantage.
Durant is a long shot but he's the long shot you go for this offseason as explained above. The only real pressure on the Celtics is lottery night. They NEED those bounces for a top 2 pick BUT they can be patient again this year. The worst case scenario for this team isn't the 6th pick in the draft it's blowing the cap dollars on the wrong guys like the Pistons did a few years back with Gordon and Gay. At least that was a veteran team.... C's are early in this and building towards something and don't need their picks to suck.
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Post by honestlyabe on May 8, 2016 13:10:39 GMT -5
Durant is the biggest Kahuna since the "King" hit FA. We have the cash, the coach, the history, and the roster -- we need to be selling him hard. The draft is gravy on top of whatever polished product Danny and Brad put together. If we get a top 2, I'm over the moon. If we don't, we still have shots at guys like Bender and Buddy. We're in quite the privileged position and I'm excited to watch the Brad Stevens Celtics roll over the next decade.
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rjp313jr
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Post by rjp313jr on May 11, 2016 8:34:45 GMT -5
Stephen Curry played really well in April when given the chance. The kid can shoot. The Celtics need shooting, he will be cheap. Might be worth a contract and roster spot as a tool in Stephens tool belt.
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Post by texs31 on May 11, 2016 10:00:31 GMT -5
Well, a good April (and rest of the year) is probably why he was unanimously named MVP but I'm not sure he's available.
#smarta$$ #iknowyoumeantSeth
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rjp313jr
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Post by rjp313jr on May 14, 2016 11:54:51 GMT -5
Tuesday is a big big day. Hope the bounces work out. I've been scanning the free agent market and to me the biggest need for this squad is shooting shooting and more shooting. A couple names that are jumping out at me so far as nice targets with varying contract requirements are:
1. SETH Curry. (Kid can flat out shoot)
2. Allen Crabbe (this could be one of those break out super stars)
3. Evan Fournier
4. Chandler Parsons if he opts it (can shoot and probably play the 4 - he'd be a deadly weapon for Stevens)
There are more and some solid options. There are also a few defensive rim protectors who have limited roles with their current teams and could bust out big with a new one. I think I'd decline Amir's option because of this but pick up Jonas. Say goodbye to Turner and obviously Sully. I love Turner and think he's been huge for the team but we need shooting. Unless we believe in his new corner 3 ability.
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 14, 2016 13:41:22 GMT -5
I say biggest need is a go to scorer that can create own shot. I agree our shooting needs to improve, but mainly from the small forward position. The Hawks series mad us look worse then we are in my opinion, two of our best shooters went down with injuries.
I think it's crazy to say let Sullinger and Johnson go, who are you replacing them with? Unless Sullinger gets a crazy offer you need to bring him back. He is only 24 and was our best rebounder last year.
Also letting Turner go without finding a replacement would be a huge mistake. His ability to create shoots for himself and others was huge for the second unit.
One free agent that I would like Danny to go after is Big Al. He would give us a low post scoring option we currently don't have.
Also think best way to add talent is through trades this year, free agent class doesn't excite me.
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Post by benogliviesbrother on May 16, 2016 12:48:05 GMT -5
Highest usage rate in the NBA (35%), only a 103 ORtg, only 33% from 3, led the NBA in turnovers among centers. 5.7 Win Shares with a 35% usage rate is atrocious. Especially for a center. Hes overrated as they come. Well, George Karl this past year and a half. That's a well accomplished person, certainly much more so than Cousins. And yet, it sounds like he paid the coach little heed from the get go. He's also had several notable assistants attempt to coach him, including Clifford Ray, Pete Carril, Corliss Williamson and Tyrone Corbin, among others with plenty of NBA success on their collective resumes. It would seem to me he's not had poor coaching, but a poor response to coaching. There you have it: the OFF and ON switch. Don't think you can win anything building a team around such a player. "When the going gets tough …" and all that. |
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Post by Don Caballero on May 17, 2016 18:51:48 GMT -5
 10 minutes away from Ben Simmons. We got this. |
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Post by bookiemetts on May 17, 2016 19:23:01 GMT -5
Top 3!!!
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Post by umassgrad2005 on May 17, 2016 19:26:46 GMT -5
WTF
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Post by Don Caballero on May 17, 2016 19:27:36 GMT -5
DIKEMBE-GATE!
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